# I bought a used lathe, maybe



## phillip.c (Aug 9, 2012)

About a year and a half ago, I bought a very unique cabinet for a reasonable price. As it happens, there was a lathe bolted to the top! I have since restored the cabinet and I kept the lathe thinking I might sell it to defray the cost of the cabinet. I have now decided that I would like to try my hand at the craft and I think I may be missing a piece or two.

I attached pictures to help guide anyone with advice. My question is the following: the chuck on the lathe doesn't look much like I've seen in videos and such. It looks like it's missing a piece, but I don't know. What do you all think? I found this manual with the correct model #. 

http://vintagemachinery.org/pubs/1138/4647.pdf

Looks like I am missing part 9-147?

I can take more precise pictures if necessary. I took these pictures some time ago when I listed this on CL. 

Thanks guys.


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## old55 (Aug 11, 2013)

Can't help with that one Phillip but I'm sure someone will be along to give you a hand.


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## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

It looks to me that you have that part Phil. It's in the center of your drive spur. It's a center pin that positions where you mark center on your turning. You then drive the turning down onto the spurs. Many turners like to take that entire spindle out of the headstock when driving the spurs into the turning so that it doesn't damage the bearings in the headstock. If the turning is soft wood I sometimes just use the tail stock to push the turning onto the spurs. Make sure the tail stock turns freely on its bearing while your at it.


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## Bricknhank (Dec 28, 2013)

That looks to me like a very good lathe. No sealed bearings but that's not a huge deal. Looks like a keeper.


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## Dmeadows (Jun 28, 2011)

I agree with Charles, looks like it is there. Even if not the whole drive center is easy to replace and fairly inexpensive. I can't tell from the picture whether yours is MT1 or MT2, but here is an MT1 for $10...

http://smile.amazon.com/Grizzly-H34...d=1418994933&sr=8-2&keywords=mt1+Drive+center


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## john60 (Aug 30, 2014)

You have enough to get the money pit started. Go to you tube for some basic instructions
Very sharp tools will enhance your learing experience
. Get tools of high speed steel or better ( the carbon steel works but require very frequent sharpening). Basic turning is between centers. For bowls, platters, or hollow vessels you will need a face plate or chuck.

Live centers work best. You will also want a drill chuck, and the list of tooling goes on.

However it is a lot of fun and very satisfying

Penn State industries has pen starter kits and many lathe tooles and accesories


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## Phil P (Jul 25, 2010)

Hi Phillip

Even if that part is missing I don't think it's a biggie. At first sight it looks like it could be a Morse Taper #1 (MT1) centre like this one (just plucked from the net) and they are available from all sorts of places. The non-sealed for life bearings aren't really an issue - you just need to remember to give them a squirt of oil every now and again. If you know the thread type/size head spindle on the it should also be possible to get hold of 3- or 4-jaw chucks, etc. or a face plate to do non-spindle turning. There are real possibilities in that lathe and it looks like a good starter machine if you've never turned before

Good find!

Regards

Phil


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## PRDarnell (Mar 21, 2012)

Phillip,

Congratulations! Yes, Atlas and its line of Power King tools were popular homeowner tools in post-WWII America. They were manufactured in Indiana and some of their tools were re-badged under the Sears Craftsman label (tool numbers 534.xxxxxxxx). Since you've already found the Vintage Machinery site I encourage you to look around there and post information requests on their forum as well.

Have fun!

Paul


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## Herb Stoops (Aug 28, 2012)

The part you cite is the little center point that goes in the tailstock cup center. Since the tailstock has a morse taper hole in it ,you would be wise to get a ball bearing "Live Center" to replace the cup center. 
the other thing I would do ,would be to replace the single pulley on the motor with a cone pulley turned opposite of the headstock pulley,it will give you more speed options. 

Those are good lathes and with a face plate you can turn bowls on it too, from both sides of the headstock.

Herb


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## neville9999 (Jul 22, 2010)

Philip the only problem with the lathe is the sweep, this lathe is perfect to learn to turn on, low cost and you can learn to turn spindles, like table legs ans columns, the sweep looks small like less than 5 inches so you wont be making any bowls bigger than twice the distance from the center of the chuck to the bed, buy cheap tools and learn with them, grinding lathe tools is an art and you don't want to grind away expensive steel until you can do it and you know what the tool should look like when it is ground, later on you can buy quality HSS tools or the even more expensive Sorby type tools and they will last a long time as you wont grind the steel away unnecessarily, look for a local turning club as they can show you how. N


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## 8jmwoodie (Jan 2, 2014)

I had the same lathe for many years before passing it on to a friend. Jus needs standard faceplate to use when not turning spindles. It is possible to turn larger bowls on opposite side of headstock but would require repositioning of lathe on bench and rigging a tool rest.


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## Herb Stoops (Aug 28, 2012)

On closer look,it looks like it has bronze or babbit bearings in the head stock by seeing the oil cups.. Babbitted bearings were common in Atlas machines of that day,my dad had a Atlas metal lathe that had them.

Also you might have the center pin in the cup center on the tail stock, I think I see a set screw that holds it in place, it might be just pushed back flush inside the cup center.

Herb


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## Phil P (Jul 25, 2010)

Herb Stoops said:


> On closer look,it looks like it has bronze or babbit bearings in the head stock by seeing the oil cups.. Babbitted bearings were common in Atlas machines of that day,my dad had a Atlas metal lathe that had them.


That really surprises me, Herb. Someoneelse reckoned it was post WWII vintage, so I'd automatically assumed that it would have ball bearings by that period because after WWII they were so much cheaper (albeit still not fully sealed in the forties or fifties - hence the oilers). The newest piece of kit I've seen over here with plain bronze bearings was made in the late 1920s. I can't recall ever seeing machines with babbit bearings, but then a lot of older (industrial) stuff was converted to ball bearings in the 1930s, or scrapped, and the hobbyist stuff seems not to have survived.

Regards

Phil


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## phillip.c (Aug 9, 2012)

Thanks for all the input. From what I've read, the thing that should be inside of the hole (depicted in another picture below) is a "centering pin". 

Should I just buy any centering pin that will fit?

Could anyone suggest which turning tools I should start with? I will probably turn table legs mostly. 

Is there a reason to buy any other spur drive sizes for my purposes?

Thanks!


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## Herb Stoops (Aug 28, 2012)

Phil P said:


> That really surprises me, Herb. Someoneelse reckoned it was post WWII vintage, so I'd automatically assumed that it would have ball bearings by that period because after WWII they were so much cheaper (albeit still not fully sealed in the forties or fifties - hence the oilers). The newest piece of kit I've seen over here with plain bronze bearings was made in the late 1920s. I can't recall ever seeing machines with babbit bearings, but then a lot of older (industrial) stuff was converted to ball bearings in the 1930s, or scrapped, and the hobbyist stuff seems not to have survived.
> 
> Regards
> 
> Phil


I am just guessing, I don't think I have ever seen oil cups on ball bearings they are normally lubricated on the sides,with grease. But like I say I am not certain. 
My dads lathe was a mid 30's Atlas, the same as the Sears. 

Phillip, It would be better if you could knock out the cup center and install a live center,(0ne that spins with the work) you will like it better. The way the fixed cup center works is that it has a center pin to hold your work centered while you turn it. It doesn't move so the friction of the wood spinning on the centerpoint causes heat and it gets hot enough to burn. So the purpose of the cup is to put grease in it and this lubricates the wood you are turning, but it also throws small amounts of grease here and there and it will get hot too and start smoking and you will have to add more grease.
To remove the cup center, normally you would turn the handle running the tailstock spindle all the way in and then a steel bar inside will punch out the cup center. Don't beat on the hand wheel if it doesn't ,you will break it. 

SO since it looks like it has been sitting for a long time and the center cup will be stuck in the tailstock , run the spindle all the way out til it disengages from the hand wheel and pull it out of the tailstock. Since the spindle is hollow you will be able to bang out the cup center with a hammer and a bar. I would recommend soaking it in a container of penetrating oil for several days first to try to loosen it up. There was a source on this forum of a good penetrating oil just the other day, but I can't remember on which thread it was located.
When you put the spindle back lubricate it outside and the inside .

Herb


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## Herb Stoops (Aug 28, 2012)

Phil P said:


> That really surprises me, Herb. Someoneelse reckoned it was post WWII vintage, so I'd automatically assumed that it would have ball bearings by that period because after WWII they were so much cheaper (albeit still not fully sealed in the forties or fifties - hence the oilers). The newest piece of kit I've seen over here with plain bronze bearings was made in the late 1920s. I can't recall ever seeing machines with babbit bearings, but then a lot of older (industrial) stuff was converted to ball bearings in the 1930s, or scrapped, and the hobbyist stuff seems not to have survived.
> 
> Regards
> 
> Phil


Phil, according to the parts breakdown, it has (2) spindle bushings,and a thrust bearing, my guess is that they are brass or bronze.

Items like ball bearings were extremely hard to come by during the WWII, after the war they started showing up on equipment. My guess this is pre WWII lathe.

Herb


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## Nickp (Dec 4, 2012)

Herb Stoops said:


> There was a source on this forum of a good penetrating oil just the other day, but I can't remember on which thread it was located.
> When you put the spindle back lubricate it outside and the inside .
> 
> Herb


Is this the thread...? http://www.routerforums.com/table-mounted-routing/50538-greeting-fellow-routites.html

It mentions KROIL, PB Blaster and "Stick's Mix" of 50%ATF + 50%Acetone


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## Herb Stoops (Aug 28, 2012)

Nickp said:


> Is this the thread...? http://www.routerforums.com/table-mounted-routing/50538-greeting-fellow-routites.html
> 
> It mentions KROIL, PB Blaster and "Stick's Mix" of 50%ATF + 50%Acetone


Yes,yes, thats the one . Thanks for finding that,Nick.

Phillip, soak it in these for a couple of day if it is stuck.

Herb


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## BIG OLD TIM (May 13, 2014)

Phillip: that is a sweet little lathe you have! I definitely look for the 4 step motor pulley first thing after rust removal. It will make a world of difference for turning spindles and bowls. U-tube is a great source of information on turning. I have used it to get all sorts of tips on turning and sharpening tools. Check out Cap'n. Eddie Castelin's site. Makin' Shavins' Its at Big Guy Productions - Cap'n YouTube Gallery The old guy is full of himself but is a gold mine of info and he sells some unique products that are cheap. but good enough for any turner. 
And one observation about your lathe, it does appear to be a #2 MT. But be sure to check the dimensions of existing tapers before buying any attachments. 
And try to find someone close by your area to show you the 'ropes' of turning. it seems wood workers of all kinds, love to show their shops and prowess with tools of all kinds. All of them I know certainly do. I also know that you will be bitten by the turning bug too, like me.
TIM


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## phillip.c (Aug 9, 2012)

You all have been very helpful, Thanks!



Herb Stoops said:


> To remove the cup center, normally you would turn the handle running the tailstock spindle all the way in and then a steel bar inside will punch out the cup center. Don't beat on the hand wheel if it doesn't ,you will break it.
> 
> SO since it looks like it has been sitting for a long time and the center cup will be stuck in the tailstock , run the spindle all the way out til it disengages from the hand wheel and pull it out of the tailstock. Since the spindle is hollow you will be able to bang out the cup center with a hammer and a bar. I would recommend soaking it in a container of penetrating oil for several days first to try to loosen it up. There was a source on this forum of a good penetrating oil just the other day, but I can't remember on which thread it was located.
> When you put the spindle back lubricate it outside and the inside .
> ...


If I understand the situation, will the cup center be tapered? If so, I can replace the cup center with any live center that matches my taper? 

Thanks


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## Herb Stoops (Aug 28, 2012)

phillipdanbury said:


> You all have been very helpful, Thanks!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Yes, thats correct and the spur center is probably the same taper as the cup center. you knock it out by banging it with a bar thru the hollow headstock spindle.

Herb


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## wormil (Sep 6, 2012)

Some tailstock centers are self ejecting, you simply turn the tailstock wheel all the way in and it will pop the center out. 

Did we ever establish if it's mt1 or mt2? Here is the live center I bought for my '58 Craftsman and 30's Goodell Pratt.
Live Center, 1MT Heavy Duty 1704 - LittleMachineShop.com

In retrospect, I would buy this one instead.
https://www.highlandwoodworking.com/ballbearinglivecenter1mt.aspx


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## IC31 (Nov 16, 2012)

I just 'caught' this thread! It looks very similar to the Montgomery-Wards Power Craft wood lathe that my father in law gave me many years ago (along with a set of never used Greenlee chisels which are still in the original box). I've never had any real desire to use this lathe other then an occasional dusting off before shoving it back in the storage closet. Mine was purchased somewhere in the early '50s and was to be used for stairway spindles as he was a builder by trade but the bed is really too short. Mine also doesn't have a belt guard though and would have to be retrofitted for any use that I would ever have. And there are no ball/roller bearings, only a sleeve type to be oiled as used. 

Maybe someday


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