# Table saw opinions



## Sooner (Nov 3, 2009)

While I realize this is a router forum, most if not all of you are well rounded wood workers and have a signifcant knowledge of the tools involved, which leads me to my problem.

Up until now I have been using a borrowed Craftsman contractor style table saw, circa 1978 based on the model and serial number. While it does great at ripping large sheet goods, precision is not its strong suit, in fact precision and it simply don't belong in the same sentence.

So what I would like from some of you are your opinions on different hybrid table saws that are under $1000, have a self squaring fence because the fence on the craftsman is worthless, and are a hybrid design because it must sit flat against the wall in order for me to still be able to get my truck in the garage on the off chance that I actually get it clean enough to do so. Finally they must be able to run off of 110v power, as I don't have a 220v outlet in the garage yet....

Right now the two I have spent the most time looking at are the JET and the Delta 10" models. I was able to see the delta in person down at woodcraft where I find myself spending a large amount of my lunch hours these days and I like the way the Delta feels. Are there any other brands I should be looking at, or any specific places I should be searching. My idea is to keep it under $1000 with shipping/tax etc all total.


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## Mike Wingate (Apr 26, 2009)

I like table saws (and machines in general) with cast iron tables. I have a 10" startrite table saw. I do wish it had an extra 3/4" of cut at times. It will cut 3" with the gaurd removed.


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## TwoSkies57 (Feb 23, 2009)

Dan.. there are alot of good saws out there for the money you want to put out. A while back I picked up a Craftsman hybrid and I have to say, I have few issues of note. Plenty of power for my needs (serious more or less, hobbyist) The fence holds well, and is easily adjustable. Noise if fair to middlin, Fit and Finish are just fine for the money. I'd give dust collection at the 4" port a solid B, access to the belt and motor is easy enough. The cast iron wings were easy to mount and have stayed flush for well over 5 yrs now. Depth and angle adjustments are easily made, and hold well. My one complaint about the saw and its a biggie is that there is no mechanical trunion adjusment to true up the blade to the miter slots. You have to loosen up the whole chabang, fart around til ya get it, then tighten it back down, hoping that you nailed it. But once ya get it, she stays put for a very long time. 
The two saws you mention are a fine reputation no doubt!!! Can't comment on them, since I dont' own on. 
Sears is changing over their line and closing out some of the hybrid models including the one I bought. I wouldn't be surprised you could find one for under 800 bucks... Good luck with whichever saw you end up with...

bill


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## Ghidrah (Oct 21, 2008)

A big thing to pay attention to is table flat particularly around and across the throat. Rising up or down on either side can effect a blades vertical alignment.

Shortly after Delta was bought out, (4 or more yrs ago) there were rising complaints that their tables weren't up to par. Told to me by trusted WoodWorkersWarehouse store manager.

I have a Delta 10" cabinet saw, bought before the buyout but checked it anyway. It's low left of the blade but less than a sheet of writing paper, (a technical measuring tool).


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## jlord (Nov 16, 2009)

Hi Daniel
The saws you metioned are good saws. You could also look at the 
Powermatic & Grizzly also. I have two Delta's the cabinet 
& the contractor saws. You can get the Biesemeyer fence as an option when you buy the Delta's. It's a very good fence system & is jig friendly. You need a good acurate fence for precise cuts. The thing about Crarftsman is they change manuacturers about every 5 or 6 years & that's why there are so many parts for one style of saw such as plates. Just something to think about.


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## Hamlin (Dec 25, 2005)

I have Grizzly's Hybrid saw, an excellent saw. Cuts everything I need it to. It's rewired per their instructions to 220v, this alone made a great saw even better. If I ever have to replace it, it will be with a Grizzly cabinet saw.

I don't and won't recommend any of the sears table saws. The miter slots aren't exactly "true". If you wish to use a different miter gauge, you'll have to go back thru sears. I do have an older "bench top" ts of their in it's own stand, I only use it as a work table or a "storage" top.


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## 3efingers (Dec 21, 2006)

I've had a Delta 10 inch tablesaw for 12 years, was getting to the point I was not happy with it and on a whim replaced the fence with the Bessmeyer with the idea if that did not improve things with the saw I would have a good fence for a new tablesaw, made a big difference, thought I had a new saw, went ahead and spent some more bucks on a good blade, very happy with it, like they say "I'd rather be lucky than smart any day!"


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## BigJimAK (Mar 13, 2009)

I got a new Delta TS this last summer and its table is dead-nuts flat to the accuracy of my precision straightedge. As for a fence, I can't say enough good about the Biesemeyer that came with it. I spent about an hour very carefully aligning everything (would be 10 minutes for some folks but I was having fun with my new saw) and since that time haven't wasted my time measuring my wood for rip cuts (or for cross-cuts when using the fence with a stop block) as its that accurate.

No matter which hybrid you decide to buy, if you can spring an extra $100 for a Forrest WoodWorker II blade for it you won't be sorry. I added a think-kerf WWII to my last saw and it not only made my cuts ready-to-join, but it was as if my saw just got a tremendous HP upgrade.

Just my $0.02...


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## kp91 (Sep 10, 2004)

I've had the Craftsman Hybrid for years now, and it's been a great saw. The stock miter gage was too gimmicky, but the Bessimeyer fence is awesome. The outfeed table is a little flimsy to be supported by one support, but in general I"ve been very happy with it.

It looks almost exactly like the delta and steel city hybrids, but I don't know if they share suppliers.


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## Tommyt654 (Apr 5, 2009)

Home Depot is closing out the Ridgid Hybrid w/granite top foR $499


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## dutchman 46 (May 23, 2007)

I have a Ryobi BT3000, and i love the saw. Comes with the sliding miter table, and holds the measurements very well. I have used it for about 10 years, and i can't find a reason for anyone not to use one for normal use. I don't believe that i would use one for heavy work on a regular basis. It isn't hard t adjust ,and holds the adjustment very well. My saw came with a built in router attachment table This saw has been upgraded to a BT3100, and it is almost the same. Home depot is now the supplier, and if you wish to check out how other owners, the bt3 forum is an active sight, and it has many help issues there as well as lot of great ideas on shop made enhancements to make. http://www.bt3central.com/


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## Hamlin (Dec 25, 2005)

As you can see, for each of us, our choices are different, the same goes for routers too.  

The best choice for you, is what you like about a particular saw, (I hate to use that old cliche), it also depends on how it feels to you. Safety features, etc. Price may also be a factor but, never let that determine your choice when it comes to safety.


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## Duane867 (Oct 25, 2008)

If you want a really GOOD hybrid saw keep and not pay out the nose then keep one eye on Craigslist for a Ryobi BT3100 or BT3000. Wicked good accuracy, router table, and sliding miter table all built in with very good factory dust collection. I have the BT3000 and love it. I would venture to say that even if you have to buy a new fence for one you find ( bout' $90 shipped from Ereplacementparts.com ) it would be worth if. Its, light weight and easy to move around, smooth, quiet and holds true to the name " precision cutting system ". It will really surprise you. 

If you would rather buy new, Crafstman sells the SAME saw sold under the sears brand instead of Ryobi. It is item# 00921829000 Model# 21829. Sells for $499.99.

If space is not as tight in the long run I would HIGHLY suggest buying the Rigid granite top over this one though. BUT if space is a premium This saw is a winner IMHO. Like I said though, check Craigs list for a Ryobi BT3100 / 3000 1st. You can usually pick one up for around $200 or less used.


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## xplorx4 (Dec 1, 2008)

I have a Ridgid 3650, the older Ridgid, cast iron top and wings, I know there are others superior to this but if you could find on on Craig’s list jump on it. The big difference between the new and old Ridgid is the top, magnetic feather boards don't work well on the granite. The biggest difference is the fence; the new one is not as good as far as I am concerned compared to the old Ridgid


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## DJeansonne (Mar 27, 2009)

*Craftsman hybrid*

I have the Craftsman hybrid model 22214 (I think right #?)> This saw is good and there are many very satisfied users out there. It will do anything you need to do. The Biesemeyer fence makes it very very good. The saw is made made Orion which is owned by Steel City. The Steel City and the Craftsman is identical. the problem is that I don't think Sears is selling this model anymore.
I agree with others that you can look seriuosly at Grizzly.


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## BigJimAK (Mar 13, 2009)

Don is correct...With whichever saw you choose, the fence and blade are paramount. The saw is really little more than a motor and table. If the motor is large enough for your application and it can be aligned parallel with the miter slot, you're set. After having my setup for 6 months, a perfectly aligned and repeatable fence is a joy in and of itself. Now that it is set up, I have no need for measuring and marking my wood for ripping... just align the table-mounted rip width indicator and cut. Cut quality is based upon the blade and getting a really good blade is one heckuva TS upgrade. Before I bought my Uni I had a BT3000, a very accurate little saw but when I installed a think-kerf Forrest WoodWorker II on it, it went from a good saw to a mighty good saw!

Also, +1 on the BT3000... if I had the space, I'd have one as my second TS, and have almost bought one a couple of times but decided the "bride unhappiness quotient" wasn't worth *that* much! <g>


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## levon (Sep 14, 2008)

hello Daniel

as a former owner of a ryobi bt 3000 i would not recommend it for several reasons. first and most importantly, the bt 3000 is a good idea in ways, but i felt mine had the reliability of all the other ryobi products that i had tried. at this point, i would wait to buy anything longer and not buy anything with ryobi on it.

reason no. 2 was that it had no miter slot. you can buy a flimsy miter slot accexxory, but it isnt like having a cast iron slot built into a table.

i now own a ridgid 3660. its a lot better saw with more stability. it does a reasonably good job.

if i were buyiing a saw now, it would be a delta contractors saw with a biesemeyer fence.

just my .02 cants.


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## GoonMan (Mar 22, 2005)

Sooner said:


> While I realize this is a router forum, most if not all of you are well rounded wood workers and have a signifcant knowledge of the tools involved, which leads me to my problem.
> 
> Up until now I have been using a borrowed Craftsman contractor style table saw, circa 1978 based on the model and serial number. While it does great at ripping large sheet goods, precision is not its strong suit, in fact precision and it simply don't belong in the same sentence.
> 
> ...



Hello Sooner,

I have the older model Ridgid 3650, If I was going to buy a new saw I would buy the new Ridgid and replace the fence with a Biesemeyer 54" fence or I would buy a Grizzly Cabinet saw. Just not sure which one, I may end up replacing the fence one day on my Ridgid but right now it cuts everything I need it too.


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## AxlMyk (Jun 13, 2006)

If you don't plan on moving the saw around, take a serious look at the Hybrid cabinet saws. I have a Steel City and love it. No complaints at all. Sears also sells the same basic models.


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## Sooner (Nov 3, 2009)

Well I finally bit the bullet and went with the Delta Hybrid, for the moment it has the 31" T2 fence however at some point in the future I will likely replace that fence with the longer Biesmeyer. Having worked with it for a little bit now I am getting a little more familiar with it.

The saw was purchased assembled, and I spent the first night squaring things up, haven't gotten around to testing the 45 cuts on it but the fence, blade and mitre slot/gauge are now dead on square. I had to buy a mobile base for it because with a garage that doubles as a workshop, I must be able to get it up against one wall, and it just fits in the space that I have cleared out for it. I bought the JET mobile base at the same time as the saw (which put me over budget by about $100) but does allow me to move the saw easily. 

I notice some pretty heavy vibration on the saw during startup and shutdown, but once it gets up to speed there is very little and having it on a mobile base certainly contributes to some of that I am certain. At some point in the future I will replace the belt with an aftermarket one but for the moment it does remarkably well and is much more precise than my previous saw.

I was afraid I would have some buyers remorse spending that much on a table saw but I am very pleased with it up to this point.


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## GoonMan (Mar 22, 2005)

Sooner said:


> Well I finally bit the bullet and went with the Delta Hybrid, for the moment it has the 31" T2 fence however at some point in the future I will likely replace that fence with the longer Biesmeyer. Having worked with it for a little bit now I am getting a little more familiar with it.
> 
> The saw was purchased assembled, and I spent the first night squaring things up, haven't gotten around to testing the 45 cuts on it but the fence, blade and mitre slot/gauge are now dead on square. I had to buy a mobile base for it because with a garage that doubles as a workshop, I must be able to get it up against one wall, and it just fits in the space that I have cleared out for it. I bought the JET mobile base at the same time as the saw (which put me over budget by about $100) but does allow me to move the saw easily.
> 
> ...



Sooner the vibration you are having could be from the belt having a memory of being wrapped around the pullies. It may be something as simple as replacing the belt. I know after my table saw setting in storage for 1.5 years I noticed a little extra vibration. I am either going to replace the belt or go with the link belt system. 

Congrats on the new saw. I never regret spending money on wood working tools.:lol::lol: _My last 2 major purchases were the Large Griz Oscillating Sander, mobile bases, 3 Timber Wolf band saw blades and a 19" Band saw._:laugh::laugh:


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## TwoSkies57 (Feb 23, 2009)

DJeansonne said:


> I have the Craftsman hybrid model 22214 (I think right #?)> This saw is good and there are many very satisfied users out there. It will do anything you need to do. The Biesemeyer fence makes it very very good. The saw is made made Orion which is owned by Steel City. The Steel City and the Craftsman is identical. the problem is that I don't think Sears is selling this model anymore.
> I agree with others that you can look seriuosly at Grizzly.


Don.. I do believe you are correct about Sears not selling those saws any longer. It appears that have given up that line (one of which I own and can't really complain about it at all) to carry a couple of granite top jobs. I'm thinking they may have made mistake dropping the 22xxx series saws. 

bill


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## Duane867 (Oct 25, 2008)

GoonMan said:


> Sooner the vibration you are having could be from the belt having a memory of being wrapped around the pullies. It may be something as simple as replacing the belt. I know after my table saw setting in storage for 1.5 years I noticed a little extra vibration. I am either going to replace the belt or go with the link belt system.
> 
> Congrats on the new saw. I never regret spending money on wood working tools.:lol::lol: _My last 2 major purchases were the Large Griz Oscillating Sander, mobile bases, 3 Timber Wolf band saw blades and a 19" Band saw._:laugh::laugh:


Could be. Could it also be the blade ? Warped or what not ? Cheap blade syndrome ?


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## RLFX (Nov 20, 2009)

I got the new Riobi Folding love that thing under $500 !! 10" Pull out side pull out back
cut 4x8 sheet no probs !!


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