# Router Bits Off-Centered



## Alt (Jul 22, 2018)

12 Amp Craftsman Professional Plunge Router
Model number: 315.248851

I'm having problems with a second hand router. I think the main spinning shaft is bent, but I wanted to get another opinion before wasting time and money on parts. It's not significant, but you can see the off-centeredness if you watch the bits come to a stop. I tested the same bits on my drill press and they spin perfectly centered, so I don't think its them.

Does anyone think there could be something I'm missing, or perhaps an adjustment I can make? Or if not, which parts are probably causing the wobble. I've attached a GIF of the wobble.

Thanks!
Alt


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

welcome N/A..
it's called runout more often than not caused by a faulty bearing...


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## Alt (Jul 22, 2018)

So I should start by replacing the bearings?


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

Alt said:


> So I should start by replacing the bearings?


no..
evaluate...
who made the router???


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## Alt (Jul 22, 2018)

Craftsman. I haven't been able to find this specific model anywhere online.


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

Alt said:


> Craftsman. I haven't been able to find this specific model anywhere online.


315.xxx makes it a Ryobie...
the bearing will be a tough find... what's in it is proprietary...
a wholesaler may have it...

so now N/A let's introduce you to the world of Bosch...

*picking out a tool(s)...*
1st and most important, look to the company...
evaluate their CS and will they step up to the plate should there be issues...
see if they have a planned obsolesce program in force... as does craftsman...
what will the company and their product do for me...
try to figure out if they will respect me in the morning...

no sense in buying something that can't be fixed a few years later...

next the product...
quality..
will it have a long productive life...
will it do more than I need it to....
is it a good value...
will it protect my bottom line...
will it go the extra mile...
will it go obsolete or become disposable in short order...

tools that don't cut the mustard, suffer down time, hurt production and the bottom line need to left on the store shelf...

Online reviews...
not too much...
read a few too many that my VOE said other wise...
I prefer to use and abuse different brands and evaluate them myself and I pay attention at large job sites as to who has what and what, if any, issues they are having......
the testers should eval a tool and then put it in production mode for a few years and then do another eval..

Bosch fills the bill and then some...
2nd to none CS and support...
real work horse...
last long time...
protects my bottom line...

*WHY I LIKE BOSCH...*
2nd to none CS/TS support (American based) that's absolutely painless... They even support their tools that have been discontinued really well...
Their tools are real work horses...
planned obsolesce isn't an issue w/ them and come w/ less all around grief... 
they make tools that last a very long time... decades of hard heavy use..
they make tools that protect the bottom line... this I like...
Besides they being comfortable to use routers, they are much more feature rich, mighty fine soft start, way better fine depth adjustment, quality collets, and so much more... 
I think and believe Bosch to be an excellent outstanding company... 

Keep in mind, that saving some money now just may cost you more down the road... Do yourself a huge favor and get a Bosch...
Bosch consistently scores high in/on all categories of quality, CS/TS, reliability and support, and they are as close as a phone call and your mail box... 

http://www.routerforums.com/feature...ng-woodworking-equipment-tools-machinery.html


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## Hypnotoad (Apr 17, 2018)

Years ago I used to have to go find bearings for alternators, I would go to a bearing shop with the old bearings and they would simply measure the inside, outside and depth and get me the same bearing. If you're wanting a new router Bosch would be a good choice, so would Makita and Hitachi if you want a plunge router.


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## sunnybob (Apr 3, 2015)

A custom sized bearing is a very rare thing.
tool manufacturers use bearings made by bearing manufacturers.
If you can feel ANY side to side movement on the bit then its a bearing problem.
If you can disassemble the machine to get the bearing out you have a 99.99% chance of buying another bearing to fit, and it will be pretty cheap compared to a new machine.
But buy two because the one at the other end will be in the same state.


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## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

I would think that if the bearing is so bad that you can see the runout then you should also be able to hear and feel it. Usually when they get that bad they get noisy and vibrate. If you take the collet nut off and hold something with a sharp point across the base, touching the armature shaft, then when you spin it (by hand) there will be a gap when the armature is to one side if it's bent. At that speed the bearing won't be an issue unless it's really sloppy. When I say spin it I'm talking about maybe 1 turn in 5-10 seconds while you watch carefully to see if a gap becomes visible.


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## Danman1957 (Mar 14, 2009)

Welcome Alt,

Welcome to the Forum. What part of our great country do you call home.


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## Multiwood (Feb 24, 2013)

Welcome to the forum N/a


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## gmercer_48083 (Jul 18, 2012)

As Charles recommended testing for run out would be a good start. Remove the Collet to do the test on the shaft of the armature. You could do your "gif" filming again. There may be a collet issue causing wobble. Usually there is excessive noise from bearings as they go bad as an indicator.


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## Alt (Jul 22, 2018)

I thought they would have to be very specific bearings, so I didn't think I'd be able to do that. Thanks for the suggestion!


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## Alt (Jul 22, 2018)

Thank you!


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## Alt (Jul 22, 2018)

If I understand what you mean, I think I did do that test as well. The shaft its self also does not spin perfectly.


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## Alt (Jul 22, 2018)

I appreciate the advise. I'd rather stick with the one I have for now, as I just bought it, but if I can't get replacements parts I can see how I have few options.


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## Alt (Jul 22, 2018)

I'll have to check that... I don't think I could feel any wobble, but now I can't remember if I actually checked that.


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## Alt (Jul 22, 2018)

Hey! Thank you. I'm in Ottawa. Where are you?


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## Alt (Jul 22, 2018)

The router is new to me and quite a lot bigger then my old one, so I don't know if its noise level is partially the bearings I'm hearing or not. I'll give that test a try and get back to you. Thanks.


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## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

If the shaft is bent then it would require a replacement which wouldn't be worth it. 40 years ago I replaced a sears armature for $11 but that isn't the case anymore. A new router then was 80 or 90. That ratio got worse over the years. A few years ago I checked on an armature for a Freud and it was $10 cheaper than a new router.

There are several of us from BC but we have and have had members from all over the country. And we do a pretty good job of covering the globe too.


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## Alt (Jul 22, 2018)

That's quite unfortunate. I bought it off a relatives co-worker a year ago but didn't try using it until recently... which I realize sounds pretty ridiculous. Hopefully replacing it wouldn't be that expensive, but as you say it probably would be.


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## rabradbury (Jul 25, 2018)

Turn the rotor by hand, and see if you can feel any roughness. If so then it's for sure a bearing. If you can take the unit apart, and get at the bearings, then do so. Guaranteed since it is a Craftsman the bearings are a standard size. So go to a local supplier and have them match it/them. The bearings should only be a few dollars. Milwaukee, Bosch, and Makita are all good products.


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## radios (Sep 30, 2009)

the bearing will have a number printed on it, that number is the manufacturers part number, and it can be looked up on Google, it's VERY doubtful those bearings are discontinued by the manufacturer, since it would be a standard size, useable for many other applications. Ryobi DOES have a troubling planned obsolescence and quality issues, although tools made for Craftsman are better quality, the planned obsolescence remains..


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

radios said:


> Ryobi DOES have a troubling planned obsolescence and quality issues, although tools made for Craftsman are better quality, the planned obsolescence remains..


Craftsman tools have proprietary parts, router bearings is one of them...


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## malb (Sep 15, 2008)

I don't have info about the bit mounted in the router, but the run out that I could see in the GIF was about half of the bearing height. I think the router has been mishandled at some stage (maybe dropped or knocked of a bench with a bit mounted) that has resulted in a bent spindle between the lower bearing and collet. Generally the clearance between the armature and the field windings is kept to an absolute minimum as a significant gap reduces efficiency, and for the run out that I could see in the GIF, the armature would have to be poling (rubbing against the field windings) if all of the issue was caused by failing bearings. A simple test for this would be to disconnect the router from power, and rotate the armature/collect a few turns by hand, if you hear or feel a rhythmic scraping, or rubbing then at least the bearings are suspect. The only true way to check the armature is to dismantle the router and mount the armature between centres in an accurate lathe and measure the runout at various accessible points along the spindle. Do you have access to a decent experienced machinist?


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## Alt (Jul 22, 2018)

It hard to tell if I can feel roughness or not, but now that it's in a hundred pieces, I can see the bearing sort of hit a flat spot when rotated. Thanks!


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## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

If you can feel that then it's bad.


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## Alt (Jul 22, 2018)

I finally got a new bearing, and unfortunately that wasn't the problem. Do you know what else I might be able to check?


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

bent armature


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## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

Alt; take a deep breath, pour yourself a soothing beverage and calmly think this through...I'm not being sarcastic!
Seriously, if it's not the bearings then you're on the verge of throwing some real money at a problem that is basically a no-win situation.
You didn't mention how much you currently have invested in this particular router, but I'm guessing that you're at least going to double or triple your cost at this point. You'll still have a used router that likely isn't worth any more than you originally paid for it, but even if you could find a buyer after you repair it, you'll still be in the hole.
If you take the same cash and put it into a NEW router, you'll have a machine that's perfect, under warranty, and that has readily available parts should you need them.
You already know that Sears (Craftsman) is belly up here in Canada, so anything you need will likely have to come out of the US, assuming it's even available...shouldn't be any duty, but you may get stuck for brokerage fees and shipping is another aspect; assuming you want to actually use it in the near future, the parts situation may have you bogged down for an indeterminate amount of time. Personally speaking, that'd make me nutz (more so than normal)!
You might be able to find someone who needs the non-damaged parts from your machine and will be willing to take it off your hands...no need to just throw it into the scrap pile.
You might even be able to recover your original cost; the person looking for a newish switch or whatever is sort of in the same boat as you!

Good luck and I hope you'll give some thought to Stick's VoE and well reasoned argument for a NEW machine. 
In the spirit of full disclosure, I've been burnt every time I've gotten involved with used machinery, and I do mean _every_ time. To me they're toxic.


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## honesttjohn (Feb 17, 2015)

Good advice!!!


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

DaninVan said:


> Alt; take a deep breath, pour yourself a soothing beverage and calmly think this through...I'm not being sarcastic!
> Seriously, if it's not the bearings then you're on the verge of throwing some real money at a problem that is basically a no-win situation.
> You didn't mention how much you currently have invested in this particular router, but I'm guessing that you're at least going to double or triple your cost at this point. You'll still have a used router that likely isn't worth any more than you originally paid for it, but even if you could find a buyer after you repair it, you'll still be in the hole.
> If you take the same cash and put it into a NEW router, you'll have a machine that's perfect, under warranty, and that has readily available parts should you need them.
> ...


excellent advice Dan...
IIRC, Alt slung a pretty good sized bit on the end of an extension...


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## DesertRatTom (Jul 3, 2012)

I'm on the side of replacing the router with a Bosch 1617 EVSPK kit. I don't like repairing tools, It has usually been the beginning of a long, expensive and frustrating string of repairs. And Craftsman is no longer a great brand.


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

Alt said:


> I finally got a new bearing, and unfortunately that wasn't the problem. Do you know what else I might be able to check?


a little clarification please..
are you still experiencing ''runout'' or is the bit just offset to the hole in the base???
if it is just offset get you *one of these* to realign the router...

.


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## Alt (Jul 22, 2018)

I've never been clear on what runout meant. It seems as though the main shaft is slightly bent, or things just aren't sitting strait in the collet. That centering unit would be awesome if it could fix my problem.


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

Alt said:


> I've never been clear on what runout meant. It seems as though the main shaft is slightly bent, or things just aren't sitting strait in the collet. That centering unit would be awesome if it could fix my problem.


runout...
the end of the shaft wobbles...
strongly doubt you have a collet issue
start looking at this video at 2:25 for an example of runout..

.


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

Alt said:


> I've never been clear on what runout meant. It seems as though the main shaft is slightly bent, or things just aren't sitting strait in the collet. That centering unit would be awesome if it could fix my problem.


that cone is for centering the base plate to the center axis if the router..
that is all it does...


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## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

Basically run out is when the tip of a shaft scribes a circle as it spins instead of forming a point. I bought a Delta 16 1/2" drill press years back and it was drilling holes larger than the bits I was using. A 5/16" dowel would fall right through a hole drilled with that bit. I was trying to line up a brad point bit with the point I had marked on a board and I just touched the point to the board and it scribed a 1/16" circle instead of making a point. The quill had too much run out and I had to have it fixed.


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## Alt (Jul 22, 2018)

I apologize for my immense ignorance, but the bit in the drill is representing a router bit? The bits I've tested are all perfectly straight.


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## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

Alt; no need to apologize! Everyone here wants to help, and especially to make sure nobody gets hurt.
The diagnostic advice is to eliminate all the variables that _ aren't_ causing the issue.
The point about the bit shaft is that whatever deflection there is in the shaft itself is doubled as the bit rotates through 360deg.
ie if it's bent by .001" it is actually .002" out ...+..001" at the top of the circle and another .001" in the opposite direction at the bottom of the circle.
A stroboscope would allow you to actually see the wobble.
If you say the bit is perfect then it isn't that; it's likely the armature (ouch!).


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## Alt (Jul 22, 2018)

Thank you. I see. I'm fairly certain it isn't the bits. I can see the slight wobble on the router, but when I try them on my drill press they look perfect. I was really hoping it wasn't the armature. DX I've only been able to find one instance of its model number online. I doubt I could find a replacement even if it was worth it.


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## Mycrossover (Dec 29, 2017)

315.xxx is Ryobi, the supplier of many Sears routers


Stick486 said:


> no..
> evaluate...
> who made the router???


Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk


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## radios (Sep 30, 2009)

it's probably just the bearings. China makes almost everything for us now.. and MANY times they use common parts that are mass manufactured for other uses. the bearings should have a manufacturers part number, which can be searched for on Google. if not, then you can measure or have the bearings measured and order the proper one's from searching on Google.. you're not really going to find custom made parts for a limited range of products, it's too expensive to do it that way..


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## dekfin6 (Dec 8, 2018)

Thanks for the information.


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