# dowel spacing jig help needed



## sunnybob (Apr 3, 2015)

I'll try to explain what I want to do.
Picture the router outfeed fence.
I dont want a sliding fence, I want a series of hole spacings in the top edge of my home made fence, that will allow me to just pull up the dowel slide the half fence along a bit and relocate it by pushing the dowel back into the next hole.

Sounds simple, and I think i could do that but heres where it gets complicated;
Imagine a set of (say) 4 holes, at different spacings, and a couple of holes in the fence, also at different spacings that would give me a lot of extra settings to adjust to.
I dont want a slot because when tightening the fence to the slot, the fence goes out of square to the table. My sliding fence is above the rigid fence height, and clips over the top.


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## woodknots (Mar 7, 2012)

Morning Bob

I think I understand what you're saying, but can you post a picture of your fence so that we have a better ideal of what you're trying to do?


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## woodknots (Mar 7, 2012)

sunnybob said:


> I'll try to explain what I want to do.
> Picture the router outfeed fence.
> I dont want a sliding fence, I want a series of hole spacings in the top edge of my home made fence, that will allow me to just pull up the dowel slide the half fence along a bit and relocate it by pushing the dowel back into the next hole.
> 
> ...


Bob
After thinking about this, I wonder why you would need "a lot of extra settings".
The outfeed fence should move in two directions:
1. left to right to accommodate different size bits.
2. forward and back to accommodate joining operations.

I would think that you only have to determine the size of your largest bit and plan the placement of your outfeed fence based on that. A couple of holes in your rigid fence and one hole in your sliding fence and there you go "Bob's your uncle" (pun intended)

Secondly, if you use dowels then how do you adjust for joining, unless you don't use your router for joining operations?


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## Nickp (Dec 4, 2012)

Safe assumption the reason you want to move the fence is to make room for bigger bits...?

If so, the fence does not need to move a great deal...maybe 1 1/2"...?

It would seem that multiple holes in both your table's fence and your auxiliary fence would be overkill...maybe just one hole in your fence and 3 holes in the table's fence...?

What will you do for the infeed fence to match the outfeed...?

Might it be easier to fix whatever is wrong to your table's fence that it does not square when tightening the stock sliding fences...?


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## sunnybob (Apr 3, 2015)

I had to build a new fence because i had modified the old one once too often and it cracked.
So this Time I scrounged a metre of large window aluminium extrusion.
Now for the first time i know the fence is straight and rigid.

At this time, I'm just trying to get back up and running, so a forward back adjustment is for the future.

I think you are both right and I'm making this adjustment too complicated (its my only fault!) Yes I just want to keep the fence as close to whichever bit I'm using as possible, But the dowel no longer seems like a good idea.

By using this aluminium edge I have discovered a slight sag in the table from both ends to the router plate, so now I have had to adjust all that.
Then I had a brainwave and suddenly saw how to make my extraction blast gates more accessible. So I started off with a couple hours work and have only just finished 7 hours later.

Good job this is a hobby, I wouldnt work for the wages I pay.


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## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

I can easily see a sliding mechanism Bob but with just using dowels I`m not sure that you could take any slop out of it. You could taper the dowel at the top but that wouldn't mean that the bottom is tight. You could maybe design the movable part as a dovetail joint but if it`s tight enough to avoid play then it might be hard to slide. My personal opinion is that slots and mechanical fasteners should still be the most accurate.


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## Nickp (Dec 4, 2012)

So, Bob...the important point is you're still having fun... 

Think of it this way...you have finished a whole day of work and some of us haven't even started...


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## sunnybob (Apr 3, 2015)

When i retired, i decided to start woodwork, mainly because all my life I had hated it. I needed a challenge.

I have had a hell of a challenge this last 18 months, but i dont give up easily.

By making my own jigs and workshop furniture as much as possible, repairing it or updating it when needed, I'm becoming averagely proficient.

Fun? I suppose it must be, because nobody is making me go out there for 7 hours in the winter.

Success? kinda, I have a few boxes that are allowed inside the house. But I still wouldnt try to sell them.

And yes, I'm 7 hours ahead of USA eastern time, so I've finished my day just as youre starting yours.
Come on man, keep up!


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## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

Sorry Bob, I finally got smart enough not to accept challenges.


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## sunnybob (Apr 3, 2015)

I choose my challenges. A friend keeps telling me I should walk 6 miles a day. Another tries to get me to go running with him. A third is a 10 pints of beer a night socialiser.
Now THOSE are challenges I have no trouble giving up on!

But when a piece of machinery misbehaves... i just can not walk on by.


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## Nickp (Dec 4, 2012)

sunnybob said:


> *Come on man, keep up*!


But let's not forget...you'll be sleeping and we'll still be working...


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## woodknots (Mar 7, 2012)

sunnybob said:


> When i retired, i decided to start woodwork, mainly because all my life I had hated it. I needed a challenge.
> 
> I have had a hell of a challenge this last 18 months, but i dont give up easily.
> 
> ...


Is that an oxymoron like "jumbo shrimp"? >

Bob, I think you said somewhere that your fence is out of square when you use slots/bolts - can you expand on that?
Is it out of square on the vertical plane or the horizontal plane.
The homemade fence I made uses slots/bolts and I've not had a problem. I use two bolts on both the outfeed/infeed.


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

Nickp said:


> But let's not forget...you'll be sleeping and we'll still be working...


you are not retired Nick...
leave the serious stuff to those that are...

no get back to work...


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## Nickp (Dec 4, 2012)

Stick486 said:


> you are not retired Nick...
> leave the serious stuff to those that are...
> 
> no get back to work...


Yes, daddy... :crying:


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

Nickp said:


> Yes, daddy... :crying:


now why does ole man read into that??...


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## sunnybob (Apr 3, 2015)

Vince, my original fence had the problem of the two slotted and bolted sliding fences being out of square if you remember. Thats why i wanted to move away from that system.
But i have since realised that the problem was in my cracked fence, not the sliders.

This lump of extruded ali is not the ideal shape for a fence though, so I am thinking on my feet, making the sliding fences to fit the back fence shape. I really dont want to cut slots in the ali as I am worried it will weaken it and I'll be back to square one with a wonky fence.

Its all "prototype" stuff, which I quite enjoy. The alternative ( buying a $400 adjustable system) is not possible this year.
Today will see if it works or not. Just about to start in the workshop now, 1.40 am eastern time, hope the noise doesnt wake you.


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## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

Bob I've built 2 split fence systems now with no issues using carriage bolts to clamp it down to the main fence. I'm sure Vince will say the same. I'm not knocking the ali commercially built ones but you should be able to build your own for a few dollars instead of hundreds that works equally as well. If you use a straight flat piece for the horizontal base and attach a face to that with a few gussets for strength and to keep everything 90* and then attach faces they should be flush as long as they were straight to start with.


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## woodknots (Mar 7, 2012)

Bob
As Charles says, you can make your own for a few dollars. I posted a pic of the front earlier, here's a pic of the back showing the gussets that @Cherryville Chuck is talking about.


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## LazurusLong (Jan 20, 2015)

sunnybob said:


> I had to build a new fence because i had modified the old one once too often and it cracked.
> So this Time I scrounged a metre of large window aluminium extrusion.
> Now for the first time i know the fence is straight and rigid.
> 
> ...


Too True!!! Me too!


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## sunnybob (Apr 3, 2015)

Vince, thats what I did have, before the extraction system "improvements" proved too much for it.

I had to remove all of the centre part, use the two end 90 degree pieces to support the Aluminium box girder, then find a way of hanging sliding fences off the top of the box girder.
I never think to take pictures, as all my stuff gets modified so often the pics are obsolete before I post them. (g)

This incarnation of the fence is finished now. I might take a pic later. it looks a bit over engineered, but i think it will last this year out.


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## sunnybob (Apr 3, 2015)

ok, heres the mark 5 fence.
this shows the original 90 degree panels, and the dust extraction port screwed onto the new aluminium box section










This is the side view of the new sliding fence, you can see it just sits in the runner.









and this is both fences in place. They are a good friction fit. i have used the fence a couple times and so far the friction is enough to hold the fences in place without needing securing. I suspect that might change in time.


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## woodknots (Mar 7, 2012)

Bob

That's very clever - not sure I would have used MDF though


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

isn't that rally particle board???


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## woodknots (Mar 7, 2012)

Hard to tell from the picture - the backboard and the dustport (white) looks like particle board (loose pores) and the auxiliary fence looks like MDF


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## katabrontes (Nov 12, 2014)

Sounds a bit like the Festool system for making holes at regular intervals eg for adjustable bookshelves. Expensive if you don't' have the Festool perforated track and router base.


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## sunnybob (Apr 3, 2015)

Vince, I've said it before, I dont use good wood (or techniques) when making my work benches etc. I seem to knock them all down and rebuild as I learn more, so often that good materials are completely wasted. (lol)

youre right on all the parts listed. I had everything apart from the MDF laying around. I used MDF as its the flattest material I can find. The MDF cost me almost $5 cut to size for me. The whole fence has cost me about $20 now, dont want to get too expensive (g)

If I ever reach the stage of deciding its finished, I shall make it again with more care and better materials. I already have one improvement in mind. I'll use it for a few weeks and see what happens.

Just finished rewiring all the sockets and switches to make a cleaner and more efficient workshop.

I'm coming to the conclusion that I enjoy building the workshop more than I enjoy making wooden things.


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## sunnybob (Apr 3, 2015)

katabrontes said:


> Sounds a bit like the Festool system for making holes at regular intervals eg for adjustable bookshelves. Expensive if you don't' have the Festool perforated track and router base.



Yeah, gave that idea up pretty quick. I always start complicated, then refine and simplify as i go.


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## woodknots (Mar 7, 2012)

sunnybob said:


> Vince, I've said it before, I dont use good wood (or techniques) when making my work benches etc. I seem to knock them all down and rebuild as I learn more, so often that good materials are completely wasted. (lol)
> 
> youre right on all the parts listed. I had everything apart from the MDF laying around. I used MDF as its the flattest material I can find. The MDF cost me almost $5 cut to size for me. The whole fence has cost me about $20 now, dont want to get too expensive (g)
> 
> ...


The workshop is an ongoing project - mine's been ongoing for the last 13 years and still not finished. :surprise:

Looking forward to your finished fence.


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## sunnybob (Apr 3, 2015)

vchiarelli said:


> The workshop is an ongoing project - mine's been ongoing for the last 13 years and still not finished. :surprise:
> 
> .


 HAH! you got 11 years start on me, I'll need a little time to catch up.


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## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

All my jigs are built from spare parts too Bob. Save your cash for the stuff you can't make yourself.


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## sunnybob (Apr 3, 2015)

I need a jig for cutting accurate angles. Its driving me bonkers.

An 8 sided box turns into a disaster if the angles are 23 instead of 22.5 or one side is a 1mm longer than the others
But thats another thread


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## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

I can take that post and turn it into a new thread if you want Bob.


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## RainMan 2.0 (May 6, 2014)

sunnybob said:


> I'm coming to the conclusion that I enjoy building the workshop more than I enjoy making wooden things.


That pretty much sums it up for me to Bob 


Btw I'm liking this thread as I want to build a router fence myself


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## sunnybob (Apr 3, 2015)

Cherryville Chuck said:


> I can take that post and turn it into a new thread if you want Bob.


 Charles, why not?

When man first started being accurate, he made the best he could, and with that made something slightly better, and so on and so on, untill we have the "dead on" that we enjoy today. But i dont have a few hundred years, and I also (sadly) dont have the money to just go out and buy an incra micro thingy.
So, using the most basic of tools, how do I make an ACCURATE and repeatable angle cutter?


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## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

My mistake Bob, thought I could rename it and move that one post to a new thread but the forum wants to move everything from post number 1. I guess you`ll have to start a new thread.


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## sunnybob (Apr 3, 2015)

dont fret, I have several projects that need attention. maybe next week.


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