# Tablesaw/Router table-Kickback on camera



## TomE (Dec 17, 2010)

I suppose that this thread will be redirected to Safety but I see a little more action here and it might get a little more exposure. 

Tom Hintz over on another forum posted up his kickback "test" for all to see.


New table saws are fitted with much more convenient and effective splitters/riving knives so I suspect that they will be used more frequently.

Older saws (Craig finds, etc.) may not come with these "useless" accessories, being lost or pitched into the bin long ago. Make sure that a suitable aftermarket device is available before purchasing these oldies but goodies and get both.

Be smart, be safe.

Here's the link...Kickbacks! - NewWoodworker.com LLC


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## MEBCWD (Jan 14, 2012)

Everyone,
*This is a must watch!*

Like it shows in the video, you don't realize how fast things can happen.

You don't realize how much much power the workpiece has when it is thrown from the tool. I have seen a 1/4" piece of honeycomb nomex panel (fiberglass like faced panel with paper type honeycomb core) put a hole in heavy metal siding of a aircraft hanger. It was just the corner that penetrated the siding but what if it had been a person.

*ALSO NOTE WHERE THE SAFETY ZONE IS !!* It is not behind the the operator of the tool, so don't let anyone stand behind you when cutting. It could be one of you children or grandchildren standing there and a child would not know that something like this could happen, it's up to you to keep people out of the *DANGER ZONE*.

Use the safety devices on your tools, they were supplied with the tool for that reason.

Work safe, have fun, cut some wood,
Mike


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## TheOakDude (Oct 11, 2011)

Wow!


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## OPG3 (Jan 9, 2011)

Tom, THANK YOU VERY MUCH for sharing this! I will never again cut without a riving knife and bladeguard on my saw. Admittedly, I have often made table saw cuts without those safety accessories, but this video really opened my eyes to what could happen. I want to tell you that this may be one of the most sincere videos that I have ever seen!
You have made a positive impression on me more than you will ever know. I would, however; offer one suggestion - the title of this thread made me think of a _financial_ kickback on the _sale_ of a camera. Thousands of members should be reading this thread! It is so important and you're a great teacher for showing this!


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi

Now this is why I push using the RAS over the table saw, you can take your hand off the stock with a RAS and it will just stay in place but I do use a small hold down device if the stock is small/short..

Many take off the safe guards because they just don't work, the 1st time you want to cut on a rabbit or use a dado blade set they are in the way not to say anything about if you want to pitch the blade over a it bit..so off they come and most of the time they don't go back in place the norm, any time you don't make a full pass over the blade the safe guards are just some junk on the take saw to get hung up on..

I use the buddies to keep the board flat down to the top and to the fence and I use them on the router table also, they only turn one way so you can't push the stock by the router bit the wrong way,you can take your hand(s) off the stock and it will stay in place you will you never have a kickback with them or to say a board taking off like rocket from the table top.

Board Buddies® For Table Saws 
G2370 Board BuddiesÂ® For Table Saws - Yellow

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## reikimaster (Sep 29, 2005)

I've been shopping for a table saw. (In case you hadn't noticed) and I've been combing craigslist for a used one that might give me more saw for my money. Virtually none of the used saws come with any of the safety guards. At least not that I've seen. 

I've also been considering buying a NEW saw (Steel City 35990).

This video might have just pushed me hard in the "buy a NEW saw" direction. When I'm not making sawdust, I paint in oils, and I carve wood and stone. All of those things depend heavily on having fingers.


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## TomE (Dec 17, 2010)

*Table Saw/ Router Table Kickback on camera*



OPG3 said:


> I would, however; offer one suggestion - the title of this thread made me think of a _financial_ kickback on the _sale_ of a camera. is!


LOL, I can see some confusion about the species of kickback you mentioned.
I've just changed the title to clarify a little.

PS. Well, I thought I changed the title, guess it did'nt take on the main page.


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## The Warthog (Nov 29, 2010)

My wife used to stand behind me to watch, but since I told her that pieces of wood can come back at 200 km/h, she doesn't do that any more. Cool video.


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## jruimy (Jan 14, 2012)

Thanks for posting. I will continue to be OCD about safety.


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## TomE (Dec 17, 2010)

bobj3 said:


> I use the buddies to keep the board flat down to the top and to the fence and I use them on the router table also, they only turn one way so you can't push the stock by the router bit the wrong way,you can take your hand(s) off the stock and it will stay in place you will you never have a kickback with them or to say a board taking off like rocket from the table top.


Yep, I use similar when I go without the splitter, these aftermarket thingy's do work well. As you say, they press down and into the fence allowing for a little more accuracy along the full cut. Many a time I have left the rip "live" in place and pulled the final foot or so through,.... which I would never attempt without these devices. You can also feed stock continuously with these as long as the out feeds are pushed out of the way.


I must admit that do I try to avoid ripping short stuff like Tom shows in his demo but when I do I either go to the bandsaw or use a Grr-ripper to control the cut on the table saw.

(I rig up the same hold downs differently on my saw)


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

HI Tom

Yep they also work great, if I need to rip short small boards or thin/norrow ones I put on the type below.I have one that's only 1/4" wide but the one in the picture is 3/4" wide but they work the same way as the buddies.
The ones for the router table are about 2" thick the norm. or to say two boards glued up as one board but just on the ends so they still spring have the spring built in the hardwood stock.
The wider stock will but a bigger foot print on the stock,they can be clamped to the table top or put in a tee slot in the table top or the fence or clamped to the fence a pair of them works the best for me on the router table..one on the in feed side and one on the out feed side of the bit/fence.

Here's a link how to make them.
http://www.routerforums.com/shop-safety/9874-ice-hold-downs.html
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TomE said:


> Yep, I use similar when I go without the splitter, these aftermarket thingy's do work well. As you say, they press down and into the fence allowing for a little more accuracy along the full cut. Many a time I have left the rip "live" in place and pulled the final foot or so through,.... which I would never attempt without these devices. You can also feed stock continuously with these as long as the out feeds are pushed out of the way.
> View attachment 50290
> (I rig up the same hold downs differently on my saw)
> 
> ...


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## TomE (Dec 17, 2010)

Bob,

Those little guys are just too cool, nice job.


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

HI Tom

Thanks
I got the tip from the RWS videos, I now use them on all my router tables and table saws..great way to use up the scrap hardwood around the shop. 

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TomE said:


> Bob,
> 
> Those little guys are just too cool, nice job.


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## Chris Curl (Feb 13, 2012)

here is my post in the other thread (for those of you who didn't notice the thread in safety) ...


me said:


> wow ... that is really scary. i was one of the idiots and was using my table saw without the guard and trying to rip a thin board. long story short, i nicked my thumb and believe me, i was EXTREMELY lucky that it wasn't much worse. i spent the rest of the afternoon at the emergency room.
> 
> I was one of those idiots who said, "I'll be careful, it won't happen to me". what an arrogant dumbass i was.
> 
> ...


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

HI Chris

Sorry and very sad ,this can come about if you don't use push sticks,not push blocks but push sticks..you can replace a push stick in about a min.or two but the fingers can take weeks and weeks to replace if you're lucky.. 
I use the golden rule of 6" ,my hand is always 6" from the blade.
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Chris Curl said:


> here is my post in the other thread (for those of you who didn't notice the thread in safety) ...


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## Hsobel (Jan 25, 2012)

This is why I invested in, not one but two, Grr-Ripper push blocks from micro jig (Micro Jig | Homepage | Woodworking Evolves™ | Woodworking Safety Tools | Table Saws Safety Accessories | Wood Work Tools | How to Table Saw). Check out the videos on the website. Their zero clearance insert and kerf spreaders look like a good investment too.


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi

I did try out the grr-ripper and I didn't care for it that much I found out that my forearm was now in danger and it broke the golden rule and I found out you need to push the board and the grr-ripper pass the blade all the way b/4 you take your hands off it or the cut off part would take off like a rocket ,I think it would be great for short boards under 12" or less but my arms are not that long to make the long push over the blade without getting on top of the box so I could get on top of the table saw so to speak. 



I didn't try it out on the router table because it did make me a happy camper on the table saw, you need to takes your hands off it at some point in the pass or to say reset your hand in the pass by the bit the norm.


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But that is just my 2 cents the guy with the short arms.. 



Hsobel said:


> This is why I invested in, not one but two, Grr-Ripper push blocks from micro jig (Micro Jig | Homepage | Woodworking Evolvesâ„¢ | Woodworking Safety Tools | Table Saws Safety Accessories | Wood Work Tools | How to Table Saw). Check out the videos on the website. Their zero clearance insert and kerf spreaders look like a good investment too.


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## Chris Curl (Feb 13, 2012)

thanks bob. i'm going to get or make some of those guide buddies ... i can see how they could make life a whole lot safer

those GRRRIPPers look cool too!


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## TwoSkies57 (Feb 23, 2009)

Got the title changed for ya TomE...


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## TomE (Dec 17, 2010)

I'm not too fond of any operation that has flesh passing directly over a cutter of any kind but the GRR-ripper does come as close to making it safe as I come across.

Just set it up correctly, keep the "rubber" clean and don't let up on the side and down pressure until the cut is done and clear of spinning sharps. 

As Bob infers, limit it pretty much to the short stuff allowing for a single motion without the need to relocate the hands during the cut. Other options are available if the stock is longer.


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

hi

The video makes me recall the joke below 

Router Forums - View Single Post - Joke a Day

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## OPG3 (Jan 9, 2011)

Here my text is simply to help this thread "float" to the top. - it is THAT important.


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## Seenya (Apr 11, 2010)

This video scares the @#[email protected] out of me. Reminds me of when I first acquired a router table. I ran a piece with the cutter and it shot off the table like a rocket. The middle finger of my left hand barely nicked the cutter. By barely, I mean it only took off one layer of skin. After turning off the router and cleaning up I went inside, sat down and stared at my guitars. I've been playing guitar for over forty years and in a nano-second I could have never played again. I knew I had dodged a bullet. I literally shiver whenever I think about it. Safety is now my most-used tool.


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## papasombre (Sep 22, 2011)

Hi, Tom.

Your video is impressive. Even planning the TS kick back, you almost were hurt. I remembered I almost ripped my left thump in my TS some years ago.

Thanks a lot for risking your hand to show us how to use our tools.


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## TomE (Dec 17, 2010)

TwoSkies57 said:


> Got the title changed for ya TomE...


Thanks..I was wondering how that happened.

Please note that I'm just a messenger passing along some information.

The gent who did the real work in the video is Tom Hintz with whom I'm not acquainted but I'm sure he appreciates any thanks given.


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