# groove in floor with router



## ezr (Jun 3, 2013)

Hello all;

I'm new here and I'm not a professional at all. I just came across this forum so I decided I can get some help here.

I'm planning to do Radiant floor heat for an upcoming project and here is how I plan on doing it.

I will groove in a 3/4" diam. hole in the floor plywood where I will insert the pex tubing.

I know this will be a hard job so I'm trying to figure a way to make it as easy as possible.

My question is if there is a router that is controlled by a wheel like a grass cutter for example, so I can operate it while standing and moving forward in a linear way?

Maybe my question don't make sense at all. I'm just trying to figure if that's an opition.

Thank you very much


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## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

Interesting picture. I always thought radiant heat tubing was bedded in mortar or cement to create a thermal mass for better efficiency. I've never seen a router that has a long handle or wheels as you suggested. It won't cut as fast as you are suggesting either. I think you are stuck to nailing a straight edge to the floor and guiding the router along it. You are probably going to need more than one bit. Plywood is hard on them. You could speed up the routing part and make it a little easier on the bit and on the router by making a couple of slits with a circular saw first. 

Don't try to freehand rout the groove. It would probably turn out so crooked that you might not be able to get the pipe to lay in the groove. You can also only rout in one direction. If you and the router are facing the guide strip, rout from left to right.


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## Harrison67 (May 30, 2012)

Personally, I have never seen such a contraption...but that doesn't mean that somebody out there hasn't already made, and used one.

As a Machinist, I can see how it could be made to work; but it would take too long to type it all out.

In Machining....all things are possible.:big_boss:


Hmmmm, as long as the machine could be made to track straight, and not wander laterally, .......that would still be a lot of work, but at least you would be standing, instead of on your knees.

Good question.


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## Harrison67 (May 30, 2012)

With a horizontal shaft, and a gang saw, (similar to circular saw blades), the slot could be cut easily in one pass.

Carbide naturally,--the gang saw set-up would do the trick.


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## NotToDay (May 15, 2013)

If the floor isn’t down yet lay the sub flooring then cut runners for along the tubing rout radius bends for the return bends in your tubing. If the floor is already down you might want to look into staple up from underneath the existing floor


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## dick in ia (Jul 23, 2007)

How many layers and what is the total thickness of the existing floor? 
If the original floor is 3/4" you will weaken the floor structure too much. If you have an underlayment layer on top of the sub floor, simply remove it and strip the floor to allow for the pex tubing.


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## ezr (Jun 3, 2013)

Harrison67 said:


> With a horizontal shaft, and a gang saw, (similar to circular saw blades), the slot could be cut easily in one pass.
> 
> Carbide naturally,--the gang saw set-up would do the trick.


Give me some more info please. I know of other ways to do radiant floor heat, I'm just trying to figure if grooving might be an option.


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## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

Instead of trying to cut grooves, how about laying the pipe, fill the gaps around it with pieces that can be cut with circular saw and jig saw, and then cover over that with more sheathing? As Dick pointed out, you may not have enough existing thickness to groove anyway.


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

Watch out for nails! Makes me cringe just thinking about it.

Edit: Looking at the picture a little closer, that is a special 1 1/8 inch subfloor called warmboard. It already has the grooves milled into it.

I guess you are going to attempt a DIY version of it, huh?
Good luck with your project.


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## TRITONEER (Jan 21, 2012)

*Laying pex pipe ;routing floor*



ezr said:


> Hello all;
> 
> I'm new here and I'm not a professional at all. I just came across this forum so I decided I can get some help here.
> 
> ...


Hi Tritoneer here !,

You will need to make a twin rail guide system(jig) --this is just an idea 

2x 6ft 1/2" aluminium angle fixed together at each end
The Triton AJA 150 overhead mounting kit to fix your router
The bearings on the overhead mounting chassis will glide along the aluminium angle giving you a nice straight cut

you will have to work out your height from the floor according to you router cutter bit -maybe use the long bit from a kitchen set
best regards Paul Chaundy TRITONEER -WORKCENTRE CENTRAL


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## Coleve (Oct 31, 2012)

Hi
A couple of things you may want to consider. The pipe is subjected to expansion and contraction and the industry substrates are designed to allow for this so make sure your groove allows for this and not too much as you will get creep and chaffing on you pipe during the heating and cooling process. When the pipes are submerged into a concrete screed they are initially expanded with compressed air until the concrete cures then allowed to revert so causing a small space between the outside walls of the pipe and the concrete, hope this helps 
Colin


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## mgmine (Jan 16, 2012)

I used radiant flooring and if there is an alternative then use it. Radiant is a nice idea but does not heat as well as conventional heating. In addition it will make your feet uncomfortable when sitting for a long time. If you do cut the grooves you will most likely ruin the integrity of the sub floor. Your best bet would be to run strips of 1x4 over the joists, lay the tube down and then cover the complete floor with another sub floor. You will need to cover the floor anyway because you can't lay carpet or tile over the tubing.


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## Everend (Mar 15, 2013)

Dito to what someone else said, the subfloor in that photo is 1-1/8" thick, I think this would be the absolutely minimum thickness of subfloor to consider routing a zig-zag across. Around here all the subfloors are 3/4" thick and there's no way I would consider cutting even a little into a 3/4" floor. 
I'm also worried about nails and screws. If the floor is already thick and is a double layer, I'll guarantee there are two sets of screws/nails holding it to the joists, the set holding the lower layer you won't see until you hit it and break your bit. 
If it's a new floor, then lay the first 3/4" and pour the right kind of concrete around the tubes. If it is an old floor that is thick, pull up the top layer and pour around the tubes. If it is really 1-1/8 + already, I'd first consider raising the level of the floor by laying the tube right on it, if not, remove the 1-1/8" and lay 3/4" before pouring around the tubes.


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## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

EZR; first, welcome!

As Dick suggests, you're not really taking into consideration all the elements illustrated in the drawing. The Aluminum bonded layer is essential for the transfer of heat in their system. The total thickness of the 'Warmboard' is approximately that of a poured radiant floor, over _plastic_ PEX radiant tubing. 
If you already have radiant hot water baseboard heating, you might want to consult a Radiant Heating specialist to confirm that ADDING in-floor radiant will be compatible with your existing system. 
Gypcrete concrete Pour.mov - YouTube


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## Dr Neon (Apr 15, 2010)

Hi Guy.
The 1-1/8" base layer is one key issue. The aluminum on top of it is another. Together they give you the strength to go 3/4" into the floor, and a way to spread the heat around. If you already have 3/4" material down on the floor, I'd suggest the addition of another 3/8" layer. I don't see an easy way to replicate their aluminized coating, save maybe a good coat of aluminum paint before you install the PEX. A straightedge (wood or aluminum) screwed down to the floor will give you a good guide line for routing. (get at least two carbide edged 3/4" plunge bits. The glue in plywood tears up router bits) You could make a bandsaw-cut jig for the 180 turns at the end of each row. With proper layout it should go pretty quickly. You will have to get down on the floor, though... Use drywall screws to tie down your jigs, that way you can take them up and move them easily. BTW, a 3/4" deep slot will take at least two passes to route. Most better plunge routers have a step system for the plunge depth. It'll take a while to do, but you will really like those warm floors in the cold times.
Tim


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