# Why the complex, expensive router fences?



## TWheels (May 26, 2006)

One thing that has been puzzling me for some time is why do people use the very complex, expensive router fences when some simple modifications of the Router Workshop fences are far more flexible in use. The changes I would make to the Router Workshop typoe fence is to make it higher, around 6 inches (150 mm) high where the wood meets the router bit, with the guard adjustable in height and a means to attach a vertical featherboard.

Please do understand that I am a weekend hobbyist, not a professional woodworker, and do router work for fun, not for profit. I also have learned the hard way about safety issues and the need for continuous attention and a clear mind. (My router injury was very minor in comparison to those posted in the Shop Safety subforum.)


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## TWheels (May 26, 2006)

OK, I am a terrible typist! The Thread title should read "Why the complex, expensive router fences?"

If a moderator were to correct the spelling in the title of this thread I would be most appreciative. (I cannot figure out how to make the correction myself.)


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## Cassandra (Mar 15, 2006)

Hi Tom:

Some people prefer to work on projects rather than making workshop tools. 

Then there are some who have more money than brains. 

I have the Incra LS 17" Super System. This system does what I need it to. Expensive yes, but I didn't have to take time to make my fence (which I will do later.) Why? Quick set-up (to 1/32") for cuts. Repeatibility. Easy offsetting of the two halves for edge jointing. 

I guess I might be in the second group.

Cassandra


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## TWheels (May 26, 2006)

Hi Cassandra,

Thanks for your response. I definitely do enjoy all aspects, including building workshop tools for use in projects. Once I finish my major project I will have saved several thousand dollars over what is commercially available.

How much time does your fence save you, compared to a Router Workshop style fence? I know you like your fence very much, and from what I know of the model it is one of the better "complex, expensive" fences.

When you do build your own fence, what would it be like? How would it differ from the one you use now?

FYI, I would _never_ put you in the second group; but with two kids in college, etc., I definitely do not have excess money. I leave to others to judge my money to brains ratio.


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## Phil P (Jul 25, 2010)

Tom

I am a believer in the KISS approach. My router table is often little more than a piece of plywood with a hole in it and my fence a piece of 3 x 2in planed softwood. For the vast majority of my router table tasks those will suffice.

Regards

Phil


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## Marco (Feb 21, 2009)

Tom you bring up the subject of time vs. money. I'm cheap so I try to build what I can to save the money. One of the Cons is the time it takes from the little alloted time the hobbiest has to put towards building this accessory and making thst jig eats up most of the available time I the hobbiest has. On the Pro side, you learn a lot of what to do and not do making this accesory and that jig however a shop full of jigs and accesorrys isn't much to show for your time and effort....... in a perfect world I would have bought everything I saw and started building right away........... but it's not


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## Quillman (Aug 16, 2010)

Safety & expedition, repeatability, ease of adjustment, efficiency, zero loss of position whilst routing, and accuracy.


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## dutchman 46 (May 23, 2007)

Hello : Tom! I agree that all You need is a nice straight piece of wood, or a homemade fence, if You enjoy building nice thing,inc. tools! Al tho You can buy the plastic material for jigs, a piece of wood will do the same thing if You want to use it zero clearance; It will do as good a job as any thing else, I believe. When You want to show off Your table, then You can still build some very nice fences!


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## Cassandra (Mar 15, 2006)

mftha said:


> Hi Cassandra,
> How much time does your fence save you, compared to a Router Workshop style fence? I know you like your fence very much, and from what I know of the model it is one of the better "complex, expensive" fences.


I don't know how much time it would save me. I am sure that Bob and Rick are very proficient at setting their fence. I wouldn't be. It comes down to what one is adept at doing. 



mftha said:


> When you do build your own fence, what would it be like? How would it differ from the one you use now?


My table top is 24 x 48 inches. So, the fence is a long one, made from 3/4" baltic birch plywood, fashioned on what was shown in one magazine. 

L-shape
Base is 4x48 inches, 1-1/2inches thick.
Riser is a stack of 3/4 inch plywood layers, about 1-1/2" x 48"
Faces are two 4x24 inches, 3/4 inch thick.
Aluminum angle at bottom of faces to keep the faces in line and to allow adjusting the gap between them. 
Dust collection port out the back.
T-track for stops and featherboards.

To build it, I'll need a set of skis, along the line that Harry pushes. I can use my router table top to run the skis on, while flattening the riser.

I was in the process of making it when I decided to buy the Incra system. So, the fence on the to-do list.

Cassandra


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## walowan (Jan 21, 2011)

My fence is a couple of pieces of MDF in an L shape with a couple of guessets to keep it at 90 degrees to the table top. Held in position with two knobs in T track. My router table is the wing on my table saw.


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## Tempest (Jan 7, 2011)

I love my Jointech fence. Repeatable increments and accurate to .001". Using a basic fence is very frustrating after using such a system.


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## StephenO (Jan 1, 2011)

My fence is a mishmash of parts scavenged from two other fences, 3/4" MDF, and an Incra positioning jig.


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## jlord (Nov 16, 2009)

While I do like my fences to give me options like mountinf feather boards, stop blocks, Etc. I have had to make quick setups using a piece of plywood. Here is one that I made in about 20 min to make some raised panel doors. It's just a piece of 3/4" plywood with a piece of hardwood for the fence clamped to a set of horses. 

I did have to add a couple of 2X4s to take the sag out from the heavy Porter Cable 3-1/4hp router that was screwed to it. I drilled a hole for a carriage bolt to make it a swing fence with a clamp on the other side. It worked well.


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## TomE (Dec 17, 2010)

Cassandra said:


> Some people prefer to work on projects rather than making workshop tools.


Cassandra pretty much nails it for me.

If a commercially available upgrade is available at a cost comparable to the time, material and brain investment needed to make up something, then I buy.

Also, as Pat mentions, repeatability, ease of adjustment, efficiency, zero loss of position when routing, and accuracy.

For a "one of" project or a plan/design that's better than what's commercially available (within reason) then making up something is no problem.


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## TWheels (May 26, 2006)

It occurred to me that the title I used to start this thread might have perjorative connotations. In no way was that my intention. To all who feel that I communicated something derogatory about these high tech fences, I sincerely apologize.

Two of the high tech fences have been specifically named, the Incra LS 17" Super System and the Jointech fence. The precision and reproducibility of positioning I understand, and once having becomed accustomed to those properties I do see how the basic fence could be very frustrating.

I do not see however that the high tech fences are necessarily safer than the basic type fence.

I have one more question: In at least one episode the statement is made that for each new router bit you obtain, you need to buy a new router. Hence this question, what is better, buy a high tech fence or buy a second router?


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## harrysin (Jan 15, 2007)

mftha said:


> It occurred to me that the title I used to start this thread might have perjorative connotations. In no way was that my intention. To all who feel that I communicated something derogatory about these high tech fences, I sincerely apologize.
> 
> Two of the high tech fences have been specifically named, the Incra LS 17" Super System and the Jointech fence. The precision and reproducibility of positioning I understand, and once having becomed accustomed to those properties I do see how the basic fence could be very frustrating.
> 
> ...


Tom, I've only just noticed this thread and so must repeat what I've said on this forum many times, as seen in most of my photo-shoot threads, I use a very simple tall fence, and with it have produced a huge number of projects big and small. I've also shown the "hi-tech" fence that came with this table, a useless piece of junk, confined to live it's life under a bench out of the way. The art of routing, both hand held and table lies in the operator developing skills rather than gadgets.


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi Harry

Now I see why you have a tall fence ,it's the size of your hose LOL


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harrysin said:


> Tom, I've only just noticed this thread and so must repeat what I've said on this forum many times, as seen in most of my photo-shoot threads, I use a very simple tall fence, and with it have produced a huge number of projects big and small. I've also shown the "hi-tech" fence that came with this table, a useless piece of junk, confined to live it's life under a bench out of the way. The art of routing, both hand held and table lies in the operator developing skills rather than gadgets.


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## TomE (Dec 17, 2010)

mftha said:


> I do not see however that the high tech fences are necessarily safer than the basic type fence.
> 
> I have one more question: In at least one episode the statement is made that for each new router bit you obtain, you need to buy a new router. Hence this question, what is better, buy a high tech fence or buy a second router?


For a long time I used a "hunk o wood" fence with C clamps to hold steady, set feather boards, stops and the like. Some of my setups were elaborate enough that the end result was a forest of C clamps, I found that occasionally I would snag a clamp during operation resulting in a setup shift or loosening of the clamp, thusly I found myself paying too much attention to not knocking into the clamps and less to the actual task at hand.... a safety issue.

A high tech fence (and table), in my mind at least, has enough features, T tracks, split fence, on board lock downs, safety devices, etc. to allow for efficient, accurate and safe setup with little worry about something getting in the way of operation.

There is no reason that one cannot make a high tech fence with all of the features but that gets back into the time/cost/abitlity thing again.

More router is always better 

If you're functional with your current fence, get the router and look at the high tech things later as budget and need evolves.


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## Marco (Feb 21, 2009)

bobj3 said:


> Hi Harry
> 
> Now I see why you have a tall fence ,it's the size of your hose LOL
> 
> ...


Bobj3.... You are bad! :lol:


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## BigJimAK (Mar 13, 2009)

mftha said:


> One thing that has been puzzling me for some time is why do people use the very complex, expensive router fences when some simple modifications of the Router Workshop fences are far more flexible in use.


Why do people buy a big-screen TV?
Why do people buy a new(er) car when a beater will get them there?
Why do people buy a boat / motorhome / airplane / snowmachine if it is not necessary for their survival?
Why buy a CD... or movie?
Why pay for a vacation?


Because they want it.. some for what it will do, some for how it works, some because they like how it looks.. some because owning it gives them pleasure.. and some just cuz.

There is no universal answer.


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## paduke (Mar 28, 2010)

I made a "complicated fence. It replaced a store bought one. When I began putting my shop together about 16 months ago, I needed something STRAIGHT and square to build straight stuff so I bought it. After using my table for a year there were features I wanted added so I built my own. But some of my thinking is based on what I want to do, Like build entry doors, mill casing and baseboard and build kitchen cabinets Then I discovered lock mitre all the above spawned the ideas in my complicated fence


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## AxlMyk (Jun 13, 2006)

Marco said:


> Bobj3.... You are bad! :lol:


Yeah. He sits on his butt thinking of this stuff all day.


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## jlord (Nov 16, 2009)

BigJimAK said:


> Why do people buy a big-screen TV?
> Why do people buy a new(er) car when a beater will get them there?
> Why do people buy a boat / motorhome / airplane / snowmachine if it is not necessary for their survival?
> Why buy a CD... or movie?
> ...


You listed a few of the reasons why I buy things.


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## TWheels (May 26, 2006)

jlord said:


> While I do like my fences to give me options like mountinf feather boards, stop blocks, Etc. I have had to make quick setups using a piece of plywood. Here is one that I made in about 20 min to make some raised panel doors. It's just a piece of 3/4" plywood with a piece of hardwood for the fence clamped to a set of horses.
> 
> I did have to add a couple of 2X4s to take the sag out from the heavy Porter Cable 3-1/4hp router that was screwed to it. I drilled a hole for a carriage bolt to make it a swing fence with a clamp on the other side. It worked well.


And I thought I had a minimalist approach! Excellent! I note that the fence matches the profile of the bit you have mounted. Do you have a different fence for each bit?


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## TWheels (May 26, 2006)

BigJimAK said:


> Why do people buy a big-screen TV?
> Why do people buy a new(er) car when a beater will get them there?
> Why do people buy a boat / motorhome / airplane / snowmachine if it is not necessary for their survival?
> Why buy a CD... or movie?
> ...


I know there is no universal answer; I am looking to learn how the high tech fences improve the process and experience of routering. There are some very good answers on both sides. I personally am on the minimalist side, having learned router use from the Router Workshop from Aug. 2000 until my PBS station dropped it for a sewing show. I would like to learn more about the high tech side. There are also many who have the high tech fences for all the reasons you have implied. Probably half to 3/4 of the router bits I own are for those kinds of reasons, although I do intend to use every one of them within the foreseeable future. I do hope this discussion can go on as we get more ideas.


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## jlord (Nov 16, 2009)

mftha said:


> And I thought I had a minimalist approach! Excellent! I note that the fence matches the profile of the bit you have mounted. Do you have a different fence for each bit?


Hi Tom,
I have 2 nice router tables that have fully adjustable fences with inserts for different bits. I was on a location & needed some raised paneled doors made quickly. So I made this table in about 20 min. The fence was made from a piece of hardwood scrap. I don't normally use this type of bit in the picture. I prefer bits with a backcutter for doors, but these were just plant on's & didn't have to work so you were only going to see the front side. I threw the table away when finished. It was just temporary.


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## TWheels (May 26, 2006)

jlord said:


> Hi Tom,
> I have 2 nice router tables that have fully adjustable fences with inserts for different bits. I was on a location & needed some raised paneled doors made quickly. So I made this table in about 20 min. The fence was made from a piece of hardwood scrap. I don't normally use this type of bit in the picture. I prefer bits with a backcutter for doors, but these were just plant on's & didn't have to work so you were only going to see the front side. I threw the table away when finished. It was just temporary.


Hi James, 
I looked at your profile. To say that you and I use routers is very much like saying Albert Pujols and my sons when they were 10 year old little leaguers are baseball players. Your full adjustable fences with inserts for different bits, did you make them yourself or did you buy them? I am very interested in seeing them.


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## jlord (Nov 16, 2009)

mftha said:


> Hi James,
> I looked at your profile. To say that you and I use routers is very much like saying Albert Pujols and my sons when they were 10 year old little leaguers are baseball players. Your full adjustable fences with inserts for different bits, did you make them yourself or did you buy them? I am very interested in seeing them.


Hi Tom,
The tables I have are the old ones that Sommerfeld Tools used to sell made by CMT. I have the tops with fences only not the cabinet. The center section is removable so you can cut your own zero clearance inserts & change them up for the bit you are using. The inserts have a 10º miters on each side. Thats what keeps it in place. Here is a picture of one of the tables that is a couple of years old. The cabinet is unfinished & it shows the fence without any inserts. This is how I use them most of the time. The inserts just slide up into the middle. I will use them when using a panel bit.
CMT 999.500.02 Router Table System | AceTool.com


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## allthunbs (Jun 22, 2008)

mftha said:


> I know there is no universal answer; I am looking to learn how the high tech fences improve the process and experience of routering.


Hi Tom:

Someone above commented that they wanted repeat-ability. In response to their comment, and yours', I find that both are dictated by the method of measurement. I use setup blocks and my setup is as accurate as I want it to be. Be my fence a stick of spruce 2x4 freshly jointed or a chunk of maple, or an expensive manufactured substitute, measurement is what dictates how everything comes together. 

I do agree that my tall fence uses a pair of "C" clamps to hold the vertical featherboard and the table top similarly. But the intrusion into the working area would be the same as knobs holding similar items in like location. Now, in my case, sometimes I have to work with a magnifying glass so add that to the confusion.

I swear by my "fine adjusting tool." It works a charm and it's very high tech - so the physicists say ;-)


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## The Warthog (Nov 29, 2010)

FWIW, I am using the fence that came with my entry-level Ryobi table to good effect. I have even done jointing on it, and I will be again when I make my daughter's end table. So far, it`s all I need. I haven't wanted to add anything.


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## Tommyt654 (Apr 5, 2009)

The old adage KISS comes into play more often then not. I like it simple and easy to make minor adjustments all that are necessary so I can get on with the task at hand easily and quickly


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## KenBee (Jan 1, 2011)

I have a Woodpeckers Super Fence to go with my Woodpeckers Table that is my go to setup, but I am also working (slowly) on a homemade fence based on Pat Warner's design that was featured in FWW #144 and am building mine with Walnut, Maple and Mahogany. I really don't need the homemade fence, but it is a beautiful piece of workmanship and as a beginning woodworker I wanted the challenge of constructing something I consider complex that is also functional.


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