# ER Collets



## kolias (Dec 26, 2008)

I plan to buy a Chinese VFD / Spindle combination 0.75KW with an ER11 collet. I don’t know anything about the ER collets but as I understand the size of bits for this collet is 2-7mm (about 1/16”-1/4”).

I would like the flexibility of using bits in the range of 1/16” to 1/2" and with an ER11 collet of course I can’t do that.

Are any adapters available to convert ER11 to something which will allow me to use larger bits?


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## Phil P (Jul 25, 2010)

Hi Nicolas

How is the collet secured to the machine? If it's directly into the end of the armature then you are very much stuck with that range, if it's on something like an ISO30 pull-up cone then it is sometimes possible to get a cone with a larger collet size. That said 0.75kw (1 HP) is a tad small to drive large 1/2in shank tooling. Perhaps the manufacturer is trying to tell you something? Especially as high frequency drives are often lacking in torque against conventional slow motors

Regards

Phil


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## kolias (Dec 26, 2008)

Thank you Phil

I don’t know how the collet is secured to the machine; the main problem buying from China (besides the dubious quality) is that communications are almost not existent however some have purchased these packages and what I can see on youtube they are fine.

I understand that 0.75kw is kind of small but the larger ones are 220 volts and I only have 120 volts available in my house (I don’t want to drag a new line from the mains). But then again, if I want to mill aluminum and take off lets say 1/16” per pass at 10-20 IPM I think it should be ok. 

I’m designing my 3rd CNC router right now and collecting info on what to buy. I have not purchased this VFD unit and I’m asking questions to see the direction I will go. Perhaps I will scrap the VFD and get a Bosch router like I had before with 1/4" shank and use an adapter to go down to 1/8” bits.


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## ggom20 (Feb 1, 2012)

Hello!

IMHO:

+1 if you go for 0.75KW, you are probably stucked to ER11...

-ER11 got some collets from 0.5mm up to 7mm. 1mm increment.
-an adapter to increase size could be unsafe.

Very interested by this motors, do they make bigger ones with ER25 ?
or even ER32 ?

Regards

Gérard.


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## kolias (Dec 26, 2008)

Thank you Gerard for the info

After a lot of research on ER collets and VFD I have decided against them because I don’t have 220 volts available in my house and I don’t want to run a new 220 volts line from my panel.

I am kind of disappointed because I would have liked to have a VFD along with an ER20 collet and the price is really good. I could get a VFD with ER11 but this restricts the bits size to 2-7mm and I want to have the flexibility to use larger bits if I want to. So I will have to settle for a router like before.

Gerard if you go to ebay.com and search for ER25 or ER32 you will find a lot VFD packages (VFD with matching Spindel) with these collets and at a very good price and since in Europe you have in your house 220 volts then you are all set to go. The one that I was told is recommended is 

items in linearmotionbearings store on eBay!


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## ggom20 (Feb 1, 2012)

Hello!

IMHO:

Dealing with 220v is not a big thing.

We all at to do so in the 60's when we changed from 110 to 220 v
In many cases, we had to use a transformer 220 to 110 they work also 110 to 220v.
It reduces current and size of wiring.
With 220v, it uses 1/2 weight of copper!

PS:
your link didn't work.

Regards


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi

In the states 220 is a big deal the norm and it takes bigger wire and more of it..

P.S. your link works just fine..

===


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## kolias (Dec 26, 2008)

Don't know why the link deos not work for you Gerard because as Bob says it works fine and works for me too.

Try ebay.com and search for ER20 collets and you will see the guys site

(linearmotionbearings)


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## ggom20 (Feb 1, 2012)

bobj3 said:


> Hi
> 
> In the states 220 is a big deal the norm and it takes bigger wire and more of it..
> 
> ...


Hello Bob!

I'll try again with the link..

About wire, I must be an idiot but I can't figure out why you need to have bigger wire ?
It's in contradiction with basic level physics.

And about more of it, it's probably because you want to go further?


Regards
Gérard


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi Gerard

That's just the way it is in the states I don't make the elec. code.

If we run a 220 wire say about 3ft long it still needs more copper wire to do it.
2 hots and neutral wire and a ground wire..

To switch it over to your way it would be a nightmare just like switching over to Metric system only more so.. 

==

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ggom20 said:


> Hello Bob!
> 
> I'll try again with the link..
> 
> ...


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## ggom20 (Feb 1, 2012)

Hello!

Ok link did work this time..
At times of the day links don't work well here.

Could be this ER11 ?
a water-cooled spindle motor 0.8kw with a VFD as a set | eBay

Aniway, tiny motor, good for engraving.

Regards


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## Phil P (Jul 25, 2010)

bobj3 said:


> To switch it over to your way it would be a nightmare just like switching over to Metric system only more so..


Yeah, odd that the rest of the world has decided to go Metric - we must all be perverse out here! :lol:


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi Phil

I give up 



=== 




Phil P said:


> Yeah, odd that the rest of the world has decided to go Metric - we must all be perverse out here! :lol:


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## kolias (Dec 26, 2008)

ggom20 said:


> Hello!
> 
> Ok link did work this time..
> At times of the day links don't work well here.
> ...


This is one of them Gerard and it is for 220 volts but there are others similar for 120 volts. It is true the motor is very small and that is why I'm so skeptical about it


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## Mike (Nov 22, 2004)

We have had enough discussions about which way is the correct way as far as metric/Imperial. I think everyone will agree that once there is a national standard, altering it creates problems. Enough said on that issue.

Gerard, the point BJ was making is a simple one; while the actual wire size does not increase when switching from 110 to 220 we are required to add a 4th wire which means an increase in the physical amount of copper of 33%. No small task to alter all the wiring which is in place.

Please lets keep on track with the original post.


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## ggom20 (Feb 1, 2012)

Mike said:


> .
> 
> Gerard, the point BJ was making is a simple one; while the actual wire size does not increase when switching from 110 to 220 we are required to add a 4th wire which means an increase in the physical amount of copper of 33%. No small task to alter all the wiring which is in place.


Hello!
Strange way to wire things! 
And false.
220v uses same wiring diagram than 110V. 3 wires.
One earth grounding, one live, one neutral.

If you got a biphas system, as we had in the 60's then you should use:
One earth, one live phas , a second live phas (3 wires). 
No need for neutral.

The voltage and Amp question:
If you got a cable with 16 A capacity:

110V x 16A = 1760 w of usable power.
220V x 16A = 3520 w of usable power.

Also it means that you could run 1760w on 220 with a 8A cable.
That will use Half of the copper weight. 

If you really whant 4 wires: 
-your calculation is also false:
the real weight of copper is in relation like that:

number of wires (4) / number of wires (3) = 1.33 ok
but wire section (110V) / wire section (220) = 0.5 .

Resulting weight 1.33 x 0.5 = 0.66

The result is -33 % in Wheight.


Hope this could be usefull for some that want to use 220V motors on CNC's.

Regards.

Gerard


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## ggom20 (Feb 1, 2012)

kolias said:


> Thank you Gerard for the info
> 
> After a lot of research on ER collets and VFD I have decided against them because I don’t have 220 volts available in my house and I don’t want to run a new 220 volts line from my panel.
> 
> ...



Hello Nicolas!

I am still very interested by those CNC motors, did you bought things from
this ebay seller?

Is it safe do do so ?

Regards


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## Mike (Nov 22, 2004)

Gerard, I have no idea of what electric codes are in France. I am familiar with electrical code in the US. Sensitive items like CNC components run off of 220vac/60hz here have two hot leads, a neutral and a ground. This not only provides power but helps to reduce line noise which effects operation. Having wired up a fair number of sensitive devices I know this to be true. Devices like stoves or arc welders use the 4 wire system here; even the 220 outlet on my generator is 4 wire. You see my statement is not false.

For the last time; please stick to the threads topic.


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## kolias (Dec 26, 2008)

Gerard I made a mistake and the link I provided before (linearmotionbearings) is for linear bearings & ball screws. For the VFD / Spindles the link is:

items in vfd store on eBay!

I’m in the design stage of my new CNC and expect to start purchasing around May – June. Regarding safety to buy from ebay (oriental vendors) there is never a guaranty with them, you always take your chance. However for the price they offer, I will take my chance like many others did. The links I provide does not mean that these sellers are "guaranty", it just means that others had a good experience with them.

Look at the “Seller information” where it is indicated the seller’s feedback and decide for yourself. One thing for sure; there is NO communications with them because of the language. So make sure what you buy is what you want and you know about the product because after you purchase you are on your own.

I did purchase in the past from various vendors in China and Hong Kong and I was very happy but I also purchase my 1st four axis stepper driver and never use it because I could not get information on how to connect it


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## ggom20 (Feb 1, 2012)

Mike said:


> For the last time; please stick to the threads topic.


That looks like what?
You got power and I am nothing at all?

You made mistake about wire weight and so what ? , 
admit mistake and learn from mistakes, you could feel better.
And learn something.

And who whent into speaking of 220 V ?
Read the threads, please...

Regards.
Gérard.


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## ggom20 (Feb 1, 2012)

kolias said:


> Gerard I made a mistake and the link I provided before (linearmotionbearings) is for linear bearings & ball screws. For the VFD / Spindles the link is:
> 
> items in vfd store on eBay!
> 
> ...


Hello Nicolas!

OK.
Thanks for the care you take to give me a complete answer!
I will probably try it , looks possible to built good machines with them stuff.
what i could get from european market is really out- priced.
And they'l probably sells chinese things...

ER system looks great in my opinion, an ER 25 collet would fullfill my needs.
ER25 goes from 0.5mm to 16 mm. a big cutter.
But obviouisly need for 2 or 3 HP.
I will crawl Ebay.

Regards.

Gérard.


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