# All thread for router skiis



## rstermer (Apr 22, 2008)

I'm going to be making some router skis and was thinking about using all thread to go between the skis. But, I'm concerned it might damage the internal threads in my router base, which is made of aluminum. Any thoughts?
rstermer


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi rstermer

It may but it would take a LONG time,you don't move the router on the rods the norm..you move the router into place and then lock it down in place 

========



rstermer said:


> I'm going to be making some router skis and was thinking about using all thread to go between the skis. But, I'm concerned it might damage the internal threads in my router base, which is made of aluminum. Any thoughts?
> rstermer


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## rstermer (Apr 22, 2008)

bobj3 said:


> Hi rstermer
> 
> It may but it would take a LONG time,you don't move the router on the rods the norm..you move the router into place and then lock it down in place
> 
> ========


Thanks for clarifying that for me. I wasn't thinking the skis were used that way. Just to make sure I understand, if I wanted to route a slot, I'd set the skis up with a guide (or guides?) , move the router into position, lock it onto the rods and then route moving the skis along the guide?
rstermer


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## BigJimAK (Mar 13, 2009)

I was wondering about that too, Bob. If you are going to use the skis to support the router and then slide the wooden base on your desktop, wouldn't it make sense to apply UHMW plastic on the bottom of the support and possibly add handles (if it made them more comfortable)?

Jim


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## SE18 (Apr 6, 2009)

Wow, I was thinking the router moves on the rods. I need to find a ski tutorial explaining how it works!


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## BigJimAK (Mar 13, 2009)

David,

That's what I originally envisioned also but when I noticed there was no provision to clamp it to a table and realized it would have to move front-to-back anyway, since there are no bars for motion in that direction, it got me thinking.

Jim


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## rstermer (Apr 22, 2008)

BigJimAK said:


> I was wondering about that too, Bob. If you are going to use the skis to support the router and then slide the wooden base on your desktop, wouldn't it make sense to apply UHMW plastic on the bottom of the support and possibly add handles (if it made them more comfortable)?
> 
> Jim


I think both of those are good enhancements and would improve ease of use and smoothness.
rstermer


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi rstermer

Right on,just like below 

=====




rstermer said:


> Thanks for clarifying that for me. I wasn't thinking the skis were used that way. Just to make sure I understand, if I wanted to route a slot, I'd set the skis up with a guide (or guides?) , move the router into position, lock it onto the rods and then route moving the skis along the guide?
> rstermer


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## rstermer (Apr 22, 2008)

bobj3 said:


> Hi rstermer
> 
> Right on,just like below
> 
> =====


Bob- Thanks. Do you have a picture of the fixture with the holes in it with nothing on it you could post? That looks like something that would be extraordinarily useful to have. What is the material?
Thanks,
rstermer


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## allthunbs (Jun 22, 2008)

SE18 said:


> Wow, I was thinking the router moves on the rods. I need to find a ski tutorial explaining how it works!


Hi David: You're not allowed to see the manual. Had you access you would find out why drill rod is better than threaded rod.

BTW, skis are one of 16 methods of using a router. Skis are not jigs.


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi David

I will agree the drill rod is better if you have alot of money and you have a way to thread the rod, if not all thread will work just fine and you can get it from any hardware store for pennies 

Don't forget you don't need to move the router up and down the rods,just now and then to lock it in place..

====



allthunbs said:


> Hi David: You're not allowed to see the manual. Had you access you would find out why drill rod is better than threaded rod.
> 
> BTW, skis are one of 16 methods of using a router. Skis are not jigs.


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## harrysin (Jan 15, 2007)

These shots from several of my past threads show some of the many uses for the skis, unfortunately because they came from various places in my computer, I didn't notice 'till they were uploaded that a few were rather big files.

I use plastic iron on edging under the cheeks, this gives plenty of slip but not so much that the skis are difficult to control. I get a feeling that some members are fed up to the eyeballs from hearing about skis, well, skip such threads and leave them for the ones who are interested, I'm not attempting to ram them down anyone's throat, it doesn't make any difference to me one way or the other.


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## rstermer (Apr 22, 2008)

Harry- Thank you for the pictures showing the various uses for skis. I was wondering what, if anything, can be done to deal with dust collection when using skis? Do you have any photos showing dust collection setups while"going skiing?"
Thanks again,
rstermer


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## allthunbs (Jun 22, 2008)

bobj3 said:


> Hi David
> 
> I will agree the drill rod is better if you have alot of money and you have a way to thread the rod, if not all thread will work just fine and you can get it from any hardware store for pennies
> 
> ...


I can't remember exactly how much I paid for the drill rod. I think it was about $30 for the pair of 12mm x 4' long. Finding the machinist to thread the ends was the hard part. I found one in the next town who has since helped me with a bunch of other projects. Once you find a _good_ machinist, you use him alot. There's lots out there that charge minimum fees and won't look at small projects. I found one who has a small cramped shop and is always busy and charges fair rates - not free but fair.

If you're using threaded rod, you tend to fix the router in one place and not move it. With the drill rod, I'm moving the router all over the place. If I need something cut very accurately, I move the router tight to one end and control it with the other end. This "magnifys" any movements that I make allowing me to control cuts far more precisely. 

Harry's first demo of skis is to serve as a planer and for templates and signs. I use skis for freehand cuts and for anything where a dado blade or radial arm saw is used.

The design of the radial arm saw dictates that when you take the cut, the blade drops towards the table. I found this when attempting to make lap joints and I couldn't figure out how they were never even. Now, I use skis, the material is always cut cleanly and precisely.

With skis you measure what is to remain and remove the rest. With other tools you have to measure what you need to remove and hope you leave the correct amount. I've not had much luck with that. Invariably I screw up somehow.

Allthunbs


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## SE18 (Apr 6, 2009)

Thanks, I was going to ask if anyone had a video of ski setup in action but the 2 photos BobJ displayed pretty much answer the question and the peg board he uses looks very practical.

As for the horizontal movement, that is apparent as the wood "bookends" holding the skis slide along.

As for vertical movement, it appears that the plunge function is still used and the skis can be raised or lowered for projects that need a lot of vertical movement (more than the plunge can plunge)

As for diagonal movement, I'm more puzzled. It would seem this could be facilitated better by having the router move along the rods as the table is sliding.


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## harrysin (Jan 15, 2007)

rstermer said:


> Harry- Thank you for the pictures showing the various uses for skis. I was wondering what, if anything, can be done to deal with dust collection when using skis? Do you have any photos showing dust collection setups while"going skiing?"
> Thanks again,
> rstermer


Before I answer you Bob I must confess that I don't treat dust collection as seriously as I should, that out of the way, here are some shots that explain what I do (when I remember!)


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi Guys

Most good routers come with a vac.pickup tube on them,just pop in the hose and the vac.system will suck up most of the chips that come off the cut.. once it's cut free it has no place to stay so it's gone up the tube and in the bag 

======


harrysin said:


> Before I answer you Bob I must confess that I don't treat dust collection as seriously as I should, that out of the way, here are some shots that explain what I do (when I remember!)


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## rstermer (Apr 22, 2008)

bobj3 said:


> Hi rstermer
> 
> Right on,just like below
> 
> =====


Hi Bob- I hope you don't mind some questions about your positioning fixture. What are the overall dimensions? Is it made of MDF? Is the finish shellac? Did you cut the holes using the plunge router? If so, how did you accurately position the plunge router to make the cut? Sorry for all the questions, but I really like that fixture and am going to make one as nearly like it as possible.
Regards,
rstermer


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi rstermer

I think I'm going to let levon jump on this one ,he is doing it from square one. 

=======





rstermer said:


> Hi Bob- I hope you don't mind some questions about your positioning fixture. What are the overall dimensions? Is it made of MDF? Is the finish shellac? Did you cut the holes using the plunge router? If so, how did you accurately position the plunge router to make the cut? Sorry for all the questions, but I really like that fixture and am going to make one as nearly like it as possible.
> Regards,
> rstermer


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## rstermer (Apr 22, 2008)

bobj3 said:


> Hi rstermer
> 
> I think I'm going to let levon jump on this one ,he is doing it from square one.
> 
> =======


Thank you, hopefully he will post some photos.
rstermer


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi rstermer

If not I will  he has come a long way..from square one..

Don't forget most but not all are in My Galllery 

=======



rstermer said:


> Thank you, hopefully he will post some photos.
> rstermer


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## allthunbs (Jun 22, 2008)

harrysin said:


> Before I answer you Bob I must confess that I don't treat dust collection as seriously as I should, that out of the way, here are some shots that explain what I do (when I remember!)


Hi Harry:

If you're looking for a cyclone lid that serves a similar function to the Triton one in the picture, Lee Valley Tools sells cyclone lid in several sizes. If you're too cheap (that's me) you can make your own following these instructions:

The Thien Cyclone Separator Lid w/ the Thien Cyclone Separator Baffle

Phil has also created a different version of this he calls the "Frakenvac." Phil has a bunch of other useful stuff there too.

For Hitachi M12V owners (ones that _haven't_ modified their routers for large bits) there is a dust collection attachment that attaches to the template guide tabs part #997466. I don't know the cost. Harry, is there something like this for the Makita 36xx?

I have some other ideas for dust collection on skis but I have to wait until I can try them out. Wish me luck.

Allthunbs


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## levon (Sep 14, 2008)

rstermer said:


> Hi Bob- I hope you don't mind some questions about your positioning fixture. What are the overall dimensions? Is it made of MDF? Is the finish shellac? Did you cut the holes using the plunge router? If so, how did you accurately position the plunge router to make the cut? Sorry for all the questions, but I really like that fixture and am going to make one as nearly like it as possible.
> Regards,
> rstermer


hello rstermer,

the dimensions are 14 x 20. it is 3/4 mdf. after putting the crosshatch lines on it i sprayed it with clear laqcer to save the lines. put the lines on front and back. i have not done the wholes yet. you first make a counter bore on the back for t-nuts and then drill the holes all the way through for the screws. i have made my cams but havent drilled them yet. all the drilling is done on the drill press.

i cut some 1 inch wide strips of 1/4 mdf to lay out the lines. but next time i would make them 1/16 less than 1 inch, because after adding 13 pencil lines it akes up enough space that you only get a little over 13x 19 inches instead of 14 by 20.

im sorry for the time it took to get back, but my wifes mom is very sick and we have our daughters family visiting. will try to post some pictures but it may take a little while. id like to show this fixture and another i made. the second is fast but takes some fanagling for different thickness materials.


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## istracpsboss (Sep 14, 2008)

harrysin said:


> Before I answer you Bob I must confess that I don't treat dust collection as seriously as I should, that out of the way, here are some shots that explain what I do (when I remember!)


Hi Harry

For someone that doesn't take it seriously that looked liked reasonably serious kit! I've only the Triton bin and a vaccuum cleaner!

BTW, what is the foot pedal actuating in that shot under the Workcentre ?

Cheers

Peter


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## harrysin (Jan 15, 2007)

istracpsboss said:


> Hi Harry
> 
> For someone that doesn't take it seriously that looked liked reasonably serious kit! I've only the Triton bin and a vaccuum cleaner!
> 
> ...


Peter, every one of my photo shoots shows saw dust everywhere, yet most others are surgically clean, so I can't be doing things right! As for the foot pedal, I'm amazed that you've missed it each time I've posted the link in answer to similar questions. The original idea came from former member Niki in Poland, his was fabricated from little more than sticks, but it worked! Apart from making dowel holes the fastest, easiest way imaginable, it makes setting the cutter height a piece of cake, leaving only the locking lever to reach the router for. The router shown is now the one on the skis and the big Triton is now height adjusted by the Nikilift.

http://www.routerforums.com/44165-post8.html


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi Harry

You crack me up hahahahahahaha LOL LOL every time I see the Seat you made for your router table , it cracks me up hahahahahahaha I know you said that you where short but a little seat to sit on under your router table hahahahahahahahaha is very cute way of doing it LOL ...

=================



harrysin said:


> Peter, every one of my photo shoots shows saw dust everywhere, yet most others are surgically clean, so I can't be doing things right! As for the foot pedal, I'm amazed that you've missed it each time I've posted the link in answer to similar questions. The original idea came from former member Niki in Poland, his was fabricated from little more than sticks, but it worked! Apart from making dowel holes the fastest, easiest way imaginable, it makes setting the cutter height a piece of cake, leaving only the locking lever to reach the router for. The router shown is now the one on the skis and the big Triton is now height adjusted by the Nikilift.
> 
> Router Forums - View Single Post - Back from Japan with...


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## allthunbs (Jun 22, 2008)

You don't crack me up Harry. I just admire your ingenuity and your ability to take advantage of other's suggestions. Right on! BTW, can this be jury-rigged to work with Routerworkshop philosophy?

Allthunbs


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## harrysin (Jan 15, 2007)

Ron...............
"The Thien Cyclone Separator Lid w/ the Thien Cyclone Separator Baffle"

is a very cute idea.

The original lift shown by Niki was little more than a few sticks fitted to a B&D workbench, held together I think with rubber bands, and it worked! Perhaps Bj can find the original thread.


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

HI Harry

Link below

http://www.routerforums.com/table-mounted-routing/5211-router-lift-above-table.html
=========

http://www.routerforums.com/search.php?searchid=323776

=========


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## harrysin (Jan 15, 2007)

bobj3 said:


> Hi Harry
> 
> You crack me up hahahahahahaha LOL LOL every time I see the Seat you made for your router table , it cracks me up hahahahahahaha I know you said that you where short but a little seat to sit on under your router table hahahahahahahahaha is very cute way of doing it LOL ...
> 
> =================


You cheeky sod Bj, that old milk crate is what I stand on when my 5' 2/3" isn't quite enough to reach dizzy heights. I also sit things on it to spray paint. By the way, milk BOTTLES and therefore crates haven't been used here for a very long time.


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## harrysin (Jan 15, 2007)

I'm forever amazed at how you find these things Bob. As is obvious, I modified things a little, for dowelling, using an up-cut spiral bit, one step on the pedal and the hole is there. At the moment I have stripped a sewing machine motor to fit a reversing switch with the idea of fitting it to the Nikilift but have been side tracked with so many other projects.


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## allthunbs (Jun 22, 2008)

harrysin said:


> You cheeky sod Bj, that old milk crate is what I stand on when my 5' 2/3" isn't quite enough to reach dizzy heights. I also sit things on it to spray paint. By the way, milk BOTTLES and therefore crates haven't been used here for a very long time.


what you don't know, Harry, is that Bob is 3'6" and jealous as hell )

Allthunbs


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## SE18 (Apr 6, 2009)

I was going to make skis for my router this weekend, but I found that allthread sags too much and the diameter is much smaller than can accommodate the router holes.

I was going to use copper plumbing pipe (filled with sand and cemented at both ends) but none fit (visited HD and Lowes). Same with steel pipes there. In the home improvement section there were expensive stainless appliance piping that look like they'd work.

Boy, wish I had a lathe!

Anyway, I still can't determine how a ski works. I see it or the board slides along as the skis are set perfectly at the ends of the table. However, couldn't one also use the skis "freehand" across the board to make circular cuts and such? 

It wouldn't be as precise as fixing the skis to the table ends, but it would make the router steadier and you wouldn't have to hold it and it would make it more level. Does anyone use skis in this manner?

Here's how far I got this weekend, making the peg board.

I used a circle cutting attachment on my power drill and drilled thru 2X4s and then cut them in half with my bandsaw. 

The wood is about ½ inch thick plywood with reinforcing stripwork underneath.

It holds projects nicely.


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## rstermer (Apr 22, 2008)

bobj3 said:


> Don't forget most but not all are in My Galllery
> 
> =======


The problem I have with your gallery is that every time I start looking for something, I get distracted, and start looking at something other than what I'm trying to find. When it comes to your gallery,its like I'm the kid and your gallery is the candy store!
rstermer


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## rstermer (Apr 22, 2008)

levon said:


> hello rstermer,
> 
> the dimensions are 14 x 20. it is 3/4 mdf. after putting the crosshatch lines on it i sprayed it with clear laqcer to save the lines. put the lines on front and back. i have not done the wholes yet. you first make a counter bore on the back for t-nuts and then drill the holes all the way through for the screws. i have made my cams but havent drilled them yet. all the drilling is done on the drill press.
> 
> ...


Levon- It looks like you have a pretty full plate at the moment. Please feel no urgency to reply to my request. Also, my best wishes for a rapid recovery for your wife's mom.
rstermer


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## rstermer (Apr 22, 2008)

SE18 said:


> I was going to make skis for my router this weekend, but I found that allthread sags too much and the diameter is much smaller than can accommodate the router holes.
> 
> I was going to use copper plumbing pipe (filled with sand and cemented at both ends) but none fit (visited HD and Lowes). Same with steel pipes there. In the home improvement section there were expensive stainless appliance piping that look like they'd work.
> 
> ...


I don't have any answers to your questions as I haven't built skis or used them yet, but I did want to say that you've got a nice looking pup there!
rstermer


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## harrysin (Jan 15, 2007)

SE18 said:


> I was going to make skis for my router this weekend, but I found that allthread sags too much and the diameter is much smaller than can accommodate the router holes.
> 
> I was going to use copper plumbing pipe (filled with sand and cemented at both ends) but none fit (visited HD and Lowes). Same with steel pipes there. In the home improvement section there were expensive stainless appliance piping that look like they'd work.
> 
> ...


David, whilst cam jigs are very useful for many routing jobs, sometimes it's faster and more convenient to simply pin bits of scrap MDF around the workpiece as I've demonstrated on many occasions. The size of the side fence holes in the router determine the diameter of the rods. I've never made a secret of the fact that I dislike all thread, it is weaker than smooth rod and it takes much longer to adjust when fitting a router and apart from having to set the height, you have to ensure that the cheeks are parallel. These are not problems with the rods that I make, the non-threaded part of the two rods is identical, ensuring parallel cheeks and the rods are long enough for all my projects, but it's important to make sure that the bench is big enough to allow sufficient movement without dropping off the end! I don't consider Copper tubing to be suitable, how did you propose to attach the cheeks? These two shots show how the skis can be used freehand, north, south, east, west and any direction in-between!

I have to admire your Herculean effort in making the cam jig, but think that it's far too BIG, it means that the skis have to sit on it and because on some projects like routing slots, the cutter goes all the way through it's soon going to look more like my sacrificial bench top!


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## SE18 (Apr 6, 2009)

thanks, Harry, for the photos and explanation

copper tubing is not the right size anyway. I know it is pliable. Steel is preferred.

I was surprised when someone said hollow tubing is structurally stronger than solid. Guess it makes sense when you think about it (but sort of counterintuitive).

That's our 10 week beagle pup. She wouldn't get off the cam board so I snapped a photo. Only took about 3 hours to build so not that Herculean


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi David

Some routers can't take on the rods,but with the work around. see below you can use any size you want like 3/4" if you want..

Tubing works well but think of lamp fixture hardware , many of the rods are steel/brass that go up the center of light fixtures,most have threads on both ends the norm and they 3/8-24 or 1/2-20 threads..and come in many lengths form 6" to 4 ft. long the norm..you can find them on the net..  plus you can get the nuts to fit at the same place...

http://www.mylampparts.com/index.php?cPath=480_593
http://www.mylampparts.com/?gclid=CMCtlPHy0psCFQk_agod8jZyIQ

=======





SE18 said:


> thanks, Harry, for the photos and explanation
> 
> copper tubing is not the right size anyway. I know it is pliable. Steel is preferred.
> 
> ...


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## SE18 (Apr 6, 2009)

Thanks (again) Bob. Now that's definitely the way to go!


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## rstermer (Apr 22, 2008)

SE18 said:


> thanks, Harry, for the photos and explanation
> 
> copper tubing is not the right size anyway. I know it is pliable. Steel is preferred.
> 
> ...


What you are really interested in is minimizing deflection. A simply supported beam with a center load (not quite our case but good enough for illustrative purposes) has a maximum deflection given by the following equation:

d = wl^3/48EI

where 
d is the defelction
w is the applied load
l is the length of the beam
E is Young's modulus , and 
I is the moment of inertia

If the desire is to minimize deflection, copper tubing is not suitable because Young's modulus for copper is very low, steel is much higher.

If they are both of the same outside diameter, a solid steel rod will deflect less than a hollow one because it has a higher moment of inertia than does a hollow rod. However, if the choice is between a hollow rod and a solid rod, each having the same weight per unit of length, the hollow rod is better. In that case the hollow rod will have the higher moment of inertia.

If the ends of the rod are fixed so that they have no slope the deflection is given by the formula:

d= wl^3/192EI 

In terms of limiting deflection you can garner the following from the two formulas:

- since deflection is proportional to the length cubed, minimizing the length of the rod will minimize deflection, make the rods no longer than strictly necessary,
- use the highest Youngs modulus material you can find at a reasonable cost, steel is probably best (3 times higher than aluminum),
- try to design so that the ends of the rods can not flex (i.e. have zero slope), in practice this is a difficult thing to do, but I have some ideas and will post the same as soon as I can get it built and get someone with a digital camera to take some pictures.
- consider a design that does not use the holes in the router base as a guide so that you can use a larger diameter rod (or even a pipe) and thus increase I and decrease d.

I don't mean to get overly technical or to conduct a math clinic, but sometimes resort to the underlying equations is the clearest way to present the concepts.

rstermer


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## SE18 (Apr 6, 2009)

Thanks, rstermer, for the analysis and the important clarification on hollow vs solid

I immediately saw the benefit of using the design posted by BobJ, since steel pipe could be accommodated.

After all, I don't want my router acting like a pungy jumper as would be the case with allthread


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## allthunbs (Jun 22, 2008)

Hi David:



bobj3 said:


> Tubing works well but think of lamp fixture hardware , many of the rods are steel/brass that go up the center of light fixtures,most have threads on both ends the norm and they 3/8-24 or 1/2-20 threads..and come in many lengths form 6" to 4 ft. long the norm..you can find them on the net..  plus you can get the nuts to fit at the same place...
> =======


I wouldn't trust my heavy Hitachi M12V 3 1/4HP monster on anything so light as lamp tubing. I use 12mm drill rod and other than it being available through Metal Supermarkets which makes it a little harder to find, it suits my needs perfectly.

There are a variety of ways that you can use skis. You can lock them into rails or rail equivalents and use them that way. I have used them that way when I'm doing repeating tasks. It is easier to make repetitive cuts by sliding the router on the rails than it is to freehand it. 

However, I use a striking knife to scribe a line then, using skis and a magnifying glass I can get right to the line, freehand. It depends on the application and your objective and method.

Thanks for the discussion. I'll update the manual accordingly.

Allthunbs


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## BigJimAK (Mar 13, 2009)

rstermer said:


> What you are really interested in is minimizing deflection. A simply supported beam with a center load (not quite our case but good enough for illustrative purposes) has a maximum deflection given by the following equation:
> 
> d = wl^3/48EI
> 
> ...


Extrapolating on rstermers idea of larger pipe, I've attached a PDF of one concept for the plate for such a jig. Is this over the top? It's still a very rough concept. 


You would snadwich the router between two of these plates, snugged up tite. Pony clamp sized pipe fits through the bushing to a (not shown) oversized pair of ski ends. Any pipe would do, its just that many of us have pony's with multiple sizes of pipe already in our shop.

Due to weight, primary motion would likely come from sliding the pipe in the bushing, different from their smaller cousin.

One thing about it; it would be ridgid enough to plane the surface of wide panels, even several feet wide.

What do you think?

Jim


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## allthunbs (Jun 22, 2008)

Hi Jim:

Ok, I think this is going a bit too far. 



BigJimAK said:


> You would snadwich the router between two of these plates, snugged up tite. Pony clamp sized pipe fits through the bushing to a (not shown) oversized pair of ski ends. Any pipe would do, its just that many of us have pony's with multiple sizes of pipe already in our shop.


As I've said, I'm using 12mm drill rod to support a >12lb Hitachi M12V running 33,000 rpm with a bit carving away 1/2" thick at a time. I don't get any noticeable deflection in the rods. There is a limit to the amount that you can feed into the bit at any given moment, but that's not enough to cause much deflection.

I've used 12mm threaded and 12mm drill rod. I prefer the drill rod but I've not noticed deflection with either. My drill rods are 3' long and the threaded rods are about 2' long (I think, can't remember at the moment, they're buried).

The setup you're proposing will certainly have less deflection but your router will not be able to plunge deep enough to contact the workpiece under the hollow rods. There are pictures kicking around somewhere that show rods on the top of a baseplate. If you're stuck, that would be a preferred method.

Just a different perspective. I hope this helps.

Allthunbs


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi Guys

You're making it to hard ..just some threaded rod works just fine,,it's no big deal with threads or without threads ,the router doesn't need to move to one side or the other side all the time..it comes down how the rod is setup,,contact points or to say load points the shorter they are the better...it's very hard to bend 3/8" diam.rod if it only 6" long to the load point ,after all we are talking about 15lb.the norm..that's about 1.875 lbs.per.load point.. this is the same if it goes into the router base or on a base plate carrier , if the rod was bigger like 5/8"or 3/4" diam. you could drive a truck on it and I don't think it would sag down..

I'm not a math wiz but I do use common sense  that's why I say all thread rod works just fine...and it's cheap and just about anyone can make the ski jig for almost nothing. and that's what it's all about I think 

========


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## levon (Sep 14, 2008)

bobj3 said:


> Hi Guys
> 
> You're making it to hard ..just some threaded rod works just fine,,it's no big deal with threads or without threads ,the router doesn't need to move to one side or the other side all the time..it comes down how the rod is setup,,contact points or to say load points the shorter they are the better...it's very hard to bend 3/8" diam.rod if it only 6" long to the load point ,after all we are talking about 15lb.the norm..that's about 1.875 lbs.per.load point.. this is the same if it goes into the router base or on a base plate carrier , if the rod was bigger like 5/8"or 3/4" diam. you could drive a truck on it and I don't think it would sag down..
> 
> ...


i agree with BobJ totally! i used his tutorials and advice to build my ski jig. 
it works great! i used allthread for my ski jig.

i think people overthink things sometimes. you need to realize the ski jig rests on the template or workpiece totally and my ski jig with allthread works great!

while i could be worrying about deflection and such, instead, im using my ski jig to make ovals and rectangles and boxes etc.

also, i would not use a router over 2 1/4 hp on a ski jig. its lighter and does anything you need to do. 

this is just my humble opinion.


----------



## levon (Sep 14, 2008)

here are a few photos of mine and it works greaat.


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## rstermer (Apr 22, 2008)

levon said:


> here are a few photos of mine and it works greaat.
> 
> View attachment 25621
> 
> ...


I like your paint job, matches your router!


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## levon (Sep 14, 2008)

rstermer said:


> I like your paint job, matches your router!


hi rstermer,

thats kind of funny, i just went to lowes and picked up a can of spray paint and luck have it, it was close.

thanks for the compliment. my ski jig is simple, like me, but i do love it.

p.s. now it has scratches on the paint job, but i built it to use a lot


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## rstermer (Apr 22, 2008)

bobj3 said:


> Hi Guys
> 
> You're making it to hard ..just some threaded rod works just fine,,it's no big deal with threads or without threads ,the router doesn't need to move to one side or the other side all the time..it comes down how the rod is setup,,contact points or to say load points the shorter they are the better...it's very hard to bend 3/8" diam.rod if it only 6" long to the load point ,after all we are talking about 15lb.the norm..that's about 1.875 lbs.per.load point.. this is the same if it goes into the router base or on a base plate carrier , if the rod was bigger like 5/8"or 3/4" diam. you could drive a truck on it and I don't think it would sag down..
> 
> ...


I'm not saying allthread is bad or knocking the ski concept as it has been developed here. I was just responding to a post that was looking for another way to go about it because the poster felt there was too much sag using allthread. The math was just to point out how one could, if one wanted to, go about constructing a stiffer structure. Sorry if I offended anyone's sensibilities. I spent a good number of years analyzing and designing structures and machinery in the aerospace industry. My enthusiasm for designing optimum structures is a lifelong thing, I certainly don't mean my response as criticism for what has already been done.
rstermer


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## levon (Sep 14, 2008)

hi rstermer,

you surely didnt offend me and im pretty sure you didnt offend BobJ. he just usually says what he thinks. hes a pretty tough guy and means no harm. (maybe i shouldn't have let his secret out) lol lol

i might add i have copied his designs numerous times and have always found them to work great.

but also, its great to get different points of view on different subjects, after all thats how we learn and improve.


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## harrysin (Jan 15, 2007)

Guys, I really don't know what all the fuss and re-inventing is all about. I and several others that I know personally, have been using skis just like mine for MANY years without problems, sure, our routers are well designed by Japanese specialists Makita and Hitachi, both brands having 12mm or maybe for some countries 1/2" side fence holes. With smooth rods of this diameter, even with 27" rods there is no noticeable sag, bearing in mind that the skis are operated by the end cheeks. Much longer than 27" and the amount of control, irrespective of the size of the operator, seems to diminish.

Levon said "you need to realize the ski jig rests on the template or workpiece" this should not be so, by leaving a gap between the workpiece and the router base, the debris disperses far easier, and with a large gap, it's possible to see just what the cutter is doing.


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## levon (Sep 14, 2008)

hi Harry,
i rethought that after i posted it, and know there are instances it has to be off the workpiece or template. and i know youre far wiser than me. but it is a lot easier to me to sit it right down on the wood anytime i can. i use a 1 1/2 guide, clear plate and lights to help. but dont do as i do, do as i say do, lollol


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi Harry

Many don't use a tank of a router (3HP /3 1/4 HP ) to do a simple job  it's true the tank routers do have 1/2"/12mm holes but not all of them,one that's comes to mine is the PC 3 hp router that many of us use in the states, but most don't need a tank to drive a tack,so to speak..

You and I have been down the road about all thread rod so I will open that sore again 

I know you said the router should be up and off the template/stock but I'm not to sure way,,all it takes if a vac.pickup tube and all the chips get sucked out and out of the way making it easy to see what's going on under the router base then if you add a light it makes it just a little bit essayer on top of that..  as you know 

I don't want to re-inventing the ski jig I just want it easy for anyone that wants one to have one,by mounting the router a base plate and the add the rods to keep it up and floating along nice and easy..
I will agree that using 1/2" rods would be nice but it's not to be on some routers  and the cost of do so can put some off I think..

It's like most would love to have a 1200.oo dollar table saw but we all know a 200.oo dollar table saw will do the job just fine 



Ping/Pong Harry 

=====





harrysin said:


> Guys, I really don't know what all the fuss and re-inventing is all about. I and several others that I know personally, have been using skis just like mine for MANY years without problems, sure, our routers are well designed by Japanese specialists Makita and Hitachi, both brands having 12mm or maybe for some countries 1/2" side fence holes. With smooth rods of this diameter, even with 27" rods there is no noticeable sag, bearing in mind that the skis are operated by the end cheeks. Much longer than 27" and the amount of control, irrespective of the size of the operator, seems to diminish.
> 
> Levon said "you need to realize the ski jig rests on the template or workpiece" this should not be so, by leaving a gap between the workpiece and the router base, the debris disperses far easier, and with a large gap, it's possible to see just what the cutter is doing.


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## BigJimAK (Mar 13, 2009)

Nice job, rstermer.


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## allthunbs (Jun 22, 2008)

levon said:


> i used allthread for my ski jig.


Then, I challenge you to try smooth rod. Warning, you'll have to modify your philosophy though. Smooth rods allow you more freedom and greater functionality.

Allthunbs


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## allthunbs (Jun 22, 2008)

rstermer said:


> The math was just to point out how one could, if one wanted to, go about constructing a stiffer structure. Sorry if I offended anyone's sensibilities.


I may be the one guilty of such sensibilities without meaning to. It is a good thing this discussion is taking place. You must remember that router manufacturers don't know what skis are. Heavens, they don't even know what template guides are used for. Some router makers give you one hole for a straight edge and that's all. Others give you two holes but make them so small, they're useless. In this case, your calculations will be very handy. I use 12mm rod but there will be those that buy routers before they know what skis are and are trying to retrofit skis on routers that can't handle them.

Rstermer, your contribution is appreciated. Now, is there some way that we can simplify the calculations, like -- press down on the rod, if it moves its too week?

Allthunbs


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## allthunbs (Jun 22, 2008)

bobj3 said:


> Many don't use a tank of a router (3HP /3 1/4 HP ) to do a simple job


All router operations are simple. It's the volume of them that demands heavy equipment. Cutting a shallow groove can be done with a dremel or a laminate trimmer. Remove the background from a sign can still be done with a dremel or a laminate trimmer, but it would go quicker with a 3HP workhorse. Buy the workhorse first. You won't regret it. You can actually use it to cut the groove.



bobj3 said:


> it's true the tank routers do have 1/2"/12mm holes but not all of them,one that's comes to mine is the PC 3 hp router that many of us use in the states, but most don't need a tank to drive a tack,so to speak..


I repeat, router manufacturers don't design for skis, let alone other functions. Just because it's a PC doesn't mean it was designed by router users. One collects routers, one does not have "A" router because manufacturer's can't get it right. If multiple routers are hard on the budget, search around garage sales and you can find some real bargains. Your first purchase will begin your education, as will every purchase thereafter. Some will be lucky and participate in this forum and learn before they buy. 



bobj3 said:


> You and I have been down the road about all thread rod so I will open that sore again


I have and have used both. There is no comparison. Smooth rod is far more effective than threaded rod and my experiments have proven it.



bobj3 said:


> It's like most would love to have a 1200.oo dollar table saw but we all know a 200.oo dollar table saw will do the job just fine


I had a $200 table saw. It won't do the job just fine. It is dangerous and wastes material. I tried to cut some shelving using a $450 Sears Craftsman plastic table saw and I had to add cement block to the base to stop it from tipping over. Then, I couldn't get the fence set up accurately enough so the blade wouldn't bind so I ended up cutting the shelves by hand. Give someone you hate a $200 table saw. Buy a minimum of a contractor's saw for yourself.

Allthunbs


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## harrysin (Jan 15, 2007)

RON, WOW, you've saved me at least an hour that I would have spent answering all those posts, and I doubt that I would have stated the FACTS so elegantly.

Just one further point, for most operations there is no need for the skis if the router is sitting on the template, as shown here, in one case a router support is used which ensures that the router won't tilt at the edges and the other shot shows how, when the template has a large opening that could allow the router to tilt into it, then pieces of material the same thickness as the template are a fast simple solution. Like the skis, I was not the one who conceived the ideas.


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## rstermer (Apr 22, 2008)

harrysin said:


> RON, WOW, you've saved me at least an hour that I would have spent answering all those posts, and I doubt that I would have stated the FACTS so elegantly.
> 
> Just one further point, for most operations there is no need for the skis if the router is sitting on the template, as shown here, in one case a router support is used which ensures that the router won't tilt at the edges and the other shot shows how, when the template has a large opening that could allow the router to tilt into it, then pieces of material the same thickness as the template are a fast simple solution. Like the skis, I was not the one who conceived the ideas.


Hi Harry- What are the approximate dimensions of the frame used in the second photo you posted? Making a frame for template routing is just another in the seemingly ever increasing number of things I need to do to get set up to do some real woodworking! The list just continues to grow!
rstermer


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi Ron

That's like saying buy a 18 wheeler and you can use it to go to the store to buy a loaf of bread..

" $200 table saw. Buy a minimum of a contractor's saw" that is a contractor's saw..

The holes in the router base are in place for the edge guides the norm not for the ski rods...

Why not just buy a router that setup to do all the jobs, like 3/8" holes in the base to take on the ski rods..

"It's fine to disagree with other members as long as you respect their opinions." 
MIKE
Senior Moderator


======



allthunbs said:


> All router operations are simple. It's the volume of them that demands heavy equipment. Cutting a shallow groove can be done with a dremel or a laminate trimmer. Remove the background from a sign can still be done with a dremel or a laminate trimmer, but it would go quicker with a 3HP workhorse. Buy the workhorse first. You won't regret it. You can actually use it to cut the groove.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


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## levon (Sep 14, 2008)

hi Ron,
you are entitled to your opinions and i, mine. i wont say im right, but neither will i say you are.

just a basic difference of opinion. im not being negative just stating my opinion. 

im not going to try and tell anyone that i know everything and im right and they are wrong. 

there is room for everyones opinions here.


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## allthunbs (Jun 22, 2008)

levon said:


> hi Ron,
> you are entitled to your opinions and i, mine. i wont say im right, but neither will i say you are.
> 
> just a basic difference of opinion. im not being negative just stating my opinion.
> ...


Hi Levon:

I was not saying you were wrong nor was I not accepting your opinion, nor was I being disrespectful. You have tried threaded rods as have I. However, I have also tried smooth rods and I found a tremendous difference. I'm trying to encourage you to try the smooth rods too. You _may_ find a difference.

Allthunbs


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## allthunbs (Jun 22, 2008)

harrysin said:


> RON, WOW, you've saved me at least an hour that I would have spent answering all those posts, and I doubt that I would have stated the FACTS so elegantly.


Elegant? I've never been accused of that before:sarcastic:




harrysin said:


> Just one further point, for most operations there is no need for the skis if the router is sitting on the template, as shown here, in one case a router support is used which ensures that the router won't tilt at the edges and the other shot shows how, when the template has a large opening that could allow the router to tilt into it, then pieces of material the same thickness as the template are a fast simple solution. Like the skis, I was not the one who conceived the ideas.


The first picture I call a foot. In my case, it's just a board replacing my straight edge jig.

Rstermer:

The template frame is just four sticks of equal thickness to the workpiece nailed to a common foundation. the workpiece may need to be attached with double stick tape. Make sure the sticks are nice and wide.

Harry has a slightly different setup so I'll leave that to him to explain.

Allthunbs


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi Ron

I should note , on my main ski jig I did go over board just a little bit with the all thread rod, I use 3/8-12 ACME full thread B7 4140 steel DHT steel with nuts of the same stock it's almost imposable to bend that's why they use in jacks/vises/etc..the threads are almost flat so to speak and it stronger than solid 3/8" rod... and I would say it's stronger than 1/2" stock as well 

One more note you said you used 12mm drill rod that must be a Type-O,,  drill rod is Rockwell 35-45, if I recall and almost imposable to thread without a annealed job and then a HT job after..now if it's hot roll or cold roll or leadalloy it would be easy to thread the ends.. 

Putting threads on drill rod would be like trying to put threads on a drill bit..




=======


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## allthunbs (Jun 22, 2008)

MetalSupermarkets.com identifies the stuff I got thusly:

Metal Supermarkets

Category: TOOL STEEL 
Profile: DRILL ROD A2 12MM X 36
Grade: A2
Size: 12

This is a common stock item and comes in a variety of sizes:

RILL ROD A2 .125 X 36
DRILL ROD A2 .156 X 36
DRILL ROD A2 4MM X 36
DRILL ROD A2 .187 X 36
DRILL ROD A2 5mm X 36
DRILL ROD 01 5mm X 36
DRILL ROD 01 .2343 X 36
DRILL ROD A2 .2343 X 36
DRILL ROD A2 .250 X 36
DRILL ROD A2 .265 X 36
DRILL ROD A2 .281 X 36
DRILL ROD A2 .313 X 36
DRILL ROD A2 .375 X 36
DRILL ROD A2 .3906 X 36
DRILL ROD A2 .4062 X 36
DRILL ROD A2 .438 X 36
DRILL ROD A2 .4687 X 36
DRILL ROD A2 .500 X 36
DRILL ROD A2 17/32 .531 X 36
DRILL ROD A2 .625 X 36
DRILL ROD A2 .750 X 36
DRILL ROD A2 .875 X 36
DRILL ROD A2 1.000 X 36
DRILL ROD A2 1.125 X 36
DRILL ROD A2 1.250 X 36
DRILL ROD A2 1.500 X 36
DRILL ROD A2 2.00 X 36
DRILL ROD A2 7mm X 36
DRILL ROD A2 8 mm X 36
DRILL ROD A2 6MM X 36
DRILL ROD A2 10MM X 36
DRILL ROD A2 12MM X 36
DRILL ROD A2 15 mm X 36
DRILL ROD A2 16 mm X 36
DRILL ROD A2 20 mm X 36

Other grades available are as follows: 01, A2, D2, M2, O1 and, W1. Grades A2, O1 and W1 have the largest range of sizes available. Consult MetalSupermarkets for hardness and other characteristics.

They also sell round bar in a broad range of grades and sizes. Consult your local metals supplier for best council on materials and grades for your specific purpose.

My machinist used a few choice words while he was doing the sizing and threading but the job is done and they work beautifully. No it did not need an "annealed job and then a HT." I took my router and threaded rod skis with me, showed the machinist what I was doing and allowed him to do his job. 

I'm sure that if it needed to be "annealed and HT'd" he would have done it. He has been practicing his craft for at least 30 years and has a client base both in the US and Canada, so I'm not about to start second-guessing him.

"Putting threads on drill rod would be like trying to put threads on a drill bit.." I find this comment somewhat felicitous. The machinist's partner was making milling machine bits while I was there.

Allthunbs


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## SE18 (Apr 6, 2009)

harrysin said:


> RON, WOW, you've saved me at least an hour that I would have spent answering all those posts, and I doubt that I would have stated the FACTS so elegantly.
> 
> Just one further point, for most operations there is no need for the skis if the router is sitting on the template, as shown here, in one case a router support is used which ensures that the router won't tilt at the edges and the other shot shows how, when the template has a large opening that could allow the router to tilt into it, then pieces of material the same thickness as the template are a fast simple solution. Like the skis, I was not the one who conceived the ideas.


It appears however that the ski could still be used in most freehand cases, IOW, I'd be inclined to leave the router on the ski unless there were a compelling reason to remove it.

It would be interesting to know who invented the first skis (Scandinavians .

It would also be interesting who there are not more commercial vendors hawking skis, seeing how useful they are


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## allthunbs (Jun 22, 2008)

SE18 said:


> It appears however that the ski could still be used in most freehand cases, IOW, I'd be inclined to leave the router on the ski unless there were a compelling reason to remove it.
> 
> It would be interesting to know who invented the first skis (Scandinavians .
> 
> It would also be interesting who there are not more commercial vendors hawking skis, seeing how useful they are


You're right. My procedure analysis is to determine if I can do a job on skis first, then the table, then other "methods." Harry will do it differently, he starts with a template and works around that.

You must appreciate that everyone has their own focus and methods. For me, I'm renovating a house so I need lots of joints and large milled pieces that skis are ideal for. I also had to make my shop portable so lap joints are commonplace here. Your requirements will be different depending on your focus. My objective is to give you just one other method of using a router. It is up to you to determine your requirements and what works best for you.

I'm not sure but I think credit is supposed to go to "Template Tom" for router skis. He sticks his nose in here from time to time. 

I've wondered that myself, especially since everybody and his uncle sells dovetail jigs, which are marginally useful for most jobs compared to skis which are far more universal. I guest there's something about "12lbs with a really sharp knife travelling at 30,000 rpm, stuck way up in the air" that is rather terrifying. I'm still remembering the sweat rolling off my forehead when I was about to turn my router on for the first time on skis. ;-)

Allthunbs


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## harrysin (Jan 15, 2007)

My approach to a routing project is to way up the job and then decide which is going to be the best or quickest way to accomplish it. This is why I push plunge routing, template guides and skis, not because I consider them the only way to use a router, but because they ADD to the more usual methods, giving the routologist a wider choice of problem solving techniques.

I make my rods from bright mild steel rods, cheap, easy to get and easy to machine and thread.


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## harrysin (Jan 15, 2007)

rstermer said:


> Hi Harry- What are the approximate dimensions of the frame used in the second photo you posted? Making a frame for template routing is just another in the seemingly ever increasing number of things I need to do to get set up to do some real woodworking! The list just continues to grow!
> rstermer


Most of the jig holders that I make and use are 300mm x 400mm, close to 12" x 15", others are 300mm x 300mm, about 12" x 12". These sizes are based on the fact that most of my projects can be completed within these sizes. If you were going to rout a set of table legs 28" long, you would need to make a long narrow jig holder, there are no fixed rules here. My jig holders are made from 2" x 1" pine


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## levon (Sep 14, 2008)

hi Harry,

i have one like the photo #1 you show. it works good, but as instructed by someone and i dont remember who, i put setscrews in mine. for anyone wanting to build one, i would not use the setcsrews. the reason being that when using various thicknesses of materials and templates, they become useless.

i think thin wedges work a lot better. just my opinion.


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## allthunbs (Jun 22, 2008)

levon said:


> i think thin wedges work a lot better


Thanks for the tip Levon. I'll stick that one in the "keep it" category.:yes4:


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## levon (Sep 14, 2008)

thanks Ron, i use thin washers, the make great shims. at least for me.


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## harrysin (Jan 15, 2007)

levon said:


> thanks Ron, i use thin washers, the make great shims. at least for me.


I'm assuming that you're referring to keeping the template tight in the jig holder. If you look about half way along the right side of the template in this shot, you'll see a small scrap of Laminex tapped level with the surface.


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## levon (Sep 14, 2008)

hi Harry

youre absolutely right. and i think i see it, its early here and my eyes are not focusing that well yet


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## allthunbs (Jun 22, 2008)

levon said:


> hi Harry
> 
> youre absolutely right. and i think i see it, its early here and my eyes are not focusing that well yet


Geeze you got good eyes.


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

HI Ron

I have been thinking about your ski jig, but I could not find a picture of it in your Gallery I did find a picture of a switch on a 2 x 4 but that was about it..700 posted items over a year ,but only a picture or two ,what's up with that ? ?

Can you please post a picture or two of it, I would love to see it and how you have yours setup 

Thanks 
=======


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## Duane867 (Oct 25, 2008)

I am SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOooooooooooooooo going to make a set of router ski's now !
:-D


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## harrysin (Jan 15, 2007)

Duane867 said:


> I am SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOooooooooooooooo going to make a set of router ski's now !
> :-D


I should think so Duane, you've been a member since October, reading time is over, building time is about to commence, complete with a photo shoot, isn't it?


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## BigJimAK (Mar 13, 2009)

levon said:


> hello rstermer,
> 
> the dimensions are 14 x 20. it is 3/4 mdf. after putting the crosshatch lines on it i sprayed it with clear laqcer to save the lines. put the lines on front and back. i have not done the wholes yet. you first make a counter bore on the back for t-nuts and then drill the holes all the way through for the screws. i have made my cams but havent drilled them yet. all the drilling is done on the drill press.


Levon,

What is the advantage of putting the crosshatch lines on the back? I would have thought you would mark one side and then drill through and use the holes to identify the grid. I'm sure I'm missing something important here. <g>


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## levon (Sep 14, 2008)

hi Jim

i used the marks on back to make a counterbore for the tee nuts and then drilled all the way through. if my camera battery were up and running, id post a pic. i just finished drilling all the counterbores and all the thru holes , a total of 432. i still have to finish all the cams.


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## BigJimAK (Mar 13, 2009)

levon said:


> hi Jim
> 
> i used the marks on back to make a counterbore for the tee nuts and then drilled all the way through. if my camera battery were up and running, id post a pic. i just finished drilling all the counterbores and all the thru holes , a total of 432. i still have to finish all the cams.


Wow! You may want to send your drill on a well-deserved vacation after that!


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi Guys

This may help 

http://www.routerforums.com/jigs-fixtures/13311-bobj3-mr-jigs.html

========


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## Bob N (Oct 12, 2004)

BJ..... I could have lived all day without being reminded of all those holes :no:

That was one "boring" task... excuse the pun :haha:


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## levon (Sep 14, 2008)

hi Bob

you know it isnt that bad with a drill press and a fence, or i think i used 2 different fences and then a fence made from shims to get the center 2 rows,lol.


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## BigJimAK (Mar 13, 2009)

Thanks, BJ...

That was very helpfull. I tried searching the forum for information like this, but couldn't come up with the correct words to find it.

Jim


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi Jim

Your Welcome ,,it's hard for me to find them also,,,I make a note of who did what, that's about the only way I can find them 

========



BigJimAK said:


> Thanks, BJ...
> 
> That was very helpfull. I tried searching the forum for information like this, but couldn't come up with the correct words to find it.
> 
> Jim


----------



## Duane867 (Oct 25, 2008)

harrysin said:


> I should think so Duane, you've been a member since October, reading time is over, building time is about to commence, complete with a photo shoot, isn't it?


Yeah yeah, I hear ya Harry 

I'll snap a photo of my Ryobi intermediate table and what I have done of the super sled for the TS this weekend. Then I'll start on the ski's. I gott'a say though I am enjoying the router much more then the TS so far.


----------



## Duane867 (Oct 25, 2008)

Holy hell,
Now I have another project I want to build after seeing Bob and Harry's jig boards. 
Those are sweet. Whats the dimensions on those cams, or does it matter ?
If/when I make one of those bad boys I'll just lay it all out in pencil and use a punch to mark the center of each hole. Then go to town on the press. Wont really need a table or a fence that way. I'll end up doing the center rows by hand any way though. My Press has a shallow reach. ( that and its a Harbor freight cheapy 8" that the key less chucks going out on )


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi Duane867

Cams be any size,I like the bigger ones (2") but Harry likes the smaller ones (button size) but to each his own..

Cam board ,use 6" to 8" wide stock then glue in up after the holes are in place  to any size you want to use.. aging the bigger the better for me..



========




Duane867 said:


> Holy hell,
> Now I have another project I want to build after seeing Bob and Harry's jig boards.
> Those are sweet. Whats the dimensions on those cams, or does it matter ?
> If/when I make one of those bad boys I'll just lay it all out in pencil and use a punch to mark the center of each hole. Then go to town on the press. Wont really need a table or a fence that way. I'll end up doing the center rows by hand any way though. My Press has a shallow reach. ( that and its a Harbor freight cheapy 8" that the key less chucks going out on )


----------



## levon (Sep 14, 2008)

thanks BobJ 
for putting up the pictures. i bought my wife a nice camera awhile back and took the old one for pictures in the shop which i have been using. i started to use it the other day and the battery wont charge. i dont want to take wifes new expensive job to do that. also it is a high mega pixel camera and being dumb about that kind of thing, think the picture files would be very large. especially when trying to post them.


----------



## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi Bud

Your Welcome,,,,Duck soup stuff 

Give the old one to wife  ,most the high end cameras can be set down, pixel size and picture size, easy stuff with the menu item  just a note the same card can be used in both the norm...use hers,take the picture with your card in it, then pop it you cam ...

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levon said:


> thanks BobJ
> for putting up the pictures. i bought my wife a nice camera awhile back and took the old one for pictures in the shop which i have been using. i started to use it the other day and the battery wont charge. i dont want to take wifes new expensive job to do that. also it is a high mega pixel camera and being dumb about that kind of thing, think the picture files would be very large. especially when trying to post them.


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## levon (Sep 14, 2008)

thanks BobJ

i called and located a battery, its 30 bucks


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## Duane867 (Oct 25, 2008)

Thanks Bob. 
I'll start on that as soon as I get another TS. The bargain saw I got has turned out to be a POS to the 10th degree. Its going in the dumpster this Sunday so no one else will come along and possibly kill them selves thinking they scored from garbage picking. I'll keep the table and stand though. Maybe make a router extension from the table, and a work bench using the stand ? Who knows .. but I will make some thing with them damn it ! LOL !
I'll pick up a new saw here in a week or two I think. Hopefully in two weeks that Ryobi BT3000 will still be up for sale near me.


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## BigJimAK (Mar 13, 2009)

Duane867 said:


> Thanks Bob.
> I'll start on that as soon as I get another TS. The bargain saw I got has turned out to be a POS to the 10th degree. Its going in the dumpster this Sunday so no one else will come along and possibly kill them selves thinking they scored from garbage picking. I'll keep the table and stand though. Maybe make a router extension from the table, and a work bench using the stand ? Who knows .. but I will make some thing with them damn it ! LOL !
> I'll pick up a new saw here in a week or two I think. Hopefully in two weeks that Ryobi BT3000 will still be up for sale near me.


Duane,

Somewhere I saw a post where the writer found an aluminum-topped TS in the dumpster. He stripped out the motor and arbor and cut the top to mount a $20 garage-sale belt sander on its side in it, to use for edge sanding. It sounded like a pretty good idea.


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## RustyW (Dec 28, 2005)

Bob said:


> BJ..... I could have lived all day without being reminded of all those holes :no:
> 
> That was one "boring" task... excuse the pun :haha:



There seems to have been a lot of people drilling lots of holes lately. My jig (that was a lot less boring) has held up really well. It uses T-slots and 10-24 T-nuts that I got from Hartville.


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## harrysin (Jan 15, 2007)

A first class jig Rusty, I can see others following that route.


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## Bob N (Oct 12, 2004)

Nice jig Rusty and you got my attention


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## Duane867 (Oct 25, 2008)

There ya go Rusty ! 
I'll try that ! I'm a lazy SOB so I'll go the easy route 1st HA HA HA !


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