# Bathtub refinishing?



## 163481 (Jul 8, 2015)

I think some of you know I have an older house. In the bathroom is a cast iron bathtub that is chipped and rusted in spots and is in desperate need of refinishing. What I've been looking at is an "epoxy acrylic" finish that is professionally applied. Is epoxy acrylic a good product? Is there something better? What would you renovators recommend?

Bearing in mind this is the Bay area of California, what should this job cost?


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## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

Chuck, if you can afford it the best solution is to pull it out and take it into a shop that does porcelain glazing...ie they have a kiln.
I haven't done one for years but there was a company up here in Vancouver, BC that did the whole thing. Picked it up, did the re-glazing, and brought it back.
The epoxy route is good but only for occasional use; basically for aesthetics. Again, there's guys that'll come over to your site, mask everything off, and spray the epoxy paint for you.
From my experience with them I'd recommend that route. (But again, for looks, not long term durability.)

As folks like to say, 'your mileage may vary'.


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## 163481 (Jul 8, 2015)

Dan, how does the epoxy acrylic compare with the gel coat of a fiberglas tub? I can't imagine there'd be much difference.

I'd certainly prefer to keep the cast tub and there is another consideration: In order to get the tub out, the walls would be destroyed along with the floor tile. That would be expensive to fix and I'd rather not do that.


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## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

Epoxy is way more durable than polyester resin. But epoxy is a serious health hazard in it's vapour form. Don't get it on your bare skin or breathe the vapour...and the epoxy thinner is even worse. Soap and water cleanup for any that you get on yourself..._do not get the thinner on your bare skin._ Very carcinogenic and harmful to your liver.
Not saying don't use it; just be health conscious. Good ventilation for starters, and a vapour mask.
Send us before and after pics, Chuck.


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## 163481 (Jul 8, 2015)

DaninVan said:


> Send us before and after pics, Chuck.


That ain't gonna happen. My wife would kill me if I took any "before" pics.

I wasn't intending to do this myself. For this kind of specialized work I'd just as soon let the pros handle it. Do you have any idea of what the epoxy acrylic finish application should cost? The place I'm looking at does all the cleaning and patching, etches the porcelain with acid and, of course, applies the epoxy. And they talk about bringing in a portable ventilation system.


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## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

Sorry, Chuck, it's been awhile. But keep in mind the condition, size, and type of tub will vary, making each one a custom quote. 
I'd be surprised if it was less than $500.


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## rpludwig (Nov 22, 2011)

from my experience (40 years), don't bother....cover it with several moving blankets and take a sledge hammer to it (wear eye protection) and carry it out in pieces. Replace with a current f-glass, acrylic or similar product of your choice and configuration....price out your options both ways...messy but worth the effort, and you'll be glad you did...fwiw...


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## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

I wasn't going to go there, but Ron makes a good point. The flip side is that a cast iron tub that's been reglazed is fairly valuable; un re-glazed somewhat less. Only break it up if you can't get it out easily. They have value.
Another point is that if you decide to refinish it in-situ, do it _ last_. Guaranteed you or a trades person will damage the new finish! It's a law of meta physics...


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## schnewj (Nov 18, 2013)

If this helps, I had a 4 1/2 foot tube that came out of a farm house in Iowa. My Ex's brother got it for her for $50. I hauled it back to LA and it sat in my back yard for almost two years. I sandblasted the ball and claw feet and use Minwax chrome paint in a rattle can. I then found a guy who sprayed epoxy on it for $125. 

I had it installed into the master bathroom on a new house I built. The fixture for the tub cost me more then I had into the refinish job.

That was about 15 years ago. The spray job price it probably light compared to what they would charge today. I was able to haul it to the refinisher's house. He needed to do some touch-up and ended up coming to me and doing it in my garage. So, someone should be able to do it in place. 8' tubs are not easily moved.


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## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

Bill, I think Chuck mentioned 'disturbing the tile'...I'm assuming from that it's not a claw footed tub, but rather a built in.
That means of course that the tile floor runs up to it and the walls are tiled down to the rim on three sides. I could be wrong... ?

-My suggestion about taking it out for re-glazing is a non-starter.


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## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

I don't know if polyester resin is still one of your choices but it is not water proof. The gel coat is what makes it waterproof. Epoxy resin is waterproof. That originally came from Dan by the way.


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## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

Dan's not waterproof either.


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## schnewj (Nov 18, 2013)

DaninVan said:


> Bill, I think Chuck mentioned 'disturbing the tile'...I'm assuming from that it's not a claw footed tub, but rather a built in.
> That means of course that the tile floor runs up to it and the walls are tiled down to the rim on three sides. I could be wrong... ?
> 
> -My suggestion about taking it out for re-glazing is a non-starter.


Opps, missed the second post! Sorry! Since it is just a cast tub, rusted and beat up it is probably cheaper in the long run to just replace it with a new unit. If it is not rusted/pitted too much then it may be salvageable.

Most tubs can be refinished in place. Cost is another matter...it is California.


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## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

"Cost is another matter...it is California."
$500 for the tub...$1,000 for environ-mental fees? 

Please let us know what happens, Chuck. Especially the cost, eh?


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## mgmine (Jan 16, 2012)

I've seen re-glazed tubs. They look great when new but terrible when a few years old. Plus it cost more to have a tub glazed then it does to buy a new tub. A new tub is easy enough to install and as far as ruining the tile, would you want a new tub and old tile? A new tub and tile wall is a weekend job.


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## 163481 (Jul 8, 2015)

DaninVan said:


> it's not a claw footed tub, but rather a built in.(


Right, Dan. I guess I'll have to be satisfied with an epoxy recoat. Now if I can just get my wife to forego abrasive powder cleansers :no: and use non-abrasive liquids...


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## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

Bingo! I think the refinishing guys have recommendations for cleaners.


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## 163481 (Jul 8, 2015)

I've been looking online at home improvement stores and I can get a 15 x 32 x 60 porcelain enameled steel tub for $255. A porcelain enameled cast iron tub is $375. Of course, that doesn't include installation but if I could get someone to help me lift it into place, I could do the rest myself...even if I have to do some minor reframing.

I'll have to give this some more thought.


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## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

Plan on doing the whole tub enclosure; it's time.


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## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

Cast iron has way more mass than other tub materials. If you live in a hot climate and take cool baths that's a good thing. If you live in a cool climate and take warm baths then it's a bad thing because it takes a lot of really hot water to warm the cast iron up. If you live in a cold climate you want a tub with very low mass and density from an economics point of view.


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

go country...


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or get really serious...

.


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## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

On the other hand, if you take showers, Bob's your uncle!


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

DaninVan said:


> On the other hand, if you take showers, Bob's your uncle!


showers???


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## rpludwig (Nov 22, 2011)

sfchuck said:


> I've been looking online at home improvement stores and I can get a 15 x 32 x 60 porcelain enameled steel tub for $255. A porcelain enameled cast iron tub is $375. Of course, that doesn't include installation but if I could get someone to help me lift it into place, I could do the rest myself...even if I have to do some minor reframing.
> 
> I'll have to give this some more thought.


Look at American Standard Americast tubs...half the weight of cast iron, much better than steel or cheap acrylics...although a bit more pricey. Suggest you go look at HD/Lowes/Menards, whatever is in your area, chk 'em all out.

Steel = cold, chips easily, not a good choice...
Cast Iron = heavy & pita to install other than in new construction...


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## tomp913 (Mar 7, 2014)

rpludwig said:


> Cast Iron = heavy & pita to install other than in new construction...


In my first house, the steel tub was replaced by a cast iron tub. The distance between the framing left minimal clearance for installing the tub which set between two walls. My father-in-law opened up the wall in the bedroom at the end of the tub and we slid the tub in through the hole. The hole was patched but included an access panel in case the plumbing needed work in the future. Putting in the new tub allowed us to put backer board under the new tile and do the job properly, something to keep in mind when considering the pros and cons of replacing a tub.

We also packed insulation underneath the tub to help hold the heat in (once it warmed up).


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## 163481 (Jul 8, 2015)

My problem is this: This small bathroom is only 5' wide and to get a new tub in I'd have to get it past the vanity and the stool...a difficult job to say the least. I couldn't bring it through the wall of the master bath because that stool is in the way. Bringing it through the other side is out of the question...the dining room has a paneled wainscoting that I dare not disturb.

I'm thinking about selling the house and letting the next guy deal with it. :wink:

This thing was obviously installed as the house was being built and hasn't been touched since.


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## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

Chuck; it should fit. You bring it in standing on end. Slide it down into the tub space then rotate it into position.
All the wall cladding needs to be gone however in that tub space; it's normally only the apron side that's a serious length problem, and the open stud spaces allow for more diagonal distance on the apron side.
You need to have everything else done first...spout removed, valve handles off. In fact excellent time to replace the whole valve/shower assembly, do the removal before you play with the tub install; the replacement after.

Having the toilet out is a big help as well.


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## Herb Stoops (Aug 28, 2012)

You might consider taking the tub out and installing a shower stall instead, a big one!
Herb


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## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

+1 on the shower...just ignore Stick. 

I always held that there should be at least one tub per dwelling. If it's a tub-shower so much the better. A tub is just so useful as a place to wash the dog, take a bath if for some medical reason someone can't shower...a surgery or cast for instance. Sponge bath is the only practical alternative, in the tub. Mind you, you could certainly do that in a large shower enclosure.


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## Herb Stoops (Aug 28, 2012)

DaninVan said:


> +1 on the shower...just ignore Stick.
> 
> I always held that there should be at least one tub per dwelling. If it's a tub-shower so much the better. A tub is just so useful as a place to wash the dog, take a bath if for some medical reason someone can't shower...a surgery or cast for instance. Sponge bath is the only practical alternative, in the tub. Mind you, you could certainly do that in a large shower enclosure.


I can't remember the last time I took a bath.................................in a tub.:grin:

I have a shower that I use and a 5'X5' soaking tub that I have never used in the master bath. I have been thinking about tearing it out and putting a 5' wide shower in there with with shower head tube all way around 3 sides waist high and another big one overhead.
Herb


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## RainMan 2.0 (May 6, 2014)

Herb Stoops said:


> I can't remember the last time I took a bath.................................in a tub.:grin:
> 
> I have a shower that I use and a 5'X5' soaking tub that I have never used in the master bath. I have been thinking about tearing it out and putting a 5' wide shower in there with with shower head tube all way around 3 sides waist high and another big one overhead.
> Herb


I'm with you Herb as I only take showers . Although I do have a hot tub now but it's not for cleaning lol .
If I had my way I wouldn't have a bath tub in my bathroom ,but instead a big shower . For resale I don't think you have much of a choice though


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

DaninVan said:


> Chuck; it should fit. You bring it in standing on end. Slide it down into the tub space then rotate it into position.
> All the wall cladding needs to be gone however in that tub space; it's normally only the apron side that's a serious length problem, and the open stud spaces allow for more diagonal distance on the apron side.
> You need to have everything else done first...spout removed, valve handles off. In fact excellent time to replace the whole valve/shower assembly, do the removal before you play with the tub install; the replacement after.
> 
> Having the toilet out is a big help as well.


won't work because of the hypotenuses of the tub width and length and a mix there of..


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## Herb Stoops (Aug 28, 2012)

Stick486 said:


> won't work because of the hypotenuses of the tub width and length and a mix there of..


You just get a bigger hammer, Stick. After watching all those videos Dan posted ,I think he is qualified to get er in .:laugh2::laugh2:

Herb


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## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

Trust me, it works. You absolutely need the extra length/space provided by the stud spaces being empty at both ends. As I mentioned originally, it's only the apron end that is full ht. the wall side sits on a horizontal ledger; getting that in the exact right spot (ht. and perfectly level) is the secret.
How do you think they got them in originally?
The rough framed opening length should be at least 60 1/2"...1/4" gap at both ends when the tub's in. (Check the mgf. specs first!!!)


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

DaninVan said:


> Trust me, it works. You absolutely need the extra length/space provided by the stud spaces being empty at both ends. As I mentioned originally, it's only the apron end that is full ht. the wall side sits on a horizontal ledger; getting that in the exact right spot (ht. and perfectly level) is the secret.
> How do you think they got them in originally?
> The rough framed opening length should be at least 60 1/2"...1/4" gap at both ends when the tub's in. (Check the mgf. specs first!!!)


unnmmmmm
different VOE here and at least one wall isn't there...
or no DW...
or one or two studs gets pulled...


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## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

I think I mentioned bare studs. For sure no cladding in the tub enclosure. Using the empty stud spaces at both ends adds 7" to the horizontal distance (67"+/-)
I don't remember ever having to remove studs. Mind you,the KY might have helped.


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## jw2170 (Jan 24, 2008)

Stick486 said:


> go country...
> 
> 
> .
> ...


Nice view from the Deck, Stick... Cannot see the antennas from there...


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## mgmine (Jan 16, 2012)

rpludwig said:


> Look at American Standard Americast tubs...half the weight of cast iron, much better than steel or cheap acrylics...although a bit more pricey. Suggest you go look at HD/Lowes/Menards, whatever is in your area, chk 'em all out.
> 
> Steel = cold, chips easily, not a good choice...
> Cast Iron = heavy & pita to install other than in new construction...


I have put in 5 American Standard tubs and can't agree more they are great and not that heavy to work with. One person can easily do it. I think that they are called Ameri Cast but I can't be sure. What you don't want is a steel tub they look and feel cheap and chip easier than cast iron. As far as cleaning any tub Bon Ami is what you should use it won't scratch the surface. Auto detailers use it on windshields.


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## 163481 (Jul 8, 2015)

To close the loop, I took an entirely different tack. I stopped at the BORG and got some 2-part epoxy filler and some Naval Jelly rust remover. I treated the rusted spots and then filled the chipped spots with epoxy. After it cured I rasped and sanded the spots as flush as possible. That, I hope, will get us by for a few more months until we get some of the other work done that has been on the agenda for a while.

Thanks for all the comments and suggestions.


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