# lock bit length



## stuartwatson (Jun 13, 2011)

hi guys 
daft question maybe ! 
have just obtained a lock jig and am wondering what length of cutter bit i will require to plunge to a lock body depth of 3 inch .
i may just have a mental blank !
router has quarter inch collet and door is 55 mil thick.cutter to be 22 mill wide .
thaks fellas
stuart


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## istracpsboss (Sep 14, 2008)

Hi Stuart

I don't think I'd like to use a very long bit with only 1/4" shank. You need a 1/2" shank for that sort of work. I also doubt you'd get a 22mm bit in that shank size other than very short ones.
George does extra long bits but they will be 1/2" shank and you'll need several passes.
1 pc 1/2" SH 3" Blade Extra Long Straight Router Bit | eBay

I think you'll need a bigger router. You'd also be best hogging out most of the material with a drill first.

Cheers

Peter


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## Phil P (Jul 25, 2010)

stuartwatson said:


> have just obtained a lock jig and am wondering what length of cutter bit i will require to plunge to a lock body depth of 3 inch .
> 
> router has quarter inch collet and door is 55 mil thick.cutter to be 22 mill wide


Hi Stuart

If you are doing trade work the only jig worth a bean (in the UK, the OP is British, Bob) is the Trend jig. Which jig do you have?

As to trying to do a full-depth lock mortise with a 1/4in router, then no way Jose. You really require a 1/2in router and the work on lock jigs is generally done with deep pocket bits. Post me some more info and I'll be able to point you in the right direction about bit sizes, etc as i do lock mortising in multiples regularly

Regards

Phil


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## Phil P (Jul 25, 2010)

The OP contacted me by PM to confirm that he did indeed have the Trend lock mortise jig, which is the same jig as I use on commercial work, so this answer is to round out my previous reply.

The jig utilises laser-cut galvanised steel templates which are held in place by a pair of magnets. The procedure to set-up the jig is to mark a centre line on the door, loosen-off the angled fence and wind back the locking knobs. The V notches at each end of the jig are centred on the door centre line and the fence locked in place. The jig can then be clamped in place on the door and has another couple of notches to show the horizontal centre line of the lock. 

The router is then fitted with a 30mm guide bush (which comes with almost all 1/2in routers sold in the EU), which needs to be centred using a centring mandrel. A 12mm cutter (not 1/2in, please note) is then installed in the collet and the cutter is zeroed onto the surface of the door with the router sitting on top of the jig. The required template is then inserted into the jig - the jig comes with 12 faceplate templates and 4 mortise body templates which cover a large part of the "standard" range of locks here in the UK. Other templates are available including ones for Perko closers (hateful things!). 

I tend to rout-out the faceplate recess with a shorter (25 to 50mm or 1 to 2in long) 12mm diameter cutter before swapping to a deep pocket cutter (T2121-1/2) and an appropriate mortise body template to hog out the bulk of the lock body mortise. Any extra depth required in the mortise is simply and quickly achieved using an auger bit in an electric drill and a chisel to clean out. Finally I chop out the round corners of the faceplate recess using a corner squaring chisel. 

For speed when I'm doing these in batches I use two routers, one for the face plate, the other for the body. I also work the mortises with the door ready hung, although I wouldn't recommend that to others as it is a potentially hazardous procedure

The depth of plunge required means that only a 1/2in router can be used on the lock body mortises, although I generally use my little Festo OF1000 for the face plate recesses (which in any case are only 1/8in (or 3mm) or so deep. Unfortunately the router cutter suggested by the Peter is just not deep enough for use with this lock jig (sorry Peter!) quite apart from being the wrong diameter, hence my recommendation to buy a Wealden deep pocket cutter or similar (Trend also sell them at a much higher price). The range of templates supplied covers a wide range of standard locks available in the UK, although Trend can supply a wider range from stock (not in their catalogue, though), mostly overnight, and can make special sizes in 1 to 2 working days. These are all ordered directly from Trend, not the dealers (Please note: This applies in the UK/Ireland market. I'm unsure how it works elsewhere)

I'm about to experimant with larger diameter cutters (16mm x 150mm long - gives an extra 30mm depth of cut) and a special made to order guide bushing (34mm diameter) to increase my depth of cut. These will be used on my current project (a restaurant refurb). If this works satisfactorily I'll publish my results here

Regards

Phil


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

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===


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## Phil P (Jul 25, 2010)

Hi Bob

Then look a little on the lightweight side for serious (trade) use. How do they stand up to multiple use?

Regards

Phil


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi Phil

Not to sure. it's one of things I don't do all the time but I will say the rest of my life I think. I don't buy tools for my kids to sale off when I pass 


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Phil P said:


> Hi Bob
> 
> Then look a little on the lightweight side for serious (trade) use. How do they stand up to multiple use?
> 
> ...


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## Mike (Nov 22, 2004)

In North America most doors use knobsets and deadbolts which are quick and easy to install with the Kwikset installation kit shown below, there is also a newer version. For serious production work installing mortise locks there is no substitute for the Porter Cable mortising machine.


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## Phil P (Jul 25, 2010)

Mike said:


> For serious production work installing mortise locks there is no substitute for the Porter Cable mortising machine.


Hi Mike

We use completely different locksets over here in Europe. The type of set you have we normally only ever see on hotels and the like. The insurance people don't seem to like them, I'm told

I'd agree that for production work the P-C 513 is pretty good, although the more-modern Spanish-made Virutex FC16S has better dust extraction together with some other advantages (such the ability to carry side-drilling templates). I've used the Virutex and whilst it is a very nice piece of kit it is a lot more cumbersome to carry around - which is why for smaller batches of doors I tend to use the Trend

Regards

Phil


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi Phil

A slot is a slot, how about a 55.oo tool to do the same thing and all one needs is drill, no need to drop 1800.oo+ for a tool to do the same thing.
But You may say, but the max is 1/2" bit no big deal just move it over a little bit and make a 2nd. slot for the lock set to drop/fit in.  or use the 3/8" bit to make a 3/4" wide slot with a pass or two, by the way the bit is 10" long.

JessEm Zip Slot Mortise Mill - YouTube

http://www.routerforums.com/bargain-bin/23736-jessem-slot-mortiser-woodcraft.html

http://www.amazon.com/Porter-Cable-517-Lock-Face-Template/dp/B0000224L7/ref=pd_bxgy_hi_img_b

http://www.amazon.com/Porter-Cable-...ref=sr_1_1?s=hi&ie=UTF8&qid=1318115534&sr=1-1

for the cheap way ▼
http://www.amazon.com/JessEm-Pocket...ref=sr_1_1?s=hi&ie=UTF8&qid=1318108839&sr=1-1
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## Mike (Nov 22, 2004)

Phil, I am fully aware of the locks you use. I have had extensive dealings with Trio/Ving. I had two teams installing Vingcard mortise locks in hotels from the midwest to the Caribean and on cruise ships. Each 3 man team installed 50 locks a day. I customized a Simplex Unicam 1000 to fit a 5" thick oak door on The Sovereign of the Seas, at that time the worlds largest cruise ship. Quality knobsets and deadbolts properly installed are very secure; just ask the Detroit Police Department. It took them a little over an hour to defeat the Schlage deadbolt I installed in a boiler plate door on the Renegades M/C clubhouse.


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## Phil P (Jul 25, 2010)

bobj3 said:


> A slot is a slot, how about a 55.oo tool to do the same thing and all one needs is drill, no need to drop 1800.oo+ for a tool to do the same thing.
> But You may say, but the max is 1/2" bit no big deal just move it over a little bit and make a 2nd. slot for the lock set to drop/fit in.  or use the 3/8" bit to make a 3/4" wide slot with a pass or two, by the way the bit is 10" long.


Well, Bob, the video you link to shows a rather lightweight tool, IMHO. And in any case they've stopped making the jig which might be indicative of its durability or useablilty. Either way it's not really in the same league as the P-C or Virutex. 

As to a slot is a slot, well yes and no. The OP was enquiring _specifically_ about European-type lockset mortises. The lock bodies of these are generally in the range 17 to 24mm wide (5/8in to 31/32in) and with a length of 72 to 110mm (3 to 4in), although DDA locksets (required for disabled access doors, etc) can be up to 220mm long. The face plates are obviously even longer and wider (up to 245mm on DDAs), albeit at a depth of 3mm (1/8in). The JessEmm can do that sort of cut only if you are prepared to move it around, something like 8 positions for a DDA lockset (4 for the lock body mortise, 4 for the face plate mortise) - by which time I and most competent joiners I know could have drilled out the lock mortise, cleaned it out with a chisel, chiselled out the face plate recess and dropped the lock in ready to side drill........ Mike was talking in terms of a team installing 50 locksets a day (for a 3-man team, so 16/17 locks a day which I have achieved with a Trend jig and a purpose made keeper plate jig but only because we were using plant-on stop laths). That should give you some idea of the rate of commercial work and indicate why any jig like the JessEmm which needs to be moved to achieve the recess in recess lock openings we do is just going to be a royal pain. I've seen locksmiths over here using an even faster tool for one-offs, the Souber DBB which does the two mortises in about 5 minutes flat

Regards

Phil


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