# Safety Switch..



## Packy46 (Oct 28, 2007)

..


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## Bob N (Oct 12, 2004)

Here is a picture of mine. It came from Hartville Tool although they are available about anywhere.


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi Tim

I have 3 or 5 of them,, they are called dead man type, they sit on the floor and if you lift your foot off of them the machine will stop I have them on my band saw and the scroll saw as well ,they work great here's a link to one of them. You can find them in many types...most are about the same price, I do like the smaller ones...they really work great on the scroll saw, if I get into a jam I just lift my foot and move the stock around.. 


I like the foot type because my hands are always full of stock.. LOL and some times I don't want to let go to turn off the machine..the buttons are sometimes hard to find if you're in a toot...

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http://www.ptreeusa.com/routerControls.htm
http://www.intarsia.com/Hardware.html

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Packy46 said:


> Hi:
> Looking for a good emergency electrical cut-off switch,that I can externally mount to by table, or recess it into the stand ,for easy access.
> Thanks.
> Tim


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## kp91 (Sep 10, 2004)

http://www.sears.com/shc/s/p_10153_12605_00925188000P?vName=Tools&keyword=switch

Craftsman Power Switch for Router Table 
Sears item# 00925188000 Mfr. model# 25188 I'm using this one, it's not bad for $20


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## Ladd (Nov 11, 2007)

Rockler has a very nice one that you can turn off by bumping it with your knee. $30.
If the Sears on can do the same and is made OK, that would be a better deal.


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## challagan (Feb 7, 2006)

Tim, here is mine on the side of the table,it has a panic bar. Made by Rosseau. 

Corey


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## Gerard_sr (Dec 7, 2008)

While I'm just starting off, I did come up with an idea that may be worth mentioning here.
Please see *this post*.
I have not used it except for a few tests as I'm still building the router table extension for my Delta table saw. 

This week I'll be strengthening the table a bit and building a fence adapter, to put on the table saw fence in lieu of the sacrificial piece of wood on it now, when it will be used as the router fence.

I favor the "dead man" switch idea for some reason and this sort of moves it up a notch.

I'm also thinking of embedding a piece of red tinted Plexiglas right in the table top with a pair of lamps, rather than the one this prototype uses, behind it. There would then be less chance of one failing and not knowing the dead man switch is active.

Cordially,
Gerry


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## Bogydave (Nov 14, 2008)

I am going to upgrade from the "on/off" toggle switch I have now & move the location to a better accessible place. The "hip bump" type sound good but you have to be near it. Sometimes I find myself on the side or end of the table. (not alway close to where I have the toggle sw now) 
The foot switch looks promising but do you ever move a little & slip off the switch.
Probably take some getting use to but this may be the way to go.
Any trouble with reliability? 
Gerard: The low current with an interposing relay could be wired to activate the Vacuum also. May need a 2 pole relay but that should be no problem.
I'll look around locally first & see what's what.
Leaning to a foot SW of some type though. You can slide it to where you are. You could even wire it in series or parallel with the existing sw, depending on how you want it to operate. (sorry thinking as I type)


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi Dave

I do like the dead man type, I have my hands full most of the time with wood,, and to move over to the hip type is a bit more work than I want to do..

It's not a big deal for me just to move back and away from the machine and at that point it's dead so to speak  in fact I'm on the way out the door at that point  or looking for the TP 


http://www.ptreeusa.com/routerControls.htm

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Bogydave said:


> I am going to upgrade from the "on/off" toggle switch I have now & move the location to a better accessible place. The "hip bump" type sound good but you have to be near it. Sometimes I find myself on the side or end of the table. (not alway close to where I have the toggle sw now)
> The foot switch looks promising but do you ever move a little & slip off the switch.
> Probably take some getting use to but this may be the way to go.
> Any trouble with reliability?
> ...


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## Gerard_sr (Dec 7, 2008)

Bogydave said:


> Gerard: The low current with an interposing relay could be wired to activate the Vacuum also. May need a 2 pole relay but that should be no problem.
> I'll look around locally first & see what's what.
> Leaning to a foot SW of some type though. You can slide it to where you are. You could even wire it in series or parallel with the existing sw, depending on how you want it to operate. (sorry thinking as I type)


No need to apologize for thinking! 
Thinking is a good thing! 

That is a two pole relay in my post/diagram, only I'm also switching the neutral. But one pole can be re-utilized to offer the low voltage switching that most vacuum setups require. 
(Please see attached diagram. router-power2.jpg)
One might be tempted to just plug a vacuum into the other half of the outlet, but *that is not advisable* as it surely will overload the line cord, relay or internal wiring or trip the circuit breaker.
For example, my Freud draws *13 amps*, both my Shopvacs draw *7.4 amps* and *that would exceed a typical 20 amp shop circuit*! 

Cordially,
Gerry


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

HI Gerard_sr

I sure like you new switch, that's neat ,may I show you mind 
It's not high tech but it sure works 

Just a small note *** some of the new routers have a green light built in showing that they are plugged in ( hot) ready to run ..  it would not be a big deal to put in some wires and fix a red light on the out side of the router...if it's a table mounted router 

see below,,,

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Gerard_sr said:


> No need to apologize for thinking!
> Thinking is a good thing!
> 
> That is a two pole relay in my post/diagram, only I'm also switching the neutral. But one pole can be re-utilized to offer the low voltage switching that most vacuum setups require.
> ...


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## scotirish10 (Nov 11, 2008)

I'm with bobj3 on this one. I use the "dead man switch" no the floor and it is great! Once when (that's right' once) I did not hold the piece tight it went flying a crossed the room and the minute I stepped back the router stopped! Hay don't hold my feet to the fire on the once!!!


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## Gerard_sr (Dec 7, 2008)

*That, my friend, is the best way!*



bobj3 said:


> HI Gerard_sr
> 
> I sure like you new switch, that's neat ,may I show you mind
> It's not high tech but it sure works
> ...










*
That, My Friend, is the best way to do it!
Unplug it every time!
GOOD FOR YOU!*

I'm particularly impressed with the hi tech color, it certainly is eye catching. That seems to be a non standard color though, did you order it at a high price because it was custom molded or did you send it out to a car restoring shop to have it custom painted in some vintage Chevy color?

*Seriously now,* I came up with mine because I'm OK with a tool when it's new, but as time goes by, I get sloppy and forget to unplug it. There were several times I did that with my table saw and I'm constantly doing it with my drill press and corded electric drills. While I've had my radial arm saw the longest, I'm most afraid of it most and still unplug it.
Soooo......
Retired from working in electronics, I'm more apt to see a warning light indicating something.

Cordially,
Gerry


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

HI Gerry

Yep,, I send it out for the custom paint job,,  I do like Chevy..Orange that way I can find it when I turn the lights out..it's more fun to work in the dark  I can't see the errors that way.. 
Hi Gerard_sr

Just joking with you , it comes in that color from CMT/sommerfeld tools 
CMT Pat. color just about the same as the router bits/saw blades..



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Gerard_sr said:


> *
> *
> 
> I'm particularly impressed with the hi tech color, it certainly is eye catching. That seems to be a non standard color though, did you order it at a high price because it was custom molded or did you send it out to a car restoring shop to have it custom painted in some vintage Chevy color?
> ...


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## Gene Howe (Jul 10, 2007)

*Foot switch question*

My foot switch is the [step for on-step for off] type. I considered the deadman type but I didn't want to have to keep my foot on the switch. 
Either way, it's a lot easier to reach and operate than the table mounted bump switch that's still there. 
I was concerned about chips and dust getting in the switch so, I slid a bubble pack sack over it and taped it to the cord.

And, I *ALWAYS* unplug the router ( or any other cutting tool) before making any adjustments/bitchanges. etc.


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## reuelt (Dec 29, 2008)

*Foot Switches need guards*

When I was a Factory Manager, I made it a rule that all foot switches must have guards.
e.g.
http://www.grainger.com/Grainger/categories/electrical/switches/foot-switch-guards

Think what happens when something (e.g a piece of wood or a tool)accidentally drop on a foot switch or someone or some animal accidentally activate it?

In Australia, a magnetic swich (called NVR here - No Voltage Release switch) is strongly recommended. A magnetc swich stays off when there is a power interuption so the machine would never turn on unexpectedly when power returns.

e.g. of one suitable for router table
http://grizzly.com/products/Magnetic-On-Off-Switch-110V-10-Amps/G8990

Reuel


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Reuel

Many routers in router tables pull 15amps.

Grizzly switch rated at
110V, 10 Amps.
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http://www.ptreeusa.com/routerControls.htm

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## reuelt (Dec 29, 2008)

bobj3 said:


> Reuel
> 
> Many routers in router tables pull 15amps.
> 
> ...


Thanks Bob for pointing out my mistake. (In Australia 10A is heaps because we use 240V power)

If router needs more than 10A then
110 V 16A magnetc Switch is more suitable.
http://www.grizzly.com/products/110V-Magnetic-On-Off-Switch/H8240
Rated at 16A


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

HI reuelt

No big deal,, in the USA we have 220 volt equipment also but it's not the same as yours,, 220 volts takes a 30 to 50 amp. breakers the norm and real hvy.duty switches...  and we also drive on the right side of the road. LOL

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reuelt said:


> Thanks Bob for pointing out my mistake. (In Australia 10A is heaps because we use 240V power)
> 
> If router needs more than 10A then
> 110 V 16A magnetc Switch is more suitable.
> ...


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## Gerard_sr (Dec 7, 2008)

*My safety switch pictures.*

Guys,
Well, I had some time to neaten things up, the whole thing is now not a bird's nest of wires without any boxes.
I posted some pictures on my *router page*.
The ones pertaining to my switch start at #29, so scroll down.

I had to re-think my original idea when actually incorporating it into the available electrical hardware boxes. Also because the relay's capacity was 11 amps per contact, I doubled up on them so it's a single pole 22 amp relay now, not a double pole 11 amp relay.

As a teaser, the modified diagram is attached.

It does have an added twist.  
If I so decide NOT to use the foot switch relay, I would reverse the plugs in the outlet and the router then works of the Main Power switch.

Cordially,
Gerry


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## woodnthings (Jan 30, 2009)

*Too many AMPS!*

Gerry, I can find you everywhere you go on this forum...LOL I know this post is about a "Safety Switch" but, I just saw your post and I was thinking that the "current draw" that is named on the machine is usually "Running "current, rather than "Starting" current. Right? That would mean that in your example the total amperage would exceed the 20 amp circuit by even more. Now, in my case I run a PC 518 router and a small Craftsman 3hp vac underneath on the same circuit, without tripping the breaker. It's probably not good for either motor, but I don't enough about that. Sooooo, the question then becomes "How do we wire a shop vac and router to come on simulteanously on the same 20 amp circuit?" I don't think we can! My own answer is: they have battery remotes for outdoor light circuits, I picked up several for $15 at a TSC store close out. One is already hooked up to my overarm dust collector on my TS.
I think I'll put the other one on the router table, but keep it on a separate circuit. Other than that, I don't have an answer. Any thoughts? Bill


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## Gerard_sr (Dec 7, 2008)

*time delay relay....*



woodnthings said:


> Gerry, I can find you everywhere you go on this forum...LOL I know this post is about a "Safety Switch" but, I just saw your post and I was thinking that the "current draw" that is named on the machine is usually "Running "current, rather than "Starting" current. Right? That would mean that in your example the total amperage would exceed the 20 amp circuit by even more. Now, in my case I run a PC 518 router and a small Craftsman 3hp vac underneath on the same circuit, without tripping the breaker. It's probably not good for either motor, but I don't enough about that. Sooooo, the question then becomes "How do we wire a shop vac and router to come on simulteanously on the same 20 amp circuit?" I don't think we can! My own answer is: they have battery remotes for outdoor light circuits, I picked up several for $15 at a TSC store close out. One is already hooked up to my overarm dust collector on my TS.
> I think I'll put the other one on the router table, but keep it on a separate circuit. Other than that, I don't have an answer. Any thoughts? Bill


Bill,
I would not worry about the surge, I'll bet that a circuit breaker is designed to handle a surge. (I read that somewhere.) and the wire, well I also read somewhere that #12 wire is technically oversize for 20 amps @ 120 volts I think it was computed out to something like 25 amps.
See this PDF file from *Square-D*:
http://ecatalog.squared.com/pubs/Ci...eakers/QO-QOB Circuit Breakers/0600DB0103.pdf

And according to this PDF chart, also from *Square-D*:
http://ecatalog.squared.com/pubs/Ci...t Breakers/QO-QOB Circuit Breakers/910-03.pdf

*It may take up to 8 seconds for a QO120 to trip with 2 times the rated current.
That kind of lets motor surge be OK with this brand of circuit breakers. * 

*All Bets are OFF with fuses!* 

But if you really want a delay in starting to accommodate loads, use a time delay relay:
http://www.drillspot.com/products/44022/Dayton_5X829_Time_Delay_Relay

Is that enough info? LOL 

Cordially,
Gerry


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## woodnthings (Jan 30, 2009)

Gerry, Hi, Today I went to the depot and bought some outdoor switch boxes, and 2- 20 amp outlets, cover plates and other small misc. I had already received my 2 pole on-off paddle switches from Grizzly at about $14. I took off the power strip I was using as a on-off switch and replaced it with 
the 2 boxes bolted back to back, wired up correctly and....NBH! "nothing bad happened" All the motors started up and sounded great! I like it when a plan comes together. BTW all my 110v circuits are 12ga and 20amp outlets, where some folks make the mistake of running the 12 ga but don't use the 20 amp outlets. I used an entire 100 amp panel when I wired up the woodshop. I color coded the outlets with colored tape and also the wires coming into the box, and also the breakers, so I know exactly which circuit and breakers go together. I don't have the electronics experience that you have but I enjoy doing my own wiring in the shop and around the house. I posted some pictures in "my gallery" under woodnthings if care to check it out, Off for now, Bill


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## Gerard_sr (Dec 7, 2008)

*Good for you Bill!*

*Good for you Bill!*

Generally speaking, the 20 amp vs the 15 amp outlets are the same. The size of the metal strips and parts inside are the same. The difference is the outside. Besides the 20 amp label they have a T slot on the neutral side. NBD, (no big deal). Some appliances come with cords that require they be plugged into a 20 amp circuit so they have the neutral prong going sideways, that's the necessity for the special 20 amp outlets. In all the stuff I did the only two notable appliances I had seen that had these cords on them were a very few air conditioners and a few floor buffers. 
Strangely enough I once had a 110 volt electric clothes dryer that did use 20 amps and it had a standard plug on it's factory cord, two parallel prongs and a ground prong!

Now don't get me wrong, there must be other appliances and/or tools that have factory cords with the neutral prong's axis at 90 degrees to that of the hot prong, but I have not seen them.

Color coding is a great idea. But with that many circuits used, I hope you didn't run out of *colors*! LOL

The one mistake I see, actually not a mistake, *but IMHO a mistake*, is that some people use the back wire part of the outlets to make connections. You know, strip 3/8" off the wires and plug them into the holes on the back of an outlet. When they do that, there's only a thin piece of metal contacting the wire, over time this contact point becomes a resistor, generates heat and the metal softens, making a weaker contact and eventually it doesn't make contact at all or is intermittent. Personally I think they ought to ban those. Me, I always put that wire under the side screw and snug it down good. I've even broken a few devices tightening it too much! I figure that if the screw mashes the wire slightly flatter, it has a greater surface area to contact and a better contact point. But, that's only my opinion.
The exception to this is that some devices, most notably newer GFCI outlets, have a back wire hole that you must use and the screw tightens on the wire in the hole. That is because if one were to put the wires under the side screws, there would be a greater chance of them being too close to the side of the box or another device and shorting out. Those devices, the GFCIs are a tad bit wider than normal outlets.

Gee, maybe we ought to suggest a forum area for shop wiring questions and suggestions? Not because of me, but because of the shop safety thing.

Cordially,
Gerry

PS: You forgot to get them there pictures up, whenever you can, no hurry...


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## Bogydave (Nov 14, 2008)

Just a little added knowledge. FYI: #12 solid wire is good for 20 amps (#12 romex, etc)
#12 stranded wire, sold on individual spools in various colors, is rated for 25 amps in some conditions.
The reason for this is electricity runs on the outside surface of the wire (called "skin effect") There is more surface area on #12 stranded wire than on #12 solid wire.

I agree with Gerard
The good 20 amp outlets have 2 - #12 wire sized slots for each screw & an internal clamp tightened by the screw. (easier to install, work with solid or stranded wire & better all around)
The typical "contractor" house outlets are made for #14 size wire, & now, the hole is too small to put a #12 wire into. (New National Electric Code (NEC) rules a few years ago) They are cheaply made, have poor connections to the wire & to whatever you plug into it & will need replaced after a few years of repeated use. Same is basically true for switches.

When wiring a shop, use #12 wire minimum, the good 20 amp switches & outlets. It makes for better versatility for new tools in the future. If using 20 amp breakers, you MUST USE at least #12 wire! (wire size current rating has to match or exceed the current of the breaker or fuse rating ***NEC rule**)
(#14 wire on 20 amp breaker is BAD & a way to burn the place down! )
All is just IMHO. 
The NEC has a web site for the National electrical rules. Sometimes local rules are more stringent. Good rules to follow.


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## woodnthings (Jan 30, 2009)

You Guys are all so smart! We should all get together some day in Mat-Su and have a few beers or what ever doesn't freeze up there! Bill


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## Gerard_sr (Dec 7, 2008)

By the way Guys,
I have been in contact with Grizzly Industrial, Inc, and they supplied me with some information on one of their magnetic switches. As soon as I can, I'll post information in a new thread on it.
Cordially,
Gerry


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