# My Journey into CNC Routing



## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

Well, you fellows have given me the bug! :surprise:

I am not sure if I will be able to justify $4000 for a CNC ready to run out of the box but I guess time will tell.

In the mean time, I realized that before cutting anything, I would need to figure out how to design and prepare the data for the machine. So, with that in mind, I downloaded the trial version of VCarve Desktop.

And here we go! :grin:

I have been watching video tutorials and they were helpful. After clicking around for awhile, some things are starting to sink in.

Today I created my first project - a license plate for my sweetie. My idea is to make a few for the kids/grandkids etc. That is if I have a machine before Christmas rolls around.

The license plate would have the persons name, year born, state and city they were born in. I think that could be quiet useful, and may sell by the tens!:frown:

I have most of the details worked out except for the smaller letters. Even the 1/8th inch bit can't clear out the material in the letters that are enclosed (a, o, etc). I guess I have two choices - 1) make the letters larger, which I don't want to, or 2) switch to a smaller cutter such as a 1/16th end mill.

With that said, I have a question...How do I make the text look better? I used a 1/8th inch end mill for the tedious work and a 1/4 inch end mill to bore the mounting holes, clear out the pocket trash, and cut out the frame.

Note the text is "raised" because I removed everything around the letters and numbers by 3/64th. Total cutting time is about 20 minutes.

So, there you have it. My first foray into the CNC world, at least on the computer. :surprise:

This might turn out to be fun. Computer stuff is right down my alley!

Here is a screen shot of my project and some real plates I found on the internet.
Mike


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## honesttjohn (Feb 17, 2015)

hehehehehehehehe!!!!!!!


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## DesertRatTom (Jul 3, 2012)

With someone as determined as you, this will be fun to watch!


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## difalkner (Jan 3, 2012)

Looking forward to this ride!

David


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## RainMan 2.0 (May 6, 2014)

Congrats Mike , it will be interesting to watch and see you progress . I'm shocked actually lol , as I didn't think you were that interested in CNC's .
Going to be a great toy


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## old55 (Aug 11, 2013)

This is going to be good. Chair is out.


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## beltramidave (Jan 6, 2016)

Try using a 30 or 60 degree V bit instead of the 1/8" endmill. It will get into tighter spots. Also, don't get too hung up on the software "run" time as it is not real accurate.

Welcome to the world of CNC, it is definitely a contagious disease! 

Still getting use to my new Saturn 4x4, but I must say this thing is a beast. Give them a look for sure. 

Dave


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## Tagwatts (Apr 11, 2012)

Mr Stringer, I read your information on your Trial of the Desk Top V Carve. Should you get your machine be sure to up grade to the 8.5 version if it is not already. One other thing, in your bit selection you may like to try a 60 degree bit with a .25 diameter. I have a tendency to cut to deep when doing lettering. I really like using the v bits. I also use a 90 degree bit for lettering. Using a half inch piece of wood, I would try to cut at about .25 or less for letters. I have used the Ball Nos Bit at times. Experiment with the computer and see which you like best. I usually do the cutting on the line and is better than on the inside or the outside for me.. 

Not sure if this will help. There are some people here who really know their CNC Stuff. I am as you, very new, and having a lot of fun and wasting a lot of wood. But, it makes great scrap wood. 

Good luck.


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## MEBCWD (Jan 14, 2012)

Mike as others have said you might want to use a V-bit for the pocket toolpath with an end mill as a large area clearance tool. You will want a 60 degree or smaller angle V-bit (remember the angle of the V-bit is double the angle it actually cuts). Using the V-bit also leaves more material under the small letters for support, small raised lettering can get a little fragile. 

Sounds like you will have no problems learning the design portion of CNC and I'm sure you will catch on to the machine operation quickly.


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## honesttjohn (Feb 17, 2015)

Frank, firepits are our friend!!


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## LDBecker (Jun 16, 2015)

MT Stringer said:


> and may sell by the tens!:frown:
> 
> Mike


Hahaha!!! Looking forward to your sharing the journey. You're just a little ahead of me in my own journey - I spent a little time in Aspire and found it really not too bad. It sounds like you have some good advice here (esp on the V Bits). LOTS of us appreciate the effort in sharing, and the humor!

Larry


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

Thanks for your suggestions. I will play around with the v bits.

The video tutorials have helped a bunch. I learn several things from each one I have watched. This is more fun than watching the cartoons on Saturday morning! :grin:


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## rwl7532 (Sep 8, 2011)

Option suggestion for upper right corner: "I am 29"


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

Whew! Lots of videos to watch, especially those involving VCarve and it's features. I have already learned enough to start forgetting the early stuff I learned! :surprise::grin:


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## 4DThinker (Feb 16, 2014)

The great thing about online videos is that you can always go back and watch them again. Although I consider myself pretty polished at using Aspire I'll admit I hit up those training videos for a refresher every now and then. 

4D


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## MEBCWD (Jan 14, 2012)

4DThinker said:


> The great thing about online videos is that you can always go back and watch them again. Although I consider myself pretty polished at using Aspire I'll admit I hit up those training videos for a refresher every now and then.
> 
> 4D


Every time they redo the tutorials I watch all of them at least once and like you say I go back now and then just to make sure I know what I am getting into.


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

I know I have said it before. I work in a one car garage with a lot of stuff in it. All of my tools are either on mobile bases or casters so I can re-position them as needed. The only things that stay in the same place are the table saw and the work table/bench. Even though the miter saw cabinet is mobile, I don't ever move it unless I need to retrieve something that has fallen behind it! :surprise:

With that said, I am having a difficult time figuring out where I can put a CNC. Currently there simply isn't any room available.

But, I have an idea! :smile:

What if I build a frame that will allow my adjustable height dual router table to fit underneath? When needed, I can roll the table out and do my routing, then push it back under the CNC frame.

At it lowest configuration, the router table is 31 inches high. The top is 31 inches wide x 40 inches long.

I have attached some drawings of my proposed frame. It would be made using 2x4's and two pieces of 3/4 inch mdf for the top. Middle supports would also be doubled 2x4's. The legs would be 4x4's. All joints would be half lap, glued and screwed. A lower frame stiffener would be attached on three sides.

As drawn, the top would be 39 x 49 which would be just big enough for the Probotics Asteriod. The specs say it is 35 x 46 inches.

So, what say you? Will this frame support the CNC?

The specs list total machine weight at 125 pounds...and a few more for a Bosch 1617 router. I am thinking it will. My old work bench was built this way and it was solid as a rock. 

Note that I would probably rip the rounded edge off of each 2x4 and run it across the jointer to get a straight and flat edge. When the frame is assembled upside down on my work table, the result should be a flat frame ready for the top to be installed.

Attached are a few drawings and a picture of the adjustable height router table.


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## honesttjohn (Feb 17, 2015)

Mike,

I got my Nebula on a table I made 30 years ago out of 2x4's - not even knowing what a CNC was at the time. I have 3 legs on each side with a couple of cross braces on the top and legs -- all just 2x4's - with a 3/4" plywood top. And my machine is a lot heavier than 125 lbs. You're using 4x4s. All you need is a solid 4 corners for it. Don't even need the table top. 4D can give you more info. In fact, look back in 4D's threads and he's got pics of his 4 posted stand. And storing something under it isn't a problem. Tell Mama you need a bigger piece of property so you can have an insulated (had to Rick) pole barn!! 

Move forward my man. Order it!! At least Meteor size.


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## 4DThinker (Feb 16, 2014)

I'll admit I started with a much more solid/overbuilt table for my meteor than what I now have it on. When I saw that the Meteor's frame was itself stiffer than any 2x4s I might use this idea of mainly just legs to hold it up came to me. The plywood perimeter band keeps the legs plumb/vertical. I've since slid a 3-drawer tool cabinet onto the plywood shelf you can see in this photo. I often take a section or all of my MDF top off to let me clamp large parts under the gantry, so I don't fill up the underside with other tools. But you certainly could leave one end open to roll 24"x48" worth of cabinet(s) under there if you needed to. Large casters on mine usually stay locked, but do allow me to roll this CNC aside when I want to clean underneath it. 

4D


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## honesttjohn (Feb 17, 2015)

Tell him 4D -- at least a Meteor size -- he won't regret it in the near future.

You coming to Vegas in Oct - - school business you know. Will help with new ideas for the students. Tell the dept head it's a must --- plus an introduction to Aspire 9 --- gotta keep your students ahead of the rest!

See, Mike - there's a way to fit it in.


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## 4DThinker (Feb 16, 2014)

honesttjohn said:


> You coming to Vegas in Oct - - school business you know. Will help with new ideas for the students. Tell the dept head it's a must --- plus an introduction to Aspire 9 --- gotta keep your students ahead of the rest!


We've got a brand new building with a brand new shop space in it to move into this Fall. I may be in Las Vegas in August for the AWFSfair and associated FreshWood student furniture design competition. That is before classes start (barely) and an easy sell to my higher-ups. To skip out in October is much more difficult, and the only way they'd let me go is if I was invited to give a talk or demonstration. Love to chat about how I solve "impossible" joinery challenges with creative tool path creation and my compound angle clamping jig. No time off otherwise. Fall is a busy semester. 

4D


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## boogalee (Nov 24, 2010)

If you are only going to do small projects you can try a Carvewright.

It is not much larger than a Dewalt 735.

It does have limitations (14 inch wide by infinite length). 

This is not a recommendation just info.


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## roofner (Aug 1, 2010)

cnc is intriguing but 2 things are against me . I cant afforded to spend $4000. I can't even master sketchup .


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

Thanks Al. Nothing definite yet.


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## honesttjohn (Feb 17, 2015)

No offense, Al, but he'd outgrow a Carveright before he got thru all the directions.


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## honesttjohn (Feb 17, 2015)

roofner said:


> cnc is intriguing but 2 things are against me . I cant afforded to spend $4000. I can't even master sketchup .


I can't do Sketchup either , but have managed to do a few simple signs and plaques.


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## boogalee (Nov 24, 2010)

honesttjohn said:


> No offense, Al, but he'd outgrow a Carveright before he got thru all the directions.


Again not a recommendation just a alternative.

Mike would have to do the research to see if it would work for him.


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

boogalee said:


> Again not a recommendation just a alternative.
> 
> Mike would have to do the research to see if it would work for him.


Thanks Al. No doubt, it wouldn't be beyond me to cut cabinet parts on the CNC, even if it was one piece at a time. :surprise::grin:


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## 4DThinker (Feb 16, 2014)

roofner said:


> cnc is intriguing but 2 things are against me . I can't afforded to spend $4000. I can't even master SketchUp .


You don't need SketchUp to program for and run a CNC. The various small CNCs that are out there in that $4k range either come with or have a discounted option to buy Cut2D or VCarve Desktop or something similar. These are far simpler to use than SketchUp and designed to get right to the point about what programming for a CNC is. There are also video tutorials online that get most folks up-and-running in short time. 

Now you just need that $4k. Yep, CNCs are expensive tools. The versatility of what you can do with one is what makes them worth their price. 

4D


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

4DThinker said:


> You don't need SketchUp to program for and run a CNC. The various small CNCs that are out there in that $4k range either come with or have a discounted option to buy Cut2D or VCarve Desktop or something similar. These are far simpler to use than SketchUp and designed to get right to the point about what programming for a CNC is. There are also video tutorials online that get most folks up-and-running in short time.
> 
> Now you just need that $4k. Yep, CNCs are expensive tools. The versatility of what you can do with one is what makes them worth their price.
> 
> 4D


I actually found VCarve Desktop trial version fairly easy to use with a little practice. Now I have downloaded the Pro trial version to see what the $350 difference is. :grin:

I have been watching the video tutorials and practicing some of the projects and making several of my own. I think I can do it sooner than later. That was my concern. Starting from knowing nothing about project design, how a CNC works and programming it to cut out my work was scary. I am feeling a lot better now.

And it is painfully obvious that I will have to buy a complete machine ready to power up. All of that electrical stuff confuses me...and my fumble fingers...and reading glasses! :surprise: UGH!

If anyone has the Probotics Asteriod, I would appreciate it if you could post the frame dimensions. That would help in my decision making. My frame would be 2x4 construction similar to David's.
Thanks
Mike


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## 4DThinker (Feb 16, 2014)

MT Stringer said:


> If anyone has the Probotix Asteroid, I would appreciate it if you could post the frame dimensions. That would help in my decision making. My frame would be 2x4 construction similar to David's.
> Thanks
> Mike


On Probotix.com they have the frame dimensions for every CNC they sell. I've copied it and shared it here.

4D


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

Got it. Thanks.
UGH, the meteor would take up my entire work table! I will have to make do with less, thus the Asteriod. I think I can fit that size in by building the frame over the router table (lower left corner of picture). :grin:


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## difalkner (Jan 3, 2012)

MT Stringer said:


> Got it. Thanks.
> UGH, the meteor would take up my entire work table! I will have to make do with less, thus the Asteroid. I think I can fit that size in by building the frame over the router table (lower left corner of picture). :grin:


I see floor in that photo - what are you using that for??? That's more floor than I have available, of course, I had more until I put a CNC in... :wink:


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

difalkner said:


> I see floor in that photo - what are you using that for??? That's more floor than I have available, of course, I had more until I put a CNC in... :wink:


That is the path in and out of our house through the garage. And according to SWMBO, it will not be blocked! :surprise::frown:


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## honesttjohn (Feb 17, 2015)

There's room for a Meteor - especially if you have it on casters that can lock. Like Jay says, there are times he wished for a bigger machine, but never for a smaller one.

And get the trial version of Aspire and see if it's worth more than just the upgrade to Vcarve Pro. With Aspire you can share files with all of us, not just the Vacrve people.


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## beltramidave (Jan 6, 2016)

honesttjohn said:


> There's room for a Meteor - especially if you have it on casters that can lock. Like Jay says, there are times he wished for a bigger machine, but never for a smaller one.
> 
> And get the trial version of Aspire and see if it's worth more than just the upgrade to Vcarve Pro. With Aspire you can share files with all of us, not just the Vacrve people.


Hey, What's wrong with us VCarve people....LOL

Both the Asteroid & Meteor have there advantages. Personally, I would have bought the Asteroid over the Meteor as as it is wider in the X and you can always thru feed on the Y. All depends on what you are going to do with it. Both machines are great.

Dave


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## honesttjohn (Feb 17, 2015)

OK, Mike.

After looking at the dimensions again, I'll let you slide with an Asteroid. lol

Everything I've done so far on my Nebula, with the exception of a couple "experiments" could have been done on an Asteroid. It's a sawed off Nebula. And I've only needed that extra length a couple of times. And with the shorter leadscrews it should make for a more solid machine. I think the Nebula's leadscrews are just about at their limit for strength as they do flex a little.

So I will quit telling you how to spend your money, even though it is fun. Put your Nike's on and "Just do it!"

Oh, and get cross members if you can - that MDF bed (which you'll probably replace) needs all the support it can get. Sagging is bad, even a little bit when doing text. Good call Dave.

There, we've got that settled. Now..........about the software.............


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## beltramidave (Jan 6, 2016)

I agree with getting at least one extra support. Look into Probotix's table frame, I think it is about 600.00 for the Asteroid. It is made out of extruded aluminum and supports the machine at the 4 corners. Also like the keyboard/monitor stand.
I used this exact setup on a machine that I modified slightly. Tell Len to put a full mdf shelf underneath instead of a partial sheet.


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## honesttjohn (Feb 17, 2015)

Dave,

He needs the table open to slide stuff underneath. And I think he's already got a table made. Len's stands are nice, but expensive (put the $$ towards Aspire). You can buy the stuff from 80/20 and make one cheaper if you want one like that, but the 4 post version that 4D has is a very good setup, too. IMO


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

I havent built the table yet. I have a project to finish first. Then I can get serious about rearranging tools and spring cleaning!:smile:


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## beltramidave (Jan 6, 2016)

honesttjohn said:


> Dave,
> 
> He needs the table open to slide stuff underneath. And I think he's already got a table made. Len's stands are nice, but expensive (put the $$ towards Aspire). You can buy the stuff from 80/20 and make one cheaper if you want one like that, but the 4 post version that 4D has is a very good setup, too. IMO


Probably true that you can buy parts cheaper, but unless you have actually checked pricing, especially for the nuts and fasteners, you might be surprised. Sometimes the extrusion is the cheap part. Also need to be able to cut the extrusion to size. The proper blade in a miter saw works fine, but it sure makes a mess.

HJ, you get the aluminum spoilboard installed yet?

Just thought I would throw the table out as an option. My Saturn sits on a heavy table made from wood.


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## honesttjohn (Feb 17, 2015)

beltramidave said:


> HJ, you get the aluminum spoilboard installed yet?
> 
> 
> No, not yet. Had to order longer screws than what 80/20 had. Needed the smaller heads to go thru the channel opening. Then.....I got to thinking about how to lower it to give me a couple more inches on the Z axis. Was wondering how it work if I fastened a couple more cross members on the ends and then laid the bed channels lengthwise. It's all extruded aluminum and should, I think and hope, all be able to be connected with a little more stuff from 80/20. Trouble is, I got some stuff to cut out and once I start fooling with it I'm down til I get something figured out, which could be a while, if I have to order parts a couple times.


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

I have a couple of questions...

Assuming I go with the Robotics Asteriod with the LinuxCNC control software...

1) Is there a length limitation on the parallel port cable from the PC to the control box? I might have to position the PC on a nearby work bench which could necessitate a 10-12 foot cable.

2) Are the parallel port cables pin specific or would any generic printer cable work?

3) What are the consequences of running the PC on my home wi-fi w/no internet access? 

Thanks.
Mike


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## RainMan 2.0 (May 6, 2014)

I think your better off not having internet access to your computer that's controlling your CNC , as there's less chance of getting a virus , or unwanted updates using resources as your in the middle of a cut . 
I used my house computer for design , then transferred it via a jump drive to the computer in my garage that run my laser engraver . 
Just my 2cents


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## honesttjohn (Feb 17, 2015)

Just my 2 cents -- leave the dedicated computer to run the machine .......and NOTHING else! It comes with the machine, programmed for the machine, and meant for the machine. Let it do it's job with no interference. That's why it was set up that way.


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## difalkner (Jan 3, 2012)

I have Wi-Fi access to our network and the Internet with mine but I have all notices and updates turned off. I do keep Kaspersky running but it is set to not interfere and thus far it has not. The main reason I do that is because I design and generate G-code on the much more powerful computer in the house and then drop the file into Dropbox. Before I can get out of the room it has already landed on the drive of the computer out in the shop. The other reason is that I can access software updates for Mach4, ESS plug-ins, and look something up online or on YouTube instead of having to go back to our bedroom. 

Having said that I agree it is probably better to not have it on the network.

David


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## RainMan 2.0 (May 6, 2014)

honesttjohn said:


> Just my 2 cents -- leave the dedicated computer to run the machine .......and NOTHING else! It comes with the machine, programmed for the machine, and meant for the machine. Let it do it's job with no interference. That's why it was set up that way.


I did a simular thing John . The computer for my laser ran Windows XP , and because I kept it off the net , I turned off auto updates , the virus protection , and went into MS config so I could turn everything off in the background that wasn't necessary .
I formatted it first for a clean install , as I had all kinds of games etc on the HD before.
I don't always believe things are removed properly/thoroughly , when you delete programs in add remove programs , so I format the drive and reinstall the operating system .


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

Thanks for the info on question #3.

How about 1 & 2?


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## Scottart (Jan 8, 2015)

start making dust.. the rest will follow..


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

Still thinking...
@honesttjohn, does the computer that came with your CNC have a HDMI port? That would help me mount the monitor on the wall (or storage shelving unit). There is no wall space available! I have a 25 foot HDMI cable I have used in the past to connect my laptop to the TV across the room. :grin:

Of course, the monitor might not have a HDMI port. :frown:


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## 4DThinker (Feb 16, 2014)

1. On my older controller the parallel cable is hard wired into the controller. 25pin female on the PC end. The newer unity controller has a 25 pin male port on it.
2. The newer parallel cable for the Unity controllers has the same plug on both ends. So it is NOT a typical parallel printer cable. 

You might be able to convince Probotix to ship you a 10'-12' cable when you order it. If not, then they can surely give you a link to where you can buy a compatible cable. Monoprice.com comes to mind for me.


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

4DThinker said:


> 1. On my older controller the parallel cable is hard wired into the controller. 25pin female on the PC end. The newer unity controller has a 25 pin male port on it.
> 2. The newer parallel cable for the Unity controllers has the same plug on both ends. So it is NOT a typical parallel printer cable.
> 
> You might be able to convince Probotix to ship you a 10'-12' cable when you order it. If not, then they can surely give you a link to where you can buy a compatible cable. Monoprice.com comes to mind for me.


Thanks. Good to know. I have bought from Monoprice numerous times over the years.


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## UglySign (Nov 17, 2015)

difalkner said:


> I have Wi-Fi access to our network and the Internet with mine but I have all notices and updates turned off. I do keep Kaspersky running but it is set to not interfere and thus far it has not. The main reason I do that is because I design and generate G-code *on the much more powerful computer in the house* and then drop the file into Dropbox. Before I can get out of the room it has already landed on the drive of the computer out in the shop. The other reason is that I can access software updates for Mach4, ESS plug-ins, and look something up online or on YouTube instead of having to go back to *our bedroom*.
> 
> Having said that I agree it is probably better to not have it on the network.
> 
> David


So thats where the designing is....? :surprise: :grin: :nerd: :x

Kinkie


Would setting up a 2nd Router (PC) work? Like 1st router (House)192.168.0.1 & 2nd router (Shop) 192.168.1.1


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## difalkner (Jan 3, 2012)

UglySign said:


> So thats where the designing is....? :surprise: :grin: :nerd: :x
> 
> Kinkie
> 
> ...


I tell our daughters that's where all the action is and then I hear, 'Mom! Make him stop saying that!' LOL!

On a more serious note... I have the computer in the shop on our 192.168.x.x network and kept the ESS at its default 10.9.9.9 scheme, so the controller doesn't have access to the Internet or our network. The ESS is connected to the computer via Ethernet cable and the 192.168.x.x is on Wi-Fi to our network.

David


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## honesttjohn (Feb 17, 2015)

After the monitor that came with mine fell on the concrete floor a few times (it worked after two, but not three times -- I think those darn Russians had something to do with it )I just went to WalMart and bought one (bigger of course). Hooked up just fine - so to answer your question - yes.

You can also get a swing arm or get Len's set up for the hardware. Dustmop for sure!!


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## honesttjohn (Feb 17, 2015)

difalkner said:


> I have Wi-Fi access to our network and the Internet with mine but I have all notices and updates turned off. I do keep Kaspersky running but it is set to not interfere and thus far it has not. The main reason I do that is because I design and generate G-code on the much more powerful computer in the house and then drop the file into Dropbox. Before I can get out of the room it has already landed on the drive of the computer out in the shop. The other reason is that I can access software updates for Mach4, ESS plug-ins, and look something up online or on YouTube instead of having to go back to our bedroom.
> 
> Having said that I agree it is probably better to not have it on the network.
> 
> David


With a Probotix, you just save the file to a thumbdrive and plug it in the machine's computer. Select your program off the thumbdrive (doesn't take long to have several of these with files saved if you don't delete them), touch off the Axis', and click the blue start arrow - - dust will appear magically.


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## difalkner (Jan 3, 2012)

honesttjohn said:


> With a Probotix, you just save the file to a thumbdrive and plug it in the machine's computer. Select your program off the thumbdrive (doesn't take long to have several of these with files saved if you don't delete them), touch off the Axis', and click the blue start arrow - - dust will appear magically.


Yep, I can, and have done, the same thing with a flash drive. I just prefer to use Dropbox. Save to Dropbox, open in Mach4, click the green button, and Pecan chips fly all over the shop. Piece of cake! :nerd:


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## 4DThinker (Feb 16, 2014)

difalkner said:


> Pecan chips fly all over the shop. Piece of cake! :nerd:


Wouldn't that be pie? (pecan pie?)


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

Well, Dang it!

Last year, we put up a gazebo on our patio. Even though it is not a pop-up style, it sorta looks like one. This year so far, the storms have taken their toll. The top is torn and ripped. A replacement top costs as much as the entire unit! <insert rant here!>

Today a guy came out to give us an estimate on a real pergola/gazebo. It just so happens the quote came to $4100. Ouch.

There goes my CNC money for a while! Hopefully, I can recover it sooner than later and get on with this journey. UGH!

Feeling a little beat down at the moment. But my sweetie is on cloud nine! She out there right now pulling dead flowers from the flower bed.


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## honesttjohn (Feb 17, 2015)

With your talents -- you build your own gazebo, it will only cost you materials. AND....you get the CNC. Win Win!!!!


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## RainMan 2.0 (May 6, 2014)

honesttjohn said:


> With your talents -- you build your own gazebo, it will only cost you materials. AND....you get the CNC. Win Win!!!!


I was thinking the same thing . I mean this is Mike we're talking about here


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## RainMan 2.0 (May 6, 2014)

Mike your a resourceful kinda guy ,if you build this it may help with your space issue ?


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

Hmmf, must be nice to have all of that wall space.


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## RainMan 2.0 (May 6, 2014)

MT Stringer said:


> Hmmf, must be nice to have all of that wall space.


Well my thinking was you use the underside of the cnc table as your wall space . Just hang your tools etc off of it .

Just kidding Mike


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## difalkner (Jan 3, 2012)

MT Stringer said:


> Hmmf, must be nice to have all of that wall space.


Wall space? What's that? People come to my shop and expect me to raise the garage door to let them in; I tell them that's a wall, not a door... :wink:


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## RainMan 2.0 (May 6, 2014)

difalkner said:


> Wall space? What's that? People come to my shop and expect me to raise the garage door to let them in; I tell them that's a wall, not a door... :wink:


That's funny, as I was eyeing up my garage door and thinking the same thing . It just may not be to useable in the future lol


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

She said yes!!!


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

Picking up the Probotics Asteriod at the shop Friday afternoon in Ft Walton Beach, Fla.

They are behind in building machines, but when I mentioned Honesttjohn's name, he said...Oh Hell NO!!! >:grin::grin::grin:

Then after checking with the guys in the shop, he said we will have it ready for you! Yee Haw! :smile:


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## RainMan 2.0 (May 6, 2014)

Congrats Mike ! I'm certainly looking forward to seeing your new CNC arrive and running


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## difalkner (Jan 3, 2012)

MT Stringer said:


> Picking up the Probotics Asteriod at the shop Friday afternoon in Ft Walton Beach, Fla.
> 
> They are behind in building machines, but when I mentioned Honesttjohn's name, he said...Oh Hell NO!!! >:grin::grin::grin:
> 
> Then after checking with the guys in the shop, he said we will have it ready for you! Yee Haw! :smile:


Awesome news! So y'all are driving over to pick it up or are y'all already in Florida?

David


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## kp91 (Sep 10, 2004)

Best space saving suggestion I have heard:

Go for the biggest CNC table that will fit in your dining room. A nice table cloth and a candelabra on the gantry and you have one classy set up. Plus, you can use the X-Axis to pass the salt and pepper


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## honesttjohn (Feb 17, 2015)

"She said yes!!!"

Sometimes when you beg long enuff, it helps, along with a few tears Congrats!!!!!!



MT Stringer said:


> Picking up the Probotics Asteriod at the shop Friday afternoon in Ft Walton Beach, Fla.
> 
> They are behind in building machines, but when I mentioned Honesttjohn's name, he said...Oh Hell NO!!! >:grin::grin::grin:
> 
> Then after checking with the guys in the shop, he said we will have it ready for you! Yee Haw! :smile:


Len pushed you right to the front after I told him how important and influential you were!!!!

Get the dustmop from Len - he's only $10 more than McMasters.

What you'll save in shipping - put that towards Aspire!!! Those guys should give you a quick lesson on the basics to get started -- that saves a lot of teeth gnashing getting started.

Again --Congrats!!!! Pics when you pick it up.


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## RainMan 2.0 (May 6, 2014)

Mike , as I was laying in bed it struck me , leave your CNC outside and get the misses to make a cover for it?


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

difalkner said:


> Awesome news! So y'all are driving over to pick it up or are y'all already in Florida?
> 
> David


we are already on the road heading to new orleans
to meet up with our kids and pats cousins for a couple of days.

then we will drive to ft walton to pick up the machine.


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## 4DThinker (Feb 16, 2014)

Their Asteroid should be a great machine to have. My only reservation about that model is that it has the same longer gantry as the Nebula. Our Nebula shows more vibration of the bit/spindle when profile cutting through hardwoods near the center of the cutting area. That leads to a greater chance of breaking a bit as well as a tendency for the vibration to set off either a Z axis or X axis limit switch. We never have had the same problem on my Meteor or the University's Meteor. 

4D


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

Just checked into our hotel in New Orleans.


First 350 miles behind us!:grin: Play time tomorrow.

I just remembered that I ha e a 1/4 inch end mill in my router bit collection. Ordered it by mistake several years ago.

I am sure I will be asking where to buy bits. But first things, first.


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## DesertRatTom (Jul 3, 2012)

@MT Stringer So when you get back are you building the gazebo? I was thinking that if you built a real doorway and fold down covers for the open areas, you'd have a home for your CNC. I'm now curious about where you're going to install it.

I was at Rockler yesterday and the had the premium space filled with CNCs, all the standard power tools were lumped together in the also-ran space. You can see which way the wind's blowing. Thanks to whoever mentioned a higher Z axis, seems that would greatly widen the scope of things you could do with it.

I am not yet bitten by the CNC bug, but enjoying all the discussion of it.


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## difalkner (Jan 3, 2012)

DesertRatTom said:


> [MENTION=79327]I am not yet bitten by the CNC bug, but enjoying all the discussion of it.


Oh, you've been bitten, Tom. It just hasn't festered and gotten infected yet. The only cure when that time comes is to satisfy the urge, there is no antidote to make it go away. :nerd:

David


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

This is just another phase of woodworking that I want to experience while I can still do it! Not getting any younger.:frown:


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

DesertRatTom said:


> @MT Stringer So when you get back are you building the gazebo? I was thinking that if you built a real doorway and fold down covers for the open areas, you'd have a home for your CNC. I'm now curious about where you're going to install it.
> 
> I was at Rockler yesterday and the had the premium space filled with CNCs, all the standard power tools were lumped together in the also-ran space. You can see which way the wind's blowing. Thanks to whoever mentioned a higher Z axis, seems that would greatly widen the scope of things you could do with it.
> 
> I am not yet bitten by the CNC bug, but enjoying all the discussion of it.


Tom, vision a double decker bus. The frame for the CNC will be just tall enough so my adjustable height router table (at its lowrst height) can roll inder it. :smile:


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

Pulled into town yesterday afternoon and found the shop. Even got a tour!

Picking up the machine in a little bit, then heading home...600 miles away!


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

The trip meter indicated 600.1. That got me to thinking...instead of driving east from Houston to New Orleans, then through Mississippi, Alabama, and into Florida, had we went west, we would still be in Texas! :surprise:>>>


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## honesttjohn (Feb 17, 2015)

Long week end to play with it


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## MEBCWD (Jan 14, 2012)

Now the fun begins!


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## Gaffboat (Mar 11, 2012)

MT Stringer said:


> The trip meter indicated 600.1. That got me to thinking...instead of driving east from Houston to New Orleans, then through Mississippi, Alabama, and into Florida, had we went west, we would still be in Texas! :surprise:>>>


That's the problem with going west from New Orleans. We can never get out of Texas.:surprise:


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## difalkner (Jan 3, 2012)

What's the poem? 

"The sun may rise, 
the sun may set, 
driving east to west, 
you'll still be in Texas yet!"

David


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## 4DThinker (Feb 16, 2014)

While there ask them why they moved to Florida. Tired of the snow? Tax breaks/incentives?


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## honesttjohn (Feb 17, 2015)

4D
I talked to Len a few weeks ago. he said they got twice the space for 1/2 the money. Add to that the cost of doing business in IL (which ain't cheap) it was a no brainer. Plus, he likes the water and is playing around with underwater robotics. 

You get your new controller yet?


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## 4DThinker (Feb 16, 2014)

honesttjohn said:


> 4D ... You get your new controller yet?


It arrived today. I haven't had a chance yet to work on getting it configured to run my Meteor though. I have to rewire all the steppers to bipolar from unipolar, then run their new configurator. I'll be moving my A axis rotary stepper to the new box. It currently runs from its own standalone box. 

I noticed an AUX port on the rear panel. Thinking that might be a trigger to start a spindle, but wondering if it can be used for other things.... like a touch plate. 

I'll dig into the stepper rewiring tomorrow. Not too hard and I have all the tools (wire snips, soldering iron, heat gun, shrink tubing) I need. They have a great drawing of how to hook them up on their wiki. I don't have a working color printer at the moment so I may be visiting my local BestBuy in the morning. 

4D


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## beltramidave (Jan 6, 2016)

4DThinker said:


> It arrived today. I haven't had a chance yet to work on getting it configured to run my Meteor though. I have to rewire all the steppers to bipolar from unipolar, then run their new configurator. I'll be moving my A axis rotary stepper to the new box. It currently runs from its own standalone box.
> 
> I noticed an AUX port on the rear panel. Thinking that might be a trigger to start a spindle, but wondering if it can be used for other things.... like a touch plate.
> 
> ...


4D, You need a second parallel port card for the touch plate and/or tool sensor. 

Here is the description for the aux port:
O: AUX -/+ - This is a 5V logic level signal that can be connected to a PowerSwitch Tail or other [email protected] relay circuit. This signal is controlled by the flood coolant controls in the software (M8/M9). The AUX output shares parallel port pin 16 with the VFD 0-10V signal, so it is only used if you are NOT using the VFD output.

I have modified a few controllers though to use the aux connectors to give a run signal to the the vfd versus the way they do it it now. Tried to talk Len in to doing them all like that or just adding 2 more wires going to the vfd. The way Probotix sets them up now, the vfd always has a run signal, but won't start until it has a speed reference signal. Not the correct way to do it, but it works...and it saves on parallel port signals.

Think you will like the new drivers and changing the motor connections isn't too bad after you get the first one done.


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## 4DThinker (Feb 16, 2014)

beltramidave said:


> 4D, You need a second parallel port card for the touch plate and/or tool sensor. ...
> Think you will like the new drivers and changing the motor connections isn't too bad after you get the first one done.


Thanks for that info. I do have a second parallel port on the Linux PC. Currently it is used to run my second controller for my A axis. The new controller will take care of the A axis now so I have that second pport free. I've had a 2-strand cable running down the cable chains from the router to my controller for a long time now. Hoping to wire it up to work as a touch pad now that my 2nd pport is free. You don't by chance know the pins I need to connect to on that 2nd pport do you? 

4D


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## beltramidave (Jan 6, 2016)

4DThinker said:


> Thank for that info. I do have a second parallel port on the Linux PC. Currently it is used to run my second controller for my A axis. The new controller will take care of the A axis now so I have that second pport free. I've had a 2-strand cable running down the cable chains from the router to my controller for a long time now. Hoping to wire it up to work as a touch pad now that my 2nd pport is free. You don't by chance know the pins I need to connect to on that 2nd pport do you?
> 
> 4D


Check out this from the Wiki:
Z Touch-off Puck - PROBOTIX :: wiki

When you set up your new controller config, it will ask you if you have a touch off puck/plate. This should set up your .hal file config for you as long as you wire it to the pins in the above link.

Dave


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

Home Sweet Home!

We made it safe and sound. Our little mini vacation turned out great. We met up with our kids in New Orleans. Two of Pat's cousins were there also. One was attending the same convention our son-in-law was going to. The other's husband was also at the convention. Some type of plant maintenance type convention. Vendors and potential customers.

We walked the French Market area Wednesday while the guys were at "work". Turned out to be a good day...mostly eating and drinking...and listening to some music. Then when the guys got home from work, we went back (took a cab this time). Yeah, that's the ticket. More eating and drinking and listening to music. Ended up at a bar called Sneaky Pete's. Just a hole in the wall, but it was fun. More guys from the convention were there that Pat's cousin works with, so it was a grand time.

Then Thursday morning, we checked out and pointed our wagon east. We pulled in to Fort Walton Beach about 4:15pm. I think they were fixing to lock up the shop. Len gave us the grand tour. Sorry, no pics. I told myself, that was not the thing to do. I think they have three bays of a warehouse storage. Lots of businesses in the same complex, including a big cabinet shop across the drive. Nice fella. We enjoyed the short visit.

Then, we were off to find a place called Boschamp's. Yeah, seafood on the water. The pics show an endless line of boats motoring about in the bay. More drinks and more good eats. That was a darn good time.

This morning, we checked out of our hotel and went to pick up the machine. They had it ready to go. We loaded the boxes in the cab of the truck and put the machine in the bed. The trifold tonneau was a perfect fit. We strapped it so it couldn't slide forward or to the side. It rode home like a champ. And the weather was perfect - no a cloud in the sky for the whole trip. The weather had swept through and cleared everything out.

We headed towards Houston at 11am. That turned out to be a 12 hour drive. Why? Because...we took a detour off I-10 over to Biloxi, MS to have lunch at a place called Shaggy's! More good food. No drinks this time. I was driving. We made a couple more stops just for rest room breaks and gas.

Even though this is about my CNC adventure, it was also an impromptu vacation for the two of us.

Here are a few pics...ha ha...mostly eats and drinks! Blackened Red Snapper, Crawfish poppers (at BB Kings place)...and a Long Island Tea, or was it two? :surprise:
And wife, daughter and cousin.


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## RainMan 2.0 (May 6, 2014)

Well I'd call that a good couple of days !


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## 4DThinker (Feb 16, 2014)

Nothing better than a great vacation when back at home you have a new toy to play with! Thanks for sharing your adventure so far. If you have any questions about getting that shiny new Asteroid to run just post them here. 

4D


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## difalkner (Jan 3, 2012)

Glad y'all made the trip safely and had a good time on the trip. That machine looks huge in the back of the truck!

David


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## honesttjohn (Feb 17, 2015)

Vacation's over. Now it's time to get serious, sorta. Sounds like a good trip, especially if Mama was happy.


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

Thanks everyone. In typical fashion, we slept in today. But it's time to get out in the shop and do a little re-arranging. My aches and pains from all the walking in New Orleans is fading fast so that is a good thing for sure.

I am sure I will have more questions as time goes on...and more pics to follow soon.


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

Here is a picture of a patio chair. I thought I would post it for reference just in case anyone might be interested in building one. Model not included! :surprise::grin:


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

Well, it is unloaded. Onward and upward.


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## difalkner (Jan 3, 2012)

So you'll be cutting by Monday? :wink:


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## 4DThinker (Feb 16, 2014)

Monday? The Asteroid should have already been running to teach him:
1. You never can use too many clamps. 2 clamps is never enough.
2. Consider clamps as consumables. You will end up cutting through them. 
3. Consider bits as consumables. Bits dull, and bits break. 
4. Straight bits are often not the diameter they claim to be. 
5. V bits are often not the angle they claim to be.
6. Wear hearing and eye protection any time the CNC is running.
7. 3D carving takes exponentially longer than 2D pocket/profile or 2.5D v-carving. 
8. Work needs to be held down *and* kept from moving sideways in any direction. 

And this is just a day-one list. 
4D


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## honesttjohn (Feb 17, 2015)

Leave him "some" surprises, 4d.

Now that the forward has been written......on to chapter 1.


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

4DThinker said:


> Monday? The Asteroid should have already been running to teach him:
> 1. You never can use too many clamps. 2 clamps is never enough.
> 2. Consider clamps as consumables. You will end up cutting through them.
> 3. Consider bits as consumables. Bits dull, and bits break.
> ...


Well...we are a few miles down the road at a crawfish boil! :surprise::grin:

And i just took a deposit on a cabinet style structure to cover two wine refrigerators!:smile: Gotta do something to pay for the machine. :smile:


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## 4DThinker (Feb 16, 2014)

I can forgive any excuse that involves seeking out food.


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## UglySign (Nov 17, 2015)

MT Stringer said:


> Well, it is unloaded. Onward and upward.



Crickets..... :wink:


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

UglySign said:


> Crickets..... :wink:


Slowly but surely. I bought the lumber to build the frame this morning, then drove across town to spend some time with my daughter and her family.

I am modifying my drawing for the frame. Going to start on it tomorrow.

Yeah, I am getting excited. :smile:


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## 4DThinker (Feb 16, 2014)

I can also forgive any excuse that involves spending time with family.


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

Question for the learned/experienced.

I was surveying my router bit collection, and realized I have several bits that could be used.

I have a set of Whiteside router bits for cutting dadoes in undersize plywood (7/32, 31/64, 23/32).

and v cutter...possibly 60 degree (need to measure angle)

a 1/4 inch HSS spiral up cutting bit.

also a 1/2 inch spiral up cutting bit.

All of these mentioned cut flat bottoms. Is there any reason these cannot be used? It seems most tutorials use the basic v groove or end mill or ball nose cutters. I don't have any of those so I will be hitting the credit card soon.

Some of the bits are 1/4" shank, others are 1/2" shank. The Bosch 1617 has both collets.

Oh, I also bought the license for Vetric's Cut2D Desktop. It should be good for my learning curve (and pocket book!)

One last question---What format of GCode do I use for the Probotics machine. There are many listed in the software to choose from.

Thanks.
Mike


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## difalkner (Jan 3, 2012)

I use Freud and Whiteside router bits and end mills and have some upcut and downcut in the same size. Everywhere possible I order and use 1/2" shank for a more rigid cutter. One bit I use often for smaller items is a 1/8" bit and shank end mill, about $12 for 10 on Amazon or eBay. 

Just occurred to me that I have a photo of my small collection from a couple of weeks ago when I made that holding tray (the bearing bits are obviously for use in my router table) -


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## kp91 (Sep 10, 2004)

If the straight cutters can plunge, they should be ok.

Centurion Tool has some reasonably priced v bits, and if you search the Vectric forum they have some recommended cheap bit sources on eBay, etc.

I started with simple signs, so it only took a couple of bits.


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## 4DThinker (Feb 16, 2014)

If you mean which post processor then look for EMC2-G64arcs(inch).(*.ngc) or EMC2-G64arcs(mm).(*.ngc) if you prefer working in metric rather than imperial units.

EMC2 is what LinuxCNC used to be called. 

4D


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## beltramidave (Jan 6, 2016)

Here is a link to the post processor files.
Vectric - PROBOTIX :: wiki

If you don't want to drill through all of the possible PP files that Vectric has, then just put the ones you use in the "My_Post PP" folder. You can find this by going to File > Open Application Data Folder..

Happy cutting!
Dave


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## honesttjohn (Feb 17, 2015)

4DThinker said:


> If you mean which post processor then look for EMC2-G64arcs(inch).(*.ngc) or EMC2-G64arcs(mm).(*.ngc) if you prefer working in metric rather than imperial units.
> 
> EMC2 is what LinuxCNC used to be called.
> 
> 4D


Yup -- What 4d said.

Won't be long and Cut2d won't be enuff -- you know you get credit from Vectric when you upgrade. Your goal should be to get to Aspire.


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

honesttjohn said:


> Yup -- What 4d said.
> 
> Won't be long and Cut2d won't be enuff -- you know you get credit from Vectric when you upgrade. Your goal should be to get to Aspire.


I might have to set up a Youfundme account for that!:surprise::grin::grin::grin:


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## MEBCWD (Jan 14, 2012)

MT Stringer said:


> Well...we are a few miles down the road at a crawfish boil! :surprise::grin:
> 
> And i just took a deposit on a cabinet style structure to cover two wine refrigerators!:smile: Gotta do something to pay for the machine. :smile:


First I do understand taking time out for the crawfish boil, I miss living near the coast where you can get fresh seafood and mudbugs.

You are jumping right in there getting your first deposit for a CNC job when you don't even have it set up yet! Is this just a basic cabinet to house the wine coolers or are you adding some V-carve embellishments?

Just wait until you add 3D to the mix and then the price will go up and projects will help pay for better software. To start if you use .v3m 3D files you can download Design and Make Machinist for free to view the models up close and when you buy a model you can run 3D toolpaths to cut the files. They do have some free models so you can make sure everything works with your machine.
Software

There are other programs you can use for 3D, some free and some that can be purchased. I do recommend the Vectric software and as John said you can upgrade to higher levels of Vectric software.


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

MEBCWD said:


> First I do understand taking time out for the crawfish boil, I miss living near the coast where you can get fresh seafood and mudbugs.
> 
> You are jumping right in there getting your first deposit for a CNC job when you don't even have it set up yet! Is this just a basic cabinet to house the wine coolers or are you adding some V-carve embellishments?


Oh, no. This project has been in the works for several months. We just haven't had a chance to go visit and see what she wants. The cabinet will have sides (and stretchers for the back so air can circulate) and a face frame on the front, but still be open so the coolers can be accessed. They will get a top for it once it is installed.

I took measurements and got a better idea of what the final result will be. And she wants it flat black! heh, heh, it just so happens I have some Transtint black dye. I have used it before and I can guarantee it will be black.

Here is an overview. I have to modify the drawing so it reflects the measurements I took. This is what I showed her and she liked it.


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

IT'S ALIVE!!! :smile:

More tomorrow.
G'Night!


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## difalkner (Jan 3, 2012)

What a tease!!

David


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## RainMan 2.0 (May 6, 2014)

difalkner said:


> What a tease!!
> 
> David


Ya nice guy eh :|


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## MEBCWD (Jan 14, 2012)

MT Stringer said:


> Oh, no. This project has been in the works for several months. We just haven't had a chance to go visit and see what she wants. The cabinet will have sides (and stretchers for the back so air can circulate) and a face frame on the front, but still be open so the coolers can be accessed. They will get a top for it once it is installed.
> 
> I took measurements and got a better idea of what the final result will be. And she wants it flat black! heh, heh, it just so happens I have some Transtint black dye. I have used it before and I can guarantee it will be black.
> 
> Here is an overview. I have to modify the drawing so it reflects the measurements I took. This is what I showed her and she liked it.


Looks like it would work to me, plenty of ventilation. You could carve some flowers in the face frame with that new machine.


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

OK. First test cut is in the books. :smile:

I found a piece of 1/2 inch mdf that I could use. And a couple of 3/4 inch pieces I could screw to the spoil board for temporary spoil board.

I drew up a test piece which could resemble a sign or plaque or whatever. And a pair of 90 deg angles to use on my work bench.

The results - I am calling this test a success. The machine cut exactly what I had drawn. And now I have mdf dust everywhere! Obviously, a dust boot will be in the works shortly. I wore my dust mask 'cause I knew it was coming.

The machine worked well. The Bosch 1617 just hummed along. I used a 7/32 inch router bit (for undersize plywood) mainly because I want to use it to cut out the parts for a drawer I need to build. Might as well cut the parts out since the machine is ready to go.

So, what did I learn?
1) Lots of dust!

2) I made the tabs a little too thick. They could have been thinner.

3) The final pass on each of the cuts could have been a smidgen deeper. A paper thin layer was left that I removed with a chisel.

4) That darned limit switch! I was moving the router around front to back, and raised it a little too high and banged the z axis switch. And, I was stuck! After some internet searching, I found out how to remedy the situation. Turn the controller off then rotate the motor shaft by hand enough to lower the router. That worked and I was good to go.

5) I am not sure if was doing something wrong but even though everything was cut with the same bit, I had to load each tool path separately and touch off the three axis each time. That was aggravating. I hope there is a better way. When you look at the pictures, you can see that everything was cut with the same cutter.

I think I could rewrite the manual with additional information that could prove helpful to beginners like me.

Now saying all that, I am a happy camper. Note the air filter and box fan are still running! :surprise: I may shut them off after a while. :grin:


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

Ah Ha! I think I have solved my problem. I didn't know I had to check the little box to save all visible toolpaths to a single file!

I'll know better next time.


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## honesttjohn (Feb 17, 2015)

Yay!!! Dust

Told you about the dustmop

You can save all the toolpaths to a single cut IF they use the same bit. You also don't have to touch off all 3 axis each time unless you change the bit. Then it's only the Z axis. The machine holds the touch off points until they are either changed or it's shut off and has to be rehomed. You can run the gantry all the way back, right or left - hit start and it'll come back and start right from the last set touch off points. I just turn the controller off and leave the computer on all of the time, just like my main PC in the office.

You got a manual???? That's more than I got with mine.

Looks like you're on the way.


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

honesttjohn said:


> Yay!!! Dust
> 
> Told you about the dustmop
> 
> ...


Yes sir. Thanks. I ordered several bits. They should be here some time Thursday.


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## RainMan 2.0 (May 6, 2014)

Wow your a quick study Mike . I can hardly imagine what will be seeing in the future . I think this is money very well spent


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## difalkner (Jan 3, 2012)

Good job, Mike. Are you going to make your own dust shoe or buy one? I've enjoyed playing with designs to make one and now that I've modified the last one (again) it's working pretty good. One thing it taught me is doing some steps I had not used in the software, making parts that have to fit something else, designing usability into the part, etc. - all fun and good training.

David


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## old55 (Aug 11, 2013)

This is a great read and journey Mike.


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## MEBCWD (Jan 14, 2012)

Mike looks like you are figuring it out pretty quick. I notice you used a fillet in the inside corner of your squares, but looks like you used a profile toolpath on a small circle. There is a Fillet tool that you can use that allows you to add a fillet to the corner and it will be cut when you cut your profile cutout. You can add a regular fillets, dog bone fillets or T-bone fillets. Just make sure you size your tool radius for the bit you are using or larger, remember it is the radius and not diameter.

Work Safe, Have Fun, CNC Some Wood!


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

Heck Mike, I thought a fillet was a cut of meat! >

I have a quick question.* Is there any reason why I can't shorten the power cord on my router?* I only need about 15-18 inches. My thinking is to buy a good 15 amp replacement plug and cut the cord and install it. That sure would make a better looking installation with the Bosch 1617.

Don't worry, the Asteroid is the 1617's new home. I have another one if I need to do some hand held routing.


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## kp91 (Sep 10, 2004)

It shouldn't be a problem, just make sure you have enough cord for every x-y-z combination.


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## MEBCWD (Jan 14, 2012)

You just bought a new CNC so you can't afford to buy the meat kind of fillet:stop: but just wait until you get it all figured out and then you can sell some projects :sold:and be able to take your wife out for a nice dinner that includes the meat kind of fillet and maybe a big piece of pie for desert.:dance3::jester:


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## 4DThinker (Feb 16, 2014)

I used a Dewalt router which had a removeable cord and simply bought a new end, cut the cord to the length I needed, stripped the newly cut end wires and screwed then into the new end plug. It must help more than just looks because after shortening the cord I can tell my router now runs .0001 percent faster. 

4D


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

Thanks. I will check out the travel before I make a cut. That would be a bummer.


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

Next plan of action. I screwed some 3/4 mdf to the factory bed. My thinking is why mess up the factory mdf when I have a perfectly good piece waiting for me to ruin it!

Hopefully tomorrow I will modify it with a few dog holes. :grin:


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## difalkner (Jan 3, 2012)

MT Stringer said:


> Next plan of action. I screwed some 3/4 mdf to the factory bed. My thinking is why mess up the factory mdf when I have a perfectly good piece waiting for me to ruin it!
> 
> Hopefully tomorrow I will modify it with a few dog holes. :grin:


Are you planning to surface it first, Mike?

David


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

difalkner said:


> Are you planning to surface it first, Mike?
> 
> David


I haven't decided. I don't see where it would make any difference. Just cutting out 3/4 inch holes.

Probably wait and do it afterward.


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## difalkner (Jan 3, 2012)

MT Stringer said:


> I haven't decided. I don't see where it would make any difference. Just cutting out 3/4 inch holes.
> 
> Probably wait and do it afterward.


You're right in that it won't make any difference but it is good practice and will show you what you're working with as far as everything being square, level, perpendicular, etc. 

Plus, as a bonus it will show you once again how much dust you can generate when you cut MDF! :grin:


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## beltramidave (Jan 6, 2016)

Will definitely want to surface your board eventually. If you don't, you will never get consistent depth v carving or 3d work.

I have found it best when zeroing your z axis to zero to the top of the material when vcarving and pocketing and zero to the spoilboard when profile cutting. If you surface your bed and zero accurately, you will hardly leave a mark on spoilboard.

Did you get the z puck or tool length sensor with your Asteroid?

Use your dust boot when doing anything with mdf, that stuff is nasty!

Dave


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

I finally got around to slinging some sawdust today, and boy did I do some slinging. A dust boot is definitely on the priority list. 

I thought it would be a good idea to get some experience with the CNC by cutting lap joints on the 2x4 frame members of the new frame I am building for the CNC.

As the day went on, I broke my first bit. The second one started chattering in a cross cut, and somehow, made the cut deeper, even though it was tight in the collet. I was using a 1/4 inch end mill with a fairly long shank.

Finally, I took inventory of my router bits and chose a new Whiteside 23/32 inch cutter designed for undersized plywood (1/2" shank). I modified the settings in VCarve and generated new gcode. I also reduced the cut from .125 to .1. The combination resulted in smoooth milling of the 2x4 as it cut a 3 1/2 x 3 1/2 x 3/4" lap joint. And the process went faster due to the bigger diameter cutter. Man I had chips flying every where. I stood by with the dust collector hose sucking up as much as possible.

My temporary clamping apparatus worked OK. I will definitely work on that also.

Our friends are throwing a pool party/BBQ/Beer bust tomorrow so I might not get much done! :surprise::grin:


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## honesttjohn (Feb 17, 2015)

Was that one of the cheapo bits you broke, Mike??

Now, you're initiated! First broken bit.

Better to take shallower passes and a little longer cutting time in most cases.


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## BalloonEngineer (Mar 27, 2009)

Highly recommend using solid carbide spiral bits instead of the two flute type


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## MEBCWD (Jan 14, 2012)

BalloonEngineer said:


> Highly recommend using solid carbide spiral bits instead of the two flute type


Richard I have found that it really depends on the project and the materials you are cutting. 

One of the customers that I do design files for cuts a lot of western cedar and what we can get here always has a higher moisture content and using a straight 2 flute bit gives him a lot cleaner cut than a spiral bit. One thing to remember in picking 2 flute router bits you want a bottom cutting plunge type bit.


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

Trying to put my frame together. It's a struggle doing by my self. Thank goodness for lots of clamps. A brisk breeze is helping keep me cool, but blowing against the structure doesn't help at all. Gotta do it outside on the portable work bench because the CNC is taking up the entire work bench in the shop!

Pics later.


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## difalkner (Jan 3, 2012)

Fully understand, Mike. We have no outside work area so when I built the stand for ours I had to make room for _*two *_2x4 CNC's in the shop - one is where it sat while I built the stand and the other was the footprint of the stand itself. Lots of stuff got moved and pushed around for a few days and we were definitely stepping over and on lots of things! LOL! 

Ain't small shops grand! :surprise:


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## DesertRatTom (Jul 3, 2012)

MT Stringer said:


> Next plan of action. I screwed some 3/4 mdf to the factory bed. My thinking is why mess up the factory mdf when I have a perfectly good piece waiting for me to ruin it!
> 
> Hopefully tomorrow I will modify it with a few dog holes. :grin:


Saw a neat trick for placing dogholes precisely over existing ones. Drop dowel centering pins in the holes in the existing table, then drop the new surface over the old and you have your centers for you new dog holes. Of course you'll have to either buy a lot of the same size, or work out a registration scheme to make sure the new table lands in the exact same spot every time. How you'd do that depends on the existing table. Perhaps you could mark two, drill them and use dogs to align the new top, with the two pins handling the registration.


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

DesertRatTom said:


> Saw a neat trick for placing dogholes precisely over existing ones. Drop dowel centering pins in the holes in the existing table, then drop the new surface over the old and you have your centers for you new dog holes. Of course you'll have to either buy a lot of the same size, or work out a registration scheme to make sure the new table lands in the exact same spot every time. How you'd do that depends on the existing table. Perhaps you could mark two, drill them and use dogs to align the new top, with the two pins handling the registration.


Thanks Tom. I haven't got that far yet, but I will be doing something soon.


I posted earlier that I was working on the frame for the CNC. Well sir, it is assembled and in place. :smile:

I struggled some getting the frame pieces to stand on their own, but with the help of a few clamps :surprise: Yeah, like about 20 of them, I managed to get it together. I put the back and the front pieces together first because I could lay them on the work table. Then I stood up one at a time and clamped them to the table and some 90 deg angles. Thank goodness for the dog holes in the work table. They made my job a lot easier.

When I got one side done, I attached to casters, then assembled the other side (actually front and back). That way I didn't have to struggle with the casters after the frame was assembled.

Oh, there were a couple of hiccups but everything turned out OK. Definitely not fine furniture, but if you had that many screws in you, you wouldn't be able to move either! >

Another small task was putting it together upside down. That just kills me sometimes.

When my sweetie got home from running her errands, she helped me carry the frame into the shop. I like it. The router table fits under it nicely with room to spare.

After taking a break, I started working on a shelf for the computer and the control box. HMMM...this may take some finagling to get both boxes in there, but I will work on it. I don't want anything hanging or sticking out that can get caught up when I have to move things around to get to the other tools.

A quick note about the casters. I bought them at the big blue box store. They lock both ways and appear to be pretty nice. I like them so far.

Here are some construction pictures. Man I just might get to fire this thing up tomorrow! I have some dust hose ordered and a couple of bits. Scheduled for delivery tomorrow also!


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## roofner (Aug 1, 2010)

Don't you just love it when a plan comes together!!! Nice work.


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## BalloonEngineer (Mar 27, 2009)

Mike, 
You may wish to add some sheet stock to the back and sides, or at least a diagonal. That is a tall base and I fear you may find it rocking more than you expect once you start cutting at speed. DAMHIKT. Not criticizing your construction, it's just that the moving gantry and Z carriage have considerable momentum. 

Richard


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

Yee Haw! The frame is finished and the machine has been moved from the work bench to its' new home!

Last night I decided to make a lap drawer for the keyboard and mouse. I drew it up in Sketchup, and went to bed. Note: I did a little further designing in my sleep also! :surprise::grin:

This morning, I tackled the task of fabricating a mount for the drawer. As it turned out, it was easy. I almost over designed the darn thing. All I needed was something to hold the drawer slides in place. A couple of left over 2x4 pieces worked out perfect. I simply screwed them in place. You may notice I offset the drawer to the left. That is because of the ESTOP button is mounted on the right front of the machine.

The mount and the drawer were easy to build. Nothing fancy, just a few screws and some 1/2 inch BB for the drawer bottom. It just so happened I had a pair of 16 inch full extension drawer slides that needed a home! :grin::grin::grin: And she fits perfectly...soft close even! :smile:

Then we called for reinforcements. Our grandson came over and we lifted the machine off the work bench onto the frame. It's a close fit on the frame. My plan is to add some tabs to the frame legs to keep the machine from moving around.

Now that it is in place, I can work on shoring up the back with some sheet stock - Thanks @BaloonEngineer for that timely tip. :wink: And go about mounting the controller, PC and associated wiring.

And the dust collection hose, a 100 pack of screw in inserts and a 1/4 inch ball head router bit were delivered today. Good times straight ahead!

Mike


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## difalkner (Jan 3, 2012)

Looks really good, Mike! I like the nesting feature, good use of space.

David


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## RainMan 2.0 (May 6, 2014)

Great job Mike 
I have to say it looks a little tighter in your shop than I thought . I'm going to quit complaining about having 22x26 of space at this a rate


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## 4DThinker (Feb 16, 2014)

Looking good Mike! 

Some thoughts though about the keyboard under the CNC: I started out the same way, but soon realized with the keyboard/mouse attached to the CNC there is no way to escape having dust and chips from covering them when cutting. Yes, you can slide them under the bed, but you'll probably want the mouse handy as well as the jog keys in case you want to pause a cut in session. Your dust collector will help a bit, but using a router that probably has a fan blowing down you'll still get plenty of blown debris in your face during cuts. At this point I have all 3 CNCs I oversee on separate carts that can be rolled back from the CNC as far as the cable bundle will allow. 

You also may eventually want to open up the bed for vertical/angled cuts and the best place for all that is within the front half of the bed. Your keyboard tray is right in the prime space for that. If furniture projects are on your list then one of these: Angling clamp fixture will need that space but come in handy for those complicated joinery cuts.

4D


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

4DThinker said:


> Looking good Mike!
> 
> Some thoughts though about the keyboard under the CNC: I started out the same way, but soon realized with the keyboard/mouse attached to the CNC there is no way to escape having dust and chips from covering them when cutting. Yes, you can slide them under the bed, but you'll probably want the mouse handy as well as the jog keys in case you want to pause a cut in session. Your dust collector will help a bit, but using a router that probably has a fan blowing down you'll still get plenty of blown debris in your face during cuts. At this point I have all 3 CNCs I oversee on separate carts that can be rolled back from the CNC as far as the cable bundle will allow.
> 
> ...


Thanks for the tips. It is crowded and my only solution was to build the tray. I have already decided to cover the keyboard and mouse when the machine is in operation. 

With the CNC straddled over the router table, we haven't lost much space. There is still a path through the garage so all is good.

I still have a lot to learn, but it is getting funner every day! :grin:


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## honesttjohn (Feb 17, 2015)

I still have a lot to learn, but it is getting funner every day! ......Quote MT Stringer.

Wait til you upgrade the software to Vcarve or Aspire!!!

My keyboard is under the, bed, but I never use it. All mouse and computer. My controller and computer are on a table that fits under the table, but I just leave it pulled out since it's in it's permanent home. So far the dust hasn't bothered it. I just blow it off once in a while.

Get that dustshoe and a dust deputy ASAP. Helps a whole bunch.


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

Is it a dumb question to ask about using a wireless keyboard? I don't know anything about the Linux operating system.


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## kp91 (Sep 10, 2004)

I highly recommend getting a cheap, cordless mouse and keyboard.


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## difalkner (Jan 3, 2012)

RainMan 2.0 said:


> Great job Mike
> I have to say it looks a little tighter in your shop than I thought . I'm going to quit complaining about having 22x26 of space at this a rate


22x26???? That's huge, Rick!!! Beats our 21x21 coming and going (usable space 18x20). :frown:

David


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## MEBCWD (Jan 14, 2012)

Mike my computer is remote to the CNC and hard to get to. I have a monitor above my machine and use a wireless mouse and a mini keypad like this one. I can jog and make entries with it.

https://www.amazon.com/Rii-Wireless...kmr0&keywords=hausbell+cordless+mini+keyboard


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## DesertRatTom (Jul 3, 2012)

If you're using a desktop in the shop, slap a little filter over the air intake so it doesn't suck up the sawdust. Make a fresh clone of the hard drive once in awhile, just in case. Back up your files in the cloud if you can.


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

Thanks Tom. Yeah, I have all of that stuff except for the filters.

I need to learn more about the Ubuntu operating system.

HMMM...I found this info on making backups.
https://www.maketecheasier.com/back-up-entire-hard-drive-linux/

I will check the computer to see if it is installed. Since the hdd that came with the computer is only 8gb, I should be able to make a complete backup to my flash drive (32gb).


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## 4DThinker (Feb 16, 2014)

I also highly recommend covering the intake vents of the PC and controller with filter material. We killed a controller in our college shop by choking the inside with dust it sucked up when it was on the open-backed bottom shelf of a student-designed cart that lived in front of the CNC. I opened up the controller case and it was 80% packed solid with sawdust. The replacement cart (designed by me) has the PC and controller on a shelf with a plywood back between them and the CNC. The cables have to drop down 6" to exit the cart and head back to the CNC. Dust still sifts in there, but filter material taped over the intakes has kept it our of the cases. 

4D


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

Big smile on my face tonight. I finally have my shop back in order... and the CNC is ready for operation.

Thanks for all of the advice and suggestions. This morning, I bought a 1/2 sheet of 1/2 inch plywood, cut a back, and attached it to the frame with screws.

Then I cut some filter material from an A/C filter and taped it over the fan inlet on the PC and the controller.

With that done, I cut a piece of the plywood and attached it to the end of the frame. That provided for a place to attach the power strip and the brackets for a shelf the monitor can sit on. The brackets can be folded to the down position when not in use or when the frame will be moved around.

And so it begins. We have several things to work on. A friend saw the machine and a sign John had sent me and he said "I want you to make me a sign". His wife has a heart condition, and a few years ago, she successfully under went surgery. I don't know all the details but he wants a sign with "Survivor" and the red dress that is associated with heart disease. I have found several images to use so I will be working on that soon.

And I am working on a sign for a benefit coming up July 8th. It is being held for my wife's cousin, Dwight Cahanin.

From the event Facebook page, it reads "Dwight has been diagnosed with stage IV Esophageal Cancer. It has spread to his liver and some lymph nodes. His disease is not curable, but it is treatable."

I hope my sign will generate a few bucks in the live auction.


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## Enios (Jun 10, 2017)

Hi The cut quality is depend on many factors, including precision of cnc router, tool bits, etc.


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## RainMan 2.0 (May 6, 2014)

Great job Mike , it looks right at home in there now 

Can't wait to see all your upcoming projects with your new toy


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## honesttjohn (Feb 17, 2015)

Mike,

Time to break out the "Man Glitter" sign. lol


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## difalkner (Jan 3, 2012)

All looking good, Mike. Glad you have upcoming projects but sorry to hear about your wife's cousin - the big 'C' ain't purty at all.

Keep up the good work on the CNC!

David


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

Today has been a good day...at least for a lazy Sunday afternoon. We didn't get started until after NOON! :grin:

I finished milling the holes in the cnc spoil board for the threaded inserts. When it came time to insert them, I couldn't find the appropriate tool. That turned out to be a 6mm hex wrench. Well dang it, anyway. The inserts are for 1/4 x 20 bolts. The holes I milled are 5/16 inch in diameter. But the dang tool needs to be 6mm. :frown: So, I made a sacrificial tool from a cheep set of allen wrenches in metric sizes. I sawed with a hack saw until I was blue in the face, then broke out the Dremel and worked on it. Finally, a big pair of pliers broke off the remaining portion. I chucked it in the drill and I was ready to go.

Once I finally had the proper set up, driving the inserts was a breeze. With the driver in slow speed, and the clutch set, it was quick and easy to drive the inserts snug in their holes. During the milling process, I had cut away enough for the flange of the insert to sit below the surface of the mdf once it was in place. That worked well.

OK, the inserts were cheap...something like $7 for a 100 pack. They don't feel the smoothest when threading in a bolt but I think they will work out OK.

Yesterday, I cut a few clamp pieces and they are ready for action. I got the idea (and plans) from this guy.


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## 4DThinker (Feb 16, 2014)

Looking better each day!. Although this tip may be too late for now, you can use a 1/4" hex bolt with two nuts jammed together about 1/2" from the end to drive in those inserts. Screw an insert onto the bolt up to the nuts, the drive the bolt/nut/insert in until the insert is flush with a socket driver chucked into your drill. Often those insert are made from some soft metal that tears the allen slot pretty easily if the holes put up resistance. This 2-nut strategy will still drive them in. 

4D


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

4DThinker said:


> Looking better each day!. Although this tip may be too late for now, you can use a 1/4" hex bolt with two nuts jammed together about 1/2" from the end to drive in those inserts. Screw an insert onto the bolt up to the nuts, the drive the bolt/nut/insert in until the insert is flush with a socket driver chucked into your drill. Often those insert are made from some soft metal that tears the allen slot pretty easily if the holes put up resistance. This 2-nut strategy will still drive them in.
> 
> 4D


Well, blow me down said Popeye. I have done that exact thing in the past, but that was a few yesterday's ago! :frown:


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## 4DThinker (Feb 16, 2014)

Not to worry. I go through boxes and come across something wonderful I did/made a few decades ago and find it hard to believe I was that clever..... ever. 

Seem to me there should be some way for the CNC itself to pick-n-place those inserts and drive them in. Or perhaps chuck a tap into a stepper motor hung beside the router and have it tap all the holes? Threads in MDF might last for at least one use.


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## honesttjohn (Feb 17, 2015)

Aren't the guys putting the inserts in from the bottom - that way they won't pull out.

I like the T-track idea better.


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

honesttjohn said:


> Aren't the guys putting the inserts in from the bottom - that way they won't pull out.
> 
> I like the T-track idea better.


That is what I did, then flipped it over. The flange will help prevent the insert from pulling through.


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

Well, I'm stuck like Chuck!

I am trying to create a profile cutout on the inside of the bottom part of the dust boot to get rid of the waste area.
Help!


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## MEBCWD (Jan 14, 2012)

That error tells me there is something wrong with the tool in the data base. Mike you might check the tool you are using to make sure the size is correct in the data base. Like diameter = 2.5 instead of 0.25 for a 1/4" bit. That is the only thing I can think of with the part of the form you show.

You could also select the outer vector and inner vector at the same time and run the profile toolpath to cut outside for a cutout and it will figure the toolpath to cut outside the outer vector and cut inside the inner vector automatically.


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## Enios (Jun 10, 2017)

It is possible get a XFL-6090 Advertising Engraving Machine at price of USD4000 from China


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

MEBCWD said:


> That error tells me there is something wrong with the tool in the data base. Mike you might check the tool you are using to make sure the size is correct in the data base. Like diameter = 2.5 instead of 0.25 for a 1/4" bit. That is the only thing I can think of with the part of the form you show.
> 
> You could also select the outer vector and inner vector at the same time and run the profile toolpath to cut outside for a cutout and it will figure the toolpath to cut outside the outer vector and cut inside the inner vector automatically.


Thanks Mike.

After further review, I discovered that particular vector was "open". I looked closely and couldn't see any problems. Finally, I discovered the menu item to "Close/Join open vectors"...and that worked . So I am off and running.

Onward through the fog. I am learning by doing it the hard way! :grin:


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## kp91 (Sep 10, 2004)

Only way to learn!


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## 4DThinker (Feb 16, 2014)

When you need an answer, there are three ways to get it I've discovered over the last 4 decades teaching college students.
1. Research to find it. Don't attempt until enough supporting info has been carefully studied. Slight possibility of conflicting data out there or no data out there. 
2. Take a wild shot. Saves from having to do all that research, and will either work, or demonstrate why it didn't work. Repeat with updated wild shots until one works. 
3. Ask the gullible professor. 50% chance he/she will just do it for you the right way. 50% chance he/she will challenge you to either 1 or 2 or both above. 

4D


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

Made a little progress today. Yesterday I designed a dust boot for the CNC and today I got the top portion of it cut out and test fit. Looks good to me. I am waiting for the whiskers to arrive so I can make and install the lower portion.


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## 4DThinker (Feb 16, 2014)

Looking good!

I'm guessing that the bar clamp is a temporary feature, which begs the question: How do you plan to keep the thing attached? The ones that Probotix sells tighten around the protruding router body. The lower half stick with magnets to the upper half. No bar clamp needed.  

4D


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

4DThinker said:


> Looking good!
> 
> I'm guessing that the bar clamp is a temporary feature, which begs the question: How do you plan to keep the thing attached? The ones that Probotix sells tighten around the protruding router body. The lower half stick with magnets to the upper half. No bar clamp needed.
> 
> 4D



Yeah, the clamp is temporary. Not enough hands on deck. :grin:

I cut a protrusion that will house a screw (bolt) that will in effect cinch the top part to the router. The camp blocked it's view. Sorry about that.

My plan was to make one out of plywood and use it, then recreate it in something more permanent...like a HDPE cutting board leaning against the wall nearby! :grin:

The way the router mount is made forced me to offset the hose connection. And that is OK with me since the hose exits to that side of the machine.


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## MEBCWD (Jan 14, 2012)

Mike isn't it neat making parts for your CNC using your CNC?


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

I have been following along with a few VCarve Pro tutorials, and in particular, text on text for sign making.

Then, I decided it was nap time! :surprise::grin:

So, in my dreams, I created a button with a macro attached to it (much like something one would create in Excel).

And what does that button do when you click it...

------
Layer 1 select all text
convert text to curves
select all vectors
group vectors
select all vectors
copy to new layer
new layer name: "Top Text"
select layer 1
select all
delete
-----
Sure seems easy to do to me. :smile: But that was in my dreams.


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## 4DThinker (Feb 16, 2014)

MT Stringer said:


> And what does that button do when you click it...
> Sure seems easy to do to me. :smile: But that was in my dreams.


Any button you make using a CNC will not do anything but annoy the person wearing it if you insist on clicking on it. :wink:

Macro buttons are just buttons for extra large apparel. 

As for the value of dreams, it is in the dreams I have that experience mixes with imagination to come up with original solutions. 

4D


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## mikeacg (Sep 16, 2009)

beltramidave said:


> ... it is definitely a contagious disease!
> 
> Dave


Is NOT! I can quit any time I want!! Ha ha ha! :dance3:

Mike


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

More experience, I guess.

Today I was cutting out some coasters and the 1/4 inch end mill slipped and ruined the cutout. I removed the collet and blew it out with compressed air and cleaned the shaft of the cutter and reinserted it and made sure it was tightened securely. Then a little while later, it happened again. Looks like I am going to give up on these coasters.

The wood is hard maple 5/8 inch thick. I had the cutter configured at .1 inch cutting depth per pass.

Any suggestions?
Thanks
Mike


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## 4DThinker (Feb 16, 2014)

You might check the shaft diameter of the bit you used. Hopefully you have a digital caliper. If you don't then getting one will come in very handy for checking material thicknesses and bit diameters. Not all makes are exactly the dimensions their packaging claims. The only time I've seen a bit come out of collet during use was when a student didn't get it as tight as it needed to be, or the shaft wasn't a true 1/4" diameter. 

I also prefer using 3/16" spiral end mills if the wood isn't any thicker than 3/4" as they put less strain on the router, and even when taking the same depth passes as a 1/4" bit they don't have to remove as much wood. Onsrud bits can be pricey, but I find them to be the most reliable in dimension. 

4D


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## honesttjohn (Feb 17, 2015)

I usually just use 1/8 bits for that kind of stuff. Makes a world of difference on a profile cut.


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## MEBCWD (Jan 14, 2012)

Mike I agree with 4D about checking the bit diameter. If it is too small the collet might get tight before it has actually clamped the bit all the way so it can try to slip out. You don't say what your feed rate is but overfeeding can also cause the problem at times.


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## difalkner (Jan 3, 2012)

It depends on what I'm cutting and how fast I want to cut but usually use 1/4" spiral at 150 ipm and about 0.10" to 0.125 depth of cut in Walnut. I use upcut if it's something I need to profile the edge on later or will get a fair amount of sanding and downcut if I'm looking for a finished clean cut that requires very little attention. If it's a smaller job or the space is tight I use 1/8" bits at 75 ipm to 100 ipm and 0.0625" to 0.09375" depth of cut.

David


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## honesttjohn (Feb 17, 2015)

1/8" bit with 1/4" shank runs thru the birch panels I got with no trouble. .1" depth or less per pass. 180 ipm. She'll squeal a little bit but keeps on cutting. Now, if you go much deeper than that or forget to turn the spindle on and touch it off - you get to use your brand new spare bit.


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

I am pulling my hair out!

I started a new project. Drew a circle. Drew a star that is a little bit larger than the circle. Then I used the clipping tool to trim away the part of the five star points that overlap the circle. I had the box checked to rejoin the joints after clipping. Well, it didn't work. Now I have five open vectors.

I zoomed in only to find the star lines don't join the circle. I used the node edit tool to extend the lines of the star to intersect the circle, but to no avail. Still have five open vectors (which indicate the area snipped from the star).

Maybe I need to sleep on it.

Help.
Bob, Carol, Ted, Alice! Anyone?


*EDIT:* Never mind. I figured it out. Seems so simple when everything works as it should. :frown:


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## difalkner (Jan 3, 2012)

honesttjohn said:


> 1/8" bit with 1/4" shank runs thru the birch panels I got with no trouble. .1" depth or less per pass. 180 ipm. She'll squeal a little bit but keeps on cutting. Now, if you go much deeper than that or forget to turn the spindle on and touch it off - you get to use your brand new spare bit.


The fastest I have cut with a 1/8" bit is 100 ipm; afraid I'll break a bit. But I guess if you can cut it that fast then I should try to bump mine up a bit.

David


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## 4DThinker (Feb 16, 2014)

Loosing a little hair is not unusual.  I'm convinced that learning is best done through contemplation of then fixing your mistakes. 

4D


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

Dang that little v-groove bit is taking a long time to do its' thing. Is there any way to speed it up like the videos (4x)? ha ha ha.


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## honesttjohn (Feb 17, 2015)

MT Stringer said:


> Dang that little v-groove bit is taking a long time to do its' thing. Is there any way to speed it up like the videos (4x)? ha ha ha.


You think that's slow -- wait til you start 3d carving. You have to remember good things come to those who wait .... and wait ..... and wait ......


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## MEBCWD (Jan 14, 2012)

MT Stringer said:


> Dang that little v-groove bit is taking a long time to do its' thing. Is there any way to speed it up like the videos (4x)? ha ha ha.


Big pockets take forever. If you didn't edit and change the feed rate for that bit it should be running at 80 ipm but everything is small enough that it is probably not getting that high. It has a lot to clean out between the letters. Probably could have upped the depth of cut with that machine and been okay.

A little late to hear that now isn't it?


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

It finally finished the toolpath with the flat bottomed bit. Then the v-groove bit. Now I have turned it over to the finishing department to clean up the fuzz and some uneven places with her rotary tool! :grin:


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## MEBCWD (Jan 14, 2012)

MT Stringer said:


> It finally finished the toolpath with the flat bottomed bit. Then the v-groove bit. Now I have turned it over to the finishing department to clean up the fuzz and some uneven places with her rotary tool! :grin:


You are lucky you have your wife to cleanup your carvings I have to do it myself.


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

Latest sign. I made it for our daughter. Her little poochy looks like a dust mop!

I designed it in Vetric Cut2D and cut it on the CNC.


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## RainMan 2.0 (May 6, 2014)

Looks like your getting hang of it Mike . A bit of a learning curve I'll bet


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