# How affordable/recommend is it to convert a phase 3 machine?



## Weston Porter (Nov 20, 2013)

*recommended

I'm interested in a local machine for sale but I only have standard power at my workshop. I can't really afford to install phase 3 here, how about modifying the router?


----------



## fixtureman (Jul 5, 2012)

You can get a roto phase or VFD to run it


----------



## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

Weston Porter said:


> *recommended
> 
> I'm interested in a local machine for sale but I only have standard power at my workshop. I can't really afford to install phase 3 here, how about modifying the router?


my shop is 3Ø....
the cost of electricity will be very high per KW...
a roto phase will waste electricity hand over fist...

tell us more about this machine you are interested in...
is it really a shaper and not a router??? 
3Ø routers generally start at 5HP...


----------



## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

Getting one rewired for 220v is also expensive.


----------



## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

replace the motor if it's a shaper w/ a 1Ø...


----------



## Weston Porter (Nov 20, 2013)

Well I don't have permission to post a proper link but it's houston.craigslist DOT org/for/5459216303.html

I'm meeting with the owner tomorrow for the specs.


----------



## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

Had a look Weston. If it was practical to convert the owner would have kept it and done himself. At least that's my take on it. He didn't say he closing out, just moving. It may not be feasible to try and rewire as the casing may not allow that. The only other option is to run a power converter which will cost lots up front and then as Stick said will cost you dearly as you use it.


----------



## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

Cherryville Chuck said:


> Had a look Weston. If it was practical to convert the owner would have kept it and done himself. At least that's my take on it. He didn't say he closing out, just moving. It may not be feasible to try and rewire as the casing may not allow that. The only other option is to run a power converter which will cost lots up front and then as Stick said will cost you dearly as you use it.


went looking for it...
got a link I can use???


----------



## Nickp (Dec 4, 2012)

houston.craigslist.org/for/5459216303.html

It's a CNC machine...


----------



## Scottart (Jan 8, 2015)

3 Phase power is generally only used on the VFD and motor. So all the controls are probably 120 volt already, you can tell by looking at the control drawings. good electricians could help with this.. but they are tricky to find, especially control electricians ( different than a house wireman). I doubt that the X, Y and Z axis motors are 3 phase, but need to confirm that. 

All homes that have 120 volt, also have 240 volt single phase in the panel. in that case you would have a 240 plug installed and convert the drive and motor / Spindle to single phase 240. 

Stick is right about the 3 phase HP starting at about 5 HP. In Electrical power chat, HP is an equivalent to Watts when it comes time for billing. 5 hp for at 480 volt 3 phase will pull the same watts as 5 Hp at 240 volts. Just way different Amps.

So for the lower voltage double the amps, and the utility charges something called "demand charges". they will hit you for the largest Amps you system pulls. because they have to make sure your service is capable of carrying that. 

Tread carefully, this could get expensive. Curious what he wants for this, and wonder why you might need a large 3 Phase machine. A Lot depends on what you are going to do with it..


----------



## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

all that gets me is job opportunities...


----------



## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

found it...
that will cost a fortune to convert to 1Ø or run w/ a converter..


----------



## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

Stick all I did was copy and paste and then delete the DOT for a period and take out empty spaces.


----------



## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

Cherryville Chuck said:


> Stick all I did was copy and paste and then delete the DOT for a period and take out empty spaces.


CNC Router Table 4x8


----------



## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

Nickp said:


> houston.craigslist.org/for/5459216303.html
> 
> It's a *CNC* machine...


ahhhhhh...
new animal in the mix..
a bit different from what was envisioned...


----------



## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

@Weston Porter...

man.. sorry about that no welcome take off...
Sooooo...
Welcome Weston to the forums....
this a good place to be...


----------



## difalkner (Jan 3, 2012)

The VFD is probably 3 phase to the spindle and is probably 3 phase input, as well. But a new VFD with single phase input, still 3 phase output, can be installed with no other changes. Here's one on eBay for about $200 - 4 kw 5 HP VFD


----------



## weber (Oct 3, 2011)

I have a VFD running a 5..5 HP Perske spindle and it runs great. The cost for a brand new Delta VFD and set up by an electrical motor shop was $ 750.00. There are also VFD that can be purchased for about 1/2 that price. The VFD should be 50% larger than stated motor size if using single phase, so I have a 7.5 HP VFD for a 5.5 HP spindle.
I have 2 industrial routers and both use 110v /220v single phase for motors and controls. 1 unit is servo motors and 1 is servo drives.

Another thing I would say is that I run an entire machine shop with a rotary converter I built for $150.00 and it has run every day for the past 26 years.The unit runs 3 milling machines a lathe and a grinder all at the same time and my monthly electric bill is rarely over $100.00 a month.

Glenn


----------



## weber (Oct 3, 2011)

Made a mistake in my last post , it should read 1 unit is servo motors and 1 unit is stepper motors, one runs on 110v and the other runs 220v.

I think you would be very happy with a VFD.

Glenn


----------



## tooler2 (Aug 11, 2012)

I doubt you would even need to change the vfd, most of them run just fine on single phase even if marked as three phase input. FWIW an RPC draws very little power, it is not doing much ''work''.
Rob


----------



## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

difalkner said:


> The VFD is probably 3 phase to the spindle and is probably 3 phase input, as well. But a new VFD with single phase input, still 3 phase output, can be installed with no other changes. Here's one on eBay for about $200 - 4 kw 5 HP VFD


had one of those...
about 10$ an hour to operate in old money... (circa '84)..
around 23$ an hour in today's money
it was cheaper in the long run to change motors and rework the controls...
reworking the controls was physical rewiring and new OL relays..
the motor was around 3 - 5 bills per tool...
today... 30% more...


----------



## fixtureman (Jul 5, 2012)

There are many people running a VFD or phase convertor and they are not that much to run. We had a roto phase way back in the 60s and it ran 24/7 and didn't take all that much electric to run it


----------



## edison auto (Nov 13, 2015)

Our air compressor and tire balancer are 3 phase and have been running for the last 25 years. Balancer is 3 years old. They are cheaper to run that way and they start up easier
Mark


----------



## bgriggs (Nov 26, 2008)

A VFD will get that one up and running fast.


----------

