# Looking for a Jointer



## Ed3443 (Jul 7, 2013)

I am now looking for a jointer. Paypal credit has a great deal ending on November 24th--0% interest for 24 months. So I have been looking for a jointer for a long time. I want an 8" Parallelogram Jointer. I do not have the money or the space for a 12". I also really have no need for the additional size. 

The jointers I am looking at are.

Powermatic PJ882 JOINTER, 2HP $2,599.99 (without wheel base, Knives, 83")
PJ882, 8" Parallelogram Jointer 2HP,1Ph

Grizzly G0495X 3HP $2730 (without wheel base, Helical head, 83")
https://www.grizzly.com/products/Gr...-with-Exclusive-Digital-Height-Readout/G0495X

Grizzly G0858 - 8" x 76" Parallelogram Jointer with Helical Cutterhead & Mobile Base 3HP $1960 https://www.grizzly.com/products/Gr...ter-with-Helical-Cutterhead-Mobile-Base/G0858

Grizzly G0857 - 8" x 76" Parallelogram Jointer with Mobile Base 3HP $1530 (knives)
https://www.grizzly.com/products/Grizzly-8-x-76-Parallelogram-Jointer-with-Mobile-Base/G0857

Grizzly G0490X - 8" x 76" Jointer with Parallelogram Beds and Spiral Cutterhead $1690 3HP (This model is made in China the other models are made in Taiwan. I was told the other models have slightly better build quality.
https://www.grizzly.com/products/Gr...rallelogram-Beds-and-Spiral-Cutterhead/G0490X

Laguna Tools, 8″ Parallelogram Jointer (MJOIN8020) $3250 3HP ShearTec II blades 83"
https://lagunatools.com/classic-machinery/jointers/jointer-8-inch-parallelogram/

The jointers with knives I would eventually replace with a Byrd cutting head. Prices per month vary from $64 to $136. Money is tight but I want to buy something I will not want to replace in 5 years. The reviews on the Grizzly's seem very good. They are much cheaper than the PM or Laguna. There is a huge weight difference in the Grizzly machines--cheapest is at 365lbs and the most expensive is 796lbs. 

Thoughts about these Jointers or others that I have missed. I have not had a great experience with Jet so I have not looked at them. Are there things I should be looking for that I am missing. My bias right now is the Grizzly's. G0858, G0857 or the G0495X (do not know if it is worth the price difference). Thanks for any and all guidance.


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## gdonham1 (Oct 31, 2011)

I have Delta 6" jointer that I have had for a few years. I also have a Dewalt 735 planner. Recently I saw an ad on craigslist.org for a SCM 300 combination machine. The machine did not have the fences for the saw or the jointer/planner. That got me to thinking about replacing my jointer and planner with a combination machine. The combination machines have from 10" to 16" planner and jointer beds. I am really thinking about upgrading. The upgrade would let me get rid of two large machines and replace it with a single unit. Have you looked at any of the combination machines. Jet, Felder, Rikon and SCM have some great machines. There is also a Grizzly version of the combination machine. All of the machines have the helical/spiral carbide heads.


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## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

Fine Woodworking did a jointer test in the last year and the Grizz came out as best value if I remember right. The test was on all spiral heads I think too. I've had an 8" for over 20 years and I would have been unhappy with a 6" I think but very rarely have I ever had need for one that's wider. A longer bed would be nice though. Mine is 72". Go longer if you can afford it.
The parallelogram type is harder to adjust very finely but I don't see that as a big problem unless you do a lot of rabbeting with it. Then you need the fine adjustment. Otherwise you are just trying to flatten edges or faces and precision isn't critical regarding depth of cut.


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## mgmine (Jan 16, 2012)

There is a reason Grizzly is cheaper and you will find out why when you go to sell it or service it. Go with a brand name. Either the Powermatic which would be my choice or the Laguna. Both have sales and you can usually get 10 to 15% off.


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## Ed3443 (Jul 7, 2013)

mgmine said:


> There is a reason Grizzly is cheaper and you will find out why when you go to sell it or service it. Go with a brand name. Either the Powermatic which would be my choice or the Laguna. Both have sales and you can usually get 10 to 15% off.


Thanks Art. Can you tell me more about resale and service issues with Grizzly. I am seeing where I live that they are keeping value--part of the reason I am looking for new. In a perfect world I would love to have the PM but it is so expensive for what you get. The same is sorta true with Laguna. It seems like so much money for a machine that just makes boards flat. Thanks again.


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## Ed3443 (Jul 7, 2013)

Cherryville Chuck said:


> Fine Woodworking did a jointer test in the last year and the Grizz came out as best value if I remember right. The test was on all spiral heads I think too. I've had an 8" for over 20 years and I would have been unhappy with a 6" I think but very rarely have I ever had need for one that's wider. A longer bed would be nice though. Mine is 72". Go longer if you can afford it.
> The parallelogram type is harder to adjust very finely but I don't see that as a big problem unless you do a lot of rabbeting with it. Then you need the fine adjustment. Otherwise you are just trying to flatten edges or faces and precision isn't critical regarding depth of cut.


Thanks Chuck. I saw that review which gave me more faith in Grizzly. This will be my first Jointer. I thought the parallelogram was easier to adjust. I thought the parallelogram made it easier to have the tables in coplanar. I also thought the big advantage is that this system keeps the distance from the cutting head tight. Are parallelogram difficult to adjust depth of cut? Or are they generally hard to adjust? Thanks for your advice.


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## jemangin (Oct 23, 2013)

Here is the FWW jointer test from Jan 2019. They mentioned that if buying new, helical is a must. Grizzly is a great brand. I have their 14" bandsaw. Heavy machine and well made. I avoid brand loyalties and trust reviews and testing by good sources. I have noticed on the used market that the resell price for jointers with blades are sinking fast. I missed my window to sell my General 6" jointer and upgrade to an 8" helical.


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## CAD-Man (Apr 28, 2013)

I have a 6 inch Grizzly joiner and have been very happy with it. I also own the anniversary version of their 14 inch band saw and also very happy with that a well, 

The only thing about Grizzly tools I have found out is that the Polar Version of an identical Grizzly model. The Polar is of lesser quality. When I bought my joiner, I first bought the Polar Version and was very dissatisfied with the quality control of the machine. I sent it back and purchased the identical Grizzly and a huge difference in the quality of the machine.

CAD-Man


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## timbrframr (Nov 2, 2019)

Consider looking for something used. Jointers are simple machines that are easy to assess before buying and you can get higher quality for the same price used. I have a 16 and an 8" jointer and the 8 gets the most use. Look at the heads and see if they're true helical head or just a segmented cutter.


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## BattleRidge (Dec 19, 2017)

I have the Grizzly G0490 Jointer and like it really well. It has been a good performer, has plenty of power, is easy to use, dust collection is good and I have no complaints. I bought it used (Facebook Marketplace) last year for $650. My intent is to add the helical head at some point in time but at the present the standard cutter is working fine (though could use sharpened - which can be done economically locally). My plan is to replace my Dewalt DW735X cutterhead with a helix first when the cutters are eventually worn and then the jointer head.

I can also recommend considering the used option and there can be money to be saved by doing so - allowing the addition of other woodworking gear with the money saved. The caveat is to check the machine over well, though my experience thus far has been more than satisfactory. Another plus to buying used is that you can also eventually sell it at the same or near the price you paid with the original purchaser taking the biggest cost difference when they bought the equipment new.

I can also recommend Grizzly and have quickly become a fan - more than satisfied in every way with their equipment. My first major piece of quality woodworking equipment was the Laguna 18BX bandsaw (purchased new and I really love it) followed by a new Dewalt Planer but since then, I have been fortunate to find great buys on used Grizzly equipment in great condition which has allowed me to fill my shop in a much swifter timeframe than I would have been able to do otherwise. My first was a "new" Grizzly G0548Z Dust Collector ($200) that the seller purchased new but never placed into service due to buying a larger unit at an auction shortly thereafter (he sold it when he eventually needed the space in his shop but wasn't able to find some of the unassembled parts which I obtained from Grizzly for $40 delivered). I then bought the Jointer, then a Grizzly G0123 Table Saw ($650) and most recently a Grizzly G7944 Drill Press ($250). 

My recommendation on purchasing used equipment is to search frequently, have a wide search radius (distance) and move on it as soon as you find something you want - particularly if it is at a reasonable price. The best buys don't last long and I learned quickly that they can disappear swiftly. I had each of my Grizzly machines sitting in my shop the same day that it was listed online, and after calling the seller would often research the machine while my wife was driving to the seller's location (ranging from 15 - 100 miles away). Give the machine a thorough look and run some boards through (with the dust collector, it had never been run so we had to wire it up) and if all checks out, buy, load and go. 

To put things into another perspective, I saved over $2,500 on the Grizzly equipment I bought used (when shipping is factored in) and I haven't had any issues. To be honest, I never realized I saved that much until I just now compared my machines to the cost of new.


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## mgmine (Jan 16, 2012)

Ed3443 said:


> Thanks Art. Can you tell me more about resale and service issues with Grizzly. I am seeing where I live that they are keeping value--part of the reason I am looking for new. In a perfect world I would love to have the PM but it is so expensive for what you get. The same is sorta true with Laguna. It seems like so much money for a machine that just makes boards flat. Thanks again.


Grizzly is Harbor Freight with lipstick. They are not quality tools and they do not specialize in anything. One look at their catalog will confirm this. Grizzly has been discussed many times. Those that have the tools will tell you how great they are. After all, they sort of do what you expect them to do. But then again so do Harbor Freight tools. Compare them to a car. Close the door on a Mercedes then close a door on a Hyundai. Even a blind person could teel the difference. I am always buying and selling my tools. And over the years I have learned that brand name tools keep their value. Even the old Craftsman tools keep their value. Try an experiment and run two ads on Craigslist. One for a Powermatic 66 table saw and one for a Grizzly table saw Price them both at about half price and see which gets more action. I say table saw because there are more people looking for those and you will get a better idea of the response rate. You will never regret buying quality. As for customer service. I have only had one experience and it was bad but I have read reviews and they have not been good. To their credit, it's usually people that have had bad experiences that write about them. As far as being a good value what does that mean? A Hyundai will get you as far as a Mercedes for half the cost so does that make it a good value? I guess it does but during the time you own it does it feel as comfortable to drive. One other thing are parts. Where do you buy Grizzly parts? Can you buy them from different parts stores online or do you have to get them directly from Grizzly? I have no idea but that's important.


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## BattleRidge (Dec 19, 2017)

mgmine said:


> Grizzly is Harbor Freight with lipstick.
> 
> One other thing are parts. Where do you buy Grizzly parts? Can you buy them from different parts stores online or do you have to get them directly from Grizzly? I have no idea but that's important.



Grizzly is Harbor Freight with lipstick...? My experience has been much the opposite and I have found Grizzly to produce a well made and dependable machine. I have been to Harbor Freight and while there may be some items that I would consider purchasing there, powered equipment is not one of them unless it was for a one time or very limited use (nothing against Harbor Freight fans and HF has a large selection). The Grizzly equipment in my shop have proven to be trouble free and each performs as well as my Laguna 18BX Bandsaw which I purchased new. All of my Grizzly gear was purchased used and likewise most have wracked up use over time, but since I have obtained them, they have performed as well as they likely did the day they were made - quite well.

In regard to parts... I purchased my Grizzly Dust Collector (my first Grizzly product) from someone that had purchased the DC new, then bought a larger unit at an auction at a great price for use in his business and never placed the Grizzly into service. It sat in the corner of his home shop unassembled for several years until he needed the space for something else. Over this time he lost track of several of the pieces that went with it and while he was searching for the missing items, I went to Grizzly's website and easily found each of the pieces in stock and available, each at a reasonable price (online ordering was easy and shipping was quite quick). I have also checked Grizzly for parts availability for my other equipment which appears to have ready availability, though I have had no need to purchase anything as of yet. As a note, the DC seller had some Grizzly machines in his personal home shop as well as several others (larger and much more expensive) at his gunsmithing and metalworking business and he was quite pleased with each, as well as with any dealings he has had with Grizzly - a well satisfied Grizzly customer.

The Jointer was my second Grizzly purchase and the only reason it was being sold was that the seller was moving out of state to live near his relocated children. He was taking some of his equipment during the move, but in downsizing didn't have a future need for everything. He had ran a side cabinet / woodworking business in his garage and had a full shop of Grizzly equipment and was glowing in his satisfaction with their quality and the company. My Grizzly Table Saw and Drill Press came from sellers that were older and downsizing and had no future needs for the equipment, though each were happy to show the equipment in use and share of their experiences with the machines, each satisfactory.

I find that the statement of Grizzly being "not quality tools" to be quite misleading and frankly, with my personal experience, personal contact with other Grizzly owners and through extensive research, I take it with a grain of salt. I have seen negativity with all manufacturers at various points in time and haven't found Grizzly to be in inferior product in any way, particularly when compared with other mid-level manufacturers (Jet, Powermatic, Laguna, Rikon, etc.) for everyday folk (including professional and semi-professional) woodworkers or others. There may be some upper-level manufacturers of quite pricey gear to be an exception, but am sure they have their issues too. I have also seen a variety of folks seeking advice on unavailable parts from a variety of companies and I don't think any manufacturer stocks everything into perpetuity. In addition and with a little research, you can find that a multitude of companies are interlinked with each other so to imply that by Grizzly not specializing in anything would seem to ignore the diversity of so very many of the other manufacturers that supply woodworking equipment - most of which obtain their parts from many places throughout the world as well as have manufacturing / assembly scattered in various locations.

The bottom line is that I wouldn't hesitate to buy and do not hesitate recommending Grizzly products and personally feel that when it comes down to Grizzly, Jet, Laguna, Powermatic and Rikon that for me it often comes down to the individual machine, the features, design, size, and build, and that the overall quality is on similar par with each other - and recognizing that each mfg has an occasional machine produced that falls below their individual standards. Each buyer needs to make their own personal choice and there are many considerations and I have been quite satisfied with mine.


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## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

Art; you mentioned Mercedes parts. Here in Canada imported, high end German auto parts will break the bank, should you need to buy them. Just sayin'...


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## MikeMa (Jul 27, 2006)

To play devils advocate, some Hyundai's actually have better fuel mileage than a Mercedes. Sure the Mercedes has a lot more bells and whistles, but the Hyundai will get me just as far, if not further. True a Mercedes may go longer with less maintenance, but at the same time when that maintenance is due, it is often far more expensive than that of the Hyundai. Note, I own a Kia Sorento (a Hyundai subsidiary), and have ridden in my brother-in-laws Mercedes. My Kia has a few bells and whistles, such as my heated seats, and making a 8-12 hour drive in it is quite comfortable. Yes, the Mercedes has some additional comfort items (like massaging seats), but you really pay for those features, when the end result of both vehicles is exactly the same.

I own several Grizzly machines, and I also own a couple Harbor Freight machines. Both the Q/C and fit and finish of Grizzly is definitely ahead of that of Harbor Freight. As for getting parts outside of grizzly, it depends on the machine, just as with any manufacturer. My bandsaw I can easily find third-party parts that will work very well with it. I believe a lot of their motors use standard mounts. In fact I have gone to grizzly to buy parts for my non-grizzly table saw, as they had precisely what I needed, and a better build. My Craftsman 113.xxx table saw needed a new pulley on the arbor. Grizzly had an upgraded version of the pulley as it was cast iron vs. the old stamped steal one.

With my jointer, I had what turned out to be a minor issue with a motor when I first got it. Their customer service was excellent, and they sent me a replacement motor without issue.

Now, my Kia Sorento is on the higher end of Kia's offerings, VS the Kia Soul which is more in line of their economy vehicles. (Had one of those too, ex-wife took that one in the divorce. I await said jokes on that.) To say Grizzly is the same as Harbor Freight would be saying the same as the Sorento is the same as the Soul. From a Mercedes perspective, that may seem true, but when looking at more closely, Grizzly definitely has the advantage over Harbor Freight.

That said, to the OP, I think all the options you are looking at will deliver what you need. Determine what best fits your budget and needs, and get the machine that best fits those.


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## CAD-Man (Apr 28, 2013)

Powermatic, etc. and damn, Grizzly

?????????? - Strategic Partenrship

CAD-Man


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## Ed3443 (Jul 7, 2013)

CAD-Man said:


> Powermatic, etc. and damn, Grizzly
> 
> ?????????? - Strategic Partenrship
> 
> CAD-Man


Wow!!! That is quite interesting. And very sad--we don't make anything here any more do we.


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## Straightlines (May 15, 2013)

Laguna are now made in China, unless one buys a tool (bandsaw) specifically made in Italy.


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## Larry42 (Aug 11, 2014)

Isn't the Powermatic just another re-branded Chinese machine? 10 +- years ago I bought a Grizzly edge sander after looking at them in IWF show. It was obvious they were made by the same manufacturer. The PM was $1000 more! As for quality neither is going to be great but most likely good enough. Look at them to see how they can be adjusted so both beds are parallel. Most heads that are advertised as helical are actually simply stager. See if you can find a used SCM or similar. Much better machines. Top of the line is Martin.


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## CAD-Man (Apr 28, 2013)

Ed3443 said:


> Wow!!! That is quite interesting. And very sad--we don't make anything here any more do we.


The reason for my post was to show that the Powermatic fanboys need to research before posting. What happened was in 2017 Powermatic and JET (JPW) was purchased by a private equity firm. The way these private equity firms make money is to ship every thing overseas.

Powermatic was originally a family owned company that got beaten up by larger companies and just couldn't survive. I'm not saying older Powermatic tools are not good but just about everything in the power tool industry today is made overseas. As an example the bench top Spindle Sander that I own is a Powermatic and is identical to a WEN, Grizzly and Sears and all made China, The only difference is color and label colors and position.

CAD-Man


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## timbrframr (Nov 2, 2019)

It is too bad that nothing is made over here anymore, but I guess when people had the option of buying one or the other, they were just buying the cheaper overseas stuff and the end was only a matter of time....


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## DesertRatTom (Jul 3, 2012)

Made overseas is just the way it is today. I have two laguna saws, table and band, and both are excellent tools and clearly worth the premium. I have a 10 year old Powermatic 6 inch jointer that is a rock. No regrets on any premium purchase I've made. Same goes for my Bosch 1617s, colt and sliding miter. Of course, I had a much higher income than I do now. Only one regret, a common one, that I didn't get the 8 inch model. Oh well, too soon old, too late smart.


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## Roger Leclercq (Jan 28, 2009)

You are right a few years ago wife bought a Electrolux vacuum from Costco It was a POS It turns out that Eureka bought the right to the name. The same goes for Fuller Brush and Craftsman, Sears sold Craftsman to Stanley now all their power tools are actually Stanley Dewalt they also own Porta Cable,Delta they bought Oldam maker of Viper Router Bits and shut them down 90% of the tools are now made over seas and junk compared to the old stuff.


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## topielski (Oct 30, 2019)

I'm just starting out in woodworking and am in the market for a jointer. I read this forum, thanks for teh great info guys and the back and forth- it's great to hear informed opinions. but for entry level like me buying my first jointer, I started looking at desktop models and, before you laugh, the Ridgid 6" and Cutech 8" desktop models are getting excellent reviews on Amazon. Since Ridgid JP0610 uses straight knives I am leaning towards the cutech 40180HCB-CT with spiral cutters. For these prices ($600 and $500) I am seriously considering starting with it. There is a good Wood magazine review available [sorry can't post URL]. 
For that matter, the Cutech planer also rates excellent, and Cutech seems to have decent customer support from what I can see.


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## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

Hi Bogdan and welcome. What's adequate for you is always dependent on what you need it to do for you. With jointers its how wide and how long that dictate the answer. I think in a discussion a few years ago we came up with a rough rule that you are limited to about double the length of your infeed for how long a piece is practical and still expect good results with a jointer so if the Cutech does that then it should probably serve you well.

Keep in mind too that with woodworking machines that old heavy iron is in most cases still serviceable too. Don't discount those. If I could find an old industrial drill press for a reasonable price I'd replace my Delta 16.5" in a heartbeat.


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## Ed3443 (Jul 7, 2013)

I want to thank everyone for their input and advice. I decided to pull the trigger tonight on the Grizzly G0495X. The Fine Woodworking tool review (thanks Jamie) and the information provide by Cad-Man (thanks Bruce) makes me have a lot of faith in Grizzly. I was going to buy the $1295 jointer--but I really wanted the helical cutter and I figured if I was going to spend $1725 I might as well get what I really wanted. I figure this will be the last jointer I will buy and one of my kids will get it. Once I receive it, I will write up a review. I just want to say thank you for everyone who helped me make this decision. You guys are great!


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## timbrframr (Nov 2, 2019)

Congrats! You'll love it. If you ever want longer beds, I made a set of extension tables from shop scraps in a couple of hours that work extremely well. Aigner also sells extensions that are great.

B


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## mgmine (Jan 16, 2012)

They say that the two happiest days in a boat owner's life are the day they buy the boat and the day they sell it. I can't say that about my jointer but I can say that it was one of the least used tools in the shop. I use only wood from a sawmill (well most of the time which means that it's rough and needs to be machined. I have found that I can get a straight edge, good enough for gluing straight off the table saw. If I'm working with aboard that has a bow in it I simple rip it down and glue it back together. If the wood is too wide it will warp so ripping and regluing it is the best way to go. I also run the boards through the planer on their edges if I don't smooth them out with the table saw. I sold my jointer after 5 years for just about what I paid for it and have never regretted it.


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## DesertRatTom (Jul 3, 2012)

Ed, don't forget to take a picture of it in your shop so the rest of us can drool.


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