# table insert plate size?



## awoodnut (May 2, 2009)

I have been playing with my new bits and running into a problem with the size of the hole in the Rossuea insert plate for support of the work piece.

I see that with the smaller bits in the smallest insert ring I can use the brass inserts. My problem comes when I go to the bits that don't quite fit in that small hole. 

I take the small grey ring out and leave the outer red ring in and the hole is huge around the bit. How do I get support for my work piece?

I see some phenolic insert rings that look like they may be designed for this but they are fairly pricy at $32.99 for 4 of them at Woodcraft.

Is there a better and/or cheaper solution?

Thanks
Mike


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## jschaben (Jun 21, 2009)

I made my own custom rings from 1/8" plexi. It cuts pretty good with a circle cutter and drill press on LOW speed. The ID, in my opinion wasn't terrible critical but I wanted them to snap in tightly so to me the OD was. I made a template out of 3/4 stock using a flush trim bit and guide pin on the router table, using one of the inserts that came with the plate as a template. That gave me a loose fit template which I wrapped a couple of winds of masking tape with until I had a snug fit. 
Then I cut the plexi with a circle cutter slightly larger than the plate opening and used a top bearing pattern following bit to get it to size. 
I used #6 screws to hold the plexi on all machining operations so I wound up with three small holes in the inserts but I use a countersink to champfer the edges of them so they can't catch anything anyway.
You can use any thickness you like, preferably as close to the originals as possible. I made some for my old shaper out of 3/8" Lexan and that wasn't pretty but it worked.


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi Mike


You may want to check out the links below

Router Forums - View Single Post - Commercial source for offset rings?

http://www.routerforums.com/project-plans-how/10818-bogydave.html

1-3/4" Router Plate Inserts - Lee Valley Tools

1-3/4" Brass Template Guides - Lee Valley Tools

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awoodnut said:


> I have been playing with my new bits and running into a problem with the size of the hole in the Rossuea insert plate for support of the work piece.
> 
> I see that with the smaller bits in the smallest insert ring I can use the brass inserts. My problem comes when I go to the bits that don't quite fit in that small hole.
> 
> ...


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## awoodnut (May 2, 2009)

*Inner vs outer ring*

Thanks for the info John and Jigs.

The plexi rings may be the best solution I was hoping for something like the brass inserts in a bigger version I guess. I will have to look and see what thickness the plate would need to be. How did you do the recess at the back that the ring sits on? The Rosseau is about 2 7/8 OD and the recess is about half the thickness and down to 2 5/8 OD.

Jigs: I saw the inserts for the smaller bits and the smallest opening. The problem I have is the bits that are to big for that opening and I need to remove the inner ting and fill the hole in the second or outer ring up to the bit. 

Jigs do you find any difference between the lee valley and the harbor brass inserts? HF is about half the price.


Thanks
Mike


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## jschaben (Jun 21, 2009)

awoodnut said:


> Thanks for the info John and Jigs.
> 
> The plexi rings may be the best solution I was hoping for something like the brass inserts in a bigger version I guess. I will have to look and see what thickness the plate would need to be. How did you do the recess at the back that the ring sits on? The Rosseau is about 2 7/8 OD and the recess is about half the thickness and down to 2 5/8 OD.
> 
> ...


If I read you right you need about a 1/16" x 1/2 original thickness rabbett around the insert, is that right?? 
Well, I didn't have to do that, ..... but, I think I would be tempted to use a half inch flush cutter with a 3/8" bearing and flip your template upside down on the table with the insert still attached and do it the same way as you got the final size. Downside is you can't see the bit which always makes me antsy. That, and make sure any screws you used to attach the template and insert together with will clear. Double face tape would eliminate that problem but I'm not a big fan of double face tape. 
Another solution may be just to champfer the bottom until it is flush but that will likely give you a loose fit. 
Good Luck


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## awoodnut (May 2, 2009)

*rabbett*

Thanks John

I think that would work. I looked at it agean and I could use 1/8 plexy and it would fit in with just a little beveling on the back side or I could rabbet the 1/4 plexy.

I will give that a try if I can't find a better solution. I was just looking at the woodpecker brand aluminum ring set fot there table. Realy sweet, course it comes with a steep tag on it also.

Mike


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## levon (Sep 14, 2008)

hi mike
you can buy extra rings for 10 bucks and drill them out. i drilled it out to accept 1 1/2 in guides, but you can drill them to any size you want! you can purchase forstner bits at peachtree very reasonably.
ill try and post a pic.










p.s. i used the method BobJ shows in his post here.


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

HI Mike

I have done it many ways the best way is to get some more snap-in inserts and drill them out to the sizes you want to have on hand, once you have selected the mounting plate it's best to stick with the snap in rings for it..

HF has a good price on them but they don't sale the bigger ones ( 1 1/2" ID) and sometimes it just takes little bit more room to get the bit to spin free..


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awoodnut said:


> Thanks for the info John and Jigs.
> 
> The plexi rings may be the best solution I was hoping for something like the brass inserts in a bigger version I guess. I will have to look and see what thickness the plate would need to be. How did you do the recess at the back that the ring sits on? The Rosseau is about 2 7/8 OD and the recess is about half the thickness and down to 2 5/8 OD.
> 
> ...


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## levon (Sep 14, 2008)

sorry BobJ, i didnt mean to but in, just thought since he had a rousseau plate it might make it easy to understand.


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hey levon

No big deal ,,,I'm not a big fan of the rousseau plate and it's always best to get the view from some one that has one 

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levon said:


> sorry BobJ, i didnt mean to but in, just thought since he had a rousseau plate it might make it easy to understand.


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## levon (Sep 14, 2008)

well to be honest BobJ, i bought my plate several years ago when i knew very little about a router table. if i were going to buy one now, id probably get one from hf. 

but by using your instructions, it was pretty easy to drill out my 2nd set of snap-in rings. many thanks to you for the help!


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## awoodnut (May 2, 2009)

*rings*

thanks guys

I have my answer now. I will probably look at ordering more rings and drill them out. Don't know that I am ready to spend the $ on Forstner bits but a buddy has some he will let me use.

Will it dull the bits to drill that plastic with them? Don't want to mess somebody elses tools.

Bob why don't you like the Rousseau plate. It looks like yours dosn't have the snap in rings, is that better for you and why?

Have a great weekend. I am making little knick knack boxs for the kids. Great practice and they like to help.

Mike


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## Mike Wingate (Apr 26, 2009)

When I bought my Jessem Raiser, I also bought at great expense the pack of 4 insert reducers. They lock into the plate and use a 2 pin wrench to put them in and take them out. I am not having anything come loose w.hen I route


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi Mike

I have many ,many router tables with all types of plates,some I have made and some I buy out right,,The ones you can buy for 20.oo is a deal and most of them are flat from the get,that's to say not a high spot in the center..

I know I will get flack from Mike on the Rousseau plate  but the one from HF is a copy of it but it's flat from the get go..with the snap in rings also...

The Forstner bits will drill the plastic like cutter butter and will not wipe them out..

Just a note about the inserts without the snap in rings they will not pop out or lift out easy if they are made right (press in fit) it's easy job to get them to fit right, the ones you buy are a Stamped Out Type and they make them by the 10000 they don't take the time to make sure the fit just right so they put a tap on them to over come that..

I have CMT tables with a ALUM. inserts and they don't have any taps just a press in fit type and I have never had one pop out.. they are the best ones I have on any router table..

=
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awoodnut said:


> thanks guys
> 
> I have my answer now. I will probably look at ordering more rings and drill them out. Don't know that I am ready to spend the $ on Forstner bits but a buddy has some he will let me use.
> 
> ...


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## levon (Sep 14, 2008)

hi Mike, i used only 2 forstner bits and they cost me 8 dollars each from peachtree. i had a small set, but had none that large. at 8 dollars each i didnt think that was bad to drill out my rings plus ive used them many times since.


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## Rutabagared (Jun 18, 2009)

bobj3 said:


> HI Mike
> 
> I have done it many ways the best way is to get some more snap-in inserts and drill them out to the sizes you want to have on hand, once you have selected the mounting plate it's best to stick with the snap in rings for it..
> 
> ...


Hi bobj3,
How do you retain your sacrificial inserts between your subfences? Mating bevels, rabbets? I couldn't quite make it out from your photos. Thanks.

Joe


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi Mike

It's hard to see it but it's a ring lip that's glue to the mounting plate just under the opening ,,the hole is 3 3/4" hole the ring lip is 3 1/4" to 3 1/2" ID just a little lip to support it..

The picture down below may show it littler bit better 

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Rutabagared said:


> Hi bobj3,
> How do you retain your sacrificial inserts between your subfences? Mating bevels, rabbets? I couldn't quite make it out from your photos. Thanks.
> 
> Joe


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## jschaben (Jun 21, 2009)

Just a pic of how I made my inserts. The square block is how I held the insert while I used the circle cutter to cut the center hole. The "bushing" in the center is actually a 1/8" pipe coupling to connect 2 female 1/8" NPT couplings. ID happens to be 1/4" and OD 3/8. Drilled 5/16 hole, took a couple of swipes with a hacksaw to get a screwdriver slot and just threaded it in. I removed the pilot bit from the circle cutter and put a cut-off 1/4" bolt in it instead. 
Blue tape on the round block (hard to see in this pic, only around the bottom 1/4" or so of the template) was to fine tune the diameter of the insert with a bottom bearing flush cut bit in the table.
Worked out fine for me, fit tighter than the originals.:yes4:


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