# Shaper Used as a Router table



## coxhaus (Jul 18, 2011)

I am on the fence and don't own a router table. Been checking on CL for awhile.

I was over at a friends house that does wood working for a living. He uses a small Jet(I think) shaper table he bought used. He only uses router bits in it. I need to confirm the model but I was looking and it looks like the small shapers only run $1000 at retail. Just looking, it looks like a better motor setup and lift. They are designed that way and they are cast iron tables. It seems like most people end up buying a dedicated router motor anyway. If I am going to spend that much money any reason not to buy one of these? I know this is router forums, we could call it a router table with motor and lift built in. I have a router just not a table. Woodcraft is going to have a sale on Jet equipment coming up.


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

coxhaus said:


> I am on the fence and don't own a router table. Been checking on CL for awhile.
> 
> I was over at a friends house that does wood working for a living. He uses a small Jet(I think) shaper table he bought used. He only uses router bits in it. I need to confirm the model but I was looking and it looks like the small shapers only run $1000 at retail. Just looking, it looks like a better motor setup and lift. They are designed that way and they are cast iron tables. It seems like most people end up buying a dedicated router motor anyway. If I am going to spend that much money any reason not to buy one of these? I know this is router forums, we could call it a router table with motor and lift built in. I have a router just not a table. Woodcraft is going to have a sale on Jet equipment coming up.


used a shaper that way for decades before I went w/ a RT for the satellite shop...
the cutters you can get for a shaper will broaden your horizons immensely..
strongly suggest 3HP or better or you will regret it ....
5HP is a ''where have you been all my life''....


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## Al B Thayer (Jun 2, 2014)

I used to have a shaper that would also except router bits. But the shaper RPMs are too slow for the smaller size bits and the collet wouldn't except larger router bits. Kind of a catch 22. Never used it for router bits again. 

If you don't have either a shaper or router table. I suggest building a router table and building a lift for it. You will get so much more use from it.

al


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## coxhaus (Jul 18, 2011)

Stick486 said:


> used a shaper that way for decades before I went w/ a RT for the satellite shop...
> the cutters you can get for a shaper will broaden your horizons immensely..
> strongly suggest 3HP or better or you will regret it ....
> 5HP is a ''where have you been all my life''....


I don't know anything shapers but the bigger hp ones are like 1 or 1 1/4 spindle. Router bits are only 1/2 inch. Since the smaller shapers have smaller spindles I thought it would be a better match. I sure would hate to break a 1/2 inch bit.

I will check on speeds. It seems like the router guys want to slow down their bits so what is a good bit speed under load? I don't think the shaper motors will slow down as much as a router.


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

coxhaus said:


> I don't know anything shapers but the bigger hp ones are like 1 or 1 1/4 spindle. Router bits are only 1/2 inch. Since the smaller shapers have smaller spindles I thought it would be a better match. I sure would hate to break a 1/2 inch bit.
> 
> I will check on speeds. It seems like the router guys want to slow down their bits so what is a good bit speed under load? I don't think the shaper motors will slow down as much as a router.


look to this information for your spindle sizes and speeds...
JET | Woodworking Shapers

the only bits that I have heard of getting broken were the el-cheapo import bits...
to use router bits in shapers all it takes is an adapter to fit the machine you have providing you get a machine that will accept them...
the attached PDF is an just an example... 
this link is for Jet....
Jet Tools Shaper Router Collet, Shaper Spindle, Collet Set & Accessories


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## schnewj (Nov 18, 2013)

Another issue that you may run into is that if you buy shaper bits you have to change the set up to convert to a collet that will accept a 1/2 router bit. 

I had someone give me an older grizzly shaper with a whole bunch of shaper bits. The motor didn't run and all I had to do was replace a Start/Run capacitor for $6.60. However, you literally have to tear the spindle apart to do the swap...not convenient. It takes a 1/2" collet but the assembly it did not come with the equipment.

Other shapers may be different and easy to convert...I defer to more experienced members on that subject. 

If I was milling a lot of stock a shaper would be the ticket, but it may be tedious to set up for a quick job. Here the router table would be my choice.


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## coxhaus (Jul 18, 2011)

Looking at the Jet shaper specs only the little one will run 110V even though it is rated 1HP it seems to pull the same amps as the 2 and 3 HP rated routers. So do you think they would have the same power? The shaper will reverse is that a benefit? RPM seems to be 9000rpm. I don't know if that would be to slow?

So would the JET shaper much slower to setup than a router in a table? Sounds like the Grizzly is out due to slow setup. Is this a one time setup if you don't run shaper bits?

I have a bunch of 1/2 inch router bits which I am not sure what they do. I will ask some time in the future when I get a table. I kind of inherited these 20 or so bits. So I need something to use with these bits and I am not starting from scratch where I can only buy shaper bits.


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## jschaben (Jun 21, 2009)

When I first got into this I picked up a used craftsman "router/shaper" table. It would take either a 1/2" shaper arbor or 1/2" shank router bits.
Two things I noticed:
First, the rpms weren't high enough to get decent cuts with smaller router bits. 
Second, the fence wouldn't go back far enough to permit a non through cut with a router bit. Made sense because shaper cutters are designed to be held onto the arbor with a big nut on top. Bummer for doing rabbets or close in dado's though unless you run the stock through vertically.
I will have to throw in with Al about going with a router table and they can be had for far less than the $1000 mentioned.

https://www.grizzly.com/products/Router-Table-with-Stand/T10432

Good Luck


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

coxhaus said:


> Looking at the Jet shaper specs only the little one will run 110V even though it is rated 1HP it seems to pull the same amps as the 2 and 3 HP rated routers. So do you think they would have the same power? The shaper will reverse is that a benefit? RPM seems to be 9000rpm. I don't know if that would be to slow?
> 
> So would the JET shaper much slower to setup than a router in a table? Sounds like the Grizzly is out due to slow setup. Is this a one time setup if you don't run shaper bits?
> 
> I have a bunch of 1/2 inch router bits which I am not sure what they do. I will ask some time in the future when I get a table. I kind of inherited these 20 or so bits. So I need something to use with these bits and I am not starting from scratch where I can only buy shaper bits.


does your machine need/have to be 120V???...
how about this one???...
JWS-25CS, 3HP Shaper, 1Ph 230V Only, 1/2"&3/4" Spndls, 25"x25" Table
1HP of shaper in any function isn't much..... it will leave you wanting till it hurts...
a mid-sized router (ie Bosch 1617EVS) will out perform a 1HP shaper six ways to Sunday...

My shapers are Felder multi tilting spindle w/ bunches of HP...
Have you looked for used???...
SCMI makes substantial shapers...

comparing a router motor to the motor that is in a shaper is comparing apples and oranges...
the shaper will have the torque and a router will have the speed....
see the PDF's....

for set up...
shaper is slower... but not by much...
setting up the shaper to take bits is a one time deal....
setting the bit is a fuzz slower than a router but w/ a little practice it will become a moot point...

now let's consider a Router Table (RT)...
for this table I went w/ a JessEm Master Lift II and have never regretted it for a second... major pleased and it has exceeded expectations.. 
the base doubles as a total station....
Originally I went w/ a Porter Cable 7518 motor which I financially regret to the tune of migraine inducing numbers...
I believe the Milwaukee 5625 would be a better motor...
these together will give you a leg up over a shaper and will last you a life time and give you the edge if you need one......
http://www.routerforums.com/table-m...above-below-table-height-adjustment-more.html

this site lives and breathes router tables....
Table-mounted Routing - Router Forums

tell us about your bits...


.


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

@coxhaus...

this may interest you...
JessEm makes the Incra lifts...

http://www.routerforums.com/woodwor...t-ii-router-lift-3hp-pc-motor.html#post800297


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## DesertRatTom (Jul 3, 2012)

The deal breaker for me would be the limited speed of the shaper. Using smaller bits happens often, splines for example and that takes a higher rpm to work well.

I have 2 1617s, one used in a table for several years in a poorly designed lift. Still, it did a great job with both large and small bits. When I finally tossed the ding dong lift, I bought a Triton TRA001 with 3.25 hp motor. It has a built in lift (you remove a spring and voila. The triton is a treat to use.

I bought a Rockler table many years ago and am happy with it. But building your own is very doable. Lots of info on how to do it on the site, and Youtube has lots of videos that will walk you through the process. BTW, dust collection is a BIG deal, so you should have some sort of enclosure underneath and a dust collection port of some kind behind the fence, and plastic hardware for that can be fitted to a commercial or home made fence. I bought Rockler's metal enclosure with a magnetic door latch to go under the table. Dust port in the back, and quick and easy to reach under for setting the bit.

Last year I bought several sets of door making bits from Sommerfeld. The shanks and cutters are matched sets, so once you set the first one up, the others are an exact match. Put a small grommet in the collet so they don't bottom out. I don't own stock or anything, but switching to Sommerfeld bits has turned door making into a pleasure.


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## Garyk (Dec 29, 2011)

The two machines have similar but different purposes. One advantage of a shaper is you can have bits made for a particular profile you might need. You can "invent" your own profile. There is a machine (sort of like a key making machine) that can make the bits. I'm not aware of that existing for router bits. Stick might know. The downside is the slower speeds. IMHO I think the average woodworker would get more use out of a router w/lift & table. It all depends on your personal needs. You can take the router out of the table and use it freehand which multiplies the usefulness of the machine. Most small shops can make most anything they need with a router and multiple bits. A shaper finds more use in dedicated cabinet shop turning out hundreds of feet of stock with the same profiles or a large commercial shop that can afford the larger bits the machine needs. My *personal *opinion would be to go with the router set up.


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

the invent your own profile machine exist but can cost into six figures and having profiles made cost accordingly...
shaper for the commercial shop...
RT for the weekender to really serious woodworker...

FWIW....
splines are way easier free hand...
learn your free hand limits...
small bits = small routers.... think twice before putting them an RT... 
after the learning curve shaper speeds become moot except on but only a few occasions..
shapers = higher toque and beefier cuts... quite often one pass...
learn the limits of what you have and what you can do w/ it...

a 1 or 1.5HP shaper hanicaps you right out of the starting gate... VOE...


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## BIGROMO (Mar 16, 2015)

If you go the shaper route, Grizzly has their G1026 for around $1100. It's 3hp and a very solid machine that has been out many years and is highly popular. I have one and am very pleased with it. You can see reviews on it on amazon, but the grizzly site is cheaper to purchase it from. With smaller router bits, rpm's aren't high enough. A little more work than changing bits on a router table too and it takes up more room in the shop. I believe it also requires 220-but am not sure, you can see in the specs on Grizzly site.


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## coxhaus (Jul 18, 2011)

I really don't want to spend a $1000 for a router table or shaper. I would rather find something much cheaper, used is fine with me. I do own a PC7538 router with a separate speed controller and a Bosch 1617 set bought from Lowes when they had their sale. I would like to use the PC7538 router in a table if I go with a router table which I leaning to now. I was going to sale it if I bought a shaper.

Here are the bits I currently own.


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

use your PC router motor and build your own table...


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