# Router mill/lathe



## Ralph Barker (Dec 15, 2008)

There isn't a section for routurning, so I decided to post this here.

Have you made one of these yet, Bob?

ShopNotes Magazine - Router Milling Machine Video - Video Online Extra


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi Ralph


Nope,,, looks like one more jig from the Gear guy,, LOL, I use the router lathe  no need for all the gears, etc..

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Ralph Barker said:


> There isn't a section for routurning, so I decided to post this here.
> 
> Have you made one of these yet, Bob?
> 
> ShopNotes Magazine - Router Milling Machine Video - Video Online Extra


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## gav (Oct 12, 2009)

Bob, how is the speed ratio between stock turning and router travel changed on your router lathe ?


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## Cassandra (Mar 15, 2006)

Hi Gavin:

That's a question I was pondering myself. So, I had a look in the manual.

The linear distance traveled by the router per turn of the workpiece is fixed. So, the "threads per inch" of the flutes cut by the Trend Router Crafter is constant at 175 mm per turn (6.89 inches per turn.)

Also the number of evenly-spaced flutes is limited to 2, 3, 4, 6, 8, 12 and 24. So, if one want say 7 or 9 flutes, forget it with the Trend Router Crafter.

Cassandra


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## harrysin (Jan 15, 2007)

On all the router lathes that I've seen, all the same as the two that Bj has, the cable that rotates the workpiece which is fixed to the router traverse plate has a choice of three pulley diameters which decide the ratio between the linear movement of the router and the rotational speed of the workpiece. The headstock on the ones that I've seen have 36 indexing holes.


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## gav (Oct 12, 2009)

Ok, no gears, but pulleys. Got it.


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi gav

On the Craftsman, it has one speed and the Blue one has 3 speeds but both are setup the same so to say,,when you turn the crank the stock will spin and pull the router base plate with a cable and it's all done with the indexing head, they will do 1 to 36 indexing points, I will say the Craftsman is a bit lame, on that point..it will do 7 but you must do some math for that one, the indexing head can be locked at any point you want to use...or to say the head is locked at the number one and the stock is moved/turned to the mark on the stock..(Blue one only) Craftsman with the wooden indexing block in place will do 7,..odd numbers..

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gav said:


> Bob, how is the speed ratio between stock turning and router travel changed on your router lathe ?


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## TWheels (May 26, 2006)

Ralph Barker said:


> There isn't a section for routurning, so I decided to post this here.
> 
> Have you made one of these yet, Bob?
> 
> ShopNotes Magazine - Router Milling Machine Video - Video Online Extra



It appears that router lathes have disappeared from the market, so this thing may be the only alternative.

Is there somewhere instructions on how to build one of these things, specifically what gear ratios to use? The gears also look "home made"; are there directions on how to make them?

Thanks very much.


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi Tom 

You can find them on eBay all the time but you may want to check out the web site below I'm sure he has made one ..

Woodworking machinery


http://cgi.ebay.com/CRAFTSMAN-ROUTE...568260109?pt=Routers_Bits&hash=item35aef0720d
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mftha said:


> It appears that router lathes have disappeared from the market, so this thing may be the only alternative.
> 
> Is there somewhere instructions on how to build one of these things, specifically what gear ratios to use? The gears also look "home made"; are there directions on how to make them?
> 
> Thanks very much.


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## Ralph Barker (Dec 15, 2008)

mftha said:


> It appears that router lathes have disappeared from the market, so this thing may be the only alternative.
> 
> Is there somewhere instructions on how to build one of these things, specifically what gear ratios to use? The gears also look "home made"; are there directions on how to make them?
> 
> Thanks very much.


Tom, I'm also assuming the gears are shop-made, and that plans and instructions are available at ShopNotes, but I'm not a subscriber, so can't attest to that. I thought the design was interesting, since it follows the basic design concept of metal-working lathes and mills (with respect to the different gear ratios, etc.).

And, I thought for sure that Bob would have a jig for making the gears.


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Gears,no big deal, scroll/band saw/drill press  just takes a lot of time.

Gear template generator

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Ralph Barker said:


> Tom, I'm also assuming the gears are shop-made, and that plans and instructions are available at ShopNotes, but I'm not a subscriber, so can't attest to that. I thought the design was interesting, since it follows the basic design concept of metal-working lathes and mills (with respect to the different gear ratios, etc.).
> 
> And, I thought for sure that Bob would have a jig for making the gears.


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## TWheels (May 26, 2006)

Bob, Ralph, Thanks very much for your answers. At the moment all eBay has is Craftsman pieces parts and numerous CNC step motors.

In any case, especially after Cassandra's investigation I am convinced that the ShopNotes machine (or whatever it is) is more versatile than the Canwood, Trend or Craftsman router lathes. I have also seen enough to convince me that the quallity of Canwood and Trend is vastly greater than Craftsman. (Sorry A. J. Foyt, Craftsman is not a quality tool)


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi Tom

They are not a quality tool but it will do the job ,it's a tool that you will use just now and than but they do make one that is a very high end that sales for about 2,000.oo, I think Doug ( a member of the forum) has one of them..see search for router lathe.

Legacy ▼
http://www.routerforums.com/attachm...actacle-dust-control-part-timers-118_4805.jpg


The one for sale on eBay sold for 28.oo bucks someone got a great deal, it was a easy fix on that one..

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mftha said:


> Bob, Ralph, Thanks very much for your answers. At the moment all eBay has is Craftsman pieces parts and numerous CNC step motors.
> 
> In any case, especially after Cassandra's investigation I am convinced that the ShopNotes machine (or whatever it is) is more versatile than the Canwood, Trend or Craftsman router lathes. I have also seen enough to convince me that the quallity of Canwood and Trend is vastly greater than Craftsman. (Sorry A. J. Foyt, Craftsman is not a quality tool)


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## TWheels (May 26, 2006)

Hi Bob,

Thanks. You are right. There is no way I would ever spend 2 kilodollars for any piece of equipment that is for a hobby, unless I win the lottery and have done everything else that needs to be done with the winnings.

The computer I use was dead at the time of the eBay bid closing; the pieces parts certainly would have been useful for the next paragraph.

I certainly do not immediately *need* a router lathe. At this point I find the idea of building my own, along the lines of the ShopNotes version, a challenge that is hard to resist. When I get around to it, I will keep everyone posted, even with photoshoots!


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## harrysin (Jan 15, 2007)

"even with photoshoots!"

I should think so Tom!


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## allthunbs (Jun 22, 2008)

gav said:


> Ok, no gears, but pulleys. Got it.


Hi Gavin:

Nope, there are four philosophies, spiral, cables, gears _and_ bicycle chains. I prefer the bicycle chain philosophy because there is no (very limited) stretching and indexing is infinitely variable. (just change the cogs and chainrings.)

Legacy still makes "ornamental mills" but they are pricey. However, care must be taken because the Legacy is not a real "ornamental mill" in the same vein as the Holtzapffel which is a _real_ ornamental lathe and mill. The Legacy uses a spiral drive. Big difference in price too, just in case you think the Legacy is expensive ;-)

if you get hold of a copy of Bill Hylton's book "Router Magic," there is a home-built, chain drive one in there.

A lot depends on what you're doing. If you're using it for the occasional project, the home made variety (my objective) is the ticket, offering pride of accomplishment as part of the fun.

If you're into doing it for profit, cut to the chase, plunk down the bucks and get a Legacy. GalTurner, a former member, was a master on the Legacy and would have been an excellent resource. She came at it from the turner's end. She learned lathe work first and added a router, rather than starting with the router and adding turning. I don't know all the characteristics of the Legacy other than they've been working with routers for a very long time. 

You might also look at the pivot frame from Trend. Rather than work on the horizontal plane, the pivot frame allows you to work on the vertical plane. Add Sante's angler and/or a sled frame and you have some really interesting possibilities.

However, you might just flip a set of skis on their side and use a turntable. Interesting when you start to put stuff together huh?

"Routers - organized" just updated, again.


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## gal turner (Mar 3, 2010)

I just got an email from a friend that told me you were talking about me allthumbs  Phew, at least it was nice!!  How are you? I hope well. Hope you got your remodel done, and are now sitting back & enjoying your endeavors. Happy New Year


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

I have the book,,,bicycle chains, hahahahahahahahaha LOL LOL

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## TWheels (May 26, 2006)

harrysin said:


> "even with photoshoots!"
> 
> I should think so Tom!


Harry, shortly before I disappeared I bought a camera in part so I could make photoshoots and even videos of my work. You have set a very high bar however. 
It will be some time before I get around to my project so do not expect it soon. There is even more stuff going on now that may result in another disappearing act. I hope not, but …


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## allthunbs (Jun 22, 2008)

bobj3 said:


> I have the book,,,bicycle chains, hahahahahahahahaha LOL LOL
> 
> ========


So, what's the big joke Bob?

PP 292, "Router Magic," Bill Hylton, Rodale Press, Emmaus, Pennsylvania, ISBN 0-87596-711-6 published and copyright 1996 by Rodale Press, Inc.

Bill's comment specifically identifies cable stretching as an issue and recommends bicycle chains, chainrings and cogs as a solution.

??????


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi

I have worked with chains for a long time, it's open system and must have lube on it in order for it to work,(many moving parts) working around router dust would be a no no,,,

" cable stretching " not a big deal and no lube needed so to speak of ,once it's stretch that's it the norm.
I have seen many tools ( equipment ) use cables but I don't recall one using bicycle chain...other than a bicycle..just to much play the norm..but I will say some use both hvy.roller chain and cable but it's open system also..


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## Cassandra (Mar 15, 2006)

bobj3 said:


> Hi
> 
> I have worked with chains for a long time, it's open system and must have lube it order for it to work,(many moving parts) working around router dust would be a no no,,,


Two issues:
1. Lubing the chain
2. Working around dust

In Issue 1 - Lubing chain, I would suggest (from my bicycling days) soaking the chain in melted parafin wax. I found parafin wax lasted longer than oil on the chain. Plus, parafin wax on the chain is not likely to drip and soil parts around the chain.

In Issue 2 - Working around dust, I would suggest two things. First, add dust collection at the router to collect as much dust before it makes a mess of everything. Second, a simple cover over the chain mechanism would greatly reduce the dust issue. With Bill Hylton's design, a dust shield over the chain would be an easy add-on.

Cassandra


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## allthunbs (Jun 22, 2008)

Cassandra said:


> Two issues:
> 1. Lubing the chain
> 2. Working around dust
> 
> ...


Hi Cassandra:

You'll find that as long as the dust doesn't get trapped on the chain and just falls through, the chain will tolerate a lot of dust. The particle size of router scarf is the culprit. Small grain scarf falls through especially waxed chains but large particle will get trapped easily. This is more a problem on the duplicator than on the routerlathe. As you said, it is a simple matter to add a dust cover to the mechanicals.


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## harrysin (Jan 15, 2007)

bobj3 said:


> Hi
> 
> I have worked with chains for a long time, it's open system and must have lube on it in order for it to work,(many moving parts) working around router dust would be a no no,,,
> 
> ...


I've been thinking Bob, perhaps you should work out a schedule for regular replacement of the cables on your machines or perhaps to eliminate this stretching problem (which I've never heard about before) replace them with bike chains. These router lathes are still available here for $299.00 (Timbecon)


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## Cassandra (Mar 15, 2006)

Hi Ron:

I agree with what you said. My findings with using parafin wax instead of oil on my bike chains was that the wax wouldn't hold onto the road dirt as much as the oil. As for the getting the larger dust particles trapped in the chain, that's something that would occur regardless of the lubricant. Best to keep the larger dust particles away from the chain (the shield.)

Cassandra


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi Harry

The cables will never need to be replace (on both machines ) they are prestretch.
Many don't know the cables must be out in the open and they must come off the pulleys all the time, to replace them with chains would be a nightmare,big can of worms like they say keep it KISS and you will use the tool if not it's just one more tool that you will not use..

Like most lathes they put out tons of chips and to put a cover over them would be hell, I guess you need to have one b/4 you can say how to rework one, the wood gear type may work but the same thing with router dust and chips, as you know gears must be dead on in order to work and one little chip would lock the system up .

I would love to see someone made one for less 50.oo (when you can get one off eBay for 50.oo) the candowood lathe only cost 100.oo bucks new in the box from CD....

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harrysin said:


> I've been thinking Bob, perhaps you should work out a schedule for regular replacement of the cables on your machines or perhaps to eliminate this stretching problem (which I've never heard about before) replace them with bike chains. These router lathes are still available here for $299.00 (Timbecon)


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## brucenelson (Jan 7, 2012)

*ShopNotes Spiral Router machine*

If you look up DICK IN IA, his thread is about router turning. You will find that I made an entry about the ShopNotes Spiral router milling machine that I built, along with many pictures of the same. If you have a satisfactory way to machine the gears, and make all the machine parts out of Baltic Birch plywood, rather than MDF, you will have an excellent machine.


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## otherguy (Jan 19, 2012)

brucenelson said:


> If you look up DICK IN IA, his thread is about router turning. You will find that I made an entry about the ShopNotes Spiral router milling machine that I built, along with many pictures of the same. If you have a satisfactory way to machine the gears, and make all the machine parts out of Baltic Birch plywood, rather than MDF, you will have an excellent machine.


To bad they don't make router lathe's anymore, at least hobby/inexpensive types. Have to keep chekcing ebay for them.


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