# Dust collector clogging up.



## jw2170 (Jan 24, 2008)

I recently purchased a small dust collection unit from Hare and Forbes in Sydney and due to overseas holiday only started to use it today.

I am using the DC on a H&F 6" jointer and the results were, to say the least, disappointing.

It seems that the chips from the jointer are clogging up against the cross webbing in the plastic joiners. I am using standard 4" hose.

I am asking if anyone else had this, or a similar problem, and if so, how was the problem fixed.

At this stage, I am looking at cutting the webbing/grating out of the inlet tube on the Dc unit.


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## MAFoElffen (Jun 8, 2012)

jw2170 said:


> I recently purchased a small dust collection unit from Hare and Forbes in Sydney and due to overseas holiday only started to use it today.
> 
> I am using the DC on a H&F 6" jointer and the results were, to say the least, disappointing.
> 
> ...


James-

Here's my take on it clogging up on those long shavings... and you wanting to cut the webbing out...

The webbing is doing it's job right now. It's filtering out the big pieces that would otherwise have to get by the fins in the impeller. If it gets caught up in the impeller fins.... or without the webbing a big piece gets by and gets jammed between the impeller and the housing-- bad juju.

My suggestion would be to get 2 4" couplings and a 4" street elbow... put them through a top for a small garbage can... those should run less that $10. Cylone to separate out the chips before they get to your DC. 

My TS, RAS, planer, router table, chop saws, sanders, vacuuming, etc...All I get in the bag at my DC is a few fines.

Just saying. Doesn;t having to be something costly... just something that works right?


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## jw2170 (Jan 24, 2008)

Hi Mike.

Thanks for the response. 

One of the solutions I was looking today was to run the dc through the Triton Dust Bucket I have on my old DC system (see attached photo).

The only problem is that I would have to go from 4" down to 1 3/4" and back up to 4".

The response from the Aussie wood working forum is this is a common problem and recommending cutting away the webbing.

I do not see these shaving as "big pieces".

The jury will rest until further votes come in.......... :laugh:

PS: the old system cleaned up the mess with no clogging, but I am not sure how the Vac would handle the jointer in operation.


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## MartinW (Jun 26, 2013)

James,

I do agree with Mike.
Rather than cutting out the rough filter, make sure the rough stuff doesn't get into the impeller to start with.
If it's an improvised cyclone, as Mike pointed it out, or something more sophisticated - it doesn't have to be costly.
Since I can't post links yet - have a look for "Thien baffle". Since there's no instructions on thiens home page, you might have to do a google anyway - there's numerous people who built one successfully and gave more informations about the build.
Should be easy to build for a router-pro as you are ;-)

Kind Regards,
Martin


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## jw2170 (Jan 24, 2008)

I may look at something like this:

Carba-Tec® Dust Deputy : CARBA-TEC


For you guys in USA, check the price of this:

Carba-Tec® Super Dust Deputy : CARBA-TEC


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## harrysin (Jan 15, 2007)

jw2170 said:


> I may look at something like this:
> 
> Carba-Tec® Dust Deputy : CARBA-TEC
> 
> ...


This is what I did to mine soon after buying it many moons ago James and because it has a metal impeller I often hear clanking noises but there has never been any damage.


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

one of these or similar may be the answer...


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## jw2170 (Jan 24, 2008)

Stick486 said:


> one of these or similar may be the answer...


I had a link to one from Carba-tec, but was not sure if it would work with a 4" system.

My dc does not have a large motor, so I am hoping that will do.

My main concern is the collection of the chips/shavings. As I will be working outside, dust is not the main worry.

Being cheap, my first thought is to go with Harry's option.

Jury is still debating.........


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## MartinW (Jun 26, 2013)

@James - a cyclone is surely the best option if "government" agrees - the ones you pointed out give a good feeling, except for the somewhat flimsy looking plastic bucket, which I would replace with a metal bin. 
2nd best is to build any type of separator yourself - it's just some bucks and some work, and might even be as efficient as a cyclone. And fun to build on the way.

@Harry - no offense meant: if any tiny metal piece (**** happens) hits the metal fan, and a spark gets struck........ - only recently a wood workers shop I know burnt down due to that (luckily nobody hurt - "just" the workshop ruined). The bad thing is, you won't recognize it immediately, as it takes hours to burst into flames - usually when you're long snoring after a days work. So having the bigger parts sorted out before anything hitting the fan is surely a good idea to avoid unnecessary trouble.

Martin


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## jw2170 (Jan 24, 2008)

*Still undecided.......*



MartinW said:


> @James - a cyclone is surely the best option if "government" agrees - the ones you pointed out give a good feeling, except for the somewhat flimsy looking plastic bucket, which I would replace with a metal bin.
> 2nd best is to build any type of separator yourself - it's just some bucks and some work, and might even be as efficient as a cyclone. And fun to build on the way.
> 
> @Harry - no offense meant: if any tiny metal piece (**** happens) hits the metal fan, and a spark gets struck........ - only recently a wood workers shop I know burnt down due to that (luckily nobody hurt - "just" the workshop ruined). The bad thing is, you won't recognize it immediately, as it takes hours to burst into flames - usually when you're long snoring after a days work. So having the bigger parts sorted out before anything hitting the fan is surely a good idea to avoid unnecessary trouble.
> ...


Phew, Martin, I am glad mine only has a plastic impeller.......:jester:

The current decision on the Aussie woodworking forum is for :

Dust Separator Lid : CARBA-TEC

,this lid and a metal bucket (trash can). Or Harrys solution....(which was the first suggestion in Australia)

At this point I am leaning toward the lid instead of cutting the webbing.

This is not an exercise but a real situation I need sorted.........

I will be going to my Mens Shed and Carba-tec tomorrow.......


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## Daikusan (Apr 12, 2013)

MartinW said:


> . . . if any tiny metal piece (**** happens) hits the metal fan, and a spark gets struck........ - only recently a wood workers shop I know burnt down due to that (luckily nobody hurt - "just" the workshop ruined).
> Martin


Sorry all, I have to agree with Martin. Dust can be an explosive atmosphere with the right mixture/ratio. That is why all grain elevators have to have special electrical systems that are certified to work in explosive atmospheres. I have to make the assumption wood shops can have the same problem.

Like you James I work outside and am not overly cautious about creating an explosive atmosphere. I use a big shop vac for mine. I have often wondered if a spark got in the vac’s collection area how soon I would notice it.


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## MAFoElffen (Jun 8, 2012)

James- Look at the separator is this article (attached)....

Although, what I talked about before would be something like this:








But I have been seriously looking at how to make this one work (combining the DC, trash can and mdf into a thiel pre-separator in a compact unit.:








That would still need something for fines for me... but since you're outside...


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## MAFoElffen (Jun 8, 2012)

If I remember right Steve... That fire mentioned was a slow burn not noticed. Spark caused smoldering in shavings with later turned into a fire... well after the owner was gone from the shop. Could have been just as or more hazardous, but wasn't the result of an explosive atmosphere.


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## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

Hi James. I would try to avoid going up and down and back again in hose sizes and look for another solution. Removing the grillwork at your DC shouldn't cause a problem with the jointer. There is nothing big enough to cause a problem at the impeller. A table saw can cause problems and is the only tool I have that does. Once in a while you get slivers going through the system and they can make quite a racket going through the impeller.
You need the DC to operate the jointer, at least I do. They will plug up very quickly if the DC isn't sucking the chips clear. If you use it on the TS also then you will need to fashion a cyclone. It doesn't have to be very sophisticated to prevent large pieces from going through the impeller.


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## harrysin (Jan 15, 2007)

MartinW said:


> @James - a cyclone is surely the best option if "government" agrees - the ones you pointed out give a good feeling, except for the somewhat flimsy looking plastic bucket, which I would replace with a metal bin.
> 2nd best is to build any type of separator yourself - it's just some bucks and some work, and might even be as efficient as a cyclone. And fun to build on the way.
> 
> @Harry - no offense meant: if any tiny metal piece (**** happens) hits the metal fan, and a spark gets struck........ - only recently a wood workers shop I know burnt down due to that (luckily nobody hurt - "just" the workshop ruined). The bad thing is, you won't recognize it immediately, as it takes hours to burst into flames - usually when you're long snoring after a days work. So having the bigger parts sorted out before anything hitting the fan is surely a good idea to avoid unnecessary trouble.
> ...


Martin, metalwork is at one end of the shed THAT dust collector at the other end and never the two will meet!


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## Marco (Feb 21, 2009)

James my 2 cents is use the seperator lid with the 4" ports. At $29 its a good price and it's alot easier and cleaner emptying the metal can than the dusty old bag.


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## tvman44 (Jun 25, 2013)

Build a Thein separator and your troubles will be over!


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## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

Hey, James; I've had long slivers from my TS get jammed in my impeller. Couldn't happen with a separator in line.
(I say slivers but I'm talking about those thin cuttings produced from edge trimming.)


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## MikeMa (Jul 27, 2006)

I will admit that I cut out the grate on my DC as it was always clogging up with the planer. As for the concern about it sucking up metal, I think there is a higher concern that you suck up hot metal, which is why the DC should be disconnected if you are using any of your machines for metal work. As for random metal objects, I never run my DC as a shop vac. That's what the shop vac is for. It is always connected directly to a machine when it is turned on. Woodshops have been using metal blades for decades with very little problems. I would say there is a higher risk from the heat generated as the dust breaks down over time while it is kept in the DC bag VS. a spark off the the fins which is well separated from the collection bag. This also goes in to the debate of grounding your PVC lines for static electricity. Again, there is a concern about it, but the density of the material running through the hoses isn't enough to create an explosive situation.


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## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

I vote separator, James. I have the Rockler Dust Right rig and my very anemic shop vac is enough to run it on a 2" hose. I'm confident your system would do fine with something similar. I run it on my planner and nothing bigger than fine dust ever gets to the vac.


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

James, here's some thoughts from my personal experience.
1) The Dust Deputy works great. I have one hooked up to a Shop Vac. That is what it is designed for - vacs with 2 1/2 inch hoses.

It keeps up with my planer and jointer but the bucket fills fairly quickly so you have to stop and empty it every so often.

The plus is it catches all of the foreign matter like screws, nails etc. and they never reach the shop vac.

2) I also have the 2 hp Harbor Freight dust collector with a trash can chip separator plumbed upstream. It has the Thein baffle under the lid and it also works great. Very little dust makes it over to the bag/filter which is downstream of the fan. Once again, no foreign matter ever makes it to the fan suction where impeller damage could occur.

What I did was buy the Dust Rite fittings from Rockler and attach them to the lid of a 30 gallon translucent plastic drum. I modified the lid by building the baffle to fit underneath it.

Your dust collector is a prime candidate for the trash can/baffle type chip separator.
Here are a few pics to go along whith what I have described.

Hope this helps.
Mike


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## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

Curious here, Mike; the DC bag unit has what looks like 6" inlet/pipe yet the motor unit looks like 4" inlet (outlet at 6"). Am I seeing incorrectly? Why the size difference?
(The reduction of air pressure on the outlet side is probably very helpful?)


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

DaninVan said:


> Curious here, Mike; the DC bag unit has what looks like 6" inlet/pipe yet the motor unit looks like 4" inlet (outlet at 6"). Am I seeing incorrectly? Why the size difference?
> (The reduction of air pressure on the outlet side is probably very helpful?)


Danni, the hose diameter is 4 inch through the chip separator and into the HF fan. Then 5 inch out of the fan to the HF separator. That is the same as factory setup.

Note: Check out the 3 mil. 42 gallon contractor trash bag I am using. I buy those bags at Lowe's. It fits with no problem.


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## jw2170 (Jan 24, 2008)

OK, the jury has decided.

1. I feel that the Oneida has been designed more for a 'shop vac' with 2 1/2" hose and may be too small for my system. 

The bucket is too small to use with a jointer or thickness planer. 

There is also the issue of going up and down in size as mentioned by Charles.

2. I am going to cut out the webbing as mentioned by Harry and others as a short term solution.

3. I will purchase the lid with 4" ports and convert this to a Thein Baffle at a later stage.

I should be able to purchase a 75 litre trash can from Bunnings to use as a bucket.

Romak 75L Galvanised Metal Rubbish Bin - Bunnings Warehouse

Thanks for all the input.


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## spectacle43 (Jun 20, 2011)

*Hafco Clog-up*



jw2170 said:


> I recently purchased a small dust collection unit from Hare and Forbes in Sydney and due to overseas holiday only started to use it today.
> 
> I am using the DC on a H&F 6" jointer and the results were, to say the least, disappointing.
> 
> ...


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## MAFoElffen (Jun 8, 2012)

MT Stringer said:


> Danni, the hose diameter is 4 inch through the chip separator and into the HF fan. Then 5 inch out of the fan to the HF separator. That is the same as factory setup.
> 
> Note: Check out the 3 mil. 42 gallon contractor trash bag I am using. I buy those bags at Lowe's. It fits with no problem.


Don't know about anyone else's HF DC... But mine is 5" inlet at the impeller housing. Most of those cousins are the same... The attached "Y" is two 4" inlets. At the cyclone ring outlet, it's also 5"... 

Some people think that reducing the friction in the inlet side, but hands-on, more have found... As you mentioned, if they reduce the backpressure on their dust collector (Pleated filters having more filter area, smooth ducting, bigger ducting through the outlet...) then they seem to get more bang for their buck in performance gains out of their dust collector system. James' is part of a new design trend (from what I've seen) where mounting the blower next to the cyclone ring, gives the outlet less backpressure because it's a straight shot between. When I was shopping, alike models, those types were higher priced as performing better. (as least with Jet, General, etc.) 

Improving my throughput in my blower... I can really tell/see for myself that there is a lot of backpressure after my blower.... Filter bag and plastic bag bulging. Blower outlet to cyclone ring hose bulging. But I can also see the the inlet hoses go t and from my trash can cyclone getting sucked in, as well as the lid sucked down on it's foam seal. But not as bad. With that, I can always open a few gates if it becomes a problem.

Great to know about the Lowes Bags. Thank you very much. I had been shopping around and failed at that. I had tried Costco's clear 35 gallon/.9 mil (too thin), Home Depot clear 50 gal/1.1 (still a bit thin and way too large!!!), I even think I looked at the cash-and-carry (restaurant supply... and Sharon and I were still shopping around this morning. Oly is a drive from here and Lowes is on the far side of that for me, but now I have a reason purpose to go there.


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## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

spectacle43 said:


> jw2170 said:
> 
> 
> > I recently purchased a small dust collection unit from Hare and Forbes in Sydney and due to overseas holiday only started to use it today.
> ...


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## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

MAFoElffen said:


> Some people think that reducing the friction in the inlet side, but hands-on, more have found... As you mentioned, if they reduce the backpressure on their dust collector (Pleated filters having more filter area, smooth ducting, bigger ducting through the outlet...) then they seem to get more bang for their buck in performance gains out of their dust collector system. James' is part of a new design trend (from what I've seen) where mounting the blower next to the cyclone ring, gives the outlet less backpressure because it's a straight shot between. When I was shopping, alike models, those types were higher priced as performing better. (as least with Jet, General, etc.)
> 
> Improving my throughput in my blower... I can realy tell/see for myself that there is a lot of backpressure after my blower.... Filter bag and plastic bag bulging. Blower outlet to cyclone ring hose bulging. But I can also see the the inlet hoses go t and from my trash can cyclone getting sucked in, as well as the lid sucked down on it's foam seal. But not as bad. With that, I can always open a few gates if it becomes a problem.


I would agree with the theory about the larger outflow hose. It should work like a car engine, i.e. larger exhaust= less back pressure= better flow through= more power. Unless it can't make it through the filter bags. Add another set of bags? 

Mike that new impeller must be making quite a difference. Is it keeping your saw cleared?


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## DesertRatTom (Jul 3, 2012)

I think you need to add a chip collector bin before the impeller. I'd use a 30 gallon fiber drum (will take some looking to find one), but with a tightly sealed top and a pair of Rockler style dust collection ports, it would capture the longer pieces while letting the dust fly by. You will need to get a few yards of flexible hose to hook up, but the bin might fit in the space just below the impeller. Just make sure you check and empty it frequently! I read that shavings add up to 20 times the volume of the wood you remove. I'm thinking of adding a long, small plastic window to my drum so I can see the inside debris level. Haven't figured exactly how to seal this window, but it would be nice to know quickly when its full.


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## Marco (Feb 21, 2009)

DesertRatTom said:


> I think you need to add a chip collector bin before the impeller. I'd use a 30 gallon fiber drum (will take some looking to find one), but with a tightly sealed top and a pair of Rockler style dust collection ports, it would capture the longer pieces while letting the dust fly by. You will need to get a few yards of flexible hose to hook up, but the bin might fit in the space just below the impeller. Just make sure you check and empty it frequently! I read that shavings add up to 20 times the volume of the wood you remove. I'm thinking of adding a long, small plastic window to my drum so I can see the inside debris level. Haven't figured exactly how to seal this window, but it would be nice to know quickly when its full.


Tom. I've seen people cut out a hole in the drum/can/barrel and glue/silicone/screw a piece of thin plexiglass over it


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## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

Marco said:


> Tom. I've seen people cut out a hole in the drum/can/barrel and glue/silicone/screw a piece of thin plexiglass over it


That's why I bought a white translucent plastic drum so I could watch it fill up. It is fun watching all of that stuff swirl around when running the planer or jointer.


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## Willway (Aug 16, 2012)

jw2170 said:


> OK, the jury has decided.
> 
> 1. I feel that the Oneida has been designed more for a 'shop vac' with 2 1/2" hose and may be too small for my system.
> 
> ...


A wise decision James, that would have been my decision also. The baffle is nice but is not a necessity.


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## Daikusan (Apr 12, 2013)

James
I think you arrived at the right decesion and I think the trash can (metal?) is wise also.


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## Daikusan (Apr 12, 2013)

MAFoElffen said:


> If I remember right Steve... That fire mentioned was a slow burn not noticed. Spark caused smoldering in shavings with later turned into a fire... well after the owner was gone from the shop. Could have been just as or more hazardous, but wasn't the result of an explosive atmosphere.


Mike (MAFoElffen)

I knew that. I agree with you, and my comment should have been made clear to separate those two issues. I was also raising a secondary concern a spark in an explosive environment.

Both a spark that smolders and a spark that causes an explosion should be a concern to the indoor environment. Outside, the explosive environment likely won’t be obtained. But, what about within the dust collection system can an explosive environment be obtained? To say it cannot be obtained is being naïve.

I have never heard of a shop vacuum cleaner explosion (unless someone is dumb enough to vacuum up gasoline; they are out there). I have heard of grain elevator explosions, 50 years ago it was not that uncommon in the mid-west. That said, I have often wondered what the lower explosive limit and upper explosive limit of dust would be especially in a dust collection system.

An example of a chemical we all use in the workshop, mineral spirits. If I recall right, for example mineral spirits or denatured alcohol has a LEL 1.0% and UEL of 5.5% and a flash point around 100F closed cup (no clue where my NIOSH hand book is and that was 25 years ago, some of our firefighter friends may have the correct info). As long as the air/alcohol mixture is below 1% or above 5.5% there would be no danger of an explosion. If the ratio was 6% it would not explode; however if it was 6% that means the ratio at one point in time passed through the explosive limits. Therefore the warnings on the can, “Do not use in a closed environment.” 

The same is true with dust; that is my understanding of the dust collection system need to be grounded: 1) to stop static electricity, 2) static electricity causes sparks.

With the right mixture of air and dust combination, plus a spark, could cause a fire or less unlikely an explosion. That is why I said what I did.


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## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

The bad one is Linseed oil...no containment necessary to have the Fire Dept stop by for a visit. I can think of at least three major home fires caused by someone using Linseed, then stopping for some reason, and the oily rags spontaneously combusting. Usually involving being left in the sun coming through a window or some such. Won't have the stuff around.


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## Daikusan (Apr 12, 2013)

NiceG316 said:


> . . . I would say there is a higher risk from the heat generated as the dust breaks down over time while it is kept in the DC bag VS. a spark off the the fins which is well separated from the collection bag. This also goes in to the debate of grounding your PVC lines for static electricity. Again, there is a concern about it, but the density of the material running through the hoses isn't enough to create an explosive situation.


Mike (NiceG316) 
What about the fine dust mixed with the big stuff? The answer may be that the big stuff in the environment slows down the ignition process and thus prevent an explosion. Each type of wood, sap content, moisture content, etc is likely to change the formula too. Trying to figure all that out is beyond my capabilities.

Has any one seen studies on the dust collection environment? Don’t answer that hear, start a new thread please.


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## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

Daikusan said:


> Mike (MAFoElffen)
> 
> The same is true with dust; that is my understanding of the dust collection system need to be grounded: 1) to stop static electricity, 2) static electricity causes sparks.
> 
> With the right mixture of air and dust combination, plus a spark, could cause a fire or less unlikely an explosion. That is why I said what I did.


When I was setting up my DC system I was aware that there could be a problem with static discharge. It was for that reason that I decided to use galvanized duct pipe. I grounded to my electrical panel and never had to worry about it again. While it is almost impossible for an explosion, it is possible for a spark that could smolder for several hours.


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## Daikusan (Apr 12, 2013)

Cherryville Chuck said:


> When I was setting up my DC system I was aware that there could be a problem with static discharge. It was for that reason that I decided to use galvanized duct pipe. I grounded to my electrical panel and never had to worry about it again. While it is almost impossible for an explosion, it is possible for a spark that could smolder for several hours.


Smoldering for hours is a big concern. 

A thought, I have seen dc systems with sliding doors to isolate the unused legs. Perhaps having them on the separator’s inlet and outlet would be a good idea. Then the can (hopefully metal) would act like a butt bucket (cigarette butts) where the lid shuts off oxygen and once the smoldering coal uses all the oxygen it goes out. Once out it will cool below the ignition temperature (hopefully).


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## MAFoElffen (Jun 8, 2012)

This brings up a ponderable question I have on the risk of dust explosions with a dust collector....

Pressure is a required element in an explosion, right?. OSHA has Industrial Vacuums listed as the number one piece of equipment listed for the prevention of combustible dust to prevent a dust explosion.

Dust explosions are found in a pressurized (or over nuetral) environment, right?. 

*** Is the risk less in an under-pressurized/vacuum environment?

If so, in a dust collector, the risk area would be after the blower, so if the dust is removed before the blower...

(re: Physics and "Things that don't happen in space.")


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## MikeMa (Jul 27, 2006)

Daikusan said:


> Mike (NiceG316)
> What about the fine dust mixed with the big stuff? The answer may be that the big stuff in the environment slows down the ignition process and thus prevent an explosion. Each type of wood, sap content, moisture content, etc is likely to change the formula too. Trying to figure all that out is beyond my capabilities.
> 
> Has any one seen studies on the dust collection environment? Don’t answer that hear, start a new thread please.


I had asked the question before, and this is what I found out. When you think about a grain elevator, the air isn't moving nearly as fast as it is in DC pipe. Also the density of dust in the air in a grain elevator is MUCH higher then it will ever by in the DC pipe. Those two factors almost completely negate the possibility of an explosion occurring in a PVC pipe. As I said before, the bigger risk of a dust collection fire comes from the dust breaking down which is an exothermic process, much like an oily rag drying. If a DC is too full that heat has no where to go it will build up until it reaches its flash point.

Also, boiled linseed oil gets a bad rap with the potential with fires, mainly because it is a very popular first step in the finishing process. Don't get me wrong, there is a definitely a risk, however this risk is the same with all oil and oil based finishes. After each use of a rag always unfold it flat so that the heat will dissipate, even if you are just waiting between coats. For disposal, I leave an oil rag flat on the concrete floor away from anything else that could ignite and let it dry till it feels dry to the touch. Another thing I have done is put it in a bucket full of water. When trash day comes around, I wheel the trashcans to the curb, then I throw the rags in them.


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## Daikusan (Apr 12, 2013)

NiceG316 said:


> . . . After each use of a rag always unfold it flat so that the heat will dissipate, even if you are just waiting between coats. For disposal, I leave an oil rag flat on the concrete floor away from anything else that could ignite and let it dry till it feels dry to the touch. Another thing I have done is put it in a bucket full of water. When trash day comes around, I wheel the trashcans to the curb, then I throw the rags in them.


I hear that!! Any rag that has been in contact with flammables should be laid out flat to dry. That should be a second habit just as unplugging the router to make adjustments/changing the bit.


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## neville9999 (Jul 22, 2010)

James I agree with Stick, I would rig a cyclone drum to capture the big shavings before they get trapped, in a younger life I would have hacksawed the opening to be large and less restrictive but these days I would look for a smarter solution, the last time I was at Hare and Forbes I looked at that dust collector and as long as there is fast air flow it should work OK for small machines so try to get rid of the shavings from the mix and if you do have to open up that gate then cut off about 15% from the inside before you cut away it all as it may work much better if it is opened up a little bit and last I doubt that the shavings from a small thicknessor would damage the impellers anyway. NGM


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## jw2170 (Jan 24, 2008)

Hi Neville, that is my intention long term.


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## Willway (Aug 16, 2012)

James you can put a small amount of water in the bottom of your can for just a little peace of mind. For a single machine operation/one man shop operation like ours you have very little to be concerned about. I dont like finish/chemicals or paint inside the shop. A cheap metal cabinet outside is always a better option.


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## jw2170 (Jan 24, 2008)

Thanks Dick.

I am not concerned about fumes. My whole 'shop' is outside.


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## jw2170 (Jan 24, 2008)

*For Mike*

As per our skype conversation, Mike, here is a picture of the dust chute on my jointer.


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## darsev (Feb 3, 2012)

James,

for what it is worth, when I was working at the factory, I had a Hafco DC attached to the edge bander I was using. It was Hafco, not Shepach, and probably 3 times the size of yours - it had 4 x 4" inlets and I used 3 of them. The edge bander put out waste that was a lot bigger than what you showed in your photos but I had few problems like you described. The edge bander waste was primarily chips roughly 20mm square, ground up plastic, and long threads of plastic that could be up to 2m long.

My biggest problem were the long threads getting tangled and clogging the inlet of the hose. The next problem was the same threads clumping together with the ground up plastic and lodging in the impeller. I kept an ear out for a droning sound and cleared out the clumps at the next break when this happened. If the Sheppach is any thing like the Hafco, I can't see any problems with the slivers shown in your photo.

A cyclone or Thiele is still a good idea as the clumping was more likely when the bag was full and the vacuum down. I know there are some differences between this setup and yours, but that has been my experience for what it's worth.

Darryl


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## Daikusan (Apr 12, 2013)

Daikusan said:


> . . . I have often wondered what the lower explosive limit and upper explosive limit of dust would be especially in a dust collection system.
> 
> With the right mixture of air and dust combination, plus a spark, could cause a fire or less unlikely an explosion.


I just found an MSDS on wood dust (looking for types of wood and their toxicity), 40 grams per cubic meter. Im not sure you could see anything though 40 grams, that is a lot of dust.

http://www.continentalhardwood.com/CustomerLinks/Documents/JIII_WoodDust_MSDS_2012.pdf

“Sawing, sanding or machining can produce wood dust as a by-product which may present an explosion hazard if a dust cloud contacts an ignition source. An airborne concentration of 40 grams of dust per cubic meter of air is often used as the LEL [Lower Explosive Limit] for wood dust.”


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## jw2170 (Jan 24, 2008)

*Update......*

Just thought I would post a picture of the dust collector hooked up to my GMC thickness planner.

I bought the 4" dust shroud from Hare and Forbes some years ago, but had never hooked it up.

Yesterday I dragged the thickness planer into the car port and hooked it up to the DC.

I was planning down some old fence palings to make small box/drawers.

The unit was most successful and collected 99% of the shavings. :sold:


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## Marco (Feb 21, 2009)

Glad to hear it!


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## JIMMIEM (Apr 4, 2010)

The Thien collector is inexpensive and easy to build. I found directions on-line. It works very well with only a slight decrease in suction.


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## jw2170 (Jan 24, 2008)

That reminds me. I have to buy a couple of bags so I can dispose of the shavings in a controlled manner.


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## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

James; two items...
1) if you go for the pre DC collector (cyclone or whatever) no large chunks are _going_ to get though to the impeller.
2) following on from that; if you then remove the input and output baffles, you will substantially increase your airflow. Not recommending anything; just offering an opinion. 

That's a pretty restrictive baffle on there.


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## jw2170 (Jan 24, 2008)

DaninVan said:


> James; two items...
> 1) if you go for the pre DC collector (cyclone or whatever) no large chunks are _going_ to get though to the impeller.
> 2) following on from that; if you then remove the input and output baffles, you will substantially increase your airflow. Not recommending anything; just offering an opinion.
> 
> That's a pretty restrictive baffle on there.


Thanks Dan.

I have bought a dust separator lid:

Dust Separator Lid : CARBA-TEC

I have not yet made/bought the bucket to put it on pre DC.

And a Thein baffle is in the pipeline.

As Maree is still on crutches after her operation, wood work is on the back burner as I am doing all the housework, cooking, washing and ironing at the moment. Am I a girly-boy......LOL

I have already remove the input and output baffles. And the unit works great with the jointer and thickness planer.

It is just that I have filled a lower bag over a period of time and want to replace it while I dispose of the shavings.

The planer seemed to fill it very quickly.


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## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

" Am I a girly-boy......LOL"
No, you're a _maid_. You misread the advert, Maree was looking for a _cabana boy..._ lol


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