# Router Table-saw Extension Underway



## mbrun (Jan 12, 2020)

I have set out to replace my 25 year +/- table saw extension with a larger and flatter one. 

Using materials on hand (including left over laminate from the original it replaces) I have cobbled together this new one you see in the pictures.

The substrate is (3) layers of 1/2” Baltic birch glued and screwed. Both top and bottom are covered with laminate. 

In another post I shared that I now have a Woodpecker PRL-V2 lift. Using the lift plate itself as a template, I made the wooden template I used for creating the perfectly sized opening to receive the lift. 

Although this extension is heavy (and solid as a rock it seems), I will be adding some additional cross-bracing beneath plus a shop made dust collection enclosure.

I have also purchased the woodpecker combination miter/accessory track to install.

By making the extension larger, I gain the ability to move the table saw fence all the way to the right and still not impact the router bit.

I will post more as work progresses.


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

that sure is some nice clean work...


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## sreilly (May 22, 2018)

Looks great.


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## MEBCWD (Jan 14, 2012)

You're off to a good start. looks good so far.


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## Marco (Feb 21, 2009)

Good idea, plan and work Michael. I look forward to seeing it completed.


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## RainMan 2.0 (May 6, 2014)

Looking good Michael. I tried this myself and dun goofed at the end and aborted, so maybe I’ll learn something from yours


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## TenGees (Sep 12, 2012)

Nice, so far. Good idea about laminating both sides.


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## Willji (Feb 28, 2020)

Very nice Michael!


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## mbrun (Jan 12, 2020)

I have been working on cutting all the pieces to provide additional bracing below the extension. This will further help keep it flat.

I have also started working on the dust collection box for use below the router. 

Nothing is attached yet, just clamped in place so I can size all the pieces before start attaching things. 

I think I am going to suck the dust out the back of the box, and provide a means to bring fresh-air in to directly vent the motor. Even toying with the idea of dust evacuation near the top. We’ll see. 











































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## DesertRatTom (Jul 3, 2012)

Stick talked about a snorkle (Snork-le?) or tube through the bottom of the DC box, affixed to the bottom of the router. The easiest way to do this would be to mount two connectors flat to flat and run the flex tube up to the box and attached to one side of the connector, then a short length from the other side of the connector to the router's air intake. Pix is of the connector I'm suggesting. I would also consider putting some sort of filter box on the air intake, the less sawdust you send through the router, the better. Depending on brand, the connectors are $6-$10 each.

Making the tube fit on the bottom of the router could be done with aluminum duct tape, but you won't be able to remove it easily for other uses. For that you could get an oversized adapter with one side to fit your tubing, the other larger than the router base, then line the larger opening with door insulation strips to fit snug on the router. Easy to slip on and off and no tape residue.

Beautifully executed BTW.


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

DesertRatTom said:


> Stick talked about a snorkle (Snork-le?) or tube through the bottom of the DC box, affixed to the bottom of the router.


and that's snorkel...
*here's the thread....*


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

mbrun said:


> I have also started working on the dust collection box for use below the router.
> Nothing is attached yet, just clamped in place so I can size all the pieces before start attaching things.
> I think I am going to suck the dust out the back of the box, and provide a means to bring fresh-air in to directly vent the motor. Even toying with the idea of dust evacuation near the top. We’ll see.


here's some things on dust collecting that may be of use to you...
*here's the thread....*


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## Nickp (Dec 4, 2012)

Nice job...and liking your Jet DC...:grin:


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## mbrun (Jan 12, 2020)

Thanks for that snorkel picture. That is the exact device I have for use on the box for attaching the dust collection hose. 

There is a problem using that particular device on a porter cable 7518 motor as the vent intake holes are actually located on the side of the motor housing. I had thought about using a 6” flex duct around the plastic motor housing but that would actually choke off air flow. It would also prevent access to both the power and speed control switch. Some other means will be needed. I am currently thinking I may need to use a couple of pieces of highly flexible 2” vinyl hose or perhaps even fabric wrapped around a piece of wire spiral. Anybody else add a snorkel to a porter cable 7518 successfully?


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

mbrun said:


> 1... Thanks for that snorkel picture.
> 2... Anybody else add a snorkel to a porter cable 7518 successfully?


1... that's a start collar..
2... yes...


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

read the PDF..
https://www.routerforums.com/2030613-post7.html


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## Herb Stoops (Aug 28, 2012)

I cut a hole in the bottom of the box for the router base to go through and the routerlift posts also. Then I set the router on hi speed and used a separate speed control mounted under the table top to control the router. You are on the right track to give the router clean air to breathe.
Herb


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## mbrun (Jan 12, 2020)

Stick, thanks for the PDF and suggestion. Now comes the fun of working out the specific configuration for my situation.


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

yur welcome...
work out the fit/sizing/templates w/ pieces of light weight cardboard and tape 1st...
as in lengths, curves, rounds, rectangles, squares and what nots...


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## mbrun (Jan 12, 2020)

Today I completed the assembly of the extension with the attachment of the bracing beneath and start of the dust collection box. I attached the bracing using screws in such way that if I find the need to shim that I could push or pull to suit. 

Once assembled I set it up on some saw horses, set the lift in and leveled it. Just wanted to see how well the insert would level up. Turned out sweet.

I have since turned it upside down on my assembly table to work out the nuances of motor ventilation and dust collection for my particular equipment combination. I am now taking inspiration from Stick’s PDF and other recommendations I have read here on the forum. I will post more as I progress.

Can’t wait to get this mounted in the saw.











































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## mbrun (Jan 12, 2020)

BTW, something I know I am going to need to do when this is installed is add support. This extension is a beast. I currently intend to add diagonal bracing between the extension and cabinet saw base. I will likely also add some degree of adjustable support between the extension and the floor, if nothing more than to ease some of the strain on the fence rails. 

Given that I made the dust box out of 3/4, I could add a simple stabilizer between the underside of the box and the floor. 


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

nice work...

I gots suggestions... (in multiple posts, one thing at a time)

the mounting screws for the reinforcements...
did you countersink or counterbore them...
counterbores are less likely to split the reinforcements and will hold tighter longer...
you have resonance and vibration to contend w/...
the V of the countersunk screw tends to act as a splitting wedge...
the flat of the counterbore acts as hold down clamp...

.


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

speed and on/off controls.

my speed controller died because of capacitor failures... (on several of my 7518's)
I bypassed the controller, added external speed control along w/ on/off....

*see this post....*
and these threads...
https://www.routerforums.com/tools-woodworking/98266-pc-7518-a.html
https://www.routerforums.com/genera...er-motor-bearing-replacement.html#post2083545

.


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

motor venting...

solid mount a square tube to the bottom of the router box...
free float the end of the motor inside of the tube...
look to PVC down spouts or PVC post covers...
make your own tube from ¼'' ply...
if you feel that you need to gasket the tube to the motor us a door sweep or a door astragal......
https://www.ultrafab.com/product/door-sweeps/

Plan ''B''...
Pin the tube to the lift's motor bracket... (best way w/ external controls)...


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

Dust collection...

put a door on the box...
add kants to inside corners of your box changing it to an octagon...
add opposing air inlets/venting to the box near the top to exceed the square inches of DC hose... 
2 sides or all 4 but balanced...
I did about 50 square inches total of DC air inlet divided between 2 opposing sides consisting of 2 clusters of 2½'' holes.... (1 cluster on each side)...
Herb did one better and did his w/ adjustable gates for his inlets...
right angle boot (see the pic) the bottom for your DC pickup... it's a HVAC flanged floor register...
extend the motor air supply snorkel out the bottom and right through wall of the boot...

*Note:*
see you BB HVAC and plumbing departments fp your DC components...
@Herb Stoops... got any details on your adjustable inlets for this man????


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## mbrun (Jan 12, 2020)

Stick486 said:


> nice work...
> 
> I gots suggestions... (in multiple posts, one thing at a time)
> 
> ...



Good point Stick. Yes, all points of support are handled with counterbored holes, fitted with perfectly sized steel washers and washer head Robertson drive screws. Where you see all the holes in the horizontal beams and cross members that is what is there. I used Forstner bit for the counterbore. 


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## mbrun (Jan 12, 2020)

Stick486 said:


> speed and on/off controls.
> 
> my speed controller died because of capacitor failures... (on several of my 7518's)
> I bypassed the controller, added external speed control along w/ on/off....
> ...



My 7518 is only a few months old. I have learned that B&D has cut quality in the current generation of PC products and that they are prone to failures like you indicate. When I fall victim to this, and by all indications I will, I will go outboard. In the meantime I am going to enjoy the integral speed control with built-in feedback loop. (BTW, I love they way my Type 1 DEWALT DW625 speed control works. I think the type 1 was merely a colored change of the ELU) I did watch a video already on replacing the bearings on this guy as well as the SC just so I knew what I was getting myself into. If I recall correctly, the B&D charges about 1/2-2/3 the price of the router for a $2 speed control.


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## mbrun (Jan 12, 2020)

Stick486 said:


> Dust collection...
> 
> put a door on the box...
> add kants to inside corners of your box changing it to an octagon...
> ...



Most definitely will be adding a door. Currently thinking I will put primary air intake for dust evacuation in the upper part of the door. 

Before dinner I was outside playing with cardboard pieces to better visualize the details of how I will construct baffles to direct airflow and dust.

I made my dust box extra deep (front to back) with the idea that I would add a vertical plenum of sorts in the back side of the box. I would then draw air for dust evacuation through vents in the front door, across and above a horizontal baffle through the bit area and then down the vertical plenum. I believe I got the idea of the horizontal baffle idea from you and your many posts. I am pretty convinced I make that baffle light weight and yet strong enough to it can travel up and down with my lift.

At present, I do see bringing dedicated fresh are into the bottom of the box to feed the motor. The motor will suck that clean air up through the motor to the upper chamber (above the baffle of course) and this warm air will mix with the cross-ventilation and saw dust that is being sucked to the back of the box, down and out through that 4”x12” vertical plenum. That horizontal baffle higher up could end up resulting in little dust in the portion of the box that contains the motor. 

For my air inlets, I will do something that is adjustable so air flow can be tweaked.


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## Herb Stoops (Aug 28, 2012)

Here are the pictures of the adjustable side vent.
Herb


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## mbrun (Jan 12, 2020)

Herb Stoops said:


> Here are the pictures of the adjustable side vent.
> Herb



Thanks Herb. 

How well would you rate dust collection for your setup?


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## Herb Stoops (Aug 28, 2012)

mbrun said:


> Thanks Herb.
> 
> How well would you rate dust collection for your setup?
> 
> ...


Not 100%, the box is clean below the table except the dead air spaces in the corners. The DC in the fence works good, but there is always that small bit on the top of the table that seems to avoid getting caught. However I will say that it is way better than before I had DC under the table where plies of chips used to collect on the shelf. Before I installed the adjustable vent i was starving the airflow out of the box under the table and I feared that the airflow was not enough to keep the chips from settling out in the duct before they reached the Cyclone. I would have to open a gate between the router table and the DC in order to increase the air flow. Now I can get max. flow out of the box and the router can breathe clean air from under the table.
Herb


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

Herb Stoops said:


> Not 100%,
> 
> 1... the box is clean below the table except the dead air spaces in the corners.
> 2... The DC in the fence works good, but there is always that small bit on the top of the table that seems to avoid getting caught.


1... the kant strips will solve that issue and add ''vortex'' to the box..
2... you can fix that... it can be done in metal instead...
see the PDF...

.


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## mbrun (Jan 12, 2020)

Here you can see just the dust collection box as I continue to work through my ideas. The router lift is being held in place with the piece of scrap wood that served as my guinea pig before I routed the opening in the real extension.

If you look close you can see I have created the vertical channel in the back that drops down to the 4” outlet. You will see also a horizontal divider positioned at a height that does not impact the lift. 

I still expect I will draw clean fresh air into the bottom of the box to serve the motor (opening not yet created) along with the main fresh air intake for dust extraction entering in via a vent high in the front door. 

I still intend to tweak the shape and fit horizontal divider around the motor and lift to lessen or eliminate any dust that would drop into the lower compartment. I think the horizontal divider is going to need to be made in two pieces. One in the back, and one in the front. The back piece likely being permanently fixed while the front piece is removable so it can slide out a bit when the lift and motor need to be removed. This ability will allow me to hold tight tolerances around the motor and lift while in use, but giving me ability to clear the 7518’s speed control during lift removal.

With the current layout I am guaranteed I can tweak the airflow sufficiently that the motor will never be starved of fresh clean cool air while I also provide adequate airflow for good dust pickup.

I expect I will make more progress this weekend. May even mount the extension table in the saw and anchor the box later. We’ll see. 

Isn’t prototyping fun? 



































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## mbrun (Jan 12, 2020)

Well, today yielded more progress. I feel pretty good about the way things are turning out. And, I think progress is good enough I can turn my attention now to getting the extension installed in the table saw.

I made the horizontal separator between upper and lower chambers as two pieces and installed them so the front half can be pulled out easily when I have need to remove the lift and motor for service. Making it in two pieces also enabled me to lessen necessary clearances between the separator and router, which in turn, will lessen the dust that may still make it into the lower chamber. Assuming I achieve optimum intake sizes above and below the divider that should not be a concern.










In the next picture you can see the vertical chase in the back of the box where dust will travel down to the dust collection port on the back of the box.

















Here you can see the center divider pulled out. Both front and back pieces can be removed.









Here is the router in its lowest “storage” position. The divider is as high as it can be.

















Here you can see the router at its highest position. Notice how the speed switch resides just below the divider. 








And when the router is at its highest, the fresh air intake for the motor remains in the lower and cleanest chamber. Now, when the dust collector is running, the dust collector will be encouraging air flow thru and around the motor, aiding the routers internal natural fan flow. 








Here you can see the router in place but with the front half of the center divider still removed.









Thoughts?

I will post more as I progress.


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## mbrun (Jan 12, 2020)

Well I did make progress today but did not complete the installation. I have a few more things to work out.

When I removed the old router extension I found that the front steel angle of my Biesemeyer home shop T-square fence has actually bent downwards slightly (about 1/16-3/32 in). I knew that my old extension was not level nor coplanar anymore but honestly I thought it was wood movement and my sloppy craftsmanship from decades ago. Turns out three factors involved. 

In any event, I have to make sure I have good solid support for the extension in the saw. For now, I just cut some wood to serve as temporary supports. The 2x4 legs and post below the dust box are providing that support.




















Oh, and by the way, I bolted a piece of 3”x2” steel angle to the side of the saw tight to the underside of the cast iron to provide support for the extension front to back (I did not take pictures of that yet). I also added 5 lockable jack screws equally spaced along the angle so I could adjust the extension flush with the cast iron. So far that seems it will work well. I am thinking I am going to need metal bracket(s) and bolt or all thread to draw and hold the extension tight to the cast iron.

Couple of questions.

Anybody every experience a bend in their Biesemeyer fence front support angle? If so, what did you do about it?

Other than drilling holes in the end of the extension for adding bolts to secure the extension to the cast iron, what other means have you seen used to draw and hold the extension tight to the cast iron?


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## mbrun (Jan 12, 2020)

Back once again.

There has been only limited progress this past week. I did manage to get a wood block cut, drilled and mounted to the lower side of the saw to receive the angled supports. The angled supports will help to ensure that the extension remains in alignment when moving saw around even if pulling up on the extension a bit.

I am making the supports out of BB in two pieces that will be slightly adjustable in their final form. There should be just enough adjustment that I can tweak the length sufficient to push the extension up just enough to ensure it remains coplanar with the cast iron.

Currently I have a 3” square post under the router box to provide stability should I push down to hard on the extension. I believe now that more traditional legs with adjustable feet are likely in my future.

I got a bit antsy the other night so I dropped in the lift, added a temporary fence and made some saw dust. 

Once the angled fence rails are secured to the extension I will reassemble and adjust the fence system so I can make the door for the dust collection box, the couple of remaining pieces I need for the angle supports and the adjustable corner legs.



























That’s all for now.


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## RainMan 2.0 (May 6, 2014)

Very nice work, actually the best I’ve seen so far . Your making me want to try it again


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## mbrun (Jan 12, 2020)

This weekend saw good progress. I am back operational. I can use my table saw and route. Here is the finished product.











I finished construction of the angled support braces and got them installed. Carriage bolts are installed between layer 1 and layer 2. Layer 2 has elongated slots so I can expand or collapse the length as necessary to ensure the extension is even. If you look closely at the supports, you will see I left a small gap between the two pieces in a manner that enables the use of shims and a mallet to expand the pieces so the top can be raised slightly before being tightened down.










Here is how the supports are attached to the underside of the table:











I did some experimentations regarding air flow using different pieces of scrap wood and mocking up different combinations and sizes of holes. I had multiple objectives. One, make sure there is sufficient upward air flow from the bottom compartment into the top compartment that dust would not have a tendency to fall down into the bottom; Two, provide clean air source in the bottom compartment to serve cooling needs of motor; Three, provide sufficient air flow into and through the top compartment that no dust collects there; Lastly, ensure that a downward draft occurs around the bit such that when routing a dado, most of the dust will still be drawn downward into the box and routed into the dust collection system. At present, it seems as though I have nailed it.

The top compartment has three sources of fresh air. The fan in the motor, the gap between the center divider and motor, and the row of horizontal holes in the front door. The door holds align with the top of the center divider. With dust being extracted out the back of the box the cross ventilation created front to back ensures that no dust puddles on the top shelf. 

The bottom compartment has two sources of air. A row of holes (similar to top compartment), plus a 2-inch hole in the side through which the power cord passes.

When the DC is on, you can feel the air being sucked into all the holes including top, both rows of door holes and the side cord hole. 

After spending about 15 minutes routing dadoes and then chamfers on scrap wood, opening the box, yielded nothing visible in either the top or bottom chamber. 

Here again are some inside views of the box. 










In this view, looking down through the hole you can see just barely see the dust port in the lower back of the box.










When I sized my extension and spotted the router, I did not want the router to interfere with the table saw fence. At the same time, I wanted to leverage my table saw fence as a attachment for my router fence.

In the following image you can see the right-most limit of the table saw fence. It will not contact any router bit less than 1.5 inch diameter.









And here you can see my shop fabricated router fence in place.











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## TenGees (Sep 12, 2012)

Looks great, Michael. That extrusion is very versatile for the feather boards, stop blocks or even a 'hat' type bit guard. Well done.


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## mbrun (Jan 12, 2020)

Thanks Paul. I used the extrusion for my miter saw station as well. It’s a bit on the pricey side, but I was fortunate to obtain small lot of it from a former employer when they moved and at a price I could not pass up. Still have about 20’ left for future jigs.

I need to find a better way to spread the bottom layer apart when I need to widen or lessen the gap around the bit.


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## mbrun (Jan 12, 2020)

Just had to share something I particularly like about configuration I ended up with. Having done a couple of small shop projects recently, the fact that the full usable width afforded by the table fence is available to me without having to drop the router bit out of the way is super nice. It was almost like having a separate router table but without the space requirement. Multiple times I found myself needing to switch back to the table saw, then back to router and I was able to do so without changing my bit setup.

Something to keep in mind when considering the table saw extension option. 


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## mbrun (Jan 12, 2020)

So yesterday I had the router running constantly for about 40 minutes with dust collector on. I had been using a pattern bit. Just as I was about done it dawned on me that now would be a good time to get a temperature measurement of the router. I grabbed my Fluke DVM with temperature probe, turned off the DC and router, opened the door and immediately took its temperature. 78 deg F. Ambient room temperature was 65 deg F. So, a mere 13 deg rise. Not bad at all. I put my hands on the motor directly, and honestly, I could not tell the motor had even been on. 

Back in late fall, before I had a dust collection box, I had taken some temperature measurements before and after a 20 minute playing-with-the router session (I actually had the probe attached to motor case the whole time). Back then, I experienced about 30 degree temperature. 13 is looking really good.


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