# Another shellac question



## boxer (Sep 15, 2004)

I was wondering if there is a wood that shellac should not be applied on. Specifically, purpleheart. What say you good people?


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

HI Boxer

I'm not the pro.when it comes to shellac but if you clean the wood with Acetone then shellac should stick...they use shellac on just about all woods.. 

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boxer said:


> I was wondering if there is a wood that shellac should not be applied on. Specifically, purpleheart. What say you good people?


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## jerrymayfield (Sep 25, 2004)

Shellac is the universal sealer, I think it would stick to peanut butter. If shellac were invented(discovered) today it would be proclaimed as a miracle finish. Can you tell I like shellac ?.

Regards

Jerry


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## jerryc (Nov 27, 2007)

Properly prepared shellac should stick to any wood. I've used it on teak --oily.
Merbau another oily wood and western red cedar. 
Only problem you are likely to encounter with shellac is if you use old shellac. Once mixed with meth, shellac begins to absorb moisture. True it's at a slow rate but why cause yourself potential problems. I keep dry flakes and only mix enough for the job in hand. As the others have said, it's a wonder finish. I've even used it on the interior woodwork of my yacht instead of varnish, on vanity units in two bathrooms and on kitchen cabinets. 

Jerry


Everyone is entitled to my opinion


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## boxer (Sep 15, 2004)

I appreciate all of the replies. I'm just starting with shellac and I gotta say, it's far from the ease of the Danish oil I've been using. 
One more question, please. Can anyone tell me the difference between applying a shellac finish and french polishing?
Boxer


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## jerrymayfield (Sep 25, 2004)

One major difference, in french polishing the grain of the wood is filled with pumice. Forget all about varnishing when using shellac,its a different animal.

Regards

Jerry


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## boxer (Sep 15, 2004)

Thanks, Jerry. I knew I could count on you. I really appreciate your willingness to share your experiences and knowledge on finishing. It's a real weakness for me and it's great to be able to rely on knowledgable people like yourself and others here to set me on the right path.
Boxer


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## jerryc (Nov 27, 2007)

Boxer, 
You say using shellac is far from the ease of using Danish Oil. To me shellac is one of the easiest finishes. What troubles are you having? Perhaps I can help.
Shellac? I love it.

Everyone is entitled to my opinion

Jerry


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## boxer (Sep 15, 2004)

Jerry, I am finishing boxes. Some are 6" square, to 6"x9" and others. I really have a hard time doing the inside of these boxes. I did a little research on applying shellac and french polishing and I may be getting some aspects of the two mixed up. Or it may be the denatured alchohol in my closed up garage that's screwing me up. Even on the outside, I can't seem to get a good even coat without smudges from the pad on it. I've kinda given up on it and gone back to spraying lacquer for now, as the boxes are backing up a little. It's really frustrating because I'm usually able to do anything that I set my mind to with just a little practice. I just can't seem to get the hang of this right now. I'm sure I'll try again later this year. Right now the conditions are perfect for spraying lacquer. But when Summer hits, not so much.
Thanks for responding, Kevin


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## jerryc (Nov 27, 2007)

*shellac*

Boxer,

I have to confess I have little experience in dealing with small box interiors. I use a rubber when applying shellac but whether it would be suitable for the interior I know not. Perhaps the interior could be flock sprayed.

The fact that you are finding the shellac smearing might be because you are either using too thick a mix or applying the finish too liberally. I know in your country they talk of one pound, two pound,, etc mixes but I'm a simple soul. I put shellac into a container and just cover it with meth. If it's too thick I add more meth and if too thin it gets more flakes. I don't buy premixed finish because once it is mixed it begins to absorb moisture and it is that that gives shellac a bad name for not being waterproof. I only mix enough for the job in hand or for the next few weeks

If smearing occurs it's easy to correct. I make three rubbers, one general purpose, one small for fiddly bits and a meth rubber to correct mistakes. Just use the meth rubber to reactivate the finish

My rubbers are made of a ball of unmedicated cotton wool just a bit bigger than a baseball wrapped in linen. The shellac is poured into the back with a squeeze bottle. Putting it in from the back has the advantage of filtering any rubbish out and means you can control the amount of shellac applied. Want more? Give the rubber a squeeze. 
You can use a brush but they are expensive and a cheaper way to go is to buy a blusher makeup brush. Just wash it in meth first to get rid of loose hairs.

I've included the way I fold a rubber in attachments and hope this submission is of some help

Jerry

Everyone is enitled to my opinion


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## boxer (Sep 15, 2004)

Thanks, Jerry. I bought the Zinnser 3# cut of clear shellac. I used denatured alchohol to cut it to 1#. The boxes I make are from a lot of exotic woods. I could never bring myself to flock the inside of a zebrawood box. As I stated before, I will go back to practicing with shellac. I just have to keep production rolling for now. I appreciate the photo diary of how you fold a rubber. I've been using cut-up pieces of t-shirt wrapped up in a square of t-shirt. Maybe that's something I need to tweak as well.
Thanks again,
Kevin


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## bobi (Oct 11, 2008)

Can I put Helmsman spar urethane over a shellac finish


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## Bob N (Oct 12, 2004)

bobi said:


> Can I put Helmsman spar urethane over a shellac finish



You betcha.... just be sure the shellc is the dewaxed type.


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## Timeman (Oct 3, 2008)

lac bug wings !! shellac Is an old story, we in the modern day want to know what these compounds are.. If one wants to play with timber finishing and make it last 

Meaning:

Once it was commonly believed that shellac was a resin obtained from the wings of an insect (order Hemiptera) found in India. In actuality, shellac is obtained from the secretion of the female insect, harvested from the bark of the trees where she deposits it to provide a sticky hold on the trunk. There is a risk that the harvesting process can scoop the insect up along with the secretion, leading to its death. The natural coloration of lac residue is greatly influenced by the sap consumed by the lac insect and the season of the harvest. Generally in the trade of seedlac there are two distinct colors: the orange Bysacki and the blonde Kushmi.

When purified, the chemical takes the form of golden yellow/ golden brown flakes, this possibly providing the basis for the "Wing Source Story." Shellac is a natural polymer and is chemically similar to synthetic polymers, thus it is considered a natural plastic. It can be turned into a moulding compound when mixed with woodflour and moulded under heat and pressure methods, so it is classified as thermoplastic. But old mouldings tend to become thermoset; that is, they suffer chemical reactions over time and are no longer fusible.

I do not use other sealers Shellac is by far the best sealer and preserver for indoors and outdoors if its waxed well.. Clean cotton sheets linen and meths and a lot of time if you want lust from your work  

Is spar urethane like Polyurethane ?

Polyurethane is for boats  I find on good timber and works we have done it clouds over time I mean 10 years but it just never really holds its look..

There are my tips in no way are they the right way  I just put it this way after 10 years or more of playing with Exotics and common timbers.

Cheers!


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## jerrymayfield (Sep 25, 2004)

As I have said many times,if shellac were first used today it would be hailed as a WONDER finish.

Regards

Jerry


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## Micawber (Feb 24, 2009)

Gidday, Just found this site. liked Jerry's suggestio0n for the rubbers. As a complete newbie I was wondering if the water marks on a table can be helped with the reactivation with meths.. If you have time Jerry maybe you can let me know.. Micawber


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## jerryc (Nov 27, 2007)

Sorry folks I've been out of action for the last two months. Couple of long stays in hospital. However I'm back and so can answer questions although I know jerrymayfield does an equally good trumpeting for SHELLAC-- THE WONDER FINISH. 

To answer you question Micawber, Water marks on shellac can be removed. One problem with shellac however is that as it ages it gets tougher to reactivate. Not impossible, just tougher. By all means try reactivation by rubbing with meth, it will work, but be prepared to find it hard work. Since shellac is so easy to patch and repair it might even be possible to use a very light sandpaper as a last resort. I can go into that if necessay

It would be a help if you can either describe or better still post a picture of these marks. I am assuming they are white rings but more info would be useful.

Jerryc


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## Micawber (Feb 24, 2009)

Thanks Jerry, hope all is well with you now........... The marks came out easily with the reactivation of the surface. Must be newer than I thought at first.. Regards, Micawber


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## curiousgeorge (Nov 6, 2006)

For those interested. Here is a link to a very informative video on shellac. Charles Neil is a master woodworker but he loves to finish. He says he only builds so he has something to finish. Its the one called "Shellac: Woodworkers Best Friend"....

http://charlesneilwoodworking.com/category_player.php?type=1&cat=3


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## GBM (Dec 18, 2007)

I highly recommend the book... which many consider the Bible of Wood Finishing... by Bob Flexner ... " Understanding Wood Finishing, How to Select and Apply the Right Finish" by ' American Woodworker' - Reader's Digest. 

It is really a spectacular book and he too loves Shellac.... 

He says " Shellac is the most underrated of all finishes"...


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## bobi (Oct 11, 2008)

Jerry what is meth, bobi


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## GBM (Dec 18, 2007)

I am pretty sure he was using an abbreviation for a type of alcohol which is commonly used to clean oil from wood before applying finishes.. 

TYPES OF ALCOHOL AND ALCOHOLIC BEVERAGES


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## jmg1017 (Apr 9, 2009)

Here's what I do for small tight places that are tough to reach to shellac properly; don't shellac them. I don't see the need on the inside of a small box, there's just no benefit. Just boiled Linseed oil (or Danish oil if you prefer) and finish with wax applied with 0000 steel wool and buff it out.


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## CarlB (Feb 17, 2010)

Sorry guys, I"m new to this forum. What is this meth you speak of?


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## Al Robins (Jul 13, 2009)

Carl...I think we are talking of methylated spirits...used for diluting shellac.......AL


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## BigJimAK (Mar 13, 2009)

meth = methyl alcohol... Here in the US it is commonly sold as Denatured alcohol. The big-box stores sell it in 1 gallon cans.


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## tiggol (Mar 15, 2010)

LOL BOXER , JERRY I got to ask What is the differance between Shellac and say a clear coat diamond Varathane? ( water base) I call every thing shellac. On my to give that wood a good shellackin.


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## tiggol (Mar 15, 2010)

O boy i am lost I have to ask what is shellac? I am a oppoised to Varathane clear coat? 
i mean i call everything shellac. Off to give that wood a good shellackin! lol


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## bobi (Oct 11, 2008)

Jerry could you give me the recipe for your shellac and alcohol mix. I notice you called it meth? I also need some tips on appling shellac to larger surfaces such as table tops approx. 18 ft2. For me Shellac is very difficult to control. I find it setting up too quickly and I tend to get smudges. I need your technique using your method using rubbers. I have been using china brushes but I get streaking along with start/ finish lines. Can you help me? Bobi


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## AlanSweet (Apr 28, 2010)

I build boxes from time to time and frequently use shellac on the interior. I do, however, cheat. I finish the inside of the box surfaces before assembling a box. Normally, I use a bandsaw to cut off the top after assembly and do have to touch up the inside edges. Luckily, I have not had any squeeze out on the inside for awhile, so I don't have any cleanup problem there. But I have used a small putty knife covered with soft cloth to repair corner areas with shellac. That is a tedious process.


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