# About to attempt first window project, sanity check



## bobbotron (Jan 7, 2010)

So I'm planning on making two small windows, each about 27"x11". They're going to be for a shed, and mounted kind of like a sliding barn door, so they'll slide horizontally on a wooden track. I'm planing on using old red cedar that was reclaimed from a sauna someone in town was tearing down. (Score!) 

I'm planing on making it very basically, just a square profile, and probably dowels for the joinery. (I have great luck with dowels.)

I have a few questions about window making, I was hoping you guys and gals could help me out:


If I understand it right, a wooden sash is basically a frame, with a rebate on the inside, all the way around. Then you place the glass in, and using glazing putty and points to bed the glass? Does that make sense? I always thought there was a piece of trim on the outside, is this not the case?
The wood I have is "real" 2x3 cedar, nice and straight stuff. How small do you think I could make the window, and how big of a rebate should I make in it? It would be nice if I could make the window sashes a little narrower, so there's more room for window, but I don't want to make it fragile.

My SO does stained glass, so once I get done she'll have a project to do. Win win! :happy:

I'm planning on finishing it with tung oil, looking forward to it!


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## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

*What a Pane!*

?...there are two major components, Rob. The frame and the sash. BOTH have their rebates on the *exterior*!
The frame is rebated to accept the sash...7 to 10 degree slope on the sill...from the outside. That alone would prevent you from installing a tightly fitted sash from the interior. 
The sash has it's rebates also from the exterior; puttying is done on the _outside_. There are no mouldings involved in the glazing, unless of course you wish to use them, bedded into a glazing compound.
If you're thinking of the typical profile as seen from the interior of a traditional wood window, that's a decorative cut made directly into the sash components.
Sealed units are usually set into either glazing tape or a glazing compound, with a very small moulding set tightly into the perimeter. NO MITRE JOINTS!!!!
Don't even _think_ about using them! They lead moisture right into the heart of the frame and sash.
Cheers, eh!
-Dan


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## bobbotron (Jan 7, 2010)

DaninVan said:


> ?...there are two major components, Rob. The frame and the sash. BOTH have their rebates on the *exterior*!
> The frame is rebated to accept the sash...7 to 10 degree slope on the sill...from the outside. That alone would prevent you from installing a tightly fitted sash from the interior.
> The sash has it's rebates also from the exterior; puttying is done on the _outside_. There are no mouldings involved in the glazing, unless of course you wish to use them, bedded into a glazing compound.
> If you're thinking of the typical profile as seen from the interior of a traditional wood window, that's a decorative cut made directly into the sash components.
> ...



Hey Dan,

Thanks for the help! I'm planning on using dowels for the joinery, I got most of the way there yesterday, but it started to rain just when I was getting close to that. (And no mitre'd joints!)

I'm going for a bit of a cheeky design - these are going on my outhouse, so instead of a traditional frame, the sashes are going to be mounted on a wooden track on the outside of the building, so they'll slide horizontally out of the way. They wont fit that tight to the wall, but that's not that important for the building, a bit of extra air circulation is a good thing here


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## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

Dowel joints are good.


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## bobbotron (Jan 7, 2010)

Bit of an update on these sashes. I've got them all together with dowels and have a few coats of oil/varnish on them. They're looking pretty rustic, I think they'll turn out well!


IMG_2462 by bobbotron1, on Flickr


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## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

Rob; you need a sill (sloped) on the outside to lead water away from the wall below the window. That's a very vulnerable place for water to enter! Also, a flashing over the_ top_ and under the rainscreen/ tarpaper and siding. Another vulnerable entry point. Take the top flashing out beyond the exterior trim.
Otherwise, nicely done, Sir! 
Cheers,
-Dan
ps the *&&*^$%#$ rain just keeps coming down here. I'm trying to get 30 - 8" x 30" 'Sonotube' concrete ftg. forms in but I don't want them getting wet before I pour. I'm past frustrated and well into angry...


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## bobbotron (Jan 7, 2010)

DaninVan said:


> Rob; you need a sill (sloped) on the outside to lead water away from the wall below the window. That's a very vulnerable place for water to enter! Also, a flashing over the_ top_ and under the rainscreen/ tarpaper and siding. Another vulnerable entry point. Take the top flashing out beyond the exterior trim.
> Otherwise, nicely done, Sir!
> Cheers,
> -Dan
> ps the *&&*^$%#$ rain just keeps coming down here. I'm trying to get 30 - 8" x 30" 'Sonotube' concrete ftg. forms in but I don't want them getting wet before I pour. I'm past frustrated and well into angry...


For sure, there'll definitely be some sloped sills to direct water away. I have some time to think about that, as I'm waiting for my SO to do the glass for these.  

That's too bad about the rain! For what it's worth, those sonotubes can get a bit wet and still hold their shape well enough. How deep do you have to make them? Around here, the frost heave is pretty mighty, I think they have to be at least 3 to 4 feet deep, a real pain. I'm not looking forward to that for the cabin I'm going to build!


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## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

Frost? What's frost?.... 
Rob, they're down 2' --- 6" above grade...we're living on a glacial moraine so digging is a nightmare...x30
Strangest damn thing; I dug 5 yesterday, wrapped the sonotube forms in poly, and then backfilled. There was virtually_ no extra gravel left over from the spoil_! Where'd the 5 X 24" X 8"dia. volume disappear to?! There should have been a couple of wheelbarrows full at least. One of life's mysteries...


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## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

Oh yeh, and Cedar roots...lots of Cedar roots


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## bobbotron (Jan 7, 2010)

So these are officially finished and installed, here are the photos of the final project! I don't think the interior picture does it justice, it looks quite warm in real life inside.


Untitled by bobbotron1, on Flickr


Untitled by bobbotron1, on Flickr


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## N'awlins77 (Feb 25, 2011)

Very nice looking, indeed Rob!


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## Ironman50 (Jun 5, 2012)

Looking very good to me.


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## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

Rob; now I get the sliding thing. How does moisture (frozen water?) drain out of the lower track? Is it actually open on the inside of the channel? 
Nice touch with the stained glass! Isn't there supposed to be a crescent moon in the pane somewhere...


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## Fishinbo (Jun 11, 2012)

Feeling the warmth of the light coming through the stained glass.


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## bobbotron (Jan 7, 2010)

DaninVan said:


> Rob; now I get the sliding thing. How does moisture (frozen water?) drain out of the lower track? Is it actually open on the inside of the channel?
> Nice touch with the stained glass! Isn't there supposed to be a crescent moon in the pane somewhere...


Hey Dan! Thanks, my girlfriend made the stained glass.

There are some drainage holes drilled in the bottom track for drainage, and it's not sealed well at the ends, more will be drilled as needed. We've had some huge storms, and that side barely gets rain - must be the big overhang over top?


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