# Sticky  New CNC build using 80/20 extruded aluminum



## Noob (Apr 18, 2009)

Even though I don't know jack about electronics, I've embarked on a journey to build a CNC. I've looked at different plans for some time using MDF or plywood, but I've read a few threads about not using wood for the main structure (such as Check twice!'s build: New-build-cnc-router )

I even bought 2 DIY plans, one for a Rockcliff and the other for a Solsylva. Instead I'm going the Erector-set route and buying modular parts and extrusions. I think the most challenging part will be the electronics/software. I'm sure I'll be asking questions and hope I'll get help from time to time. I'm on the CNCZone, but that place is like a maze trying to sort through it sometimes.

The useable area is about 2ft x 3ft, and I think it will cost about $1,700. That is cheaper and have a larger working area than Rockler's smallest CNC I believe.

Most parts are from CNCRouterparts.com, and my electronics are from Finelineautomation.com since they had $50 off for Black Friday.

Basics:
Electronics: Gecko G540 pushing 3 High-torque Nema 23 380 oz-in stepper motors finelineautomation 3 Axis Electronics Kit

Mechanical: Using Linear carriages that are basically ABEC 7 rollerskate wheels that ride on 1/4" thick cold rolled steel flatbar: cncrouterparts mechanical parts
(also purchased all necessary mechanical parts from them).

And the leadscrews are 1/2-10 5-start ACME threaded rod McMaster #98940A627

The 80/20 1530 & 3030 extrusion (1 1/2" x 3" & 3" x 3") is from the 80/20 Garage sale on Ebay. 8020inc 

I'll be using my Porter Cable 690 router motor for the spindle.

For a general idea of what it will look like see this build: glacialwanderer

By the way, Fineline sells complete kits including all holes drilled in the extrusions and flatbar, but I'm saving money buy doing it myself.

I still need to buy:
ACME rod
Cold rolled steel flatbar
Mach 3
Emergency Stop
Limit switches
Wire/cable
Fasteners/hardware

Wish me luck


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Welcome to the RWS forum


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## Noob (Apr 18, 2009)

I bought the cold rolled steel flatbar cut to length from Metal Supermarkets LINK, but since they have a Dallas location, I didn't have to pay for shipping since I picked it up in person.

I cut all the aluminum extrusion to length. Now I have to drill some holes in both the 80/20 and the flatbar, tap a few ends of the 80/20, then I can start to assemble them. 

I still need to buy a few corner pieces and joint plates to stiffen up the joints, but other than that, I have pretty much everything now.

Here is a vid of me bench-testing the steppers: X,Y,Z stepper test LINK

And here is a vid of me trying out the e-stop: Testing E-stop LINK

Oh yeah, I bought a wired XBox 360 controller (for Windows) and installed the XBox 360 plugin for Mach 3. I now have a pendant to move the X, Y and Z around with it. I don't have all of the buttons mapped yet, just the X, Y, and Z. I plan on mapping one of them for the auto-zero function.


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## Trevor Walsh (Jan 12, 2011)

This is sounding pretty awesome, what CAM software are you using to run your machine?


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## dovetail_65 (Jan 22, 2008)

I love the wireless 360 controller, I couldn't live without it now! Why did you go wired?


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## mouch (Jan 28, 2011)

*ext 80/20 cnc*

Nice build, where did you use the 3'x3'? Is it for the y axis.


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## mouch (Jan 28, 2011)

That little bit of 8020 ext cost $584.00 ?
Pretty expensive.


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## mouch (Jan 28, 2011)

Sorry previous post 3 inch x 3 inch
Thanks


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## Noob (Apr 18, 2009)

Trevor Walsh said:


> This is sounding pretty awesome, what CAM software are you using to run your machine?


I'll be using Cut 2D from Vectric for starters, but I'm thinking about getting Meshcam because I would be able to import .stl files from Solidworks.


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## Noob (Apr 18, 2009)

dovetail_65 said:


> I love the wireless 360 controller, I couldn't live without it now! Why did you go wired?


I've heard that the wireless 360 controller batteries didn't last very long. I was going to get rechargeable batteries, but when I went to Gamestop all they had at the time was wired controllers. I looked at it as a 1-time payment without having to buy batteries for it.


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## Noob (Apr 18, 2009)

mouch said:


> Nice build, where did you use the 3'x3'? Is it for the y axis.


the 3" x 3" was on the Gantry. This pic isn't very clear, but it's the one going left to right. I need to cut out a router mount, but I've already attached the z-axis and all steppers and test ran it manually with the controller.

I have plenty of other pics if you have any other questions.


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## Noob (Apr 18, 2009)

mouch said:


> That little bit of 8020 ext cost $584.00 ?
> Pretty expensive.


$368 actually, and that includes shipping.


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## mouch (Jan 28, 2011)

Thanks, Really nice build Im including some of your design in mine.


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## mouch (Jan 28, 2011)

Noob, if I use 3030 8020 do you think 4 inch wide steel will clear the carriages? 
Thanks


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## Noob (Apr 18, 2009)

mouch said:


> Thanks, Really nice build Im including some of your design in mine.


I can't really take credit for the design, the bugs were taken out by Nate and Ahren from FineLineAutomation and CNCRouterParts. I modified it a tiny bit, such as widening the Y-Axis 1/2" so that I could get a full 24" of travel in that direction. I also used 1530 (1 1/2" x 3") for the verticals of the gantry instead of 1545 ( 1 1/2" x 4 1/2") to save on cost.

The plans really aren't the easiest to use since it uses the free program "Edrawings" from Solidworks. The plans can be downloaded on the "Free plans" link on this page: FLA100-00 LINK

I redrew the whole thing in Solidworks and that helped because I am VERY familiar with it now and can take apart this machine and re-assemble it if I wanted to for whatever reason. 

A dedicated person could easily finish this machine in less than a month of free time on the weekends and a few weeknights, but it's been cold and I've gotten side-tracked a few times.

I can't say I would recommend ordering from FineLineAutomation because he doesn't really have good customer service. Email response time is typically a week minimum, not good if you ask me. On the otherhand, CNCRouterparts can typically respond to your email questions within hours, a day at most.

Since I completely redrew the plans, I'm going to see if it's alright to share them in PDF format since technically they aren't FLA's drawings.


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## Noob (Apr 18, 2009)

mouch said:


> Noob, if I use 3030 8020 do you think 4 inch wide steel will clear the carriages?
> Thanks


I'm not sure if I understand your question completely, but the Z-Axis is 4" steel and that extrusion is 1530, the same width as the 3030 (3").

See attached screenshot.

Let me know If I misunderstood you and I'll try and clear it up a bit more.


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## mouch (Jan 28, 2011)

Do you think that instead of the 6 inch steel 4 inch would work? Would the carriages clear, seems that it would be very close. Thanks.


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## Noob (Apr 18, 2009)

mouch said:


> Do you think that instead of the 6 inch steel 4 inch would work? Would the carriages clear, seems that it would be very close. Thanks.


I would stick with 6" on the gantry. The Z-Axis is cantilevered pretty good considering you'll have the weight of the router on their. Is cost the reason you want to use 4"? There is only about a $10 difference between the 2, so that really shouldn't matter a whole lot.

I bought my CRS from metalsupermarkets LINK, but another place to buy it from is onlinemetals LINK 

Here is there online quote, and it didn't include shipping, but if there is one close to you, you can pick it up and save money. (see attached pic)

If you buy it, make sure it is 1018 cold rolled steel and not hot rolled because CRS has flat edges and is within a few thousandths in tolerance width-wise.


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## gregW (Mar 14, 2007)

Noob said:


> IIf you buy it, make sure it is 1018 cold rolled steel and not hot rolled because CRS has flat edges and is within a few thousandths in tolerance width-wise.


you can also get CRS stock from Amazon...free shipping and I usually receive the order within 3 days.

Amazon.com: Cold Rolled Steel 1018 Rectangular Bar, 1/4" Thick, 6" Width, 36" Length: Industrial & Scientific

Thanks for posting the progress pics and good luck with your build!!!


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## mouch (Jan 28, 2011)

No cost isnt a factor. I was trying to run the gantry right on top of the side rails using 3030 for all parts and was trying to plan for the most clearance possible between the table and z axis without any upright extension. Thanks all.


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## Noob (Apr 18, 2009)

So you plan on mounting the 3030 on top of a table/bed without feet, is that correct? I found one like you are talking about I think (see attached pic).

That build is here: FandZ's 80/20 and nearly completely bolt together CNC build LINK

By the way, I did see some that used 4" CRS on a 3030 on the Y-axis so it might not be a problem on that axis after all: 8020 DIY CNC - Full Motion Test Youtube LINK

And his build thread can be found here: CNC Wood Router Project Log LINK


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## mouch (Jan 28, 2011)

Yes that is what I was thinking. I want to build cnc with about a 50"x65" cutting area. And just trying to plan it out a little before hand so I don't waste to much material, money, and time. I'm glad I found this sight and thanks again for all the help!!!


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## iplay1515 (Feb 19, 2011)

*Leadscrew Nuts*

Noob, you have a really fine looking machine. What type of nuts are you using on your leadscrews to help prevent backlash?


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## woodie26 (May 31, 2009)

Did you say that you have the plans in a PDF format ?
Thanks


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## Noob (Apr 18, 2009)

iplay1515 said:


> Noob, you have a really fine looking machine. What type of nuts are you using on your leadscrews to help prevent backlash?


I'm using these that are made out of delrin and have the hole pattern to match the 80/20 extrusion: 1/2-10 ACME Nut, 5 Start
[CRP109-00] LINK

Some prefer the Dumpster CNC, but if you use those you'll have to figure out a way to mount them. That wouldn't be difficult, but just mentioning that they don't bolt right up. Dumpster CNC ACME Anti-backlash Leadnuts LINK


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## Noob (Apr 18, 2009)

woodie26 said:


> Did you say that you have the plans in a PDF format ?
> Thanks


I'll have to clean them up a bit because I've tweaked it a time or two.

Got the top on, but have to figure out what I'm going to do about a spoilboard: DIY CNC router controlled with XBox 360 controller LINK

Not sure if I want to use T-Slots on the spoilboard or put a couple rows and columns of holes with 1/4-20 tee nuts to hold the wood down.

I've got some of these from Amazon, and I may use them instead. 1/4"-20 Hurricane Nuts LINK


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## davidbarr (Apr 28, 2009)

Every one needs to check out Noob's website. It has the best step by step router build I have seen thus far.


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## Noob (Apr 18, 2009)

davidbarr said:


> Every one needs to check out Noob's website. It has the best step by step router build I have seen thus far.


Thanks for looking 

It is a great idea to look at those step-by-step instructions because it can save you some time on assembling and dis-assembling; also they clarify some confusing parts of the build.

If you look at the attached pic, you will notice that I forgot to put the t-nuts into one of the extrusions, and also the bearing block is on the wrong extrusion.

That part of the assembly is an example that wasn't very clear. Directly behind where the t-nuts go, there are 2 screws that attach the 2 extrusions perpendicular to each other. In other words, in that pic, you see a vertical and horizontal extrusion attached like a "T", and a screw attaches those together. Then the t-nuts go behind those screws and the purpose of the t-nuts is to attach the motor mounts.

Sorry if that explanation is confusing, but you can see how it is supposed to be in the next pic.


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## bheller (Mar 2, 2011)

*Thanks*

I'm new to the site and was lurking around and found your thread and your site. Thanks for posting the vids. I have the same kit (bought it over 8 months ago). I'm just now getting the time to build it and the edrawings do leave a little to be desired. I understand better after watching. Thanks again.

Barry


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## Longboard (Aug 5, 2011)

woodie26 said:


> Did you say that you have the plans in a PDF format ?
> Thanks


Send me the plans also if you can. Ive been looking a few and yours looks best so far


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## Noob (Apr 18, 2009)

Longboard said:


> Send me the plans also if you can. Ive been looking a few and yours looks best so far


I didn't design it, I only widened it 1/2" so I could get a full 24" width part on there. Attached is a drawing with overall dimensions and an excel worksheet so you can get a better scope of this project.

I have a more detailed drawing that isn't the cleanest as far as drafting standards go, but it is much more easier to use than the Solidworks Edrawing that is not user friendly. I'll upload it some time this week.

Instead of holes with propel/hurricane nuts that I've been using to hold stuff down, i bought a couple of t-tracks from Rockler to hold stuff down since I had a coupon for $25 off of a $100 purchase. Instead of dadoing the spoiler board to hold the t-tracks, I'm going to cut 4" strips of MDF and lay them between the t-tracks. This way, if one part get's too chewed up, I only have to replace a a strip instead of the whole table top.


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## woodie26 (May 31, 2009)

I'm just starting my build, but I added Two inches to the Length and Width to the plans.:wacko:


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## woodie26 (May 31, 2009)

Do you think it makes a deffance to have the exter bearings on the x axis?
Thanks


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## Noob (Apr 18, 2009)

woodie26 said:


> I'm just starting my build, but I added Two inches to the Length and Width to the plans.:wacko:


Now I'm confused, are you asking if adding 2 inches is safe, or just stating that you changed it?


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## Noob (Apr 18, 2009)

woodie26 said:


> Do you think it makes a deffance to have the exter bearings on the x axis?
> Thanks


Honestly, I put bearings on the outside and inside because others who had built it before complained that there was to much racking/play in it. The original plans only called for bearings on the outside, but I went ahead and heeded the warnings of others. 

Another way to overcome the racking would be to use 2 lead screws on the X-axis, and have one motor slave the first. I've seen some build an 8020 extrusion CNC this way, and even posted it here for someone, but I can't find it right now.

Basically, look at the dual lead screw in the 2nd pic below to see what I'm talking about. Another way is to use a timing belt (for lack of a better term) and just use one single motor to drive the machine, like the 3rd pic here: 
Build your own CNC router Step 2 The Frame and Base LINK


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## woodie26 (May 31, 2009)

Both


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## woodie26 (May 31, 2009)

Noob said:


> Now I'm confused, are you asking if adding 2 inches is safe, or just stating that you changed it?


Both:wacko:


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## Noob (Apr 18, 2009)

woodie26 said:


> Both:wacko:


If you only plan on cutting wood, not aluminum, then it shouldn't be a problem as far as the extrusion goes. Some have said you shouldn't count on the 1/4" cold rolled steel for strength, but I do believe it helps on the Y-axis. 

Nonetheless, 80/20 has a free beam calculator for their extrusions, and there is a short vid that helps explain it a bit: 
80/20 deflection calculator LINK

One thing that could be a problem is the lead screw on the X-axis. They say that 48" is about as long as you want to use for an ACME screw because any more than that and you get screw whip. Basically, as the ACME screw spins very fast, it will start to wobble because of centripetal force and starts to cause problems. That is why you want a multi-start, such as 1/2-10 5-start lead screw, so it doesn't have to spin as fast. 

By adding 2" on the X-axis, you are starting to get near that 48" mark and that is where most will recommend going to a rack and pinion instead. CNCRouterparts sells the r&p here (watch the video also): Rack and Pinion Drive, Nema 23

I will say that some have used 48" ACME lead screws and haven't had a problem. If you were to do that, you may not want to cut at 150 ipm, you may want to start slower to be on the safe side.


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## kp91 (Sep 10, 2004)

Paulo- did you think you'd be a CNC router expert a couple of years ago? It's amazing the amount of research and learning you've done and shared during this project!

Thanks for the hard work


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## Noob (Apr 18, 2009)

kp91 said:


> Paulo- did you think you'd be a CNC router expert a couple of years ago? It's amazing the amount of research and learning you've done and shared during this project!
> 
> Thanks for the hard work


Thanks, but I'm not expert by any stretch of the imagination. I do remember a couple of years ago posting about one, when I was still a young pup  :

David Barr - My Homebuilt CNC

To be honest, Bob and Harrysin were on an Australian wood forum discussing a router duplicator or similar machine, and said that you could get a CNC cheaper than the router duplicator someone posted. Off I went to researching this to see if that was possible and before you know it, I tricked, I mean talked my wife into start buying parts for making one.


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## woodie26 (May 31, 2009)

*So you are are saying that You would't add 2" to the X axis?*

:yes4:


Noob said:


> If you only plan on cutting wood, not aluminum, then it shouldn't be a problem as far as the extrusion goes. Some have said you shouldn't count on the 1/4" cold rolled steel for strength, but I do believe it helps on the Y-axis.
> 
> Nonetheless, 80/20 has a free beam calculator for their extrusions, and there is a short vid that helps explain it a bit:
> 80/20 deflection calculator LINK
> ...


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## Limo (Jan 1, 2010)

Thanks for posting your machine. It did inspire me to make my own. Should be done fairly soon. I'll post a pic when I get a chance.


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## Ryan360 (Jun 22, 2015)

i used t slot for alot of my main structure, i found 1" angle bolts to it really nice as guides, for v goove bearings. Also carriage bolts are a good alternative vs tslot nuts that can add up in cost. just my (maybe) helpful tips lol plus t slot just makes everything look so much cooler haha


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## Gary Salisbury (Apr 11, 2014)

I commend those who are building their own CNC and wish you good luck with your projects. 

In looking at prebuilt models, there seem to be two different construction styles; welded and screwed. Since you are using 8020, you fall into the screwed together construction style. 

My question is, what are you doing about guaranteeing the screws don't come loose after many hours of use and lots of vibration? Any special locking nuts or are you using Locktight? Red or blue?

I also teach AR-15 building and Locktight is one of our best friends.


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## BalloonEngineer (Mar 27, 2009)

Gary Salisbury said:


> I commend those who are building their own CNC and wish you good luck with your projects.
> 
> In looking at prebuilt models, there seem to be two different construction styles; welded and screwed. Since you are using 8020, you fall into the screwed together construction style.
> 
> ...




The design of 8020 tslot makes the edges of each slot is canted slightly inwards. When a bolt is tightened, this provides a locking feature, almost like a Belleville washer. I have not noticed any loosening of bolts on my machine. I have lock washers on other bolts which do not engage tslots (I.e. steppers, guide rail bearing blocks, etc.). 

The control software should accelerate and decelerate axis motion, and speeds and feeds should keep motion smooth. There will obviously be vibrations, but hopefully not the kinds of shock loads present in a firearm.


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## woodie26 (May 31, 2009)

I used Nylock Nuts on bolts which do not engage tslots.


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## UglySign (Nov 17, 2015)

*8020 Turkey Day 15% off deal - 4 days*

8020 is having a 15% off deal going you Turkeys!


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