# Bending boards made , but a horizontal router would have helped



## RainMan 2.0 (May 6, 2014)

I was given these boards and asked if I could put a groove in them to hold the cable .
There used in the telecommunications industry to maintain an engineered spec for the cable coaxial plant drip loops, which are for contraction and expansion during temperature variations. 
I don’t have my router table assembled yet , and just use a PC690 bolted under the wing of of table saw . 
I used my reversible fence to hold the board ,then clamped a piece of mdf on the other side so the board wouldn’t move,but I much would have preferred feather boards .

Anyways it wasn’t bad until I got to the radius’s , as it’s hard to navigate the board over the router bit. 

I could see where having a horizontal router would have come in extremely handy . As a matter of fact , if they want a production run of these , I’d be tempted to rig something up .
On the top of the board I just used my dado to make a 3/8” groove as a guide when it’s held against the strand


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## Nickp (Dec 4, 2012)

Looks like a slot cutter would take care of one of the cuts...

...and a cove bit of the right size would take care of the radius cut. Push it through, turn it over 180 and push it through again. No need for a horizontal router.

Possible...?


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## RainMan 2.0 (May 6, 2014)

Nickp said:


> Looks like a slot cutter would take care of one of the cuts...
> 
> ...and a cove bit of the right size would take care of the radius cut. Push it through, turn it over 180 and push it through again. No need for a horizontal router.
> 
> Possible...?


Well there has to a better way . I used this ,but as long as there was something I could raise high enough to do the bottom half and then flip as you mentioned. 
I should have got ideas from you guys before I proceeded


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## RainMan 2.0 (May 6, 2014)

Ok I googled cove bit and that’s actually what I first tried , but i couldn’t raise it high enough . If they made it with the cove part facing the router it would have worked though.
Looking at it again it may have have worked with my Festool router as I may have able to lower it more.

I tried it in my pc690 and it’s base is mounted under 3/4” of particle board , but when raised the cove bit it wasn’t even close to where I need it


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## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

You might be able to find a round nose bit long enough. I made a horizontal setup once and it was the only way I would have been able to make the picture frame stock I Made. Here's one from MCLS: https://www.mlcswoodworking.com/shopsite_sc/store/html/smarthtml/pages/horizontal_router_table.html With this the router raises up and down. The one I made had the table go up and down instead. You need a pretty stiff plate to mount the router to. Plastic is okay but keep it as narrow as possible so that it is as stiff as possible. You could make something in a day or two and the horizontal configuration gives you possibilities that a regular table doesn't allow. Keep in mind that if the bit is below your work feed direction is still right to left but if the bit is above your work feed direction reverses and you go left to right. I found out the hard way.


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## RainMan 2.0 (May 6, 2014)

Cherryville Chuck said:


> You might be able to find a round nose bit long enough. I made a horizontal setup once and it was the only way I would have been able to make the picture frame stock I Made. Here's one from MCLS: https://www.mlcswoodworking.com/shopsite_sc/store/html/smarthtml/pages/horizontal_router_table.html With this the router raises up and down. The one I made had the table go up and down instead. You need a pretty stiff plate to mount the router to. Plastic is okay but keep it as narrow as possible so that it is as stiff as possible. You could make something in a day or two and the horizontal configuration gives you possibilities that a regular table doesn't allow. Keep in mind that if the bit is below your work feed direction is still right to left but if the bit is above your work feed direction reverses and you go left to right. I found out the hard way.


That’s a neat setup . Liking the knobs on the extruded aluminum to help lock it down .
Guess a cranks a must with vibration and all


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## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

You'd never get an accurate setting without the crank. You'd need something to move it incrementally to the right setting either using the crank like they show or maybe a scissor jack underneath if you just wanted to cobble something together and didn't care how it looked. 

On mine I made a table with sides and back like a shelf and then I added slots in the back with screws to tighten it in place and then threaded through some angle brackets so that I could lift the table with the height screws and then lock it in position by tightening the ones through the back. It took me a couple of days to make mine but I don't think I had a dollars worth of parts in it. It was pretty ugly but I was just making sure it would work. Once I found out it did there was no reason to improve it.


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## Biagio (Mar 2, 2013)

@RainMan 2.0
Rick, what you have done looks pretty good to me. What are you concerned about, safety? I reckon if you are able to attach a higher false fence to your reversible fence, and make an L-shaped fence to trap the workpiece on the other side, it will be as good as you can get, with your current setup. If you were using featherboards, you would need double-height ones to give you similar safety and stability as the L-fence I am suggesting.
About the radiuses, perhaps try what Nick suggested: rout a short edge straight through, without worrying about the radius, then the long edge straight through, then the other short edge. It will leave you with an edge instead of a curve where the channels intersect, but that can be softened with a few strokes of a round rasp - less hassle than trying to follow the radius. 
@Cherryville Chuck, 
Charles, like Rick I was taken with the idea of a horizontal table - I think Matthias Wandel had a design, and I also noted the one from MLCS. There was a particularly versatile all-steel model from an outfit called Hawk, I think. I even started gathering materials to make one, but did not proceed, as I was (and am) uncertain about the ability of a non-steel construction to handle the leverage imposed by a plunge router, particularly something beefy in the 2-Hp range. I only have plunge routers, and other than a trim router, none of them have the round-body spindle motor of say a Bosch 1617. I would be particularly concerned hanging one off of the plastic plate - I note you say to keep it as narrow as possible, but again one is limited by the size of the baseplate on a plunge router.
Which router did you use on your rig, and were there any problems with leverage?


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## Wildwood (Aug 14, 2010)

I made the horizontal table featured in Fine Woodworking Feb 2001 edition. It took me one afternoon, and it works so well that I have a dedicated router on it, and use it for all my tenons. Fine height adjustment is by threaded bolt, and very accurate. If raising the bit above the table height, Charles' comment on feed direction is very important.


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## RainMan 2.0 (May 6, 2014)

Wildwood said:


> I made the horizontal table featured in Fine Woodworking Feb 2001 edition. It took me one afternoon, and it works so well that I have a dedicated router on it, and use it for all my tenons. Fine height adjustment is by threaded bolt, and very accurate. If raising the bit above the table height, Charles' comment on feed direction is very important.


Loving the simplicity as this is what I was looking for , thanks for sharing .


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## RainMan 2.0 (May 6, 2014)

Biagio said:


> @RainMan 2.0
> Rick, what you have done looks pretty good to me. What are you concerned about, safety? I reckon if you are able to attach a higher false fence to your reversible fence, and make an L-shaped fence to trap the workpiece on the other side, it will be as good as you can get, with your current setup. If you were using featherboards, you would need double-height ones to give you similar safety and stability as the L-fence I am suggesting.
> About the radiuses, perhaps try what Nick suggested: rout a short edge straight through, without worrying about the radius, then the long edge straight through, then the other short edge. It will leave you with an edge instead of a curve where the channels intersect, but that can be softened with a few strokes of a round rasp - less hassle than trying to follow the radius.
> @Cherryville Chuck,
> ...


That is pretty much what I did . Ran the bottom threw than the short sections . When it’s behind a fence it’s hard to see where the radius is located. I took a felt marker and made a mark where the router bit is to help visualize it. 

I have no safety concerns , just found it awkward, and if they want another dozen or more I think I’d take the time and fab up a horizontal system such as the one Rob posted . 
Wish I had less priorities right now, as I’d take the time my time build an elaborate one.

I’m using pc690 mounted under a tablesaw wing , and for now I just use the tablesaws reversible Excalibur’s fence for a guide . 
I also have two pc7518 motors only(no bases),and they were suppose to go in a double router table someday to compete with MT Stringer. Hopefully I use them someday


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## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

Biagio said:


> @Cherryville Chuck,
> Charles, like Rick I was taken with the idea of a horizontal table - I think Matthias Wandel had a design, and I also noted the one from MLCS. There was a particularly versatile all-steel model from an outfit called Hawk, I think. I even started gathering materials to make one, but did not proceed, as I was (and am) uncertain about the ability of a non-steel construction to handle the leverage imposed by a plunge router, particularly something beefy in the 2-Hp range. I only have plunge routers, and other than a trim router, none of them have the round-body spindle motor of say a Bosch 1617. I would be particularly concerned hanging one off of the plastic plate - I note you say to keep it as narrow as possible, but again one is limited by the size of the baseplate on a plunge router.
> Which router did you use on your rig, and were there any problems with leverage?


Long explanation here Biagio. The quick part is that I took one handle off and used the screw hole for it as one mount and also mounted it around the baseplate somehow and I don't rememeber exactly how I did that now. But when it was mounted you were looking at the original baseplate for it and not an insert plate. I think I may have also used holes at the top end of the "router" (quotes are there for a reason). 

The explanation for that is that the router I was using was a big Freud plunge that had died on me and wasn't worth fixing. I took the armature out and stripped it bare and reamed an aluminum pulley out to fit the metric sized shaft and then cut a hole through the side of the casing and ran a belt around the pulley to a 1 hp 3450 rpm motor which I sped up with the pulleys to about 12,000 at the bit. It worked surprisingly well even with small bits as the 1hp capacitor type motor has probably 5 times the torque that a universal router motor has. It barely changed pitch in use. I had some pictures of it but I may have deleted them before realizing that deleting them from my uploads also deleted them out of the original threads. It was a true Frankenstein creation but it allowed me to make some picture frames I couldn't have done any other way and the picture of one of those is still on my first page of uploads. I don't still have it either. I hadn't used it for a while and it took up a lot of space and someone new was looking for that collet and I was going to give it to them but found out when I took it off that mine was broken in the same was as theirs. So I dismantled it.

I like Rob's setup. I think it's simpler to fix the router and move the table. Fixing the router means you can use a variety of methods to support it. The edge guide rod holes are one possibility. Using one or both of the handle mounts is another. And you could build a padded cradle for the top of the router to sit on and maybe screw a top clamp onto the cradle too. You can mount it securely enough that you really don't have to mount it to an insert plate if you don't want to which of course gives you more reach with your bits.


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## Biagio (Mar 2, 2013)

Wildwood said:


> I made the horizontal table featured in Fine Woodworking Feb 2001 edition. It took me one afternoon, and it works so well that I have a dedicated router on it, and use it for all my tenons. Fine height adjustment is by threaded bolt, and very accurate. If raising the bit above the table height, Charles' comment on feed direction is very important.


Rob, I believe you have put my misgivings to rest, and also made the case for simplicity, over the sophistication of the MLCS system. I cannot quite make out what is attached to the vertical board on the left hand side?
Thanks.


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## Wildwood (Aug 14, 2010)

@Biagio


> I cannot quite make out what is attached to the vertical board on the left hand side?


Are you talking about the thing on the left of the router? Just a magnetic sort of set-up to hold the collet spanner.


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## Danman1957 (Mar 14, 2009)

WOW,
I just posted something to this thread and it just disappeared !!!

Here goes second attempt;
Rick,
I watch the Woodsmith Shop on PBS almost every Saturday. I record it then watch it during the evening, they are currently in the 3rd or 4th episode of building a router table that can be used horizontally and vertically. It looks strong and robust and capable of doing some cuts that a flat table simply can't. If I didn't have a mortising machine I think I would attempt to build it. If you check their website, you will probably find the plans but at a cost $.
Cheers, Dan


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## Biagio (Mar 2, 2013)

Wildwood said:


> @Biagio
> 
> 
> Are you talking about the thing on the left of the router? Just a magnetic sort of set-up to hold the collet spanner.


Yes, that is the one. Rob, I don’t have that particular issue of FWW, but I remember a similar arrangement in one of those collections of articles that FWW publishes from time to time. Am I correct in thinking that the vertical “Plate” to which the router is attached, pivots on a fixed bolt on the left side, and the height adjustment occurs on the right? Could you post a photo of that part of the build? Thanks.
BTW, I have the big brother of that Startel, mounted permanently in a table. Big and heavy for handheld. Quite a lot of oomph, but I am sure I will have to put in better bearings before long. Has soft start and a digital speed readout and +/- button speed setting, the only problem is that on startup, it reaches max speed before throttling down to desired speed - kind of scary when there is a large diameter bit in the chuck. originally came with metric collets, but I was lucky to find the importers at the time - they had 1/2” collets and reducers. Now out of business. Apparently interchangeable with an Atlas Copco I have never seen on sale here (only a 1400W model was out for a while). I had notions of having the speed readout and control buttons at the front of the table, but too complicated. I have however modified it for above the table height adjustment - I do the gross adjustment with a hex bar in a portable drill, then fine adjustment with a hand crank.


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## Wildwood (Aug 14, 2010)

Biagio, I will take a picture of the set-up tomorrow morning - you are quite right in your assumption that the router "plate" pivots on a bolt, below left of the router.
The slot with the tightening knob on the right, is actually an arc, radiused (is that a word?) on the pivot bolt. The slot headed bolt screws into the wooden block, and the end of the bolt rests on a metal plate attached to the lower block. As you can imagine, this gives very fine height adjustment. The table is actually designed for a non-plunging router, but I removed the spring from this one, for ease of depth adjustment.


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## MEBCWD (Jan 14, 2012)

They look really good Rick. I do agree with you it would be easier with a horizontal table. If I was going to do these all the time I'd build a large horizontail table that would support them well and probably use a large router to handle deeper cuts. I'd also charge *too much* for each one.


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## RainMan 2.0 (May 6, 2014)

MEBCWD said:


> They look really good Rick. I do agree with you it would be easier with a horizontal table. If I was going to do these all the time I'd build a large horizontail table that would support them well and probably use a large router to handle deeper cuts. I'd also charge *too much* for each one.


Well to build them from scratch isn’t a lot of money ,as all I needed was a 2x8. 
But the wear and tear and the labour really adds up .
I’m thinking of telling them $50 a piece ,as I figure it will take me at least an hour to make one .
Sounds high for a 3’ piece of wood , but it all adds up .


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## MEBCWD (Jan 14, 2012)

RainMan 2.0 said:


> Well to build them from scratch isn’t a lot of money ,as all I needed was a 2x8.
> But the wear and tear and the labour really adds up .
> I’m thinking of telling them $50 a piece ,as I figure it will take me at least an hour to make one .
> Sounds high for a 3’ piece of wood , but it all adds up .


You need to add in the cost of materials, new bits, brushes for the router, and a decent per hour labor charge. What do these normally cost? I would think they arn't cheap.


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## TWheels (May 26, 2006)

There are several horizontal router table construction projects on YouTube. One is a Stumpy Nubs (James Hamilton) :




Another, similar to one I fantasize building is an Izzy Swan project:


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## Wildwood (Aug 14, 2010)

For those that are interested, this is the end-on view that Biagio asked for, showing the pivot point of the plate, on the left, and the small arc slot and tightening knob on the right. The height adjustment bolt turns in a block of wood attached to the plate, and the end of the bolt contacts a metal plate attached to the carcass.


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## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

Basically the same method of height adjustment I used except that I took an angle bracket and drilled and threaded it instead.


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## RainMan 2.0 (May 6, 2014)

Wildwood said:


> For those that are interested, this is the end-on view that Biagio asked for, showing the pivot point of the plate, on the left, and the small arc slot and tightening knob on the right. The height adjustment bolt turns in a block of wood attached to the plate, and the end of the bolt contacts a metal plate attached to the carcass.


Thanks Rob I didn’t realize it pivoted , and I don’t know why I couldn’t have thought of that . As I mentioned I’m really liking the simplicity of the design, and it would do the job I want perfectly. 
Also I could easily attach a feather board to stop the board from trying to lift . 
Should be able to get a very clean cut this way.

Just took a closer look at the first pic and noticed the tenon . What a great way to make tenons .
I may have to make a more permanent version of this with a mitre slot


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## Stroland43 (Nov 17, 2009)

*Horizontal router table*

Search for horizontal router table on Stumpy Nubs.


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