# Advice on this Craftsman router and table needed!



## Brett K (Jan 18, 2012)

I am in the market for my first router and router table. I am a hobbyist and relatively new to using one other than just doing some rounded edges freehand. I have never used a table before. I have some Sears gift cards and Sears has a pretty good sale going on right now. I can get the Sears 14 amp 2.5hp fixed/plunge base combo (27680) and Sears HPP Router Table (61181) for under $300 before using gift cards. So, I will be in the $200 range. I am pretty sure the Router table is the same or real similar to the Bosch. Is there a reason I should avoid this set-up. I need a benchtop table due to lack of space and I think I use my router about 2-3 times per year, which will be more once I learn from some of you knowledgeable folks.


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## Marco (Feb 21, 2009)

Dive on in Brett. I don't see a problem with the set up mentioned. If you have Sears money that look likes a good set up and you should be able to do most anything you want to with it


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## BrianS (Nov 7, 2004)

Hi Brett. Welcome to our little corner of the 'net.

Good choice on the router... for your first one. There will be more later. 

The table is not a bad choice, with a couple of negatives. I have an older one, but it is similar in that it has an aluminum top. This can leave black marks on your wood. And, the table will probably not accept the porter cable style insert bushings.. instead, you will be limited to the plastic ones that Sears sells for their tables.


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## thadius856 (Dec 26, 2011)

One of the reviews on the Sears Outlet site (yes, this model and that table seem to go to the outlet stores...) says that the baseplate opening is too small to use large bits.

"I would give this more stars, but I had to re-manufacture the base plate. The opeing is only 1.25 inches. Many of the router bits that do 1/2 or more won't fit. These are the router bits that you BUY a 2.5hp router for."

1¼" is pretty restricting, IMO. You'd only be able to use fairly basic and small bits if that's true.


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## Brett K (Jan 18, 2012)

I am rethinking the sears table. What about the Grizzly t10432 vs the MLCS top. They appear the same except the Grizzly has legs. Will the polycarbonate base be sufficient in holding this router rated at 15.5 lbs or should I go MCLS for the aluminum? I plan on removing the router when not in use. Also, are miter gauges interchangeable or do I need a new one of those as well?


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## Mike (Nov 22, 2004)

Brett, the Grizzly Presidents Special router table is the best deal for the money. You can use PC style guide bushings with it, it has the dust collection port, the removable centers allow you to use all but the largest panel raising bits. For $116 + shipping it's hard to go wrong.


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## Brett K (Jan 18, 2012)

Mike said:


> Brett, the Grizzly Presidents Special router table is the best deal for the money. You can use PC style guide bushings with it, it has the dust collection port, the removable centers allow you to use all but the largest panel raising bits. For $116 + shipping it's hard to go wrong.


Where do you see it for $116? I see it at $129. Your thought on the baseplate holding a router of that weight? I am not sure... the 15.5 lbs may be with both fixed and plunge routers.


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## MEBCWD (Jan 14, 2012)

I have one of the older bench top tables from sears and I sealed the top with spray poly because of the black marks mentioned. I have other larger tables and use then most of the time. The sears table gets set up now and then when all the rest have set ups I don't want to change but have to do a special project. It does a decent job but it's not for anything big. This new one looks like you could install a different router plate, something to consider.

But for the money you are going to spend, if I were you I would go for the bigger table so you get more bang for your buck. You will be adding accessories later on if you are anything like most of us and a lot of them aren't built for this small footprint.

Good choice on the router, you can grow with it.

Hope this helps,
Mike


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## MEBCWD (Jan 14, 2012)

another thought

Buy a good router table top/ fence and build a base yourself. Later when you have the room, build a bigger better base or cabinet.
Mike


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## Brett K (Jan 18, 2012)

I have daughters. I will never have any room! lol This is why I started thinking about the Grizzly table. I could remove the legs and mount it to some saw horse if needed... Or just keep the legs in the attic over the garage.

I appreciate the advice!


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## Mike (Nov 22, 2004)

Brett, the table was on sale... but even at $129 it is still the best deal going. The plate works fine, in fact it is identical to the HF plate used in the economy table top build Sticky thread in this section.(Have you read the Sticky threads? They are Sticky because they contain great information.) Perhaps the best thing about the plates is you will always be able to get one this size for your next router.


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## wbh1963 (Oct 11, 2011)

Hi Brett,

I looked into the three tables you have mentioned in this thread, those being the Craftsman, Grizzly and MLCS. Without comment on the actual motor that might get used in any of the three, all things considered the Grizzly seemed the most attractive to me.

I think all three tables you suggested are on the 'higher quality end' of the 'basic features' entry level tables on the market. The table I ended up picking up as my first one doesn't even use a mounting insert. The router screws directly to the underside of the 3/4" MDF top. It works for now, but I don't it to last more than a year or two tops, but that should be more than enough time for me to use it to help build it's replacement.

One thing I noticed with all three of the tables you mentioned is that their fences have 'real slots' on the table surface. Mine just has a 1/4" wide slot cut entirely through the table top. Works for now, but it yet another place for future 'chipping' of the MDF's coating. My fence doesn't have the tracks on it to mount feather boards to either.

Whether or not 'fence mounted goodies' will be of use to you depends on what you want to use the table for.

When it comes to weight, even it the router weighed thirty pounds, so long as it was mounted by three or four screws, a phenolic plate should do fine. This assumes the screws are a good match to the counter sunk holes. 5 to 10 pounds weight per screw really isn't that much load. From what I have read though, a lot of the 3/4" MDF tops will sag some over time with the weight of heavier routers. That really isn't an issue with the plate though. As mentioned by others responding to this thread, aluminum tops love to leave streaks on wood that passes over them.

Good luck with your quest and thanks for starting this thread. The process of checking out the three models you brought up and comparing them to where I am at today was an educational one..


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## remotelarry (Sep 3, 2012)

I know this is an older message thread but I just bought an on sale Craftsman 61181 table clone of the Bosch RA1181. I will be mounting it between fence rails on a much modified Craftsman contractor's saw to conserve shop space. The cabinet of the basic saw has been dramatically reinforced with additional metal material and the overall saw is extremely rigid compared to a standard saw. The saw now has a Delta fence system on it, etc. etc. which will go a long way towards the overall satisfaction I will have with this saw.

The router table, as I got it from Sears, on sale, with additional coupons for savings and discount dollars from previous Sears/KMart purchases cost me $137 and gets me into a decent table quickly. I expect to build additional table(s) as time goes on and as my needs expand. Bottom line, the sale table was a good buy on a decent table.

OK, now the downside: The table was not flat exactly as received. I could have sent it back to Sears for a different unit hoping for one somewhat flatter, and I considered taking it to a machine shop and having several thousandths shaved off the top with a fly cutter but I didn't want to spend any more on it and the flatness was not so bad even so--perhaps at worst 0.012-0.015 inch. The main issues were around the machined fence slots and the insert opening which were somewhat high with only a minor dip in the middle of the "flat" part of the top. Since this is a casting, I didn't think it would be flat as cast, and the top work side was put on an abrasive tool to flatten it, etc. Overall, not as good as I would have liked.

I took a flat file or reasonable length and draw filed the top around the slots and the edges of the insert opening and really knocked the high spots down. All of this took maybe 30 minutes or less and resulted in a top that was pretty close in all directions--maybe down to less than 4 or 5 thousandths. I am somewhat of a perfectionist and still contemplated sending it off to have the last amount removed by a machinist, but I'm too cheap and I was getting pretty close as was. The next step made the difference:

I took the top to the office tonight where we have pretty large and rather flat conference table, and we have a lot of desks with tempered glass tops. I put one of the glass tops on the big flat table, glued 10 sheets of 100 grit paper down on the glass (3M 77 spray adhesive) and proceeded to flatten the router table to better than 2 thousandths in all directions. The flatter the table gets, the more work goes into the overall job since more surface has to be removed to get that last little dip out. The very shallow dips that are left are inconsequential and if I really wanted it closer I would consider a skimming coat of JB Weld with a follow up sanding to remove the excess and make the thing flatter. It's good enough now and I'm really pleased with the overall result. I will be putting this thing on my saw in the next few days and putting all the rest of the fence parts together to finish it up. I will spray a thin coat of urethane on it or maybe a very thin coat of tung oil to keep black marks down. If they reoccur I will just take the time to recoat before continuing. 

One note, the raised Craftsman letters on the table were well above the surrounding area (maybe 10 thousandths--not really sure but they stuck up quite a lot). Some people here have commented on catching stock and fingers on these letters--perhaps this is why. I draw filed them flat with respect to the rest of the table and paid attention to them during the sanding operation. They are right on now--I will see if they get in the way of my fingers as I run stock across the top in use.

I know there are better approaches than this table for many but since it fits between the fence rails, has a decent set of amenities (miter slot, fence, feather boards, aluminum mounting plate insert, etc.) I will get a lot out of this in my limited shop space. I will put a case underneath it for dust control, storage and support but that will be one of the first things to do on the saw/router combo. Later I will build a more portable table (ala Oak Park philosophy) and maybe another bigger one with cabinet for general use. If I can justify the space.


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