# Dust Collection Question



## Tigerpaw (Feb 18, 2009)

Hi folks. I'm a hobbiest and newcomer to the forum. This is my first post.

I recently finished building my first router table - a melamine variation on the NYW design - and I'm surprised by what I've encountered in my dust collection set up. I spent a lot of time trying to figure out how to best configure the cabinet cavity underneath the router to channel dust into the 4" dust collection port at the back of the case. (My dust collector is a ClearVue cyclone.) I didn't pay as much attention to dust collection at the table level - I just hooked up another 4" hose to a plastic blast gate attached to the fence.

What surprises me is that I really don't seem to get much dust in the cabinet cavity because the fence hose seems to grab almost everything. (I've only used the table for edge routing so far.) Somehow I figured that I needed a big space surrounding the router because of the volume of chips and dust that would be flowing down there. If I had known that dust collection down there didn't require a big space, I probably would have made a much smaller cavity and used the savings for another drawer or something. 

Am I missing something? Is a lot of space needed around the router to generate air flow to keep the router cool? Or is there some other reason for not making the cavity as tight as possible without restricting access to the router? Or is that, in fact, what people who know what they're doing do, and I just screwed up? 

Thanks
Chris


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## Big Buford (May 15, 2008)

Hello Chris,
When I built a enclosed cabinet for my router, which is a Porter Cable 3 1/2 hp router, I placed a 4 inch hose outlet going to my cyclone collector. Once I added an adjustable vent on the side of the cabinet my dust collection improved greatly. You need more air entering the enclosure than what you get from the opening around your router bit. A cyclone will pull a lot of air through a 4 inch hose and it needs enough air flowing in to keep the router from overheating in addition to enough air coming in to match what goes out with the chips. Mismatched airflow will affect dust collection pressure.


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## AxlMyk (Jun 13, 2006)

Hello Chris;
To answer your question, only enough room to make the router accessible is needed.
The amount of dust going to the cavity depends on what you are doing. If you are routing dados, the dust will go down, but also out the end of the dado. And, like you found out, much of it will go out the fence port.


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## Rooky (May 1, 2008)

Tigerpaw said:


> .
> Somehow I figured that I needed a big space surrounding the router because of the volume of chips and dust that would be flowing down there. If I had known that dust collection down there didn't require a big space, I probably would have made a much smaller cavity and used the savings for another drawer or something.
> 
> Thanks
> Chris


Spent a lot of time last weekend on my table too and same thing. My router "cavity" is about 25" wide and 26" north to south and maybe 25" deep IIRC. The table is a big honker at roughly 28" deep by 47" wide and now a big waste of space IMO inside that cavity. I'm thinking I try to slide in some shallow drawers for meauring tools or??? Just seems to be a huge dead space that I sure didn't need to incorporate into the design.


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## dovetail_65 (Jan 22, 2008)

Collecting dust from the top and bottom is the way to go. I think the space on the OP table for the router is all you need and probably a perfect size.


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## Dr.Zook (Sep 10, 2004)

Welcome to the RouterForums Chris.


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## Rooky (May 1, 2008)

I'll edit mine when I can figure out how to. lol


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## xplorx4 (Dec 1, 2008)

Greetings Chris and welcome to the forum glad you could make it.


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## demaX (Apr 16, 2009)

Interesting subject.
Since my Rockler was missing the Dust Collector I wasn't even going to add one.
I do have a suggestion which may or may not apply.
Could you save space by just adding a Woman Stocking ?

Using my Ridgit TS2400 Table Saw for an example, I could never find a 2 1/2" collect for it to mount my Wet/Dry Vac I decided to just hang a Woman Silk Stocking - to my surprise it is ample and allows air flow.

Just an idea.


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## westend (Mar 31, 2009)

Rooky said:


> Spent a lot of time last weekend on my table too and same thing. My router "cavity" is about 25" wide and 26" north to south and maybe 25" deep IIRC. The table is a big honker at roughly 28" deep by 47" wide and now a big waste of space IMO inside that cavity. I'm thinking I try to slide in some shallow drawers for meauring tools or??? Just seems to be a huge dead space that I sure didn't need to incorporate into the design.


That is a lot of dead space. Mine is 14" D x 14" H x 10" W.. I sized it close to a volume that allows easy installtion of the motor into the base and that's it. Attached is a pic of the router space with a dirty plexiglass door. 

Here's an idea, why not attach a couple of cleats to the sides, one on the back, install a shelf, and use most of that router cavity for bit storage or other. 

I think I'll have to deal with air handling when I get the shop vac back in the shop. I have read that some type of inlet should be provided for dust collection from the router cavity, to work effectively. I do have a 1 1/4" hole cut in the side of the cavity for the router wire to reach the adjacent outlet. I don't know if that will be enough "make-up" air. We will see. Even with the small cavity, my router doesn't get hot so that shouldn't be a concern.

Post up some pics when you have reached the "admiration" stage of your table build. It's cool to see what others have incorporated in their table.


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

HI Guys

If you are going to enclose a router air flow is a big deal...cfm is cfm,you should have some holes in the plexiglass or gap on the bottom side of the plexiglass/frame ..so the vac. system can work, the bigger the better ( 4" hole in the back side ) the norm but you need ports so it can work..it's not going to blow it out the front side but will pull the dust and the air around the router..and out..

If not it's like putting brown paper bag on the end of your vac. hose and putting a 1" hole in the bag..,,  it needs air flow...


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## westend (Mar 31, 2009)

Thanks Jigs,
The addition of a vent was what I thought was needed. I'm presuming that some holes placed in the front of the cabinet, when drawing dust from the rear, will provide the best cooling air to the router. 

I've seen pictures of how dual dust collection inlets (one from fence and one from router mounting cavity) are configured. That is probably the method I'll use. My vacuum situation is in flux, at present. My 25 yr. old Craftsman 16 gallon finally emitted the "magic smoke". Replacement parts are unavailable. I'll either have to think about a dedicated dust collection system or purchase of another large shop vac. I have a smallish shop vac but don't think it will hold up to any kind of prolonged use. 

Any tips on systems or larger shop vacs is welcomed.


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

HI Lance

Big shop vac.systems are neat but not a must have item,,a good shop vac. will do the job..try and find one with a 2 1/4" or 2 1/2" hose,,you will see HD/Lowes have some great deals from time to time..the last one I saw was going for 30.oo bucks at HD..

I should note,,,, I used both,,,4" hose system and the 2 1/2" hose type and I use the 2 1/2" most of the time..  it has a 50 ft. hose that I can plug into all the machine..quick and easy.. 

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westend said:


> Thanks Jigs,
> The addition of a vent was what I thought was needed. I'm presuming that some holes placed in the front of the cabinet, when drawing dust from the rear, will provide the best cooling air to the router.
> 
> I've seen pictures of how dual dust collection inlets (one from fence and one from router mounting cavity) are configured. That is probably the method I'll use. My vacuum situation is in flux, at present. My 25 yr. old Craftsman 16 gallon finally emitted the "magic smoke". Replacement parts are unavailable. I'll either have to think about a dedicated dust collection system or purchase of another large shop vac. I have a smallish shop vac but don't think it will hold up to any kind of prolonged use.
> ...


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## dovetail_65 (Jan 22, 2008)

Nothing is must have and a shop vac will do if you are just starting out, but I never knew a guy that went back to a shop vac after getting a Fein Turbo, Festool CT or even a Jet 650, 1100.

A shop vac is not going to work for a planer etc either. I used shop vacs and after a few years I started with a Fein Turbo after saving my pennies and MAN oh MAN!

Right now they have the Fein turbo I old model Refurb for 189.00(about 1/2 reg price). It may seem expensive, but it has a 19 amp outlet that turns on the vac when the tool that is plugged in to it goes on. The CFM is 116 -119, it is only 57-63 db(very quite), comes with the 5 mil reusable filter, you can get a filter from home depot if you want down to .3 micron and will work with it. And it rates a water pull of 99ft. 

Even a great shop vac has nowhere near those specs. And most shop vacs are so loud they themselves req hearing protection. If you are using even a 150.00 shop vac I guarantee going to a Fein unit will blow you away. Dust collection is so very important that is one place I would not skimp it it is at all possible to fit it in a budget.

If you wanted to go all out I found the Grizzly 3 HP cyclone central system is all I could ever what. And the Festool CT 22 or 33 and Fein Turbo II or III are all the best you can buy if anyone wants the top of the line lung protection for a one tool or sander, router, saw hook up., not just some of the big dust picked up. I use the Feins and Festools with the sanders not the large cyclone.

A shop vac is better than nothing, but does not protect your lungs very well or let the tool work to its max like any of the system s I mentioned. I practically live in the shop so dust collection is very important to me.


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## westend (Mar 31, 2009)

That's good info, Jigs. 
I am using the small shop vac I have remaining for an ongoing project, sprucing up a "clean room" for a local heat-treating plant. The small vac is really quite powerful. It has 30' of 2 1/2" hose and is doing the job. I will probably put it into service in the shop, here, when the project is done at the plant.

I do miss the big old Craftsman, though. That machine paid for itself many times over.


bobj3 said:


> HI Lance
> 
> Big shop vac.systems are neat but not a must have item,,a good shop vac. will do the job..try and find one with a 2 1/4" or 2 1/2" hose,,you will see HD/Lowes have some great deals from time to time..the last one I saw was going for 30.oo bucks at HD..
> 
> ...


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi Nick

My can vac.works well with my planer etc.. plus it came with a can filter built in,,it's a snap to clean it out or replace it without braking the bank open..

The air filter that came with it puts out is very clean air and it's not that loud...

Most can't put out the big bucks for the high end vac. system, I have one of the Grizzly systems and it works just fine for me...when I will have a lot of chips going in the bag.

I should note my can vac.can suck the chrome off the bumper ..

It's just a hobby for me not a 24/7 thing..  thank God 

======


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## westend (Mar 31, 2009)

Thanks, Nick, I never knew that a collection system started off at those low price points. 
I absolutely agree about the dust and health aspects. I was using a few sheets of MDF, recently and have just about cleared most of the remaining dust out of the shop. It just took three or four sweepings and about the same number of trips with the air hose to get 98% of that fine stuff out of here. I have worked in a number of hazardous environments and know all too well the price of not being cautious with certain materials.

On a side-note, the Brother-in-law, an excellent woodworker was sidelined a couple of years ago with infections in his hands from Cocobollo, IIRC. If not that, it was some other type of Central American hardwood. His hands looked like boxing mitts. Soon after, he installed a new dust collection system with the canister outside and filtration in his shop. Sawdust isn't dirt but it can be a mess to deal with.


nickao65 said:


> Nothing is must have and a shop vac will do if you are just starting out, but I never knew a guy that went back to a shop vac after getting a Fein Turbo, Festool CT or even a Jet 650, 1100.
> 
> A shop vac is not going to work for a planer etc either. I used shop vacs and after a few years I started with a Fein Turbo after saving my pennies and MAN oh MAN!
> 
> ...


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## dovetail_65 (Jan 22, 2008)

The MDF dust is the worst and those exotics can make you sick for sure.

I use a wood Massarunduba and I do not use a respirator I literally get sick, even with all my dust collection. Most other woods do not effect me personally, but some people are even effected by common woods like Walnut.

Just another reason to try to get the dust at the source.


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