# Shipping Lesson Learned



## honesttjohn (Feb 17, 2015)

Got a note from a lady in Kitchener, Ontario who wanted a (what else) Polish Eagle for Xmas. I figured I'd add an extra $5 on top of the regular Etsy shipping rate, which she agreed to. Well..................... the finished product (a tad bigger than normal) wrapped a little better for the postal exchange added about 10 ounces to the total weight, and pushed the cost up another $12 over what I had originally charged. I was already going to have to eat $5 of the original shipping cost. I guess it also included the customs charges. Now we're not talking anything oversized or valuable (under $100 and just over 3 lbs) here. Total distance is about 230 miles from my place. Now I can relate to RainMan when he says whatever he buys in the USA costs about double to get it delivered there. $34 to ship it to Canada and about $10 anywhere in the lower 48. Wow!!


----------



## difalkner (Jan 3, 2012)

Ouch! You certainly don't want to be doing that very often. What's your Etsy shop name, John?

David


----------



## honesttjohn (Feb 17, 2015)

Routerville USA


----------



## hawkeye10 (Jul 28, 2015)

John you should have drove up there and delivered it. Good customer service. :wink:


----------



## cjhilinski (Apr 25, 2017)

I build crokinole boards (crokinoleworld.com) and between 20% and 40% of the cost of a board goes to shipping. I used to be able to do international shipping all over the world. Now, I won't do international or Alaska or Hawaii. With the cost of shipping what it is, you have to offer "free" shipping and include that cost somewhere in your product price...people will balk at paying $80 for shipping crosscountry in the U.S. via ground. And then certain countries have certain package size limitations...for example, to Australia, a package has to be under 75 inches (girth + length) to qualify for the lowest USPS shipping rate whereas most countries are 108 inches. My record shipping estimate was to Poland...$832. Of course the buyer declined that and did not get a board. I am not a real fan of the shippers. I know part of the reason is that I'm paying so Amazon can get extremely cheap shipping on their products.


----------



## MT Stringer (Aug 15, 2012)

Sorry to hear that, John. Hmmm...230 miles won't even get me to Dallas from my house. :surprise::grin:


----------



## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

Welcome to _our_ World, John!. A lot of US companies won't even take Cdn. orders.


----------



## DesertRatTom (Jul 3, 2012)

+ S&H Canada is a Socialist country which means tax at every turn. NAFTA has actually kept my consulting work out of Canada, even though there's no one there doing what we do. Costs about $2,000 in gov. imposed fees per trip, per person to go there.


----------



## Gene Howe (Jul 10, 2007)

Even worse than Taxifornia?


----------



## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

honesttjohn said:


> Got a note from a lady in Kitchener, Ontario who wanted a (what else) Polish Eagle for Xmas. I figured I'd add an extra $5 on top of the regular Etsy shipping rate, which she agreed to. Well..................... the finished product (a tad bigger than normal) wrapped a little better for the postal exchange added about 10 ounces to the total weight, and pushed the cost up another $12 over what I had originally charged. I was already going to have to eat $5 of the original shipping cost. I guess it also included the customs charges. Now we're not talking anything oversized or valuable (under $100 and just over 3 lbs) here. Total distance is about 230 miles from my place. Now I can relate to RainMan when he says whatever he buys in the USA costs about double to get it delivered there. $34 to ship it to Canada and about $10 anywhere in the lower 48. Wow!!


I've been looking at buying a Musclechuck for my table router but Amazon wants nearly $50 just for shipping and I'm not sure it would be much cheaper from Musclechuck directly. It's already $100 Canadian with the exchange rate.


----------



## Knothead47 (Feb 10, 2010)

I sold a label maker to a person in western Canada. Cost a small fortune for import duties even though it was a used machine. Lost my donkey as I paid a lot more than what they went for on fleaBay.


----------



## BrianS (Nov 7, 2004)

Cherryville Chuck said:


> I've been looking at buying a Musclechuck for my table router but Amazon wants nearly $50 just for shipping and I'm not sure it would be much cheaper from Musclechuck directly. It's already $100 Canadian with the exchange rate.


Charles, for what router? I "may" have another source and can ship from Southern Ontario.


----------



## BrianS (Nov 7, 2004)

honesttjohn said:


> Got a note from a lady in Kitchener, Ontario who wanted a (what else) Polish Eagle for Xmas. I figured I'd add an extra $5 on top of the regular Etsy shipping rate, which she agreed to. Well..................... the finished product (a tad bigger than normal) wrapped a little better for the postal exchange added about 10 ounces to the total weight, and pushed the cost up another $12 over what I had originally charged. I was already going to have to eat $5 of the original shipping cost. I guess it also included the customs charges. Now we're not talking anything oversized or valuable (under $100 and just over 3 lbs) here. Total distance is about 230 miles from my place. Now I can relate to RainMan when he says whatever he buys in the USA costs about double to get it delivered there. $34 to ship it to Canada and about $10 anywhere in the lower 48. Wow!!


Yes, we get royally raped whenever something is shipped to the Great White North. I'm fortunate to be right on the border, can be in Detroit,MI in 15min if the border isn't backed up, and more fortunate to have been able to use Mike McGrath for a shipping destination. Still have to pay any applicable taxes for importing, but that's a WHOLE lot cheaper than paying the brokerage fees the delivery companies tack on. 

There is even a couple of companies in Detroit that have set up storefronts that you can ship things to. They charge a $5 fee for each shipment... still cheaper.


----------



## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

BrianS said:


> Charles, for what router? I "may" have another source and can ship from Southern Ontario.


The type 12 for a Hitachi Brian. Semipro offered to get it and then mail it to me too. He can get it shipped to him for free and according to USPS the 1st class postage is about $15.50 US.

I also looked at replacement woofers for an old set of Radio Shack speakers I have. I could get free shipping if I lived in the States. Shipping to here is exactly $100.


----------



## Danman1957 (Mar 14, 2009)

Welcome to our world, as Chuck just stated the exchange rate on the $ is also a big factor. Imagine when we buy a car built in Ontario and pay several thousand $ more than someone anywhere in the USA. To purchase from the USA we must be desperate or it is something un available in Canada. I used to build Hot Rods and Muscle Cars as a hobby, it would cost me on average double what the same build would cost in California. Last year I toured the western part of Canada and came back east through the states. I have a Class A motorhome with a pretty big fuel tank. In British Columbia I filled twice at $250 each time. In Montana and North Dakota it cost $135 and $132. Most of that gas in from Canada !
No sense complaining, it is part of being Canadian.


----------



## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

"No sense complaining, it is part of being Canadian."
-Other Dan

Yeh, but how else would we spend the Winter hours? It's a hobby...


----------



## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

Point in question...
https://www.amazon.ca/Bosch-1617EVSPK-4-Horsepower-Variable-Collets/dp/B00005RHPD

(4HP?!...oh wait, that's Canadian HP!)


----------



## BrianS (Nov 7, 2004)

Cherryville Chuck said:


> The type 12 for a Hitachi Brian. Semipro offered to get it and then mail it to me too. He can get it shipped to him for free and according to USPS the 1st class postage is about $15.50 US.
> 
> I also looked at replacement woofers for an old set of Radio Shack speakers I have. I could get free shipping if I lived in the States. Shipping to here is exactly $100.


OK, will leave it with you then. If you change your mind, lmk.


----------



## Pounamu (Oct 10, 2017)

The only way I can get a shipping price to New Zealand that makes it feasible to buy anything from the US is by using a New Zealand postal service facility which allows me to quote the Portland, OR address of a NZ Post forwarding depot. When they receive the item in my name, they send me an invoice by email for the cost of the international postage and they consign the item soon after electronic payment is made. A great service which is still not dirt cheap, but is manageable. Of course, it doesn't overcome the problem of the currency exchange rate which means the dollar price is almost double of the US price!


----------



## Geevesmac (Jul 15, 2014)

Have you tried Reship.com ? Interested to see if it works.
Cheers
Greg


----------



## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

I did and I wasn't pleased. They promoted their service and quoted a $5 service fee. It seemed too good to be true. It was. The bill was over $100Cdn.
If they'd been honest and upfront in the first place, I _wouldn't_ have bought the item OR used the service...oh, wait! *Light goes on*


----------



## greenacres2 (Dec 23, 2011)

Gene Howe said:


> Even worse than Taxifornia?


Just guessing that taxes are higher in Canada than Taxifornia, but at least in Canada there is not a requirement to put 8.3 square feet of warning labels on cutting board!! :wink:
earl
(blessed to live where I do!!)


----------



## Pounamu (Oct 10, 2017)

Geevesmac said:


> Have you tried Reship.com ? Interested to see if it works.
> Cheers
> Greg


That looks to be a likely solution to the problems some of the posters in this thread are encountering, Greg.


----------



## thomas1389 (Jan 4, 2012)

DaninVan said:


> Point in question...
> https://www.amazon.ca/Bosch-1617EVSPK-4-Horsepower-Variable-Collets/dp/B00005RHPD
> 
> (4HP?!...oh wait, that's Canadian HP!)


Converted to metric, it's 6.2


----------



## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

*The Tax Man Cometh*



greenacres2 said:


> Just guessing that taxes are higher in Canada than Taxifornia, but at least in Canada there is not a requirement to put 8.3 square feet of warning labels on cutting board!! :wink:
> earl
> (blessed to live where I do!!)


Not necessarily, Earl. 
Sales tax is different, Province to Province.
Federal (GST) is 5%
B.C. (PST) is 7%
Total of 12% but you need to do the separate calc. for each on the base amount.
There's no Income tax applied on the sale of your own home, a second home probably some, assuming you're selling for a profit; only fair as you got to write off your expenses on the property, which you can't if it's your own home.
Considering that a home in Vancouver, bought in the early 80's for under $100K is now worth probably in excess of $2M, that's a lot of tax exempt income.


----------



## greenacres2 (Dec 23, 2011)

DaninVan said:


> Not necessarily, Earl.
> Sales tax is different, Province to Province.
> Federal (GST) is 5%
> B.C. (PST) is 7%
> ...


That is pretty impressive appreciation in real estate values!! The photos I've seen of Vancouver are beautiful as well. We'll get out that way someday, the only desire I have to do a cruise is to Alaska, and Vancouver seems to be the best starting point.

earl


----------



## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

greenacres2 said:


> That is pretty impressive appreciation in real estate values!! The photos I've seen of Vancouver are beautiful as well. We'll get out that way someday, the only desire I have to do a cruise is to Alaska, and Vancouver seems to be the best starting point.
> 
> earl


Wifey and I did that this past Summer. Went on Holland America. 
Get one of the cabins with a balcony; worth every penny.
I have nothing but good things to say about the service onboard, and the food was _ excellent_.


----------



## thomas1389 (Jan 4, 2012)

DaninVan said:


> Not necessarily, Earl.
> Sales tax is different, Province to Province.
> Federal (GST) is 5%
> B.C. (PST) is 7%
> ...


Here in Ontario, Fed (GST) is 5%
Provincial (PST) is 8%
Total of 13% No need for separate calc. Almost all registers add 13% as one, called , wait for it, Harmonized sales tax.

When it was introduced many sleeps past, it was said it would replace the old "manufacturers tax" . Yeh, right, and here's another bridge for sale. If the same person has title to two homes one has to be deemed a principle residence, hence no sales tax when sold. The other is deemed to be a secondary residence and profit is Capital Gain. Calculated as the difference between purchase price and all accumulated costs, (maintenance, repairs, land taxes, anything else you can dream up) Take 50 % of the difference as free money and the other 50% is taxed at the going rate.


----------



## Danman1957 (Mar 14, 2009)

Stop complaining you fellow Canucks, Quebec is the highest taxed place in North America. 15% sales tax the gas is also at least 10 cents more except for B.C. which is about the same. Income tax is ridiculous at about 30%, wait ! why do I still live here ?, oh yeah, my wife won't even consider elsewhere.


----------



## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

Danman1957 said:


> Stop complaining you fellow Canucks, Quebec is the highest taxed place in North America. 15% sales tax the gas is also at least 10 cents more except for B.C. which is about the same. Income tax is ridiculous at about 30%, wait ! why do I still live here ?, oh yeah, my wife won't even consider elsewhere.


Your wife might have an excuse in that she may not know any better. You don't. You've been out here.


----------



## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

*The Truth is Out There*



Cherryville Chuck said:


> Your wife might have an excuse in that she may not know any better. You don't. You've been out here.


Ouch!


----------



## thomas1389 (Jan 4, 2012)

Danman1957 said:


> Stop complaining you fellow Canucks, Quebec is the highest taxed place in North America. 15% sales tax the gas is also at least 10 cents more except for B.C. which is about the same. Income tax is ridiculous at about 30%, wait ! why do I still live here ?, oh yeah, my wife won't even consider elsewhere.


Ahh! but you also have that beautiful language. We have friends in St. Lazare and it's amazing to listen to them. They're Swiss/French/ German and when she's going on in French and switches to us mid sentence to English while he's using German to emphasize something to the kids it gets confusing. Me, I'm unilingual. My kids are fluent in French and English with passable Spanish. They lived the French Immersion route in school from grade four on. Oh, by the way, I filled up yesterday for $1.09 at a Pioneer station. Whenever I'm down Brantford way I get it from the natives on the reserve for less than that. Not too bad, eh!


----------



## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

"Whenever I'm down Brantford way I get it from the natives on the reserve for less than that. Not too bad, eh!"
Not scalped then? 

You could have knocked me over with a feather; I just ordered a corebox bit, Freud, from my local lumberyard...I'll pick it up in the morning (maybe $3 in gas).
It was cheaper than anything I found online, Canadian sources of course. No waiting and no shipping cost, other than my gas I mean. There must be a catch...


----------



## JOAT (Apr 9, 2010)

Awhile back I decided to check shipping costs on something I made, a cane I think, from here to the west coast. Can't recall just what the post office would have charged, but quite reasonable, something over $10 I believe. Then checked with the local UPS office. The only quote they gave me even remotely close to the post office quote was if they delivered it in my town. Dosn't sound realistic, but that's what they said.


----------



## DesertRatTom (Jul 3, 2012)

Not sure if this would make a difference in Canada, however, I have been buying online from HD, WalMart but having delivery at local stores. No shipping charges that way. I started doing this as a price check and was surprised to discover their prices are sometimes lower, and delivery, returns are easy, just a mile away. Canadians near the border could drive across for some of these items. I'm curious to know if it would help. Living in Taxafornia, I've become sympathetic to those living in other socialist areas.


----------



## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

Tom; I wonder if we can order something Stateside and have it delivered to a_ Cdn. branch of HD?_! Never even occurred to me!
We can order some Rockler stuff at Lee Valley, up here, and they'll bring it in. No idea what kind of surcharges apply.


----------



## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

HD has a pretty extensive on-line site as does Walmart. I've ordered from both. Unless it's a surcharge for special shipping, as in large or heavy, then the item is listed in our dollars and stated shipping charges from my experience. I've seen items on the US website for Walmart that weren't on the Canadian site so make sure you are on the .ca version.


----------



## Herb Stoops (Aug 28, 2012)

Cherryville Chuck said:


> HD has a pretty extensive on-line site as does Walmart. I've ordered from both. Unless it's a surcharge for special shipping, as in large or heavy, then the item is listed in our dollars and stated shipping charges from my experience. I've seen items on the US website for Walmart that weren't on the Canadian site so make sure you are on the .ca version.


Maybe Rick would know he is the Major stockholder in HD.:grin::grin:
Herb


----------



## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

*Yes, But...*



Cherryville Chuck said:


> HD has a pretty extensive on-line site as does Walmart. I've ordered from both. Unless it's a surcharge for special shipping, as in large or heavy, then the item is listed in our dollars and stated shipping charges from my experience. I've seen items on the US website for Walmart that weren't on the Canadian site so make sure you are on the .ca version.


I think what Tom and I were getting at is, _can you walk into a Cdn. HD branch_(bricks and mortar) and order something that has to come from HD in the States? If you can, what will be the upcharges?


----------



## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

I think you would have to order it from the dot com site and you would pay the extra shipping in those cases.


----------



## thomas1389 (Jan 4, 2012)

DesertRatTom said:


> Not sure if this would make a difference in Canada, however, I have been buying online from HD, WalMart but having delivery at local stores. No shipping charges that way. I started doing this as a price check and was surprised to discover their prices are sometimes lower, and delivery, returns are easy, just a mile away. Canadians near the border could drive across for some of these items. I'm curious to know if it would help. Living in Taxafornia, I've become sympathetic to those living in other socialist areas.


Here in our HD you can order stuff that's not stocked at the store and they deliver it no charge to your home max 2 days. I don't know if that's the case all over but HD tells me it's their policy.


----------



## difalkner (Jan 3, 2012)

That's how we got our DeWalt 735, ordering online at HD. Free shipping and it came in two days even though they projected 5 days.

David


----------



## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

David; our problem is the _cross-border shopping_ conundrum.
Trying to avoid the big extra costs.


----------



## thomas1389 (Jan 4, 2012)

DaninVan said:


> David; our problem is the _cross-border shopping_ conundrum.
> Trying to avoid the big extra costs.


Yes, the conversion is steep right now. by rights you must stay in the U.S. for a complete 24 hours to bring back up to $200 of goods duty free. 48 hours to bring up to $800 duty free. Coming back, you just pay the U.S. bridge toll but you stop at Canadian Customs for the questions. Usually you have no trouble unless you're lucky enough to get some over zealous soul that believes themselves a real crime stopper. We've all met them at both ends of the bridge. I know a couple of guys that live at the Falls and they go back and forth with ease quite often. Some groceries, gas, or whatever peaks their interest. The rules for this stuff are soft and as long as it's within reason there are no questions asked. Big purchases, alcohol and tobacco are a no-no. Guns are strictly prohibited. Hunters are a different thing as long as they're declared. I can get to the Falls in 45 minutes but I've never been that eager. But last May I brought over $600. of tools after 48 hours and only got a "have a nice day" from both sides.


----------



## BrianS (Nov 7, 2004)

thomas1389 said:


> Yes, the conversion is steep right now. by rights you must stay in the U.S. for a complete 24 hours to bring back up to $200 of goods duty free. 48 hours to bring up to $800 duty free. Coming back, you just pay the U.S. bridge toll but you stop at Canadian Customs for the questions. Usually you have no trouble unless you're lucky enough to get some over zealous soul that believes themselves a real crime stopper. We've all met them at both ends of the bridge. I know a couple of guys that live at the Falls and they go back and forth with ease quite often. Some groceries, gas, or whatever peaks their interest. The rules for this stuff are soft and as long as it's within reason there are no questions asked. Big purchases, alcohol and tobacco are a no-no. Guns are strictly prohibited. Hunters are a different thing as long as they're declared. I can get to the Falls in 45 minutes but I've never been that eager. But last May I brought over $600. of tools after 48 hours and only got a "have a nice day" from both sides.


SWMBO and I frequently shop in the Detroit area and very seldom do we get sent in for the requisite taxes. And, in most cases, that is what it is now... just the sales tax. Very few items are subject to duty charges any more. I even purchase beer on a regular basis and usually get waved thru with the "have a nice day" that you experienced. And, yes, I've got the over zealous officials, on both sides of the border, as well... I have to remember that they are just "doing their jobs"... most treat people with a little common courtesy, and some even have a great sense of humor.


----------



## BrianS (Nov 7, 2004)

DesertRatTom said:


> Not sure if this would make a difference in Canada, however, I have been buying online from HD, WalMart but having delivery at local stores. No shipping charges that way. I started doing this as a price check and was surprised to discover their prices are sometimes lower, and delivery, returns are easy, just a mile away. Canadians near the border could drive across for some of these items. I'm curious to know if it would help. Living in Taxafornia, I've become sympathetic to those living in other socialist areas.


I have purchased items online and had them shipped to a Walmart store in the Detroit area with great results, I've never attempted to have it shipped to Canada. I would think that extra shipping would apply, but it might be worth checking out.


----------



## DesertRatTom (Jul 3, 2012)

Sounds like delivery on the US side and waiting 48 hours to cross would be a good choice for $799 worth of goodies. I suspect the packaging would give you away for something that cost more. Those border guys are quite sharp.


----------



## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

Woodworking tools and equipment are Duty Free. 
It's paying the taxes on our side, and brokerage fees if you use a courier, that take the buzz right out of the fun.


----------



## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

DaninVan said:


> Woodworking tools and equipment are Duty Free.
> It's paying the taxes on our side, and brokerage fees if you use a courier, that take the buzz right out of the fun.


how do repair parts, samples and gifts fit into the scheme of things???


----------



## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

I've gotten quite a bit of stuff shipped across but I always made sure it was coming via post offices. Gifts are normally free, not sure about samples and parts. It may depend on what they are. Out of dozens of packages I've gotten, which were mostly router bits and other woodworking hand tools, I've paid our value added tax 2 or 3 times and I don't think that was ever over $10. I've paid an inspection fee once or twice of $5. Most of the time they can't be bothered for the few dollars of revenue it will provide so they just let it go through. If I want to buy something down there and they say they'll ship courier I tell them to forget it. Like Dan said, you pay the taxes and a brokerage fee that is usually $40-50.

If we go across the border and stay at least 48 hrs we can come back with quite a bit of stuff without paying. I think we are currently allowed a $900 exemption once per year or the quarterly equivalent of that. Brian is probably more familiar with the details of that than I am. Back when the dollars were about at par with each other it was common for people in Vancouver to go across to Blaine, Washington for gas, milk, cheese and a few other things. Some used to go down and get new tires but I heard of a few people that got nailed on that one. With our dollar way down the cross border shopping doesn't happen so much anymore.


----------



## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

Theoretically, you can drive down, pick up your $5,000 tablesaw, come back, declare it and bring it over duty free same day. I'm guessing there might be Tax repercussions based on the Declaration.


----------



## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

Once NAFTA went into force duty was only supposed to be charged on items that weren't available from a Canadian manufacturer. You would still owe GST on it and maybe provincial sales taxes. I haven't driven over the border in 27 years so I'm not that sure whether I paid those or not.


----------



## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

This might be of interest...
https://www.crossbordershopping.ca/duty-tax-import-guide/canada-customs-duty-rates-tariffs-and-taxes
Cat. 4 & 5


----------



## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

Thanks for that Dan. That can be handy to reference to. We know we can't get out of the federal Get Screwed Tax or the provincial ones but any idea what that Other column represents?


----------



## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

Cherryville Chuck said:


> Thanks for that Dan. That can be handy to reference to. We know we can't get out of the federal Get Screwed Tax or the provincial ones but any idea what that Other column represents?


Not really sure, Charles; maybe from anywhere other than the US?


----------



## thomas1389 (Jan 4, 2012)

DaninVan said:


> Not really sure, Charles; maybe from anywhere other than the US?


It means produced or manufactured in places other than the U.S. ( country of origin) That seems to cut it down a lot depending on if you can find something actually made in the U.S. The quality of goods seems to have improved a lot over the past decade or so. Made in the U.S.A. did mean a lot but then for a while I think they were resting on their laurels. (car industry for one) But now the anger, or fear, of Chinese encroachment in all areas has put the heart and pride back into quality. I would buy "made in U.S.A." in a heartbeat now. I see signs of dedication glowing in some areas. From my perspective the skills and ability and the creative juices were always there, much the same as in our country, but when you get corporations beating things down to the lowest common denominator you feel somewhat helpless. Twas ever thus.


----------

