# Best Portable Router for Timber Framing?



## timberwright (Aug 13, 2013)

_Hello to the board!_

We presently employ a dedicated housing router -- the Makita 2516N -- for housing duty, but there are many occasions when the 'big rig' is just too cumbersome and slow for timber framing work. 

In short, we're shopping for a powerful plunge router that will be used [chiefly] for hogging out notches in, as well chamfering edges on, construction timbers. While German-made power tools -- i.e., Mafell, Scheer and Festool -- are the Rolls Royce brands of choice in the timber framing world, they come at an exotic price, as well.

I'd really appreciate any productive words on which 'domestic' brand of plunge router might be well-suited for our purposes. As there are times when every bit of cut depth will be called for, I'd have to say that power and accuracy are our top priority.

Thanks very much for your time ... :thank_you2:


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## Mike (Nov 22, 2004)

Since you are looking for a work horse router I would suggest the Bosch 1619EVS.


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## timberwright (Aug 13, 2013)

*Thoughts please*



Mike said:


> Since you are looking for a work horse router I would suggest the Bosch 1619EVS.


Hi Mike,

My research has lead me to a few of your posts in the past, so your advice is well taken. I was wondering, however, if you've ever read a review [that I recently read] in which the Bosch 1619EVS didn't fare very well.

The article I'm citing appeared on the TOOLS OF THE TRADE website back in May 2009, and is entitled *Tool Test: 3+ Horsepower Plunge Routers*. As I don't have a high enough post count, as yet, I can't link you directly to the review. Consequently, I'll simply post an excerpt from the article (below).

Excerpts taken directly from Page 4 of the article (all comments relate directly to the 1619EVS):

_"Although it has some positives, this tool was handicapped by low reserve power and plunge-accuracy problems...The plunge mechanism allows too much play. To ensure accurate cutting, you must lock the stop rod to support the loose side of the router – for every cut. Otherwise the bit will tilt in the cut as you push down on the handles. This is a big performance compromise. Testers did not like the auto-locking lever that you must hold down to plunge the router; it adds a step and increases hand strain..._(and as for power) _Lower than most – stalls when pushed."_

As you obviously have experience with this model, Mike, I'd love to read your thoughts on the article.

Thanks again for your time ...


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## neville9999 (Jul 22, 2010)

I agree with Mike as I think that those Rolls Royce routers are too expensive for what you get, there are a bunch of mid priced variable speed Routers that work very well, both plunged and fixed base depending on what you need it for, you can buy four of these for one of the others, Bosch, Makita, all good. NGM


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## jschaben (Jun 21, 2009)

timberwright said:


> _I'd really appreciate any productive words on which 'domestic' brand of plunge router might be well-suited for our purposes. *As there are times when every bit of cut depth will be called for, I'd have to say that power and accuracy are our top priority.*
> Thanks very much for your time ... :thank_you2:_


_

In this case, I would suggest looking at the Bosch MRP23. It is only rated at 2.3 HP but sports a 15 amp motor as do the other 3+ HP rated routers. The reasoning here is that the plunge capacity is 3" as opposed to 2-9/16" for the Bosch 1619.
Good Luck_


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## Mike (Nov 22, 2004)

Perhaps the best thing I can say is opinions vary. We have been testing the routers in the photo for several months now. Front and center you will see the MRP23EVSK John mentioned. I bought two of them so draw your own conclusions. 

When you are plunge routing it is normal to plunge part way into the cut. clear out the material and then plunge a bit deeper on each additional cut until the full depth of cut is reached. Having the plunge lock lever engage when released should be easier on your hands. For sure this will make it easier to make each of your progressive cuts at the same depth. I think this boils down to personal choice.

The best depth stop turret is the design on the Bosch routers, they make it super easy to cut in increments. The worst turret design is on the DeWalt... the screws get in the way for bit changes. For timber framing this may not be a consideration as much as it is in finish carpentry projects.

If you are in the Detroit area you are welcome to stop by and try any or all of these routers. Only you can decide on which is the right choice for you!


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## timberwright (Aug 13, 2013)

*Neville*: Thanks so much for the input, and you're right! The German brands are very good tools, _but just how far do you go?_ By buying merchandise that is hyper-inflated in price, you're essentially supporting the practice (in my humble opinion).

*John*: _Do you reckon that the horsepower rating on either the 1619EVS or the MRP23 is erroneous?_ I have operated the MRF23EVS and it did [occasionally] seem a bit starved for power. This is the reason that Mike's suggestion seemed to make more sense (higher hp rating). Hmmmm... :blink:

*Mike*: As our tool source will allow us a trial period, I've put it an order for the Bosch 1619EVS. I appreciate your thoughts, once again, and I'll get back to this thread with my impressions (after I've used the tool a few times). By the way, my Dad spent his childhood in Livonia.

More to come ...


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## harrysin (Jan 15, 2007)

timberwright said:


> Hi Mike,
> 
> My research has lead me to a few of your posts in the past, so your advice is well taken. I was wondering, however, if you've ever read a review [that I recently read] in which the Bosch 1619EVS didn't fare very well.
> 
> ...


I have to agree with the Bosch review, some years ago I bought a Bosch GOF1300-ACE and had exactly the same problem with play in the pillar bearings. The large rubber boots served to hide thin pillars. I replaced it with a Makita 3612C which I'm now planning to replace as my main router with the current Makita RP2301FC which has linear bearings giving a play free super smooth plunge. The plunge depth is 70mm and it has built in lights. The only reason why I'm delaying the purchase is that I'm patiently waiting for a Muslechuck to be produced to suit this model, having had a Muslechuck on my 3612C for some time now, there is no way that I'll consider going back to a spanner. By the way, I'm not knocking Bosch per se, in fact I've recently bought a Bosch GCM 12 GDL 12" compound mitre glide saw and it is simply fabulous. As a matter of interest, the manual that came with mine is pathetic compared to the one that I downloaded from the American website BUT, mine came with several parts ready installed whereas the US one needs these to be assembled, but better still, mine has twin laser beams for accurate positioning but the US one doesn't mention or show this in their manual.


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## Mike (Nov 22, 2004)

Timberwright, please spend a few minutes filling out your profile.

HP ratings are a rough idea of the power a router generates, a better choice is the amps rating or watts. There is no fudge factor in these ratings. Of the 3+ hp models we are testing there is no question that the Festool OF 2200 EB is the top choice but it is overkill for the typical forum member plus the $1K price tag with the accessory kit and vacuum hose puts it out of range of many members. Speaking of dust collection I hope you will use it on which ever router you choose. Reducing clean up time is always a good thing and having healthy lungs is a pretty good bonus.

If the Milwaukee 5625-20 had a plunge base it might move to the top value of the list. Maybe they will listen and produce one. Priced at under $200 the Hitachi M12VE is the value leader at this time. Light weight and easy to maneuver it is a pretty good choice.


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## timberwright (Aug 13, 2013)

*Harry*: Thanks for the very interesting post. We also employ a 12" sliding compound miter saw, so your thoughts on the Bosch model are just as interesting as your input on the routers.

*Mike*: Although we do own a couple Milwaukee tools, I have to say that I've never used one of their routers. As we've been more than satisfied with our Hitachi 15A circular saw (I'm not much on remembering every model number), the *M12V2* did cross my mind. If the Bosch 1619EVS we've ordered doesn't work out for us, I'll think long and hard about the Hitachi. By the way, _will you recommend a good source for the Hitachi router?_

Thanks very much for your time...


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## jschaben (Jun 21, 2009)

timberwright said:


> *John*: _Do you reckon that the horsepower rating on either the 1619EVS or the MRP23 is erroneous?_ I have operated the MRF23EVS and it did [occasionally] seem a bit starved for power. This is the reason that Mike's suggestion seemed to make more sense (higher hp rating). Hmmmm... :blink:


Hi Red - I tend not to believe advertised horsepower on any electric power tools, at least not on the ones marketed in the US. All different sizes of horses; Clydsdales to Shetlands. I have a Shop - Vac with 6.5 HP plastered all over it and an 11 amp motor... who they kidding?

I have to defer to Mike's analysis as I have no experience with the 1619 and have only had the MRP23 but a few weeks. I've planned a few boards with the MRP which isn't particularly a test of power but does test the depth control which is very good. Mike has used both.


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## Mike (Nov 22, 2004)

Red, as a rule the best place to buy if you know what you are after is Amazon.

Hitachi M12VE 3-1/4 Peak High-Powered Variable Speed Plunge Router - Amazon.com


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## timberwright (Aug 13, 2013)

*John*: I'm starting to see what you mean about the advertised horsepower versus the current load and, yes, it would be easier to fudge the HP figures than it would the motor's load. By the way, _what was it you've used your MRP23 for? Is there a possible typo in your last post?_ 

*Mike*: _Would you mind posting your thoughts on the differences between the *Hitachi M12VE* and the *Hitachi M12V2*?_ I'm always willing to learn.

Have a good evening and thank you both very much...


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## Mike (Nov 22, 2004)

Red, the M12VE is the latest version of Hitachi's biggest router and it has dust collection attachments available. I don't think the M12V2 does.

What John is talking about is using a router on a ski jig to level a board like running it through a jointer.


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## harrysin (Jan 15, 2007)

timberwright said:


> *Harry*: Thanks for the very interesting post. We also employ a 12" sliding compound miter saw, so your thoughts on the Bosch model are just as interesting as your input on the routers.
> 
> *Mike*: Although we do own a couple Milwaukee tools, I have to say that I've never used one of their routers. As we've been more than satisfied with our Hitachi 15A circular saw (I'm not much on remembering every model number), the *M12V2* did cross my mind. If the Bosch 1619EVS we've ordered doesn't work out for us, I'll think long and hard about the Hitachi. By the way, _will you recommend a good source for the Hitachi router?_
> 
> Thanks very much for your time...


This morning I was advised by John DeRosa who makes the Muslechuck that the type 4 should fit the Makita RP2301FC so I immediately picked up the phone and ordered one which hopefully will be with me on Monday. I really do put my money where my mouth is! By the way, the Bosch 12" compound mitre GLIDE saw has the wonderful feature for those like me with limited space, that it fits right up to the wall.


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## jschaben (Jun 21, 2009)

timberwright said:


> By the way, _what was it you've used your MRP23 for? Is there a possible typo in your last post?_
> Have a good evening and thank you both very much...


Hi Red - not necessarily a typo, had to look up the proper spelling. I used it to "plane" paint off of some signs I made. I think the correct spelling should have been "planed" but that looks odd to me also. :wacko:


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## timberwright (Aug 13, 2013)

*Mike*: Thanks very much for your thoughts on the "green" routers. It still has me wondering, however, _why they sell two separate models that are so similar?_

*Harry*: _Do you mind posting a few words about what you're referring to when you write "musclechuck" ?_

*John*: I now understand what you meant. I've always seen the term written as "planing," so I think you've got it right. By the way, _do you have any photos of your "sled" system?_ 

UPDATE: We're still waiting for the new Bosch 1619EVS to arrive. After I've used it a few times -- for timber framing purposes -- I will get back to this thread with a few impressions.


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## vindaloo (May 30, 2009)

timberwright said:


> *Harry*: _Do you mind posting a few words about what you're referring to when you write "muslechuck" ?_


musclechuck dot com

Can't post URLs yet.

HTH


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## vindaloo (May 30, 2009)

The Musclechuck

Oooo now I can


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## Mike (Nov 22, 2004)

Lots of good info in this thread Red: http://www.routerforums.com/general...ollet-replacements-extensions.html#post339633

The Type 4 Musclechuck fits all the Bosch routers in the photo.


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## timberwright (Aug 13, 2013)

*Revival Time*

It's been a while, so I can only hope that I can revive this thread …

Okay, so we purchased the Bosch 1619EVS that was described/discussed in this thread (last summer). By the time we got it, however, we had already used our traditional tools and, more to the point, we never got the chance to use the 1619EVS … _until now_!

I've got a set of drawings in front of me and it looks like a beefy router -- with an appropriate straight bit -- could save us some time. The idea, in my head anyway, is to clamp several timbers together and use the 1619EVS to hog away wood (straight cut) to a 2-3/4 inch depth. The problem with this idea, however, seems to be plunge depth. As I've read, the 1619EVS has a max plunge depth of 2-9/16 inches, which leaves us with a deficit of 3/16 of an inch.

_Is there any way to overcome this shortfall? Perhaps a long straight bit that extends below the base (prior to the plunge)?_

By the way, I realize that the 1619EVS will not take away 2-3/4 inches of wood in a single pass. The process will take several passes, no doubt -- it's the final depth that has me scratching my head. 

Thanks for your time …


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## Mike (Nov 22, 2004)

Red, adding a Type 4 Musclechuck gives you an additional 5/8" of depth; it also gives you about 4 times the holding power of the factory chuck. Changing bits is super fast, one half turn of a T handle Allen wrench to loosen/tighten the bit.


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## timberwright (Aug 13, 2013)

Mike said:


> Red, adding a Type 4 Musclechuck gives you an additional 5/8" of depth; it also gives you about 4 times the holding power of the factory chuck. Changing bits is super fast, one half turn of a T handle Allen wrench to loosen/tighten the bit.


Glad I got in touch with you again, Mike!  

Thanks for the suggestion -- I'll be sure to order one as soon as possible. As I'm not aware of all of the dimensions involved, would you recommend a 1/2" shank *straight bit size* that would work well with the 1619EVS for the cut I previously described. 

Thanks again,
Red


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## Mike (Nov 22, 2004)

Red, the cutting length required for your project is beyond what Whiteside recommends. Companies do make extra long straight bits and my thought is you will tear them up on a regular basis so plan to buy multiples of an inexpensive bit.

I think this is who members recommend: 1 PC 1 2" SH 3" Blade Extra Long Straight Router Bit | eBay


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## timberwright (Aug 13, 2013)

Okay, Mike, I'll definitely look into the 3" straight bit you've linked me to.

As for the Muscle Chuck, however, I'm a bit confused. The website shows the various types of chucks, but then it gets into combination kits. In short, _I'm wondering if the Type 4 chuck you mentioned accepts 1/2" shank bits natively or, conversely, does one have to purchase a separate 1/2" collet to mount 1/2" shank bits?_

We should definitely buy the wrench they offer on the website, but I'm thinking that the collets may [effectively] be adapters. In other words, if one wishes to use 1/4" bits with the Muscle Chuck, the 1/4" collet "adapter" would be necessary to grip 1/4" shanks?

Please educate me on this. I don't have a lot of time, and only wish to place one order.

Thanks for the advice,
Red


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## Mike (Nov 22, 2004)

All you need for 1/2" shank bits is the Type 4 Musclechuck and the 4 mm Allen wrench. The top quality adapters are inserts to use different shank sizes so you may want to order a 1/4".

Order from this link to get the routerforums 5% discount. 

Quick Change Router Chuck - Camless Router Chuck - Dewalt - Porter Cable - Festool - Hitachi - Bosch - Makita - Trend - Feud - Fein - Metabo - Carvewright


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## Tom King (Jan 22, 2014)

I'm probably too late to this thread, but I'd say a Porter-Cable 7539. That's what we use for timber work. See the "Structural" page on my website.

I've had that router for over 20 years. We used it for milling 3/4" off of a couple of hundred feet of Heart Pine flooring-see "woodwork" page. We did wear out a couple of collets, and I thought we would probably at least wear out a set of bearings, but I've never had to go into that router. After the floor work, it served flawlessly milling muntin faces on a big sash job under a table, and still runs like the day I bought it.


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## Mike (Nov 22, 2004)

Tom, both the variable speed 7538 and the single speed 7539 are the heaviest routers at about 18.5 lbs each. The large plunge lock lever is nice to use. No dust collection moves them down on the list of routers I suggest. No question that they are real work horses. I have my 7538 set up on Infinity's 12" square clear base plate. Both of these routers use a Type 1 Musclechuck.


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