# lock miter bit



## mjadams61 (Dec 24, 2015)

I am looking to get into using lock miter joints and was wondering if anyone uses the MLCS lock mitre bits?


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## Steve Pack (Jan 1, 2014)

I have onr and works fine. Buy set up block. If you are going to a huge amount of corners buy an American made bit.


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## gdonham1 (Oct 31, 2011)

MCLS bits are good and are mostly asian made. MCLS also owns Eagle America and they are mostly US made. The difference is price and quality. If you are going to make a couple drawers then get the MCLS. If you are going to make hundreds then get the Eagle America or Infinity.

As stated by by Steve get the setup block. Setting up a perfect 45 degree lock miter is exhausting. The gauge makes set up fast with only a little tuning.

The trick to making drawers with the lock meter is you need a gig to hold the parts vertical and square to the fence and table. They make commercial jigs or you can make one your self . Whichever jig you choose use it. Trying to free hand a drawer side vertically through a router can make you grow old quick.

Check out this link https://www.infinitytools.com/blog/2013/05/17/set-up-lock-miter-router-bit/ for setup instructions. 

Warning 45 degree miter lock bits are fussy to set up perfectly.

Good Luck


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## gdonham1 (Oct 31, 2011)

Sorry I pushed post too quick. Look at this site as well for setting up lock miter bits.

https://www.popularwoodworking.com/projects/lock-miters/

The key is in the picture, if the joint is set up right it will look like this. The bit is adjusted just right and the fence is adjusted just right. To achieve this without the set up gauge to get you in the ball park will take a long time to trial and error your setup.


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## DesertRatTom (Jul 3, 2012)

Infinity also has a setup jig that is a tiny piece of aluminum. It has a mark to line up with a certain spot on the bit. Find a safe home for this tiny jig because it's really easy to lose. There are two jigs, depending on the size bit you're using.


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## Herb Stoops (Aug 28, 2012)

The setup blocks work only if your material is the same thickness, I use the infinity setup guage, it woks with any thickness.
Herb


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## Gene Howe (Jul 10, 2007)

+1 on the infinty set up jigs.


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## sreilly (May 22, 2018)

I've got a few as I was trying to use these on 1/2" plywood drawers. It was a mess and most likely due to the quality of the plywood. I also bought a Whiteside after not doing so well with the Infinity bit. I don't have a local source for Baltic Birch plywood and expect my results would have been different if I had. Using these bits on solid wood was much better and I've resolved myself to using hardwoods for my drawers going forward. Quality plywood is just too hard to get at home. There is a wood supplier about an hour away but they have very restrictive hours for the hobbyist and I think they sell 5x5 sheets. I really need to get down there and check them out. Company called Wurth Wood Group> I don't know a thing about them or what their pricing is like but it sounds like it might have to be a journey made.


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## mgmine (Jan 16, 2012)

Mlcs has great bits and I use them all the time. As mentioned if you plan on doing hundreds of drawers then maybe you should be looking at other brands. But if you are a typical woodworker then they are all you will ever need. Having said that, unless you are a glutton for punishment I would stay away from the lock miter bits. In the time it takes to set the bit up you could build the entire drawer using traditional methods. It won't make the drawer any stronger and you will still need to make other cuts or the bottom. in addition the sides will have to be thicker which doesn't necessarily make them look better.


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## Herb Stoops (Aug 28, 2012)

sreilly said:


> I've got a few as I was trying to use these on 1/2" plywood drawers. It was a mess and most likely due to the quality of the plywood. I also bought a Whiteside after not doing so well with the Infinity bit. I don't have a local source for Baltic Birch plywood and expect my results would have been different if I had. Using these bits on solid wood was much better and I've resolved myself to using hardwoods for my drawers going forward. Quality plywood is just too hard to get at home. There is a wood supplier about an hour away but they have very restrictive hours for the hobbyist and I think they sell 5x5 sheets. I really need to get down there and check them out. Company called Wurth Wood Group> I don't know a thing about them or what their pricing is like but it sounds like it might have to be a journey made.


I have them cut the sheets into 3'X5', and 2'X5' to get into my van, besides I can't handle a 5'X5'
@mgmine , I am with you the first time I used the lock miter bit, I must have use a whole sheet of plywood scraps trying to get it right, then gave up. I would recommend a Drawerlock bit myself.
Herb


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## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

I wonder if the manufacturer noticed that the joint pictured in the top illustration is impossible to make Herb? At least with the bit shown and if only using one bit.


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## Jerry Bowen (Jun 25, 2011)

I'll probably get accused of talking outg of turn but what the heck, I am know for doins gos,

In my ipinion and experience, llthe only people that use set up blocks and/or gauges are those that don't know how to set the bit mathematically.

Now, I'm the first to say that such a statement is a bit arrogant and most people will wonder why I would make such a statement.

There is a god reason for this and this that due to my poor vision along with my desire tmaster the set up. I had to do some work that other's with normal vision wold probably never try to do.

In doing so I found out how to do the set up for any thickness of stock using only my dial calipers and some very simple math.

If anyboy just happens to wonder what I'm talking about, I'll gladly explain it again as I have done so in the past on this forum.

The odds are almost zero that anybody will ever need to use the things that I learned in my quest to do the up the way that I do it.

It's just my nature, as many of the members will attest to, to always try to re-invent the wheel, but when one is handii capped one has to find way to work around such issues.

Now llthat I hve written what I have, I need to akd for forgiveness for being so arrogant. 

Jerry


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## TwoSkies57 (Feb 23, 2009)

If reinventing the wheel is what floats your boat, well keep on rowing brother!!!! 

Given your circumstance down there in Texas, the fact that you are willing to pursue an alternative that works
for you and then share the adventure is admirable. 





Jerry Bowen said:


> I'll probably get accused of talking outg of turn but what the heck, I am know for doins gos,
> 
> In my ipinion and experience, llthe only people that use set up blocks and/or gauges are those that don't know how to set the bit mathematically.
> 
> ...


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## DesertRatTom (Jul 3, 2012)

OK, what is the method Jerry?


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## Herb Stoops (Aug 28, 2012)

Cherryville Chuck said:


> I wonder if the manufacturer noticed that the joint pictured in the top illustration is impossible to make Herb? At least with the bit shown and if only using one bit.


Good eye Chuck,
I think I cropped the picture, there is a #51 and a #52 bit,two separate bits. the #52 is the one I wanted to show. My bad when I took the screen shot and cropped it then saved the picture.

Herb


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## Jerry Bowen (Jun 25, 2011)

DesertRatTom said:


> OK, what is the method Jerry?



Tom, it's kind of you ask me about "my method" of setting up the miter lock bit, however, as happy as I am with how I do what I do and the result that I get, I seriously doubt if many of the members would have any realy interest in it. Id say this because I believe that the majority of the member have normal vision or at least good enough vision to do the set up in a traditional manner.

I have been led to believe that many folks have given up on the set usp due to not understand how the joint is designed to work. If I were t tell you what I went through to arrive at what I eventually did, most of the people reading about it would either get a big laugh out of it or just cry when they saw how ignorat ignorat I was in the beginning.

I suppose that I could describe what I learned if there were enough sincere interest in what have to say about what I went through and learned, but I do doubt if that is the case.

But thanks anyway for asking, it did make me feel good that you did ask.


Jerry


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## harrysin (Jan 15, 2007)

Considering that these commercial set-up jigs are made for specific thickness material and any difference in thickness will lead to an imperfect joint, it's important to be able to set-up the bit without such an aid. I put a piece of the material against the bit and look along the table as I adjust the height of the bit so that an equal length of the mitre shows at the top and bottom. I then adjust the fence whilst still looking along the table. This gives a close setting, a couple of test cuts will show what fine tuning is required. Once this is perfect, make and keep a small sample for the next time the same thickness material is used, which will be no different to using a set-up jig.


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## sreilly (May 22, 2018)

Now that looks like a MCLS bit or maybe Eagle?


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## DesertRatTom (Jul 3, 2012)

Here again is the Infinity set up jig. Note with the larger bit that there is a mark for the centerline. That park aligns with the center of the workpiece. Mark the center of the workpiece and line up the mark by adjusting height and you should be very close to perfect, with only a little bit of error. Still going to still make a trial cut, but the correction will be minimal. This is very similar to what Harry described. Tiny errors are barely visible, but people can feel an edge only 1 or 2 thousandths over. No matter what you'll want some extra stock to set up with.

The infinity bits work very well for me.


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## Herb Stoops (Aug 28, 2012)

AND remember to take the jig off the bit BEFORE you turn on the router.

Just saying,
Herb


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## CharleyL (Feb 28, 2009)

DesertRatTom said:


> Here again is the Infinity set up jig. Note with the larger bit that there is a mark for the centerline. That park aligns with the center of the workpiece. Mark the center of the workpiece and line up the mark by adjusting height and you should be very close to perfect, with only a little bit of error. Still going to still make a trial cut, but the correction will be minimal. This is very similar to what Harry described. Tiny errors are barely visible, but people can feel an edge only 1 or 2 thousandths over. No matter what you'll want some extra stock to set up with.
> 
> The infinity bits work very well for me.



These Infinity gauges work quite well, but they are dependent on you finding and marking the exact center of your piece to be cut, and then setting the gauge on the bit and adjusting your router bit height or fence position so the exact center of the piece to be cut is in line with the long line of the gauge. I use the Rockler #56094 Center Finding jig, but any good means of easily finding and accurately marking the center of the thickness of your work piece will work. 

The gauges work very well, once you understand how they need to be used. You really only need the larger gauge, because it will work for either size bit, if you have enough room around the small bit for it to fit between your router table and fence.
Tables with removable inserts won't have a problem. You can replace the insert after the bit height is set. I think they work much better than the setup gauges that you can get with the bits, because they take into account different thicknesses of the work pieces by adjusting the bit height or fence position based on the center of the work rather than one surface.

It may be of interest to know that the inventor of the Incra I-Box jig also invented these Lock Miter Master gauges. He is a member woodworking club that I belong to.

Charley


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## Jerry Bowen (Jun 25, 2011)

Herb Stoops said:


> AND remember to take the jig off the bit BEFORE you turn on the router.
> 
> Just saying,
> Herb


After you forget to remove the gauge a cou[e pf time you will start to remember. Boy do I know what you are talking about Herb, I was of the opinion that I was the only dummy that made that mistake. 

Since I don't of you as a dummy Herb, and that sounds like you may have made that mistake too, I feel that maybe Id am not quite the dummy that I thought I was.

It's good to see that it was pointed out to Harry that the Infinity gaubes are not restricted to a single thickness as set up blocks are. Harry is so familiar with such things that he probably has never had a reaon to look at the gauges.

The trick with the Infinity gauges is to be able to "see" the marks, they are made to work fo a person with a vision handicap. By the way, I am starting think of my vision issue as more of a blessing than a handicap. I have had to figure things out for myself which has added to my enjoyment that oormally slghted peopld have missed out on.

Jerry


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## DesertRatTom (Jul 3, 2012)

CharleyL said:


> These Infinity gauges work quite well, but they are dependent on you finding and marking the exact center of your piece to be cut, and then setting the gauge on the bit and adjusting your router bit height or fence position so the exact center of the piece to be cut is in line with the long line of the gauge. I use the Rockler #56094 Center Finding jig, but any good means of easily finding and accurately marking the center of the thickness of your work piece will work.
> 
> The gauges work very well, once you understand how they need to be used. You really only need the larger gauge, because it will work for either size bit, if you have enough room around the small bit for it to fit between your router table and fence.
> Tables with removable inserts won't have a problem. You can replace the insert after the bit height is set. I think they work much better than the setup gauges that you can get with the bits, because they take into account different thicknesses of the work pieces by adjusting the bit height or fence position based on the center of the work rather than one surface.
> ...


I also use the Rockler centering jig. Sharpen the heck out of the pencil first to get a fairly precise mark. Very easy to find the center with it. https://www.rockler.com/rockler-center-offset-marking-tool

I found some small round pencils at HD (orange, 12 per pack) that shapen to a needle fine point, that I use in this jig.


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## Herb Stoops (Aug 28, 2012)

It is easy to make one of those jigs, Just take a block about 6" long and draw a line down the middle, then drill 2 holes one on each end, and one exactly in the middle between them. the end holes are for the wooden dowels and the center hole for the pencil. It will let you find the center of any thickness board.

herb


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## hawkeye10 (Jul 28, 2015)

Where is Stick's opinion? I know he is reading this and going off the deep end. > :laugh2: 

What about using a spline on the inside of your mitered joint? No measuring, just cut them glue your spline in put them together and call it a day.


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## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

I agree Don, the spline is much easier. Once yo set a saw blade and fence or make a jig then it does every piece exactly the same no matter where on the miter the spline lines up. With splines or biscuits I prefer to get the spline close to the heel of the joint so that I have more wood around it.


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## Jerry Bowen (Jun 25, 2011)

Herb Stoops said:


> It is easy to make one of those jigs, Just take a block about 6" long and draw a line down the middle, then drill 2 holes one on each end, and one exactly in the middle between them. the end holes are for the wooden dowels and the center hole for the pencil. It will let you find the center of any thickness board.
> 
> herb


Here I go again, the method that I use eliminates drawing that line and trying to find the center of the stock which does have to be done. I use a dail caliper to determing the error created on a test cut. Once I know the error, I am able to make the adjustment due to accuracy of the Incra Master Lift. Instead of needing a line marked on the work piece, I measure to the spot on the profile where the male and felmale meet. By knowing where the center of the work piece is by measuring the thickness of it with the dial calipber and dividing that measurement by two and then comparing the error on the test cut with the depth finding end of caliper, the error is quickly determined and the precise adjustment can be made. No line to draw, no gauge to be used. It works very well for me.


I am wondering if most people that use the miter lock bit make their cuts in one singe pass, I can't do it and so I don't. I sneak up on the cut making several shallow passes. Just have to ask as most deoms that I dhave watched do make a single pas. 

Making end grain cut in one pass are even worst for me but sneaking up solves that problem for me. 


Jerry


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## DesertRatTom (Jul 3, 2012)

A spline _would_ be an easier solution and all done with a table saw, with a 45 degree blade angle for both the miter cut and the spline cut. Stop block on the miter gauge makes certain all cuts are identical.


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## harrysin (Jan 15, 2007)

sreilly said:


> Now that looks like a MCLS bit or maybe Eagle?


I've had the two yellow bits for so-many years that I've long since forgotten from where they came. The black one was from a firm a few years ago that was liquidating all it's router bits at unbelievable prices. It was announced on the forum and discussed by several members. I bought heaps of them and never had a problem, a few I have never used. The ones in question are in the boxes, the rest are also shown. Building up a collection over the years means that just about anything can be routed.


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## CharleyL (Feb 28, 2009)

hawkeye10 said:


> Where is Stick's opinion? I know he is reading this and going off the deep end. > :laugh2:
> 
> What about using a spline on the inside of your mitered joint? No measuring, just cut them glue your spline in put them together and call it a day.




Although I have the lock miter bits and Lock Miter Master gauges, I have gone back to using full length spline grooves in my mitered joints and making cross grained splines to put in them, but sometimes for larger work, I'll use biscuits. Lock miter joints just take too much time to set up, can't be used effectively on plywood because of the resulting splintering and tear out, and the older ways are just easier and faster for me. Just as strong or stronger too. My methods still keep the joint from sliding out of line during glue-up too.

Charley


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