# cleaning up end grain on hardwood



## JRB The Handyman (May 25, 2011)

sorry to those of you who are now reading this for the second time. I am new to the site and may have inadvertantly sent it the worng way the first time. I installed hardwod floring 3/4" thick a year or so ago and have now decided tha I want to continue it into the next room. I had a transition strip that covered the first ends that were not perfectly lined up (off by up to 1/16"). Now I want to continue but there will be gaps if I don't get them perfectly flush. I am thinking about using a template bit 3/4 dia. 11/4 " long with a 1/2" shank and taking multiple passes. Any other thoughts/suggestions would be most helpful.

Thanks

JRB


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## jschaben (Jun 21, 2009)

JRB The Handyman said:


> sorry to those of you who are now reading this for the second time. I am new to the site and may have inadvertantly sent it the worng way the first time. I installed hardwod floring 3/4" thick a year or so ago and have now decided tha I want to continue it into the next room. I had a transition strip that covered the first ends that were not perfectly lined up (off by up to 1/16"). Now I want to continue but there will be gaps if I don't get them perfectly flush. I am thinking about using a template bit 3/4 dia. 11/4 " long with a 1/2" shank and taking multiple passes. Any other thoughts/suggestions would be most helpful.
> 
> Thanks
> 
> JRB


Hi JRB - Welcome to the forum

Router would probably work but that is a lot of endgrain to deal with. I would be inclined to use a circular saw with a fine tooth finish blade. Lay down a guide strip for the shoe to run against and make the first cut a scoring cut (1/8" or less).


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## Ralph Barker (Dec 15, 2008)

I mostly agree about the circular saw with a guide rail. The practical side, however, is whether there are obstructions at either end of the saw's path. It might be easier to scribe a line with a straight edge, and cut only the "offending" boards, perhaps with a hand saw or Multi-Tool. 

Depending on the layout of the original floor, you'll still have an obvious break line at the transition point. Thus, you might still want to have some sort of transition board perpendicular to the flooring strips, just to make a clean line.


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi

I disagree with the power hand saw they like to lift the wood up and rip up the ends.I suggest you get the saw below.
5" DoubleCut Saw

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Ralph Barker said:


> I mostly agree about the circular saw with a guide rail. The practical side, however, is whether there are obstructions at either end of the saw's path. It might be easier to scribe a line with a straight edge, and cut only the "offending" boards, perhaps with a hand saw or Multi-Tool.
> 
> Depending on the layout of the original floor, you'll still have an obvious break line at the transition point. Thus, you might still want to have some sort of transition board perpendicular to the flooring strips, just to make a clean line.


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## RJM (Apr 11, 2010)

I think you should pull up some boards to eliminate the break line. Extra work and cost but the break will look pretty bad. Also, no matter how you do it, it's going to be very difficult to get a clean edge cutting installed HW flooring. A router might work if you use some double sided tape to hold a straight edge and make cuts that eliminate the break line. Clean up corners with a small chisel, etc.

Just sayin'


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## crquack (Oct 10, 2008)

> I disagree with the power hand saw they like to lift the wood up and rip up the ends.I suggest you get the saw below.
> 5" DoubleCut Saw


Interesting. Do you actually use one? There is a heated debate on another forum about it. The one guy who actually uses one likes it. The rest have many opinions based on conjecture.

Have you used it on anything else but wood?


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## debbicot (Apr 23, 2011)

You could try to cut the new boards at the angle to fit into the edge of the old boards and then finish the edge off the tongue or grove , with the router too match


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## Ralph Barker (Dec 15, 2008)

bobj3 said:


> Hi
> 
> I disagree with the power hand saw *they like to lift the wood up and rip up the ends*.I suggest you get the saw below.
> 5" DoubleCut Saw
> ...


True of most old-style circular saws. A plunge-cut saw with a zero-clearance insert at the uplift end of the blade (e.g. Festool) would be less likely to do that. 

The double-cut saw you linked looks interesting.


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## Phil P (Jul 25, 2010)

Ralph Barker said:


> True of most old-style circular saws. A plunge-cut saw with a zero-clearance insert at the uplift end of the blade (e.g. Festool) would be less likely to do that.


A Festool (or Makita 5000SP, or Mafell MT55cc, or Hilti WSC255/WSC265, etc) on a rail will do exactly as Ralph says - near perfect straight cut with minimal edge splintering. What you get can often be disguised with a little bit of coloured wax (such as Liberon). Part of the trick is to have the correct blade in the machine. The ends of cut are finished using a hand saw running against a straight hardwood block and possibly paring with a sharp chisel as needed. It's the sort of set-up I use for breaking-out floors for electric/plumbing installs and minimises the amount of make good work required. 

Don't know about using that Harbor Freight souped-ep angle grinder doo-hickey, though, doesn't look like it could be guided to cut a dead straight line. I've seen plumbers using them to cut access holes in floors but we joiners generally have to quite a bit of clean-up afterwards as the holes aren't always that straight. I do agree that with fresh blades they can cut cleanly - but nowhere near as good as a rail guided saw set-up IMHO

Regards

Phil


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

YouTube - ‪Dual Saw(tm) Counter-Rotating Power Saw - As Seen on TV‬‏

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PI0SMzMf5zI&NR=1&feature=fvwp

But who wants to put out 500.oo + for Festool.. 
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Phil P said:


> A Festool (or Makita 5000SP, or Mafell MT55cc, or Hilti WSC255/WSC265, etc) on a rail will do exactly as Ralph says - near perfect straight cut with minimal edge splintering. What you get can often be disguised with a little bit of coloured wax (such as Liberon). Part of the trick is to have the correct blade in the machine. The ends of cut are finished using a hand saw running against a straight hardwood block and possibly paring with a sharp chisel as needed. It's the sort of set-up I use for breaking-out floors for electric/plumbing installs and minimises the amount of make good work required.
> 
> Don't know about using that Harbor Freight souped-ep angle grinder doo-hickey, though, doesn't look like it could be guided to cut a dead straight line. I've seen plumbers using them to cut access holes in floors but we joiners generally have to quite a bit of clean-up afterwards as the holes aren't always that straight. I do agree that with fresh blades they can cut cleanly - but nowhere near as good as a rail guided saw set-up IMHO
> 
> ...


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## Phil P (Jul 25, 2010)

bobj3 said:


> But who wants to put out 500.oo + for Festool..


These days almost any professional finishing carpenter, shop fitter, bar/restaurant fitter, floor fitter, ets, etc. Once you've had obne you'll wonder why you "suffered" inferior power hand saws for so many years

Regards

Phil


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi Phil

hahahahahahaha I guess one could say about the same for using a BMW . going from A to B but why...

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Phil P said:


> These days almost any professional finishing carpenter, shop fitter, bar/restaurant fitter, floor fitter, ets, etc. Once you've had obne you'll wonder why you "suffered" inferior power hand saws for so many years
> 
> Regards
> 
> Phil


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## Ralph Barker (Dec 15, 2008)

bobj3 said:


> Hi Phil
> 
> hahahahahahaha I guess one could say about the same for using a BMW . going from A to B but why...
> 
> ======


BMWs are OK if you want to dawdle along. But, for serious A-to-B-ing, I really prefer my Ferrari FF. 660hp, 335km/hour, and style to spare.


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi Ralph

You have a Ferrari ?????????????

How about a snapshot, but just of the motor I love art..

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Ralph Barker said:


> BMWs are OK if you want to dawdle along. But, for serious A-to-B-ing, I really prefer my Ferrari FF. 660hp, 335km/hour, and style to spare.


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## Ralph Barker (Dec 15, 2008)

bobj3 said:


> Hi Ralph
> 
> You have a Ferrari ?????????????
> 
> ...


Doesn't everyone? Mine, however, is cleverly disguised as a Chevy Suburban.


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

hahahahahahahahahahahaha LOMAO hahahahahaha

My 84 vet.is also disguised as one hahahaha

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Ralph Barker said:


> Doesn't everyone? Mine, however, is cleverly disguised as a Chevy Suburban.


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## dutchman 46 (May 23, 2007)

I think that the saw with guide is great. Try to rent one! Unless You are a carpenter by trade. Else, You have Ferrari prices just for the tool!


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## Phil P (Jul 25, 2010)

bobj3 said:


> I guess one could say about the same for using a BMW . going from A to B but why...


Sorry Bob, but I can't see BMW ever selling many vans....... However, Festool _et al_ do sell a lot of saws on guide rails. If you need to break-down sheet stock without a table saw and not have to time cleaning up the edges with a plane then it's the only way to go. Just like a BMW as opposed to a Corvette you get what you pay for.....



dutchman 46 said:


> I think that the saw with guide is great. Try to rent one! Unless You are a carpenter by trade. Else, You have Ferrari prices just for the tool!


Well there's always Dino's conversions (EZ_Smart) which use your hand existing rip saw...... Or you can even make-up a piece of 6mm plywood with a straight 4 x 1in planed batten screwed onto the top as a home-made sawing rail

Regards

Phil


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi Phil

All I'm saying you need to be Rich or Nuts to buy a ( Festool ) track saw system just to cut up some plywood, it's just plywood after all  the norm..

By the way I would take a Vet. over a BMW any day of the week..
The Vet is made in the States 

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Phil P said:


> Sorry Bob, but I can't see BMW ever selling many vans....... However, Festool _et al_ do sell a lot of saws on guide rails. If you need to break-down sheet stock without a table saw and not have to time cleaning up the edges with a plane then it's the only way to go. Just like a BMW as opposed to a Corvette you get what you pay for.....
> 
> 
> Well there's always Dino's conversions (EZ_Smart) which use your hand existing rip saw...... Or you can even make-up a piece of 6mm plywood with a straight 4 x 1in planed batten screwed onto the top as a home-made sawing rail
> ...


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## Phil P (Jul 25, 2010)

bobj3 said:


> By the way I would take a Vet. over a BMW any day of the week..
> The Vet is made in the States


So the build quality of the Vette is better than a Beemer? I always thought that Vettes were notorious for ther propensity to shed bits.........:laugh:

Regards

Phil


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