# DIY Box Joint jiq question



## tbreland (Apr 18, 2009)

I have seen page after page praising the Shopnotes box joint jig, and was wondering if anyone had actual instructions to build it. I know I can order them, but the poverty is a little extreme right now. I figured I could use up some of my scrap pile. I've found sites with lots of pics, but I'm a little challenged at estimating proper measurements. Any help would be appreciated.
-Thomas


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## TwoSkies57 (Feb 23, 2009)

Thomas,, to get ya started..

WoodCentral's Shop Shots


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Here's just one to get you started 

1 PC 1/2" SH 5 Slots Adjustable Box Joint Router Bit - eBay (item 130370231104 end time Mar-04-10 16:34:18 PST)
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## Santé (Jan 14, 2010)

tbreland said:


> I have seen page after page praising the Shopnotes box joint jig, and was wondering if anyone had actual instructions to build it. I know I can order them, but the poverty is a little extreme right now. I figured I could use up some of my scrap pile. I've found sites with lots of pics, but I'm a little challenged at estimating proper measurements. Any help would be appreciated.
> -Thomas


This jig is verry easy to make. you can find the one i made at this address: http://www.lescopeaux.asso.fr/Equipement_Atelier/clic.php3?url=Docs/Sante_Ass_Queues_Droites.pdf
With this, you can make the fingers on the 4 pieces at once
With your dado blade (we do not dado blade in Europe) you can calculate what gear wheel you should take
Santé


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## gav (Oct 12, 2009)

I have a pdf file of a shopnotes edition with a box joint jig for the table saw. Looks like it could be adapted for the router table.
If you want it, send me a pm with your email and I'll send it to you.


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

No math needed or table saw for the jig below to make box joints ,just pick it up at your front door 
pop it in your router table and put your box joints in place quick and easy ..
This one will also do 4 pieces at once  if you set it up with a off set spacer you only need to make two passes to make the complete box.
======
White box joint bit,sold out 28.oo US,just type in box joint bit
http://www.elitetools.ca/Recherche.aspx#

=======


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## Soapdish (Jan 18, 2010)

Bob are there any bits that you don't have? How much do these pictured cost?


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi Jake

O Yes many , many I don't have but I'm working on that all the time   , the bits in the pictures ,are a total of about 140.oo bucks for all of them.

The next one on my list is the one below if I can find it a bit cheaper.

http://www.rockler.com/product.cfm?page=19721&filter=shutter bit
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Soapdish said:


> Bob are there any bits that you don't have? How much do these pictured cost?


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## harrysin (Jan 15, 2007)

bobj3 said:


> Here's just one to get you started
> 
> 1 PC 1/2" SH 5 Slots Adjustable Box Joint Router Bit - eBay (item 130370231104 end time Mar-04-10 16:34:18 PST)
> =====


*Thanks for the link Bj, I've just ordered 13 items at a total cost of $US320.00 including freight and when converted to Australian dollars it came to $AU363.00 which equates to $AU28.00 each item, which for run of the mill cutters is still cheaper than here, however, included in the order was a 5 slot box joint bit, CMT cost here $AU169.00, a 1 1/4" bowl cutter CMT price $AU65.00, a 3/4" bull nose bit CMT price $AU85.00 and an 11 piece slot, tongue and groove set CMT price $AU270.00. So you see with the other 9 assorted bits it's quite a bargain providing the quality is as claimed. So far dealing with these people has been a pleasure, every question that I asked was answered promptly.*
*I'm not sure if I really need these cutters or if, subconsciously I'm attempting to accumulate more than you Bob!*


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## Cochese (Jan 12, 2010)

Hi Thomas, I can personally vouch for this one:
Router Table Box Joints - Techniques - American Woodworker

Scrap ply is all you really need, but you can upgrade as you see fit. I used UHMW for the runner, and scrap 3/4 birch for the backer.

I'll take a picture soon, but pretty much everything is there.


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi Harry

That's great  your welcome

" I'm attempting to accumulate more than you Bob! "

That would be FUN let's do it, can't have to many router bits  I may have a small edge on you at this point, at last count just over 300 to 500 ..I think.

Just a small note,,,it may be down by one, I dropped a 3/16" a carb.bit on the shop floor Tues. and it snapped just like glass  (25.oo bucks down the tube) that made me mad I had 3 in my hand and I said better put them back in the holder but no I broke the golden rule..put it back 1st. then move on .. 

=======



harrysin said:


> *Thanks for the link Bj, I've just ordered 13 items at a total cost of $US320.00 including freight and when converted to Australian dollars it came to $AU363.00 which equates to $AU28.00 each item, which for run of the mill cutters is still cheaper than here, however, included in the order was a 5 slot box joint bit, CMT cost here $AU169.00, a 1 1/4" bowl cutter CMT price $AU65.00, a 3/4" bull nose bit CMT price $AU85.00 and an 11 piece slot, tongue and groove set CMT price $AU270.00. So you see with the other 9 assorted bits it's quite a bargain providing the quality is as claimed. So far dealing with these people has been a pleasure, every question that I asked was answered promptly.*
> *I'm not sure if I really need these cutters or if, subconsciously I'm attempting to accumulate more than you Bob!*


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## istracpsboss (Sep 14, 2008)

bobj3 said:


> Hi Jake
> 
> O Yes many , many I don't have but I'm working on that all the time   , the bits in the pictures ,are a total of about 140.oo bucks for all of them.
> 
> ...


You had me going for a moment there, Bob. I thought you'd found something useful. I'm looking for a bit to do real shutters with, Something like a pair of thumbnail cutters mirrored together, so they do both sides at once. I figured if they had a decent gap you could run through one edge, then just raise it enough to do the back edge. Trying to form both sides simultaneously seemed to be pushing it.

I'm increasingly drawn to the idea of, for table work, using the blank arbours and stringing on them the combination of cutters and spacers I need, rather like a shaper, but apart from rabetting and fluting cutters I don't see much about. The ability to do slightly thicker external door or window work would be handy sometimes, particularly when trying to match an existing one.

Cheers

Peter


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## istracpsboss (Sep 14, 2008)

harrysin said:


> *Thanks for the link Bj, I've just ordered 13 items at a total cost of $US320.00 including freight and when converted to Australian dollars it came to $AU363.00 which equates to $AU28.00 each item, which for run of the mill cutters is still cheaper than here, however, included in the order was a 5 slot box joint bit, CMT cost here $AU169.00, a 1 1/4" bowl cutter CMT price $AU65.00, a 3/4" bull nose bit CMT price $AU85.00 and an 11 piece slot, tongue and groove set CMT price $AU270.00. So you see with the other 9 assorted bits it's quite a bargain providing the quality is as claimed. So far dealing with these people has been a pleasure, every question that I asked was answered promptly.*
> *I'm not sure if I really need these cutters or if, subconsciously I'm attempting to accumulate more than you Bob!*


Hi Harry

Are these CMT or from George? The last CMT I got were from Canada, where they were a lot cheaper than in the UK. From what I see on the Aussie forum, stuff down your way is very dear, not unlike the UK, although with maybe more justification.

Cheers

Peter


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi Peter 

They make a bit to do " real shutters " but it's very labor intensive , you can see the setup on Norm A.web site. I wish they made a bit to do both sides at one time but the only machine I know about is a molding machine.

And it's not cheap also see it on Norm's web site.

http://www.eagleamerica.com/product/175-0735/ea_-_molding_bits
http://www.eagleamerica.com/product/p14-3564/
http://www.eagleamerica.com/whatsthediff

http://www.newyankee.com/getproduct.php?0101

http://www.newyankee.com/getproduct.php?0602
========



istracpsboss said:


> You had me going for a moment there, Bob. I thought you'd found something useful. I'm looking for a bit to do real shutters with, Something like a pair of thumbnail cutters mirrored together, so they do both sides at once. I figured if they had a decent gap you could run through one edge, then just raise it enough to do the back edge. Trying to form both sides simultaneously seemed to be pushing it.
> 
> I'm increasingly drawn to the idea of, for table work, using the blank arbours and stringing on them the combination of cutters and spacers I need, rather like a shaper, but apart from rabetting and fluting cutters I don't see much about. The ability to do slightly thicker external door or window work would be handy sometimes, particularly when trying to match an existing one.
> 
> ...


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## CanuckGal (Nov 26, 2008)

Jake I got the Box joint bit below from Elite tools for $29.00 CAD. Looks like they are sold out atm though


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## istracpsboss (Sep 14, 2008)

bobj3 said:


> Hi Peter
> 
> They make a bit to do " real shutters " but it's very labor intensive , you can see the setup on Norm A.web site. I wish they made a bit to do both sides at one time but the only machine I know about is a molding machine.
> 
> ...


Thanks for that Bob. They are not cheap at all :-(

One of these minus the back cutter might work.

http://cgi.ebay.com/1pc-15-Straight...ViewItemQQptZRouters_Bits?hash=item20afb767d1

Cheers

Peter


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## Soapdish (Jan 18, 2010)

Thanks for the link Deb!


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi Peter

It's to small (short) 1" max not to say anything about using the bit without the bearing in place..and the back cutter..

======





istracpsboss said:


> Thanks for that Bob. They are not cheap at all :-(
> 
> One of these minus the back cutter might work.
> 
> ...


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## jlord (Nov 16, 2009)

istracpsboss said:


> You had me going for a moment there, Bob. I thought you'd found something useful. I'm looking for a bit to do real shutters with, Something like a pair of thumbnail cutters mirrored together, so they do both sides at once. I figured if they had a decent gap you could run through one edge, then just raise it enough to do the back edge. Trying to form both sides simultaneously seemed to be pushing it.
> 
> I'm increasingly drawn to the idea of, for table work, using the blank arbours and stringing on them the combination of cutters and spacers I need, rather like a shaper, but apart from rabetting and fluting cutters I don't see much about. The ability to do slightly thicker external door or window work would be handy sometimes, particularly when trying to match an existing one.
> 
> ...



Hi Peter,
Here is a set of bits from Woodline USA. It is a complete set of bits to make the plantation shutters. There is also a set of instructions in pdf to make the templates needed for assembly. You will find the instructions under the instruction tab at the top of the page incase link does not work. The set of bits are only 69.00 US & I think they will do what you want to make operational shutters. They also carry the shutter pins needed for assembly. I found that one of my cabinet parts suppliers carries the pins in bags of 500. 

Woodline USA - Plantation Shutter Set

http://www.woodline.com/instructions/Plantation Shutters.pdf


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## istracpsboss (Sep 14, 2008)

jlord said:


> Hi Peter,
> Here is a set of bits from Woodline USA. It is a complete set of bits to make the plantation shutters. There is also a set of instructions in pdf to make the templates needed for assembly. You will find the instructions under the instruction tab at the top of the page incase link does not work. The set of bits are only 69.00 US & I think they will do what you want to make operational shutters. They also carry the shutter pins needed for assembly. I found that one of my cabinet parts suppliers carries the pins in bags of 500.
> 
> Woodline USA - Plantation Shutter Set
> ...


Thank you so much for that, James. I'd seen the article before but hadn't noticed the special bit set. I'm really grateful to you for it.

Cheers

Peter


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## harrysin (Jan 15, 2007)

istracpsboss said:


> Hi Harry
> 
> Are these CMT or from George? The last CMT I got were from Canada, where they were a lot cheaper than in the UK. From what I see on the Aussie forum, stuff down your way is very dear, not unlike the UK, although with maybe more justification.
> 
> ...


They're from George, I quoted CMT comparative prices because they were the only ones with all the types that I wanted, and the few similar ones in Timbecon and Carba-Tec catalogues weren't much cheaper.


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## gav (Oct 12, 2009)

istracpsboss said:


> Thanks for that Bob. They are not cheap at all :-(
> 
> One of these minus the back cutter might work.
> 
> ...


I'm not really familiar with louvre construction but it sounds as if a straight bit in a horizontal table that has the ability to adjust the angle of the router might work.
See pic.


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## istracpsboss (Sep 14, 2008)

Hi Gav

James came up with a reasonably priced set that includes all the bits including the louvre one.
http://www.woodline.com/p-1774-plantation-shutter-set.aspx
BTW, did you make that horizontal table?

Cheers

Peter


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## gav (Oct 12, 2009)

I didn't make that table, it's for sale on amazon. I'm thinking of making one like it though. Seems it could be useful. Last summer I made a small wooden bucket with a handsaw, sandpaper, and scrap wood from a building site in my summer village. Turned out wonky but ok and I'd like to make some more with the router.


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## Santé (Jan 14, 2010)

Hi
On the table top i was making, i will ave a vetical router with lift or my router with ability of adjusting angle of bit
and, increasingly, I will have the possibility puting my ajustable router horizontally.

Cheers

Daniel


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## istracpsboss (Sep 14, 2008)

Hi Daniel

Do you squeeze the two handles for rise and fall ?

Where did you find the castings?

Cheers

Peter


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## allthunbs (Jun 22, 2008)

CanuckGal said:


> Jake I got the Box joint bit below from Elite tools for $29.00 CAD. Looks like they are sold out atm though


Good grief! You mean they actually sell something that is a price leader? They're about an hour from me and I visited them once only to find their prices terrible. Well, I'll have to visit their site again.


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## allthunbs (Jun 22, 2008)

tbreland said:


> I have seen page after page praising the Shopnotes box joint jig,


Hi Thomas:

The original thread was about this box joint jig but no one pointed you to the Routerworkshop, router version that cuts all four joints at the same time. Worth a look, and you don't need to buy the parts, it's very easy to make. I used UHMW for my first one but I think a chunk of 3/8" plywood and a strip of something of suitable size for the fence would work nicely.


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## Santé (Jan 14, 2010)

Hi Peter,
For handle, is exactly that, when I close the handles, bit plunge.
I made the model for casting and I did run 2 times the parts in an aluminum plant, I sent these pieces at a woodworker who is also a metalworker, he worked the pieces and kept 1 model for him in payment for his work.
All this is explained with other pics (in French) on the site lescopaux.asso
Cheers
Daniel


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi Guys

Yes they can be made on the horz.table you just need a two part jig and some stock to slide it by the standard bit..the stock/jig is clamp in place at the angle you want and then just slide it down the track so to speak.

The boys have a show and tell how to make one> on the Oak Park table

1411. Window Shutter

"Shutters are used in many places in our homes. 
They can be closet or cabinet doors. They can be used instead of drapery for window covering or on the outside of the house for decoration of windows. 
A shutter consists of a framework with wooden louvers applied at an angle. We have chosen to make fixed louver shutters that open by swinging the shutter on hinges. 
In episode #1411 Bob and Rick show you how to make angle louvers for a shutter with the router and a *mitre gauge* on the Router Workshop"

Router Workshop: Series 1400


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

HI Gav

Just a note about wooden buckets, they make bits just for that job.see below.

MLCS Euro door, door lip, finger pull, drawer lock bits, glue joint router bits

======





gav said:


> I didn't make that table, it's for sale on amazon. I'm thinking of making one like it though. Seems it could be useful. Last summer I made a small wooden bucket with a handsaw, sandpaper, and scrap wood from a building site in my summer village. Turned out wonky but ok and I'd like to make some more with the router.


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi Daniel

You had me going for a min., I saw the picture and I said what is that a French Frye Slicer ? but than I saw the router in the center of the jig. 

Nice jig Daniel, man when you make a jig you go all out..


==========



Santé said:


> Hi
> On the table top i was making, i will ave a vetical router with lift or my router with ability of adjusting angle of bit
> and, increasingly, I will have the possibility puting my ajustable router horizontally.
> 
> ...


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## istracpsboss (Sep 14, 2008)

Santé said:


> Hi Peter,
> For handle, is exactly that, when I close the handles, bit plunge.
> I made the model for casting and I did run 2 times the parts in an aluminum plant, I sent these pieces at a woodworker who is also a metalworker, he worked the pieces and kept 1 model for him in payment for his work.
> All this is explained with other pics (in French) on the site lescopaux.asso
> ...


Hi Daniel

Well done ! I used to do patterns and get stuff cast in aluminium and cast iron when I was in the UK, but I've no foundries around here and my metal working machinery is still stored. I've lots of information on building a home foundry and one day I might make one if I can get some cupolas.

Cheers

Peter


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## CanuckGal (Nov 26, 2008)

> Good grief! You mean they actually sell something that is a price leader? They're about an hour from me and I visited them once only to find their prices terrible. Well, I'll have to visit their site again


They actually have some very good prices on router bits and the bits are pretty decent. I bought thier 66 pc 1/2" shank set at the wood show. Works out to about $2.50 a bit even with taxes in. Can't beat that.


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi Guys
I got one also see post above, it was 26.oo dollars but the freight was very high from CD. to the U.S. and it took over 10 days to get. but other than that it's a good bit.

========


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## CanuckGal (Nov 26, 2008)

Bob did you buy it direct from their website or from their EBAY site? I found the shipping was higher on EBay.


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi Dep 

direct from the website 

====



CanuckGal said:


> Bob did you buy it direct from their website or from their EBAY site? I found the shipping was higher on EBay.


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## Stefang (Feb 10, 2010)

Hi BJ, 

Those bits you are recommending as box joint bits look more like what most of the manufacturers of these call finger joint bits. I know there might not be any clear distinction between the two, but in general finger joints are quite a bit more narrow than traditional box joints, and a lot of tiny joints might look out of proportion on some boxes. Of course personal preference plays an important roll here.

I also have a question on those super long straight bits which from the postings are 2-1/2" to 3" in length. For one thing thing, a price of around $11 for any bit would make me suspicious of the quality and for another I wonder what effect such a long bit would have on a router. I am thinking that putting pressure on the end of a long bit will create a certain amount of leverage and whip. Is this a problem with the bits in question? I wouldn't want to prematurely wear out the bearings in my router.


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

2pc 1/2"SH Adjustabal Box & Finger Joint Router Bit Set - eBay (item 130370387515 end time Mar-05-10 10:42:37 PST)


I have been using the LONG bits, I have been getting his bits for about 2 years and not one dud out of them .

Check his feedback ( 100% Positive feedback or just over 13,000 bits sold by him ) so I must not be the only one that's happy with his bits.

What else could you call a joint with square corners other than a box joint,see below.
========



Stefang said:


> Hi BJ,
> 
> Those bits you are recommending as box joint bits look more like what most of the manufacturers of these call finger joint bits. I know there might not be any clear distinction between the two, but in general finger joints are quite a bit more narrow than traditional box joints, and a lot of tiny joints might look out of proportion on some boxes. Of course personal preference plays an important roll here.
> 
> I also have a question on those super long straight bits which from the postings are 2-1/2" to 3" in length. For one thing thing, a price of around $11 for any bit would make me suspicious of the quality and for another I wonder what effect such a long bit would have on a router. I am thinking that putting pressure on the end of a long bit will create a certain amount of leverage and whip. Is this a problem with the bits in question? I wouldn't want to prematurely wear out the bearings in my router.


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## istracpsboss (Sep 14, 2008)

CanuckGal said:


> Bob did you buy it direct from their website or from their EBAY site? I found the shipping was higher on EBay.


You do need to look at both the website and the ebay site because there are often price differences on both the bits and the freight.

Other than that, I was surprised when Ron said he'd found them dear in the bricks and mortar place, because online they seem quite reasonable. The bits I've had from them have been OK.

Cheers

Peter


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## allthunbs (Jun 22, 2008)

bobj3 said:


> Hi Guys
> I got one also see post above, it was 26.oo dollars but the freight was very high from CD. to the U.S. and it took over 10 days to get. but other than that it's a good bit.


A word of caution for purchasers in the US buying product from Canada. On a previous attempt to export into the U.S. I was faced with a Customs law in the U.S. that states they won't process anything under $30.00. That's why a lot of Canadian organizations setup shop just across the border in the U.S. (Ogdensburg, NY; Detroit, MI; Port Huron) If you order from Elite Tools again, make sure your order is at least $30.00 U.S. Better still, check with your local customs office to find out what the minimum is. It's probably changed since then (>10 years ago.)


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

I Should know better I got a router lathe from CD. for 100.oo bucks and the freight to the US was 75.oo bucks..


=======


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## allthunbs (Jun 22, 2008)

Hi Mike:



Stefang said:


> Those bits you are recommending as box joint bits look more like what most of the manufacturers of these call finger joint bits. I know there might not be any clear distinction between the two, but in general finger joints are quite a bit more narrow than traditional box joints, and a lot of tiny joints might look out of proportion on some boxes. Of course personal preference plays an important roll here.


If you take a look at the finger joint bit, you'll see that the "fingers" are tapered. The box joint bits the fingers are square. http://cgi.ebay.ca/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?VISuperSize&item=130370387515 



> I also have a question on those super long straight bits which from the postings are 2-1/2" to 3" in length. For one thing thing, a price of around $11 for any bit would make me suspicious of the quality and for another I wonder what effect such a long bit would have on a router. I am thinking that putting pressure on the end of a long bit will create a certain amount of leverage and whip. Is this a problem with the bits in question? I wouldn't want to prematurely wear out the bearings in my router.


I buy three "levels" of bits. Dirt cheap for the quick and dirty applications with softwood. I'll pay a bit more for bits to make better quality stuff of softwood or cheap hardwood and I'll pay premium prices for really nice stuff in expensive hardwoods (my firewood is sugar maple ;-)

Expensive bits do not guarantee quality. There are those that will argue that price dictates quality but that is not always the case. I would suggest that you take a look at the Carbide Processors site Whiteside Router Bits, Industrial Drill Bits, Saw Blades, Router Bit Sets, Tense Watches, Tenyru, SystiMatic . They have some interesting stuff on determining bit quality.



> Theory is when one knows everything, but nothing comes out right.
> Experience is when everything comes out right, but no one knows why
> In my shop theory and practice are united. Nothing comes out right and nobody knows why.


I have a saying "I have no experience, only hope" that goes hand-in-hand with your signature. In the same breath, "Science is the art of learning more and more about less and less until one knows absolutely everything about nothing. ;-)


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## Stefang (Feb 10, 2010)

Hi Ron,

Thanks for pointing out the finger/box jt. distinction and the bit mfr. site. I will check it out and learn something. I think all of my present bits were made in China, they seem to perform pretty good, but I must admit, I really don't have a basis for comparison. I have a 1/2" lock miter bit junior and senior set and a few other bits with 1/2" shanks. Another thing I wonder about is the spiral upcut bits. I'm thing about getting one and I wonder; do you cut in depth increments with these like with other bits or can it be plunged to full depth like for cutting a mortise? Spiral bits aren't stocked by anyone here so they have to be special ordered and they cost quite a bit. I'm thinking here of solid carbide. I don't know if they are made out of HSS.


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

MLCS solid carbide router bits

MLCS solid carbide router bits

Q: How about Foreign Shipping?
A: Sure, MLCS is happy to process orders for our international customers. We can ship to most countries. Shipping charges are based on the size and weight of the order and the country to which we are shipping. International shipping charges will be displayed accurately in your online shopping cart (subject to offline verification). Most orders ship via 1st Class Mail International and Priority Mail International. However, not all shipping methods displayed are available to all countries due to insurance requirements. Please note that customs duties, taxes, and other import fees may be imposed on shipments by some countries. MLCS cannot be responsible for these charges. We urge you to check with local authorities regarding these charges prior to ordering if you are not already familiar with them. Please check the appropriate box in the shopping cart indicating your acceptance of any duties and taxes. We will not be able to process your order without this verification.

=======


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## allthunbs (Jun 22, 2008)

Hi Mike:



Stefang said:


> Thanks for pointing out the finger/box jt. distinction and the bit mfr. site. I will check it out and learn something.


Carbide Processors has revamped their web site so I've sent a message to the president, hoping he will restore the appropriate articles to their new site.



> I think all of my present bits were made in China, they seem to perform pretty good, but I must admit, I really don't have a basis for comparison.


I swear everything is made in China now, except quality men's suits. They're made in the Eastern Townships of Quebec, Canada.



> I have a 1/2" lock miter bit junior and senior set and a few other bits with 1/2" shanks. Another thing I wonder about is the spiral upcut bits. I'm thing about getting one and I wonder; do you cut in depth increments with these like with other bits or can it be plunged to full depth like for cutting a mortise?


Take a long hard look at a spiral bit. I like the Freud. http://freud.ca/English/Pages/Bits/Spiral/75-108.gif 

Now, look at the side of the bit and you'll see some "ridges". It sort of looks like a twist drill bit. These spirals and "ridges" are used for side cutting. Take a look at the tip of the bit and you'll see that it is like a plane's blade.

Ok, the tip is for drilling into material with a plunge router, just like a drill press. And, yes, you can drill to the full depth of the bit. 

The ridges on the sides are for cutting as the bit is moving sideways. However, just like other bits, you don't want to take a huge chunk at a time. Just like other bits, take 1/8" to 1/4" at a time.

_Never_ buy a spiral that is not 100% carbide. There are upcut, downcut, up and down cut, roughing and they come in a variety of sizes. They are available 1/4" and 1/2" and I think they're available in metric sizes as well, 8mm and 15mm???? Help Harry. I don't know the metric sizes, in spite of Canada being metric.

Tegs Tools - Router Bits - Spiral Bits

I called Tegs and they will ship to Norway, if you want to pay for it. If you have internet phone, give them a call. You might try sending them an e-mail. If you don't get an answer, private message me and I'll give them a call. However, I went to the Dimar web site (Teg's bit maker) and it looks like they import from the Orient.



> Spiral bits aren't stocked by anyone here so they have to be special ordered and they cost quite a bit. I'm thinking here of solid carbide. I don't know if they are made out of HSS.


I would suggest that you become familiar with Canadian Suppliers. Some will ship to Europe. 

LeeValley.com
busybeetools.ca
tegstools.com

There is one in the U.S. that may ship to Norway and they sell a lot over the internet. The last I checked, they were among the cheapest bits available and they work like it but for rough work, I'm not going to chew up a $40 bit. A $5 bit is still too expensive.

woodline.com

Hope this helps, Mike. Let me know if you have any problems.


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## istracpsboss (Sep 14, 2008)

allthunbs said:


> Hi Mike:
> 
> 
> I swear everything is made in China now, except quality men's suits. They're made in the Eastern Townships of Quebec, Canada.


My last sports jacket and slacks were made in China. The guy comes over and takes a suite of hotel rooms in various cities and does a tour with a team of tailors who measure and photograph you. The materials are all European. The suit comes by courier !

When I was younger, off the peg suits were unthinkable and totally down market. All the old tailors seem to have gone, now, except in Saville Row and they charge fortunes there.

Cheers

Peter


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## Santé (Jan 14, 2010)

Hi Allthunbs
Metric sizes are: 6 , 8 and 12 mm but 6 is hardly used, the new norm are 8 and 12 mm

cheers
Santé


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## Santé (Jan 14, 2010)

istracpsboss said:


> My last sports jacket and slacks were made in China. The guy comes over and takes a suite of hotel rooms in various cities and does a tour with a team of tailors who measure and photograph you. The materials are all European. The suit comes by courier !
> 
> When I was younger, off the peg suits were unthinkable and totally down market. All the old tailors seem to have gone, now, except in Saville Row and they charge fortunes there.
> 
> ...


Yes Peter, ther is no more tailor in Belgium, I was the latest in my town.
Daniel


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## istracpsboss (Sep 14, 2008)

In the little market town I grew up in, there were four or five. One was very old fashioned and worked cross-legged on a table. 
Only the poorest of manual workers had off the peg suits. Everyone else had them made to measure. It made sense. One of my shoulders is very slightly lower than the other and the tailor padded it accordingly, so that it looked smart. Now all the shops want to know is your chest and sleeve length. Fused interlinings don't allow a suit to hang the way the traditional tailors made them. My made to measure Chinese jacket seems very good.

Cheers

Peter


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## Santé (Jan 14, 2010)

"One was very old fashioned and worked cross-legged on a table. "
Yes, I worked also like that, and my father was a tailor, also. It is the best position to make suits.


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## allthunbs (Jun 22, 2008)

Santé said:


> Hi Allthunbs
> Metric sizes are: 6 , 8 and 12 mm but 6 is hardly used, the new norm are 8 and 12 mm
> 
> cheers
> Santé


Thanks Daniel:

Maintenant, je doit le souvien ;-)

now all I have to do is remember it.

Ron


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## allthunbs (Jun 22, 2008)

istracpsboss said:


> In the little market town I grew up in, there were four or five. One was very old fashioned and worked cross-legged on a table.
> Only the poorest of manual workers had off the peg suits. Everyone else had them made to measure. It made sense. One of my shoulders is very slightly lower than the other and the tailor padded it accordingly, so that it looked smart. Now all the shops want to know is your chest and sleeve length. Fused interlinings don't allow a suit to hang the way the traditional tailors made them. My made to measure Chinese jacket seems very good.
> 
> Cheers
> ...


It looks like you're right handed. Tailor's will always pad the shoulder of the dominant hand. Ready made is usually padded right handed.


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## harrysin (Jan 15, 2007)

Peter, you didn't mention "Burton's the fifty shilling tailors" every major city in England had at least one branch, Manchester had at least three, my wedding suit came from one of them in 1954.
Here in Perth we have the "Hong Kong Tailor" who visits twice a year and works out of one of the plush hotels.


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## istracpsboss (Sep 14, 2008)

Burtons always had very elegant buildings. I thought Jacksons were the Fifty Shilling Tailor? Remember Dunns for Harris Tweed jackets?

Cheers

Peter


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## Santé (Jan 14, 2010)

allthunbs said:


> It looks like you're right handed. Tailor's will always pad the shoulder of the dominant hand. Ready made is usually padded right handed.


 exactly! everybody has a lower shoulder and hip larger toward the dominant hand


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Great now I can tell if he is right hand or left hand or just hand him a pen..  LOL

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Santé said:


> exactly! everybody has a lower shoulder and hip larger toward the dominant hand


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## tbagjohn (Dec 8, 2009)

*Box Joint Jig*

I'd be interested to see what people think of this one:

Router Template | Woodworking Templates | Router Guides


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi John

Just my 2 cents,,they are a bit high in price, you can get just the templates from MLCS with free shipping but do take a hard look at the OakPark jigs all you need is the bit(s) to use them..and a router table 

BOX JOINT TEMPLATES for 12" Steel Dovetail Jig
Pins and tails dovetail jigs

Oak Park Enterprises Ltd.: Catalogue

see video
Oak Park Enterprises Ltd.: Catalogue

Hi John

I have playing with a idea ,one pair like yours but with slots so they can be adjusted for 1/8" to 3/4" box joints all in one jig so to speak..

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tbagjohn said:


> I'd be interested to see what people think of this one:
> 
> Router Template | Woodworking Templates | Router Guides


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## seawolf21 (Jan 19, 2007)

That's a nice jig but how about one for the router table? 

Gary


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## allthunbs (Jun 22, 2008)

tbagjohn said:


> I'd be interested to see what people think of this one:
> 
> Router Template | Woodworking Templates | Router Guides


Hi John:

My vote still goes with the OakPark box joint fixture. I don't like their dovetail but the box joint can't be beat in my opinion. With Martin's "system" you need to cut each finger one at a time. With the OakPark fixture you cut one finger on all four joints at the same time. You don't need a separate fixture for each size, if you're careful. If you're not, yes, you need the three main sizes.


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