# MLCS coping sled?



## thistlefly (Dec 2, 2008)

MLCS is having a weekend special on their extra-large coping sled, $10 off at $54.95.

See it here:

http://www.mlcswoodworking.com/shop...accessorysafe.html#coping_super_safety_anchor

Any thoughts on this? When I was routing things some years (10-15) back I didn't use one, and I've not started up again quite yet, but I can definitely see the benefits of using one.

Any opinions on this specific sled?

Thanks in advance-

Bob


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## dovetail_65 (Jan 22, 2008)

My thought is: Overkill


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## curiousgeorge (Nov 6, 2006)

I agree with Nick on this one. Why not make your own?


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## thistlefly (Dec 2, 2008)

*Mmmmm...*

Well, first because it includes everything I think would be useful, like the hold-downs. Second, because I'm a novice, and this store-bought thangie incorporates the knowledge that many of you have and I don't. Last, because it is made of the right kind of materials to minimize thickness and maximize strength and rigidity, which I'd have to locate and then carve up with my immature skillset.

Ummmmm... does that answer your question?


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## dovetail_65 (Jan 22, 2008)

I say overkill not because you can make it yourself and actually I hate that answer "make it yourself", heck you can try to make anything, but that is not what people that ask the questions want to hear.

Anyway the jig has two clamps and it is huge in size. I get away with a simple piece of wood with a 3.00 planer push pad screwed to the top of the piece of wood, very safe and very effective. I have made kitchens full of cabinets using it.

These coping sleds with all the clamps are just not required, they are not, they are no safer than how I do it and it adds to the time buy triple to take out the item, put it it in clamp etc, then fiddling with the piece if you clamp it in slightly cocked.

These big coping sleds are just overkill and are a waste of money, IMHO. They are not necessary at all and a beginner is better served using the proper technique with a really simple, safe push block. These big coping sleds give the beginner a sense of unfounded safety in my opinion, so technique is taken for granted.

My opinion take it for what it is, but a simpler one clamp, smaller coping jig, for maybe 20.00 is plenty if you want to go the ready made way.

I use a push pad with a backer board or push pad with the backer attached, which to me is the fastest safest way. 

Sommerfeld showed me how to do it this way over 7 years ago and it has served me well. Marc Sommerfeld is an expert in the cabinetmaking field so if you do not now me and do not want to take my word for it you can take his, he is well known and an established cabinetmaker.

A 60.00 coping sled is overkill, IMHO.

Rant complete.


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## Bogydave (Nov 14, 2008)

Nick
Got an example picture of how you do it.
Coping the ends free hand takes allot of experience.
especially short ones.
I'm at that stage now, learning to make raised panel doors/drawer fronts


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## thistlefly (Dec 2, 2008)

*Ah...*

Thanks for the deeper explanation, Nick... and as Dave said, a picture or somesuch would be great.

I do take your point; I recall being pretty careful routing across the end of even a 2-ish inch wide stile, and want to be very conscious of safety as I "tool up" again. I'll take a look at some of the coping sled plans, though I might yet end up just getting one of the smaller ready-made sleds instead.

That could very well constitute using a tool to take the place of technique and experience as far as safety goes , mebbe I'll end up with both. 

Thanks again for the input.

Bob


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## dovetail_65 (Jan 22, 2008)

I was ranting last night, excuse me please


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## Gene Howe (Jul 10, 2007)

nickao65 said:


> I was ranting last night, excuse me please


You are excused, Nick. But, only cuz I agree with you


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi Nick

I must disagree with you on this one 

The MLCS one is great,, I have one and use it all the time on the Horiz.tables ...

Many don't want to make one and buying one that's setup to use from the get go is the way to have one...easy and quick..plus they can do many jobs on the router table the safe way..

I have posted many snapshots of it and how to use it, they have a place in the shop.

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## dovetail_65 (Jan 22, 2008)

Its your money and I bet my doors look just as good as yours. Plus I am positive I can route up at least 3 for everyone you do using it.

I am not disputing its nice, I am disputing that it is even required, it's optional.


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi Nick

I don't use it for doors 

I also use the sommerfeld way to make them with a new type of push block.
Just a note, I can make a door frame in about 3 mins..the standard panel in about 4 mins.

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nickao65 said:


> Its your money and I bet my doors look just as good as yours. Plus I am positive I can route up at least 3 for everyone you do using it.
> 
> I am not disputing its nice, I am disputing that it is even required, it's optional.


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## dovetail_65 (Jan 22, 2008)

Got it.

The coping sled can be used for many things, one thing my rant did not take into account.


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi Nick

Try this without one 

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## dovetail_65 (Jan 22, 2008)

That is NOT the application the poster was probably using the coping sled for.

Smarty pants 

I am surprised you of all people spent 60.00 on a ready made though. I mean I buy a lot of jigs and things, but I usually see shop made stuff from you!

Ahh you probably have a shop made version, come on post it up.

Oh the first pic looks like you made it.


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi Nick

You will see one I made in the snapshots  it worked so well I got one from MLCS 

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nickao65 said:


> That is NOT the application the poster was probably using the coping sled for.
> 
> Smarty pants
> 
> ...


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## dovetail_65 (Jan 22, 2008)

Well if you want solid and quality with a modular system where the sleds parts can be used for other jigs and operations as well go Woodhaven. I use Woodhaven parts and jigs for everything.

Here is their coping sled and to me it is the Cats Meow! Do I have one, no, it is a little expensive, but I have almost all their other stuff and it is superior to anything I have seen(used), SOLID! 

So if money is no object go here:

http://www.woodhaven.com/ProductDetail.asp?Id=1922


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi Nick

Need to change your name to Richie Rich ,,that's 175.oo bucks for a sled wow... most don't pay that much for the router  I think I will put my money into the bits...  and brass guides  
Plus I think the sled is just a bit lame, but that's just my 2 cents... 


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nickao65 said:


> Well if you want solid and quality with a modular system where the sleds parts can be used for other jigs and operations as well go Woodhaven. I use Woodhaven parts and jigs for everything.
> 
> Here is their coping sled and to me it is the Cats Meow! Do I have one, no, it is a little expensive, but I have almost all their other stuff and it is superior to anything I have seen(used), SOLID!
> 
> ...


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## curiousgeorge (Nov 6, 2006)

nickao65 said:


> I say overkill not because you can make it yourself and actually I hate that answer "make it yourself", heck you can try to make anything, but that is not what people that ask the questions want to hear.
> 
> It may not be what they want to hear and hate the answer all you want, but in this case it makes more sense than spending $$$$$ on something so simple to make. In fact it is more simple to make than what he is wanting to make with it. I mean no slight to the poster at all when I say that if you can't make a simple sled or backer board, then forget about making panel doors. Secondly the experience gained by building your own jigs and fixtures is an excellent way to learn before you start on your projects and waste a lot of expensive wood.
> 
> ...


It seems this thread has evolved into the Nick and Bob show.


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## dovetail_65 (Jan 22, 2008)

Do you have any of the woodhaven parts? They are quite solid and anything but lame. The pictures do not do the parts justice. It works to perfection and has a ton of adjustability. It is heavy and solid, just what I like!

If you do not need it for a long while instead of the coping sled just sitting there it comes apart easily and you can use the parts to make another jig.

I am happy with them. But I would not spend that much, that was my point! 

Actually I probably have enough parts in my box to make that coping sled without the phenolic base, I just use MDF.

Well jump in the thread and it will not be only me and Bob!


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

HI Nick

One of the best ones I have seen is the OP one . I have one and it's just neat and you don't need to sell the farm to get one... it can do so many jobs, but I think you and I talked about it b/4 

Maybe I should say why I think it's bit lame,,, it looks like it a good setup for the shaper but not the router table, note the slot in the cast iron top,,the normal router can't be that way because of the drop in plate, then see the Alum bar if you need to push it over your router table top you will have black marks in the top, plus other little things you don't want to have put in place forever, I see many other errors but I will stop at this point and stop picking at it 


http://us.oak-park.com/catalogue.html?list=RTS-MGS-

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## dovetail_65 (Jan 22, 2008)

I already purchased it on your recommendation , but it is nowhere near as versatile as the Woodhaven.


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