# Need help with roundover



## sergeantnic (Feb 10, 2010)

New member to the forum and have been browsing some of the topics in search of probably a pretty simple solution.

I am a first time router user and used a flush trim bit? to trim a piece of 1 X 4 oak on a bar that I am building and it was a pretty straight forward to do.

Now I've got some 1 X 4 oak pieces on the bar top that will act as arm rests. I want to take the edge off and round them over just on the top of both the front and back edges as it sits on top of the bar.

My buddy let me borrow his router and some roundover bits but I'm slightly confused.

-Would a 1/2" roundover bit be the best bit to use? He has 3/8" and 1/2" bits.

-I was told by a cabinet maker friend of mine to make two passes. One pass at about half the depth of the bit and the second pass the full lenght so the oak doesn't splinter. Any issues with that?

And the last question. I'm assuming I want to extend the bit down no further than the curved portion of the bit itself to do the actual cutting right? 

Thanks for any insight you pro's can provide. This is my first real woodworking project and I am absolutely hooked and looking forward to finishing and starting something else.


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## allthunbs (Jun 22, 2008)

Hi Nic:

Please fill out your profile.



sergeantnic said:


> New member to the forum and have been browsing some of the topics in search of probably a pretty simple solution.
> 
> I am a first time router user and used a flush trim bit? to trim a piece of 1 X 4 oak on a bar that I am building and it was a pretty straight forward to do.
> 
> ...


There's not a big difference between the two. My suggestion is to take a scrap piece of 2x4 or whatever and try both bits and see which profile you like better. Alternatively, you can use the 1/2" bit but not cut the entire profile. I do this sometimes to sand down to the profile I want or to soften the edge without making a pronounced round-over.



> -I was told by a cabinet maker friend of mine to make two passes. One pass at about half the depth of the bit and the second pass the full lenght so the oak doesn't splinter. Any issues with that?


He's bang on the money. Take small bites and sneak up on your final dimensions. That way there are no surprises and fewer errors.



> And the last question. I'm assuming I want to extend the bit down no further than the curved portion of the bit itself to do the actual cutting right?
> 
> Thanks for any insight you pro's can provide. This is my first real woodworking project and I am absolutely hooked and looking forward to finishing and starting something else.


Experiment on scraps first. See what the effect is and see if you like it. I keep a bin full of scraps just for such experiments and you're never too old to experiment and learn.


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## Dr.Zook (Sep 10, 2004)

Hello Nic, and welcome to the RouterForums. Happy to have you join us.


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## harrysin (Jan 15, 2007)

Welcome to the forum ?, you didn't say whether the arms have been fitted, if they haven't, then this demonstration shows how I would go about it. I used a 1/4" radius cutter first followed by a 3/8" radius one, I didn't do a third side with a 1/2" one because it would have looked out of place.
If the arm HAS been fitted then just go around with the router as far as it will go, a stopped round-over can look quite attractive.


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## allthunbs (Jun 22, 2008)

Harry:

This is off topic but a quick question. How do you handle big (>3") bits in your shop? It looks like the 3612 is too small in the base to allow them.


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## sergeantnic (Feb 10, 2010)

harrysin said:


> Welcome to the forum ?, you didn't say whether the arms have been fitted, if they haven't, then this demonstration shows how I would go about it. I used a 1/4" radius cutter first followed by a 3/8" radius one, I didn't do a third side with a 1/2" one because it would have looked out of place.
> If the arm HAS been fitted then just go around with the router as far as it will go, a stopped round-over can look quite attractive.


Thanks for the info. The arms were already mounted to the bar top. Here is a picture of the bar top "before" I routed the arm rest pieces.

























So what I did was I used a 1/2" roundover bit and went around the entire outside with the bit as far down as it would go without getting into the "flat" area of the cutter?....if that makes sense.

But for the inside I could go as deep because the bit was touching the bar top so it ended up being about half as "deep" but came out very well. Only real trouble I had was the inside and outside corners.

I'll get some after pics tonight.


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## harrysin (Jan 15, 2007)

allthunbs said:


> Harry:
> 
> This is off topic but a quick question. How do you handle big (>3") bits in your shop? It looks like the 3612 is too small in the base to allow them.


Ron, the opening in the 3612/C, which is one of the largest of the routers available here is 60mm which is about 2.36". I would NEVER consider using a cutter even this size hand held, but in the table this isn't a problem because the router can be locked into position.
Perhaps Bj, who owns more routers than most shops keep in stock would be good enough to list the opening sizes of each of his routers.


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi Guys

Most are all the same more or less some cut off the tabs (ears) that hold the guides that opens the hole just a little be more, but to me that's a big mistake ,once removed you can't put them back in place  to me it's like taking the back window out of you car to haul lumber in your car ,now and than.

Most routers can take on the big bits just need to think about it a little bit,the bit spins above the table for the most part some of the bit is just a little bit in the pocket hole say by 1/4" max the norm I will say the Craftsman/PC have the biggest clean hole in the base once the black/clear base plate is removed and mounted in the router table..

=========


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## DerekO (Jan 20, 2010)

harrysin said:


> Welcome to the forum ?, you didn't say whether the arms have been fitted, if they haven't, then this demonstration shows how I would go about it.


Thank you very much for the demonstration. That pic with the router on training wheels is going to be very helpful to me in the future if I remember it.


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## allthunbs (Jun 22, 2008)

harrysin said:


> Ron, the opening in the 3612/C, which is one of the largest of the routers available here is 60mm which is about 2.36". I would NEVER consider using a cutter even this size hand held, but in the table this isn't a problem because the router can be locked into position.
> Perhaps Bj, who owns more routers than most shops keep in stock would be good enough to list the opening sizes of each of his routers.


Hi Harry:

My table mount M12V takes something in the order of 3 3/8". I've used a 1½" radius round over bit which makes the whole bit something like 3 1/2" diameter. How would you handle that, mounted in a table, in your shop? I'm looking for methods of modifying different routers for different purposes.


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## harrysin (Jan 15, 2007)

allthunbs said:


> Hi Harry:
> 
> My table mount M12V takes something in the order of 3 3/8". I've used a 1½" radius round over bit which makes the whole bit something like 3 1/2" diameter. How would you handle that, mounted in a table, in your shop? I'm looking for methods of modifying different routers for different purposes.


Quite frankly Ron I wouldn't. It sounds more like a job for a spindle moulder.


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## Hamlin (Dec 25, 2005)

Hi Ron,

Unfortunately, this is a drawback to the Mak's. They won't take on the 3+in bits, at least, not without some modification to the router base. Harry and I have had a nice conversation about this very subject a while back via email. The best solution? Vertical router bits with the use of a nice tall fence.  I too have the 3+in bits but can only use them with my craftsmen routers. 

HTH


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## allthunbs (Jun 22, 2008)

Hamlin said:


> Hi Ron,
> 
> Unfortunately, this is a drawback to the Mak's. They won't take on the 3+in bits, at least, not without some modification to the router base. Harry and I have had a nice conversation about this very subject a while back via email. The best solution? Vertical router bits with the use of a nice tall fence.  I too have the 3+in bits but can only use them with my craftsmen routers.
> 
> HTH


Exactly what I needed. Thanks Ken and Harry.


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## BigJimAK (Mar 13, 2009)

If you want a full 1/2" round-over on 1/2" stock, you can temporarily tack a straight piece of stock under the edge of the bar lip to let the bearing ride on for the cut and then remove it. In either event I'd be tempted to use a small-radius (1/16 - 1/8") round-over on the bottom before making the large cut, to give it a softer edge and less likely to splinter.


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## harrysin (Jan 15, 2007)

That sounds like a good idea Jim, some day if I can moderate my impatience to get a job finished, I'll give it a try.


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## BigJimAK (Mar 13, 2009)

allthunbs said:


> Harry:
> 
> This is off topic but a quick question. How do you handle big (>3") bits in your shop? It looks like the 3612 is too small in the base to allow them.


Ron,

This is one hurdle that is well-handled by the insert rings in some of the router plates and lifts. I can only speak of Incra, since its what I own but any of their plates or lifts (Magna-Plate, Incra/Jessem Mast-R-Lift, Incra/Woodpeckers PRLv2) all use their "Magna-Lock" rings. Between the included rings and the add-in set you get IDs of 3/8", 5/8", 7/8",1", 1 3/8", 1 5/8", 1 7/8", 2 1/8", 2 5/8", 3 3/8" and 3 5/8". They also sell a ring for PC guides.

Incra products are not for the faint-of-heart (or pocketbook), however. The prices range from $160 for the plate and all rings to $370 for the Mast-R-Lift or PRLv2 with rings. 

This is just one solution. I'm sure there are others out there that are much less expensive. The great thing about the Incra (IMO) is a high safety factor: the rings are held in with rare earth magnets so no insertion / removal tool is required and there's nothing to come loose while cutting.

I just got off the phone with Incra and have confirmed the 3-5/8" ring is designed for use with up to 3-1/2" (i.e. Marc Sommerfeld's raised panel) bit. 

One far less expensive approach for those already owning large plate-cutting drill bits and a drill press may be to buy a series of plates and drill them out to fit the large bits. For others less experienced than yourself Ron, this would have the downside of needing to remount and re-center the router when swapping to large bits or dedicating a router for this service.

My approach was to set my table up with a tank-router (PC 7518) in a lift and just swap rings. I haven't yet ordered Marc's big bits but recently got his CD set [great recommendation, BobJ!] but have run bits to 2-1/2" in it, down to 1/8" bits. For the small bit the 3/8" ring was pretty sweet.

One of the fun things about routing is that there's usually many ways to accomplish the same thing!


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## allthunbs (Jun 22, 2008)

Hi Jim:

The problem is not with the add-ons but with the router base. The 3612 doesn't have a hole large enough in the base to handle anything over 60mm which is about 2.36" (from Harry.) Now, if I happen across a 3612, based on many of the members here, I'll pick it up. But, when I saw Harry's in one of his photo essays, I noticed that the hole wasn't very big, compared to the M12V.

Hence, the result was the question, how to handle large bits with it? Based on Harry's comment, he doesn't. I'm looking for others comments. There must be methods out there. Heavens, almost every bit maker cranks out panel bit sets in large quantities.


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## GoonMan (Mar 22, 2005)

Hello Nic, Welcome to the forum and to routing.

Something that I have found to be helpful in rounding over Oak is back cutting or what some call climb cutting it first to help stop the oak from splintering. But you have to be careful because the router will want to take off on you. I actually learned my lesson the hard way after ruining a project while rounding over red oak. HTH


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## BigJimAK (Mar 13, 2009)

Ahhh... gotcha, Ron!


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