# V-Drum Sander



## Pagan Wizard (Nov 24, 2008)

I was just wondering if anyone out there has seen or used this before. I am also wondering if this is worth the investment price, which isn't really all that much compared to traditional drum sanders.

http://www.stockroomsupply.com/V_Drum_Sander.php


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

HI Pagan

If you do a search on the forum you will see 3 that I know about..
The stock room supply type 

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Pagan Wizard said:


> I was just wondering if anyone out there has seen or used this before. I am also wondering if this is worth the investment price, which isn't really all that much compared to traditional drum sanders.
> 
> http://www.stockroomsupply.com/V_Drum_Sander.php


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## dovetail_65 (Jan 22, 2008)

30" x 4" - V-Drum "The Works" for 339.00 and then all the work and other material you may need?

I have seen ready made Delta 18"/36" for 600.00 on eBay, why bother. I doubt you will get the same performance as the Delta unit. 

Even at 699.00-899.99 which I see new ones and refurbished occasionally going for is it worth all that work for a sub standard drum sander? The time it takes may or may not be worth 400.00 I guess.


806.00 brand new including tax and shipping:

http://www.ewarehousedirect.com/items/item.aspx?itemid=1098974

Actually I guess there is some fun involved in making it so if that is the reason go for it!


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## allthunbs (Jun 22, 2008)

nickao65 said:


> 30" x 4" - V-Drum The Works for 339.00 and then all the work and other material you may need?
> 
> I have seen ready made Delta 18"/36" for 600.00 on eBay, why bother.


Different world completely. The "V" drum is not a thickness sander, it is a smoothing sander. It can be "programmed" to remove a specific amount of material. I have a 24" "V"-drum. The left half is set up to remove 0.013" with 80 grit and the right side is set up to remove 0.007" with 220 grit. The neat part is the lack of dust. The Delta will spray dust all over the place if the dust collector isn't running. The "V" drum the dust drops into a bin below (or in my case, on the floor) to be swept/vacuumed up later.

You'll have to redefine your needs. If you have a planer and you are confident it is reasonly accurate, the "V"Drum will work nicely. If you need to refine your thicknesses, then possibly the Delta will be better.

Allthunbs


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## dovetail_65 (Jan 22, 2008)

Personally I do not have the Delta and have the Performax and it is dead accurate. 

I added a digital display and I can sand to .001 easily, but it is never required so I pulled the digital to use on another bench top planer. the Performax is totally 100% dustless.

I had no idea the Delta was so inferior to the Performax.

I prefer the dust get pulled off the drum from the top and I like that the drum moves, not the table, the reason I went with the Performax sanders.


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## Jack Lavallet (Aug 11, 2008)

The ad says "centrifugal force lifts the paper off the drum..." And this thing is supposed to be "accurate" as a surfacing finishing sander? So when the load slows the motor down, and the CF drops, and the paper isn't "flung" out so hard, and the "cut" is reduced... No, to this old physicist, it doesn't sound too reliable.


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## curiousgeorge (Nov 6, 2006)

Jack,
I hate to disagree with an "old physicist", but mine works exactly as advertised. Maybe you need to check your formulas...


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## tra2360 (Feb 11, 2009)

Jack Lavallet said:


> The ad says "centrifugal force lifts the paper off the drum..." And this thing is supposed to be "accurate" as a surfacing finishing sander? So when the load slows the motor down, and the CF drops, and the paper isn't "flung" out so hard, and the "cut" is reduced... No, to this old physicist, it doesn't sound too reliable.


Your assumption that the load slows the motor is incorrect.

In the V-drum sander, the work does not touch the drum.

In fact, the drum is slightly below the table.


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## dovetail_65 (Jan 22, 2008)

It depends on what is in your mid. 

I think Jack , like me knows that for what I use a drum sander for a V sander just will not work, mainly making the lumber an even thickness while smoothing.

A V drum smooths, but in no way is going to make the wood have parallel faces and in no way for larger pieces is it going to assure stick flat results on both sides while providing a consistent thickness.

I think a V drum may be helpful if one does not have other sanding capabilities, but when I see the price I just do not get how one could pass over a true drum sander for a few dollars more in some cases the same price. The fine drum sanders can do what the V drum can, but the V drum can not do what a drum sander can.

Just my opinions from using both these tools, I am not dissing the V drum, but my brother covets my drum sander over his V drum sander.


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## allthunbs (Jun 22, 2008)

nickao65 said:


> I think Jack , like me knows that for what I use a drum sander for a V sander just will not work, mainly making the lumber an even thickness while smoothing.


I think we need to separate the thicknessing function from the finishing function. I use a planer for thicknessing a purpose for which it is well designed and built.

However, once thicknessed, one must now smooth in controllable increments. The V-drum, once properly adjusted, will indeed remove a predictable amount of material per pass.



nickao65 said:


> A V drum smooths, but in no way is going to make the wood have parallel faces and in no way for larger pieces is it going to assure stick flat results on both sides while providing a consistent thickness.


For my purposes, I smooth planks, not plywood or MDF and it works marvelously. Once the thickness is established, and care is taken in the use of the sander, the thickness it will remain relatively close. 



nickao65 said:


> I think a V drum may be helpful if one does not have other sanding capabilities, but when I see the price I just do not get how one could pass over a true drum sander for a few dollars more in some cases the same price. The fine drum sanders can do what the V drum can, but the V drum can not do what a drum sander can.


Once must experience both pieces of equipment to enjoy the benefits of each. For me, it was a simple decision - a sander or not. I could not aford even a used sander of the type and style that Norm Abrahams uses let alone the cost of belts etc.



nickao65 said:


> Just my opinions from using both these tools, I am not dissing the V drum, but my brother covets my drum sander over his V drum sander.


Allthunbs


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## Gene Howe (Jul 10, 2007)

My V sander works as advertised. I had used one prior to purchasing the kit.
As has been stated here, the planer and drum sander are thicknessers. The v sander is not. It will level joints in F&P doors, remove planer and jointer marks, is practically unlimited in it's width capacity, can be used as a planer for just that "hair" off, uses far less sand paper than my Performax and does a much finer job of smoothing. 
After I built mine, my Performax sat unused for days at a time. I finally sold it on CL.
BTW, I have less than $300 in my 30" model. I did have my own stock of motors...that helped.


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## dovetail_65 (Jan 22, 2008)

allthunbs said:


> I think we need to separate the thicknessing function from the finishing function. I use a planer for thicknessing a purpose for which it is well designed and built.
> 
> However, once thicknessed, one must now smooth in controllable increments. The V-drum, once properly adjusted, will indeed remove a predictable amount of material per pass.
> 
> ...



Allthumbs I agree woth most of what you say. A planer may thickness it will NOT take out cupping etc like a drum sander. And these are the thickness operations I speak of. A V drum can not do it.

Say you have a cupped piece of lumber. Put it through the planer, still a cupped piece of lumber, albeit at a certain thickiness. Now you go to the drum sander and sand the cupping right out. That is my procedure.

If you go to the V drum you are not sanding the cupping out and you need to figure how to get that cupping out before you put it on the V sander.

A V-sander requires a virtually perfect "sized piece"(meaning virtually no cupping, warping etc) of lumber where a drum sander will make the piece perfect while using it and helping to get you to a thickness as well if you choose.

I wouldn't mind a V drum, but if I had none I would try to get a drum sander before a V drum. For the price of some of those V drum you can afford several model drum sanders, especially if you approach the 800.00 mark. 

They really are two different tools and I can see a need for a V drum for some work.


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## allthunbs (Jun 22, 2008)

nickao65 said:


> Allthumbs I agree woth most of what you say. but a planer may thickness it will NOT take out cupping etc like a drum sander.


Hi Nick: you're right, in that situation. 

My procedure is different. I always start out with the jointer. I clean off and flatten one face then using that face as a guide, I straighten one edge. Then, off to the table saw to set the other edge parallel and finally the planer to even out the thickness. Then, to the sander to get rid of the planing and saw marks. I may return to the sander to fine tune the dimensions.

The whole exercise of this thread is for each to expound on the benefits of their methods. You use a sander where I use a jointer, planer and table saw. Given the whole operation, I'm quite content with the role of the V-Drum. In similar fashion, I would expect you to be satisfied with the role of the thicknessing sander. But do you also use the planer/jointer/saw combination?

I would presume that using my procedure of thicknessing on a planer would be faster and cleaner than using a sanding belt. 

Don't defend your procedure, this is not a trial. Explain it, pros and cons. What is your whole procedure? How does the sander fit with your other tools and your procedures around them?

Allthunbs


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## dovetail_65 (Jan 22, 2008)

allthunbs said:


> Hi Nick: you're right, in that situation.
> 
> My procedure is different. I always start out with the jointer. I clean off and flatten one face then using that face as a guide, I straighten one edge. Then, off to the table saw to set the other edge parallel and finally the planer to even out the thickness. Then, to the sander to get rid of the planing and saw marks. I may return to the sander to fine tune the dimensions.
> 
> ...


Your procedure is spot on!

Jointer, table saw, planer, then drum sander if needed is my order of operation for rough lumber.

For getting my glued up panels(or inlays before backer) completed I do not worry about the thickness or getting the pieces flush. I just run the glued up panel or inlay disk through the sander. 

The drum sander assures an even thickness flat panel, which is the most critical part of my work so the V-drum would not help me in that respect.

I really want that oscillating drum sander they now make because I do spend some time sanding out across the grain marks on the inlays. They are just to new for me to get a used or cheap one yet, but I will get one.

As you can see in the picture the inlay looks pretty rough before going in the sander. Trying to keep every little piece flush was a big issue years ago until I realized with this tool it was totally unnecessary and that is where 80% of my time was spent. This sander enables me to make the inlays much faster and actually make a business of it, without it just to much time is spent getting the inlay flat enough to use. Any panel work actually is a breeze with one of these machines. Just start out with a 1/16" to 1/4" thicker material than you need for a final and you are fine.

One picture is after coming out of the drum sander and trimming to the pencil line with a jig saw or router.

I hope this helps to see one way I use the drum sander.


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## allthunbs (Jun 22, 2008)

nickao65 said:


> For getting my glued up panels(or inlays before backer) completed I do not worry about the thickness or getting the pieces flush. I just run the glued up panel or inlay disk through the sander.


Ok, I see now where we have a difference. You don't worry about getting pieces flush. I will be using a caul to force the glue-up flat. I will have predimensionned the pieces before glue up, so I'm working with final (or almost) dimensions. You're still working with rough(ish) dimensions.

Now we understand where we have a difference. which is most effective and least cost/most proficient? - Do we really care? 

Suffice to say that with your procedure yes, you need a thicknessing sander. Given my procedure, I am content with my V-Drum.

However, for your inlays, you might try the V-Drum with some very fine sandpaper. If it is set up properly you should be able to smooth out the inlays without scratches quite nicely.

Interesting stuff. Thank you for your candor.

Allthunbs


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## dovetail_65 (Jan 22, 2008)

Actually I use a 60 grit on those inlays on that drum sander! The woods are so very hard that anything less really will not flush it up. No way can you press down evenly a 36" disc on a V drum to get these woods flush and keep the results consistent, then flip it over and do the same. I have tried and I tended to get ridges because each of the woods right next to each other have a differnt hardness and I could not keep the disc from spinning let alone get it over the V drum at a constant rate.

You have that V sander and are used to it, but it does require a good user for the best results. The V takes some experience or a "knack" to get it through, I learned it in about a day. With the drum I just slam them through.

For panels yes I usually get good results keeping the pieces flat, but when working with all differnt woods together over a period of time it is impossible or really frustrating trying to keep them totally flush on top while edge gluing them like I do. The woods all curl and move at their own rates. So much so that if I cut a piece I have to glue it in that day or the next day in may not fit! SO I had to find a way to get it done and for me the Drum sander was the answer.

Like I said I could use both. I am a tool whore after all.


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## AxlMyk (Jun 13, 2006)

Jointer - TS - planer - ROS or card scraper is my procedure. Don't have a drum/V sander.


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## allthunbs (Jun 22, 2008)

AxlMyk said:


> Jointer - TS - planer - ROS or card scraper is my procedure. Don't have a drum/V sander.


Hi Mike:

The only thing I know about using a scraper is what the Lee Valley Tools site says. http://www.leevalley.com/shopping/Instructions.aspx?p=41634

Is this what you do? Any tips, suggestions, experience etc.

Allthunbs


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