# Router Insert for a Ridgid R4510 Table Saw



## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

I've had my new saw a week now and I've decided to use the space that opens up when the table is extended for a router table insert. I've checked clearances and I think some 3/4" aluminium angle, carefully cut to fit the inner groove of the rails should support the insert and leave enough room for a standard router plate from Grizzly. (Thanks Jigs). Only problem is the plates are on back-order and won't come in till June 1.

In the mean time I'll work on getting the fence mod going. I have a preliminary design I've thrown together on Google Sketchup. The large silver extrusion is the table saw fence. The white one is Incra's T-track Plus (probably will use two to get measurement on both ends). The brown is 1/2" and 3/4" MDF. If any one sees any glaring mistakes please let me know.

GCG


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## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

I thought a couple of exploded views might be useful. 

Oh, and I closed up the ends and added center support in the spacer boxes.

GCG


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## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

One more of the whole concept.

GCG


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## Clyde_WoodBee (Jan 15, 2012)

*Some thoughts for you to consider*

One question I have is how will you get bolts/nuts into and out of the slots for auxiliary fences? It appears you have a hole for a chip/dust collector which is excellent. I would also have some auxiliary jig slots along the top for flexibility of adding jig parts that may require different positioning to augment and assist the t-slots. I would also consider a t-slot at the very top facing up to gain more jig and stops design flexibility. On ting you appear to be doing wisely is making the fence taller. I have had to add a tall fence auxiliary jig to my commercial fence that permits me to do spline and mortising on things like picture frames and legs which are tall, sometimes held at an angle, and need vertical support.
I hope these comments help.



GulfcoastGuy said:


> I've had my new saw a week now and I've decided to use the space that opens up when the table is extended for a router table insert. I've checked clearances and I think some 3/4" aluminium angle, carefully cut to fit the inner groove of the rails should support the insert and leave enough room for a standard router plate from Grizzly. (Thanks Jigs). Only problem is the plates are on back-order and won't come in till June 1.
> 
> In the mean time I'll work on getting the fence mod going. I have a preliminary design I've thrown together on Google Sketchup. The large silver extrusion is the table saw fence. The white one is Incra's T-track Plus (probably will use two to get measurement on both ends). The brown is 1/2" and 3/4" MDF. If any one sees any glaring mistakes please let me know.
> 
> GCG


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## Clyde_WoodBee (Jan 15, 2012)

*One more thought*

I noticed in this drawing the double t-slot has one slot buried and not useable. Is this because of the pieces you have or am I missing something about how you might use the inward turned lower t-slot?




GulfcoastGuy said:


> One more of the whole concept.
> 
> GCG


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## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

Clyde_WoodBee said:


> One question I have is how will you get bolts/nuts into and out of the slots for auxiliary fences?


If you're asking how the aux is held to the primary I'll have three flat head screws accessible from the center in the back of the center chamber and strategically placed behind the outer slot on either end of the face. I'll have to slide the aux onto the primary from the end. I hope that's what you were asking.



Clyde_WoodBee said:


> It appears you have a hole for a chip/dust collector which is excellent. I would also have some auxiliary jig slots along the top for flexibility of adding jig parts that may require different positioning to augment and assist the t-slots. I would also consider a t-slot at the very top facing up to gain more jig and stops design flexibility.


Funds. It's all about the money. Mine is limited. I do what I can with what I've got. I'd love to do more but then there'd be the med bills when my wife beans me with that cast iron frying pan.



Clyde_WoodBee said:


> On ting you appear to be doing wisely is making the fence taller. I have had to add a tall fence auxiliary jig to my commercial fence that permits me to do spline and mortising on things like picture frames and legs which are tall, sometimes held at an angle, and need vertical support.


I like the height, too. That was intentional.



Clyde_WoodBee said:


> I hope these comments help.


All comment are very welcome.


Clyde_WoodBee said:


> I noticed in this drawing the double t-slot has one slot buried and not useable. Is this because of the pieces you have or am I missing something about how you might use the inward turned lower t-slot?


Its how the Incra TTrackPlus is made. There's a scale on the front of the back facing slot that I don't show in the sketch.

Thanks for the response.

GCG


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## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

Clyde,

I took one of your suggestions and put the TTrack Plus on the top and replaced it with a standard track. I made the support boxes shallower and added support on the top across the top of the saw fence. Then I dropped in some fasteners for clarity. I've shifted the positions of the slide-able sections to show the fasteners that would otherwise be hidden. 

GCG

Addendum: The 1/4-20 screws that the aux fence sections ride on will be in threaded inserts (I have some from a previous project). That's why I'm not going to use track there. Should have been clearer on that.


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## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

Added the Saw table for some context.

First pic: full layout with the fence at the right most position allowable.
Second pic: Fence, TTrack, and Plate removed to show the cutouts in the top (3/4 Melamine).
Third pic: Top removed to show the 1/2 MDF base inside the frame sections.

GCG


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## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

Over 160 views and no one is warning me off so I guess I can move forward.

Two dimension drawings
1. Aluminum angle detail
2. Top and base detail

GCG


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## jschaben (Jun 21, 2009)

GulfcoastGuy said:


> Added the Saw table for some context.
> 
> First pic: full layout with the fence at the right most position allowable.
> Second pic: Fence, TTrack, and Plate removed to show the cutouts in the top (3/4 Melamine).
> ...


:stop:It looked good to me until I got to this the first pic. The way you have it set up you will have to work over the long (left) end of the saw. You need to set it up so the fence is between the router position and the saw blade position so your routing work area is off the right end of the saw. Actually the fence itself is fine I just am hoping you are planning on mounting it on the other side of the saw fence than what you are showing


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## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

Had my head locked into the saw operating position. Need to open up with my thinking.

Lucky for me they're both reversible. The saw fence has a symmetrical t-slot layout so the the router fence addition (also symmetrical) can go on either side. The insert is basically a 10.25x21 inch rectangular table leaf that rides on the table rail grooves so it can go either way too.

New pic. ... Better?

The only inconvenience will be that the lock for the fence is on the near side and if I'm feeding safely from the far side, I'll have to walk around to make adjustments. No biggie, just an observation. 

GCG


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## jschaben (Jun 21, 2009)

GulfcoastGuy said:


> Had my head locked into the saw operating position. Need to open up with my thinking.
> 
> Lucky for me they're both reversible. The saw fence has a symmetrical t-slot layout so the the router fence addition (also symmetrical) can go on either side. The insert is basically a 10.25x21 inch rectangular table leaf that rides on the table rail grooves so it can go either way too.
> 
> ...


Yep, much better. I've got a 4510 also so I've been lurking here but didn't have any criticisms earlier... doin a good job, well thought out.


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## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

Comments can only help. Glad to hear any you may have.

I've been knockin' around the idea of attaching some self adhesive felt to the underside of the angle sections that will ride on the table rails. I don't want to mar them and take the chance of compromising what is now a smooth operating slide.

I've also got the safety power switch duplex outlet that is currently on the Wolfcraft table I'm using till I complete this. I should be able to retrofit it to the insert.

GCG


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## Clyde_WoodBee (Jan 15, 2012)

*That's the ticket!*

Great! the added functionality will be well worth it. The accessories and jigs I have made with the added top track feature have been useful in so many ways.



GulfcoastGuy said:


> Clyde,
> 
> I took one of your suggestions and put the TTrack Plus on the top and replaced it with a standard track. I made the support boxes shallower and added support on the top across the top of the saw fence. Then I dropped in some fasteners for clarity. I've shifted the positions of the slide-able sections to show the fasteners that would otherwise be hidden.
> 
> ...


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## Alan Bienlein (Oct 17, 2009)

I have the ridgid ts3650 with the same fence and this is what I did for a fence for my router insert in my table saw.

































I made mine taller due to the fact I was doing alot of taller pieces and also for the ability to put a feather board from the top.

I had been using this fence for about 3 years but it had alot of short comings that I think I took care of in the above design.


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## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

Clyde_WoodBee said:


> Great! the added functionality will be well worth it. The accessories and jigs I have made with the added top track feature have been useful in so many ways.


Care to share one or two. Inquiring minds and all... 




Alan Bienlein said:


> I have the ridgid ts3650 with the same fence and this is what I did for a fence for my router insert in my table saw.
> 
> I made mine taller due to the fact I was doing alot of taller pieces and also for the ability to put a feather board from the top.
> 
> I had been using this fence for about 3 years but it had alot of short comings that I think I took care of in the above design.


Nice work. Wish I had the space for the cabinet and an outfeed table but all this HAS to be stored in a very small space to allow my wife to use the garage. How did you get two Ridgid fences and what's the skinny on the digital readout I see there?

GCG


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## Alan Bienlein (Oct 17, 2009)

The second fence came about cause my wife heard me complaining about having to reset the fence between the router and the saw for this one job I needed to do so she surprised me with another fence she ordered from Ridgid.

The digital fence was also on my wish list that my wife got me for my birthday. It's a wixey and it's been wonderful!


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## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

Your wife is a definite keeper.

GCG


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## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

*Little by Little ...*

Got the angle cut and fit. The long 3/4 x 3/4 run lengthwise along the sides of the table sections and act as ledgers and the shorter 3/4 x 1/2 pieces are cross members to support the insert. The cross members will be attache to the insert and I'll drill and tap the ledgers at the cross points to use jacking screws to level the insert to the table. The two middle cross members will be cut to fit the plate opening once I've got the plate in.


GCG


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## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

*Gettin' there*

After some distractions I finally got back to the insert project. I've finished the insert and as far as the final product is concerned I'm very happy. Here's a shot from my phone.








[/url] Saw table Router insert complete by pat w1, on Flickr[/IMG]

and underneath with the Bosch 1617,








[/url] Saw table Router insert complete below2 by pat w1, on Flickr[/IMG]

You can see the four leveling screws at the corners. I need to cut them down if for nothing else aesthetics. I may or may not try to retrofit the safety switch from the original table. I could just set it up as a utility table to the side and plug the router and shop-vac to it as is. It'll still be handy enough for a safety.

I had some play in the guides I used to route the recess for the router plate which resulted in a plate that shifted between 1/16 and 1/32 in both axes. To correct this I made a paste with sander dust and glue with a consistency about like thick peanut butter. I laid in some along the back (away from the t-track) and left side. I laid down some wax paper and then set the plate in. After it set up overnight I cleared away the excess with a chisel. Now there is no noticeable play at all. 

I've delayed the fence. I've been working on getting some reclaimed red oak and I delivered a load to a local mill yesterday. It was 11 distressed 6x8 10' ties. The guy at the mill will cut it down for me for half the lumber, fair enough. As soon as I get it back (he said probably Tuesday) I'll start work on the fence.

GCG


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## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

Got the oak. There's a pic Here

The problem is now I've been tapped at work to cover one of the shifts till a couple of guys recover from injuries. It never fails.


GCG


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## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

On my last day of 12 on 12 off this week. Going on 5 days of 10 hr. nights starting Monday. Good news is I get overtime (normally straight salary) so I may get my planer ahead of schedule.

I bought some 3/4 ply to make a sled to face and plane some of the oak to make the fence. Has anyone used the method used by the Wood Whisperer in this vid.

How to Flatten a Workbench and Wide Boards with a Router | The Wood Whisperer 

I'm going to try it this weekend and I was wondering if anyone had any additional pointers.

GCG


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## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

Well, it looks like the planer will be mine this weekend. As I hoped the overtime covering for the injured shift guys will pay for it easily and I get to lay the coin on Home Depot Saturday. I get off this shift at 3:00 am Saturday morning and don't start the next shift till 7:00 am Wednesday so I should get a lot done. (The boss is going for a girls retreat to Destin Sunday so I'll be free to do as much as I want)

I've got the red oak for the fence. I'd like to stain it darker and approach a look to the wood similar to this one on Pat Warner's site:










I'm nowhere near his skill level but still I'm pushing for the clean crisp look of his work so the finish needs to be light with very little buildup. Suggestions?

GCG


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## MAFoElffen (Jun 8, 2012)

GulfcoastGuy said:


> On my last day of 12 on 12 off this week. Going on 5 days of 10 hr. nights starting Monday. Good news is I get overtime (normally straight salary) so I may get my planer ahead of schedule.
> 
> I bought some 3/4 ply to make a sled to face and plane some of the oak to make the fence. Has anyone used the method used by the Wood Whisperer in this vid.
> 
> ...


The method in that video? Well... I've seen it, but I think how he builds his jig is overkill. It's really a lot simpler than that. I'll give you 2 methods.

For tonight google router dado jig... All I use for planing is 2 boards to go across and to provide a platform for the router. The two boards I space 1 1/2" between, which lets me put my bit through it. First one I did, I made it for a 3/4" bit to use with a template bushing. I then got a wider bit and just routed through it. I have two short boards that I nail under the ends of those. They ride on the outside of the rails (mentioned later). Then I tack on 2 narrow boards that will guide the router between them. This was easier than the template guide.


The rails I mentioned above- Mine took 4 pieces, 3/4"x2"x60". If you look at the piece, I glued and nailed 2 of them together with one backed to the side of the other's corner, 90 degrees. Then I screw it down to a piece of plywood. The ally in the picture is 12"x60".

I secure it with 3/4 scrap blocks and 2 wedges. I put the blocks between the work and the rail, tighten with the wedges. If I'm doing stock down to 3/4", I use the 1/2 plywood blocks to raise the stock so that the 3/4 blocks will hold it without me routing them.

I use the same rails for wider stock on a sheet of plywood or clamped to work, using a wider dado jig. I can turn it to get different heights.

Uses the same router action as in that video. If I have stock longer, I route, stop, move it down, route more. Longest I've done was a 4"x24"x10' maple burl for a bar top.

Second way is the router sled they use on this forum. harrysin has a video showing it. It is a piece of plywood or mdf on each side (standing straight up) with 2 rods between them (in slots for adjustment) which go through the router's edge guard holes/slots in the base. So the router slides back and forth on the rods.

Clamping the work is different. He screws down blocks against the work, then wedges it.

I built a sled. It works. I'm used to the other way and it works for me, for what I do.


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## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

Mike,

Thanks for the info. I had an idea someone would have simplified some of it.

Actually, I had finished the sled portion and was going to work on the rest this weekend. However now that I'm getting my planer I'm going to focus on a planer sled similar (hopfully simpler) to this one.
A Planer Sled for Milling Lumber - Fine Woodworking Video

In any event I'll have the sled if I ever get a piece too wide for the planer.

GCG


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## JollyRoger (Jul 13, 2012)

Hi GCG,

My build for a Bosch TS is not going so well, so I'm starting from scratch. Main problem has been to get the table top flat, but then what is flat enough? My first attempt used a single piece of 3/4 play. screwed to a frame. Thought the frame would pull it flat, it did'nt... Second attempt used two pieces of 3/4 ply (with the bow outward facing) glued and screwed together. Still not flat, but at least now its bowed rather than cupped, which should be easier to fix once the plate goes in.

Questions about your design. I used a design that would allow me to drop the insert in from the top, without having to unscrew the TS extension. Your design would work on my saw as well, if I unscrew the extension. I tried to avoid this, but found last night that its easily accomplished. So I'm going to give your approach a try. How did you join the aluminium angles? Can you also give more details on the leveling screws please? I live in Hawaii (read wet), and I worry about the melamine top swelling on me. Do you have any thoughts on this?


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## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

JollyRoger said:


> Questions about your design. I used a design that would allow me to drop the insert in from the top, without having to unscrew the TS extension. Your design would work on my saw as well, if I unscrew the extension. I tried to avoid this, but found last night that its easily accomplished. So I'm going to give your approach a try.


On the Ridgid TS the table rails have a 1/2" slot on the inside both front and back. I checked and the Bosch has a slot in the back rail but I couldn't find a photo that showed the back view with the table extended. The side angles are cut on the ends to fit the slots and simply laid into the slots loosely. The end angles are attached to the end of the insert with screws insuring the ends that overlap the side angles are clear.



JollyRoger said:


> How did you join the aluminium angles?


I didn't. The side angles are placed into the table rail slots and the insert is lowered onto them and is free floating.



JollyRoger said:


> Can you also give more details on the leveling screws please?


Holes were drilled and tapped into the side rails for 1/4-20 screws at the point where the end angles rest on the side angles. Adjusting these gives me all the adjustment I need.



JollyRoger said:


> I live in Hawaii (read wet), and I worry about the melamine top swelling on me. Do you have any thoughts on this?


The melamine laminate should be enough for the surfaces it covers. Some waterproof poly finish over the exposed substrate (Minwax Helmsman Spar Urethane perhaps) should keep the moisture out.

GCG


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## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

I bought the planer (I've learned I really like having a planer) and I've dimensioned the oak pieces for the fence. I'm still working out the assembly order for a clean look with as few fasteners showing as possible. I'll be using a brad nailer (the Wife got me a HF nailer and a pancake compressor for Father's day) and glue for the permanent portions of the assembly.

I know this is taking a while but between work, life interruptions, and the fact that my garage is a sweltering sweatbox in the gulf coast heat (with or without the door open); it slow going. 

Stay tuned.

GCG


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## JollyRoger (Jul 13, 2012)

Thank you Sir! You are a scholar and gentleman!


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## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

Well, the oak sat for the four days I was on 12's at work and half the pieces cupped or twisted (I can hear some of you snickering). No way I can hope for accuracy with a twisted, warped fence so I'll have to go back to my original plan of using MDF.

Can't work now because we're directly under a thunderstorm. More tomorrow.

GCG


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## JollyRoger (Jul 13, 2012)

Hi Pat,

I have made some progress in adapting your design to the Bosch, and it's going great. In fact there is very little adaption needed. Unfortunately my top (two layers of ply glued and screwed) warped... So yeah... Getting a bit frustrated...

I was wondering whether you would mind if I amended my drawings for the Bosch insert and posted them under your post. That way I could close off the post I started and tell folks that it's a crap design and that they should rather use your approach.


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## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

JollyRoger said:


> Hi Pat,
> 
> I have made some progress in adapting your design to the Bosch, and it's going great. In fact there is very little adaption needed. Unfortunately my top (two layers of ply glued and screwed) warped... So yeah... Getting a bit frustrated...
> 
> I was wondering whether you would mind if I amended my drawings for the Bosch insert and posted them under your post. That way I could close off the post I started and tell folks that it's a crap design and that they should rather use your approach.


Sorry I missed your post. I was on a night rotation at work and, although I've been active on the board, I didn't notice it.

Feel free to add your Bosch drawings. The two saws are very similar and your contribution would open the concept up to a broader audience.

GCG


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## MAFoElffen (Jun 8, 2012)

Patrick-

Been following this from the start, I saw you grow it from your thoughts, plans, into the creation of your wonderful router wing extension...

Last I heard, you got your free oak milled externally, settling on half of the BF to cover the milling cost. Then you worked your long shift hours that helped buy a thicknesser/planer (score). Planed what you had. Worked more long hours. Lost all to cupping and twisting (stored stacked with shims? I know high humidity there).

I that point I was feeling it for you! :cray: I could see you had high hopes for that. Nothing salvagable from that batch at all?

Then you talked about making from MDF... Where are you at with that? I understand you work long continuous hours for days on end.


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## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

MAFoElffen said:


> Patrick-
> 
> Been following this from the start, I saw you grow it from your thoughts, plans, into the creation of your wonderful router wing extension...
> 
> ...


Not stored with shims, so I guess I asked for it. Some was OK but I was worried the remaining pieces might move later. I need this to be accurate. I'll find a use for it somewhere and I have more to go with it.



MAFoElffen said:


> Then you talked about making from MDF... Where are you at with that? I understand you work long continuous hours for days on end.


It wasn't continuous it was a rotating shift; a run of 12hr days 7am to 7pm with a short break to acclimate then a run of 10hr nights 5pm to 3am. It was switching that wiped me out. It was all I could do to get my sleeping schedule settled during the break, much less get anything done.

But I got a reprieve. The plant got ahead of the contract and cut out Saturdays. That allowed the maintenance dept. to go to two crews which meant they had enough PLC trained people to cover.

Sooo... 

I got everything cut this weekend and got a comp day tomorrow to do the assembly. (Actually is because the cable guy is coming to fix a problem but I can work while I wait)
:dance3:








[/url] Router fence preped parts by pat w1, on Flickr[/IMG]

GCG


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## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

*Good News, Bad News, and Good News*

First the good news I've ALMOST completed the fence (see images below).

Now the bad news - the guy that was coming back off the injured list had his PT extended and that means I'm back on the shift rotation so I'm on nights (5:00PM - 3:00AM) this week.

And that leads to some good news - overtime $$$.

I got the major assembly done. I need to buy a full set of 4 screws for the sliders and drill for the knobs that will secure the horizontal support to the top of the TS fence. I checked for square and using the cheap little protractor I have I'm seeing a little less than 10 minutes out of perpendicular which is identical to what I got with just the TS fence face so I'm happy with that.

Lining up the face screws with the nuts in the t-tracks is a little touchy but that should improve with some practice. Sliding it on with the nuts attached is a total PITA as the nuts want to rotate out of alignment just as they are entering the channel. 

Overall I'm happy. Just a few loose ends to clean up and wipe on a few coats of 50/50 poly/mineral spirits and a little wax on the moving parts and I'm FINALLY finished.


Thanks for the encouragement and being patient. 

GCG


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## jschaben (Jun 21, 2009)

GulfcoastGuy said:


> Lining up the face screws with the nuts in the t-tracks is a little touchy but that should improve with some practice. Sliding it on with the nuts attached is a total PITA as the nuts want to rotate out of alignment just as they are entering the channel.
> 
> GCG


Hi Patrick - I had that problem with the setup I did on my table saw fence. I got some oval t-nuts that solved the problem. 
These are the ones I use. 
Woodhaven 5760 1/4-20 Oval Nuts : Oval Nuts & Screws
No barrel so there are only a couple of threads in them but that's really all you need.
Peachtree has some with a barrel but the barrel was a little long and needed to be ground down. They are oval so they align themselves in the track.


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## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

jschaben said:


> Hi Patrick - I had that problem with the setup I did on my table saw fence. I got some oval t-nuts that solved the problem.
> These are the ones I use.
> Woodhaven 5760 1/4-20 Oval Nuts : Oval Nuts & Screws
> No barrel so there are only a couple of threads in them but that's really all you need.
> Peachtree has some with a barrel but the barrel was a little long and needed to be ground down. They are oval so they align themselves in the track.


I meant to thank you when I first read this and I must has gotten sidetracked ... anywho - thanks.

I've also found out that the Ridgid saw design allows you to leave the table extended and the fence attached when the stand is folded up for storage. Since I mounted the vac. port to clear the saw side of the fence as much as possible I shouldn't have to remove the router fence except in very rare cases.

GCG


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## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

Bought a $2 poly binder from Office Depot and cut out some spacers for edge jointing.

















[/url] IMAG0143 by pat w1, on Flickr[/IMG]

They mic'd out at .018" just over 1/64th" each.

GCG


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## JollyRoger (Jul 13, 2012)

Patrick,

Where did you get that dust port/cover? Design looks great. Think I'll back-engineer it to the Bosch (AGAIN!).

Cheers


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## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

Peachtree sells it through Amazon HERE.

A bunch more are available.

Amazon.com: Router Table Dust Port: Tools & Home Improvement 

The one from peach tree is item 23.

GCG


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## charleydc5 (Sep 19, 2012)

First of all, congratulations for your project. Is looks VERY good.

I got the exact same table saw and I am looking forward to achieve that project. The only thing I am not sure of is how you managed to insert the wing into the two grooves? I know a way to achieve it but it would be a semi-permanent solution. Can you remove the entire plate quite easily without disassembling the existing table saw wing?

Thanks in advance

Cheers


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## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

If you'll look at post #9 of this topic the top item in the first image is a long piece of 3/4x3/4 angle that is notched at each end. The notch is to allow the angle to be slid, loose fit style, into the slot of the wing tracks. The other angle pieces are attached to the insert and serve the dual purpose of adding rigidity and resting on 1/4-20 nylon screws in the long angles that are at the intersection points for support and for leveling. Assembly and dis-assembly take literally seconds, however the table can be folded and stored with the insert in place as long as the router plate is removed and the fence is left on the table to hold the insert down. 

GCG


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## charleydc5 (Sep 19, 2012)

I guess you need to unscrew the two plastic caps at the end of the TS extension is order to insert your plate in? The two grooves looked more like this to me:
__
|__

rather than this (in your diagram):
|__

I don't know if I am clear enough.. I am looking to find some pictures on the Internet as I am not at home right now.

Will try to take pictures tonight if my explanation was not clear enough.


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## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

charleydc5 said:


> I guess you need to unscrew the two plastic caps at the end of the TS extension is order to insert your plate in? The two grooves looked more like this to me:
> __
> |__
> 
> ...


Right you are but no dis-assembly needed. The side angle pieces can slide into place individually by first inserting them at an angle, aligning them to opposite corners of the opening, then rotating them horizontally. The side angle pieces are inserted as two separate items. They are not physically attached to the insert. They merely act as side support and are otherwise free floating.

GCG


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## charleydc5 (Sep 19, 2012)

Would you mind doing a quick video of the insertion procedure? I'm having problem to understand how you could achieve it.

If not, no biggy, I will try to manage it myself.

I am also looking to buy an insert plate for the setup. I think it is not really mandatory as I will always let my fixed base on the table saw wing. I got the Ridgid combo fixed/plunge router kit. Any advice regarding that?

Finally, I want to thank you again for sharing your knowledge. I really appreciate the detailed plans and explanations. You really should write an official PDF and maybe sell it for a few bucks. You deserve it.


----------



## charleydc5 (Sep 19, 2012)

GulfcoastGuy said:


> Right you are but no dis-assembly needed. The side angle pieces can slide into place individually by first inserting them at an angle, aligning them to opposite corners of the opening, then rotating them horizontally. The side angle pieces are inserted as two separate items. They are not physically attached to the insert. They merely act as side support and are otherwise free floating.
> 
> GCG


Oh after review I think I understand now.

Will do some tests tonight and see how it goes.

Thanks!


----------



## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

charleydc5 said:


> Would you mind doing a quick video of the insertion procedure? I'm having problem to understand how you could achieve it.
> 
> If not, no biggy, I will try to manage it myself.
> 
> ...


This is the plate I used. It's one of the favorites with forum members from what I can tell.

PT10432047 INSERT W/GUIDE PIN 9 X 12

I hadn't thought of doing a PDF. I'll think about it



charleydc5 said:


> Oh after review I think I understand now.
> 
> Will do some tests tonight and see how it goes.
> 
> Thanks!


Let me know if you still need the vid and I'll see what I can do.

GCG


----------



## charleydc5 (Sep 19, 2012)

I just don't know if this plate is available in Canada.

For the wing insertion, maybe just a picture or two showing the sequence would be enough. I am not sure 100% I understand all of it for now. Can't wait to come back home and figure out how it really works.

Thanks Patrick


----------



## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

Might be a couple of days on the pic's/vid. Got a few things on the wife's list I've been putting off and if I don't get to them ... well, you know the drill.

GCG


----------



## charleydc5 (Sep 19, 2012)

GulfcoastGuy said:


> Over 160 views and no one is warning me off so I guess I can move forward.
> 
> Two dimension drawings
> 1. Aluminum angle detail
> ...


I have just realized that you are using aluminum square angle (90 degrees) in order to make a kind of bedframe for your table insert.

Yesterday, I thought the first part on the picture was showing a piece of MDF or wood that was carfully cut to fit snugly INTO the groove on each side. I was like "how the heck can I bend, pry or rotate it to make it go into the groove..." Now I get it.

I guess the four aluminum squares (or maybe even more?) are permanent? They probably won't interfere with any existing feature on the table?

Thanks my friend


----------



## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

The shorter cross pieces are attached to the insert. The two longer longitudinal pieces are loose and are threaded at intersection points with the cross pieces (just the end pieces right now) to allow for leveling of the insert with the saw table top. It is important to note that the bottom MDF layer is slightly narrower than the top (by the thickness of the side angle on either side) to insure a close fit of the top to the table edges on either side.

Hope this helps.

GCG


----------



## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

Snaped a couple of quick pic's on my way out this morning. 








[/url] IMAG0148 by pat w1, on Flickr[/IMG]
This is the underside showing the 4 cross angle pieces and how the MDF is undercut along the side to clear the vertical portion of the long angles. I used screws because I didn't have a good melamine glue on hand.








[/url]
IMAG0149 by pat w1, on Flickr[/IMG]
This shows how the notch in the ends of the long angle pieces fit into the table rail grooves. You can also see the leveling screws at the ends.

GCG

Addendum: It should be noted that the ends of the MDF were also undercut by the thickness of the cross angles to insure a smooth face is against to the rails. -GCG-


----------



## charleydc5 (Sep 19, 2012)

Allright now it is crystal clear to me!

So, basically, your insert is floating. There is no permanent fixation. Only the weight of the router is holding it in place, correct?

Thanks for taking the time to take pics. Much appreciated.


----------



## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

charleydc5 said:


> ...
> 
> So, basically, your insert is floating. There is no permanent fixation. Only the weight of the router is holding it in place, correct?
> 
> ...


100% correct. Easy in - Easy out.

GCG


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## charleydc5 (Sep 19, 2012)

Would you mind sharing the brand of your miter channel? Looking to buy one. I have only found the Incra miter channel and it is 32 inches long. I would prefer having a shorter miter channel so I would have less waste, as the insert is 1' 8" 7/8 (20 inches so I would have 1 feet of waste for the miter channel...).

Thanks


----------



## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

I opted for a T-Track instead of a miter slot. T-Track requires a a 3/4" cut as opposed to 1-1/4" and left more material for support on the opposite side of the mounting plate. If I need to make a tracking sled if any kind I plan to make a hardwood runner that will fit the T-Track.

You can get the stuff I used (Incra T-Track Regular) from Amazon in various lengths. 

Amazon.com: INCRA t-track: Tools & Home Improvement

GCG


----------



## Stan Draughon (Oct 2, 2012)

jschaben said:


> Yep, much better. I've got a 4510 also so I've been lurking here but didn't have any criticisms earlier... doin a good job, well thought out.



It is very well thought out. I've been lurking around as well, but now I'm in the market for a table saw and the 4510 or 4512 is likely the way I will go. This certainly would be a solid add on and I am enjoying watching your design develop. Great work.

-Stan


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## Dustin B (Nov 5, 2012)

Any chance you could make the Sketchup file of your design available?


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## Dustin B (Nov 5, 2012)

Him can't find an edit button for posts you made. Just realized forgot to mention it's the insert i'm interested in. Although wouldn't mind having the fence file too.

I really like your solution to mounting the insert, so simple and adjustable. Much better than the initial thoughts I was having.


----------



## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

I've got the Sketchup file but I made some slight modifications along the way that didn't get back into it. Let me check a few things and I'll see if I can get you an accurate design.

Thanks for the complements.
GCG


----------



## JollyRoger (Jul 13, 2012)

GulfcoastGuy said:


> First the good news I've ALMOST completed the fence (see images below).
> 
> Now the bad news - the guy that was coming back off the injured list had his PT extended and that means I'm back on the shift rotation so I'm on nights (5:00PM - 3:00AM) this week.
> 
> ...


Patrick,

What did you end up using to fasten the adjustable (sliding) face plates? I was thinking of just using t-nuts... Also, did you glue the mdf pieces together during assembly, or screws?

Thanks!


----------



## Dustin B (Nov 5, 2012)

Get any time to get the Sketchup File updated yet?


----------



## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

JollyRoger said:


> Patrick,
> 
> What did you end up using to fasten the adjustable (sliding) face plates? I was thinking of just using t-nuts...
> 
> Thanks!


Sorry, I didn't see the post. If you mean the front face of the fence that make the clearance for the bit and make up the jointing fence - flat head screws. If you mean the attachment to the fence then T-nuts are the way to go but, to be honest, I leave it mounted most of the time. It just doesn't get in the way of basic saw operations.



JollyRoger said:


> Patrick,
> 
> Also, did you glue the mdf pieces together during assembly, or screws?
> 
> Thanks!


Glue and brad nails



Dustin B said:


> Get any time to get the Sketchup File updated yet?


I haven't forgotten you. I've just had a lot going on and haven't gotten to it yet. My plate's full tomorrow and Wednesday. I'll try to get it done this week though.

GCG


----------



## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

Dustin (and anyone else for that matter)

Here's the Sketchup model. Be aware that I used groups not components and a lot of layers to be able to turn things on and off at will. It should be just about right but I can't make a full guarantee. The most important thing is to get the mounting screws lined up with the t-tracks in the TS fence. The slots in the split fence sliders need to line up with them as well to make getting to the mounting screws on the ends easier.

GCG


----------



## Dustin B (Nov 5, 2012)

Thanks.


----------



## pikespeakgtx (Jan 14, 2013)

Hello, 

My name is Michael. I'm new here. 1st post. My wife Heather, my bernese mountain dog Mitch and I live in Eugene, OR. 

I spent 4 hours this AM reverse engineering your entire setup for my ridgid r4510.

Each part is now modeled in Pro-Engineer and I can make files available in Inventor, Solidworks, ProE/Creo, Iges, Step, or STL for anyone. 

One item I'm not quite sure on is how the 'fence_face_backer' part fastens to the rest of the assembly?

Do the outside holes in 'fence_face_backer' pass through corresponding clearance holes in 'fence_inside_face' and attach via T nuts to the TS fence?

Also do you know what diameter the rounds are on the Grizzly insert plate. I'd like to update that in my model. 


I racked my brain on your setup last night for 2 hours and I couldn't find a single thing that I'd want to change about your setup. Have you found any after using it?

It's really commendable. Job well done. Can't wait to build my own.


----------



## pikespeakgtx (Jan 14, 2013)

One more picture just cuz...:yes2:


----------



## jw2170 (Jan 24, 2008)

pikespeakgtx said:


> One more picture just cuz...:yes2:


Welcome to the forum, Michael.


----------



## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

pikespeakgtx said:


> Hello,
> 
> My name is Michael. I'm new here. 1st post. My wife Heather, my bernese mountain dog Mitch and I live in Eugene, OR.


Welcome



pikespeakgtx said:


> I spent 4 hours this AM reverse engineering your entire setup for my ridgid r4510.


Wow ... industrious. 



pikespeakgtx said:


> Each part is now modeled in Pro-Engineer and I can make files available in Inventor, Solidworks, ProE/Creo, Iges, Step, or STL for anyone.


Ok ... I think you may have slipped right past industrious but ... if you're willing ...



pikespeakgtx said:


> One item I'm not quite sure on is how the 'fence_face_backer' part fastens to the rest of the assembly?
> 
> Do the outside holes in 'fence_face_backer' pass through corresponding clearance holes in 'fence_inside_face' and attach via T nuts to the TS fence?


That's right and there are four knobs going to the top t-tracks for top support. The slots for the split fence are cut just long enough to allow access to the outer flathead screws when open fully. The one in the center is in the back of the bit clearance/vacuum plenum cavity.



pikespeakgtx said:


> Also do you know what diameter the rounds are on the Grizzly insert plate. I'd like to update that in my model.


Don't know right off but I'll check and get back to you.



pikespeakgtx said:


> I racked my brain on your setup last night for 2 hours and I couldn't find a single thing that I'd want to change about your setup. Have you found any after using it?


So far I like it. I've done some jointing with the spacers I made and setting up a zero clearance insert worked out very well. Really can't complain. Haven't used the top T-track yet but, hey, who knows.



pikespeakgtx said:


> It's really commendable. Job well done. Can't wait to build my own.


Thanks and glad I could help you out. Be sure to post a pic or two of your progress.

GCG


----------



## pikespeakgtx (Jan 14, 2013)

Well I got the aluminum angle frame material from home depot last night. 

qty (1) 48" long 3/4 x 3/4 x 1/8 stick $9.27
qty (1) 48" long 3/4" x 1/2" x 1/16" stick. $5.67

Cut the 2 lateral sections to 22" length and used red sharpie and my calipers to scribe the lines of the notches at the ends of the long peices. The width of the channel in the extrusion on the table saw was ~.473 so I made the notches @ .470 x .500

I was able to hit .4700, .4700, .4690, .4695 not bad for a table saw. The frame has next to none up and down play and about .020" side to side play which is fine. I love the micro-just feature on the ridgid fence for making slight adjustments. 

Then I cut the 4 longitudnal section to 10.063 and hit those within +/-.002

I'll still need to notch 2 of the longitudnal sections for the opening where the insert fits.

I picked up a set of Kreg router table insert levelers from Woodcrafters last night too. 

I found a company locally that sells 3/4 MDF with a phenolic laminate that sells a 4x8 sheet for $60. I'm going to use this to make the router table and probably much of the fence as well. 

I want the thickness of the table to turn out 1.3125 so I'll glue the mdf faces of the .75 phenolic mdf together but first run one of the peices through a planer and a timesaver and remove 3/16 off of the mdf face so my thickness comes out right. 

That's the plan for now. I will visit the vendor tommorow on my lunch hour with a set of calipers and see how true to .750 their 3/4 phenoic mdf actually is. I measured Home depot's 1/2 and 3/4 MDF and both were within .010 of nominal.


----------



## pikespeakgtx (Jan 14, 2013)

went to the wood supplier last night and he was talking about a reso backed mdf which is totally not going to work.

I'm now talking to a couple plastic suppliers to make a one peice the table out of garolite in a paper grade XX phenolic in 1 or 1.25" thickness.

I'm also talking to a treadmill supplier about getting a MDF board with a high pressure laminated phenolic top on it in .75 thickness and then bonding/screwing .5 mdf to the bottom of that as a secondary option. 

I'm also not certain I'm going to use the kreg plate levelers because one side has not enough room so two of the levelers will have to modified to work.


----------



## Dmeadows (Jun 28, 2011)

pikespeakgtx said:


> went to the wood supplier last night and he was talking about a reso backed mdf which is totally not going to work.
> 
> I'm now talking to a couple plastic suppliers to make a one peice the table out of garolite in a paper grade XX phenolic in 1 or 1.25" thickness.
> 
> ...


I have a whole stack of treadmill boards. That stuff generally is not at all durable. The wax or silicon lube(depending on brand) is all that keeps the very thin lining from coming off! Some of it is like a self adhesive stick-on type stuff. I use it for jigs and the like, but not for a router table top!


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## pikespeakgtx (Jan 14, 2013)

Dmeadows said:


> I have a whole stack of treadmill boards. That stuff generally is not at all durable. The wax or silicon lube(depending on brand) is all that keeps the very thin lining from coming off! Some of it is like a self adhesive stick-on type stuff. I use it for jigs and the like, but not for a router table top!


Oh really? I've never had any in my hand to look at. It looked in the pics like it was a 1/16 phenolic sheet laminated on both sides. Thanks for the heads up! 

It looks like I'm in for the solid 1 piece paper phenolic... For a 12x24x1 inch sheet it's about $40. Seems like the way to go to me. 

From what I've seen in my limited experience, the solid phenolic tops come on the high end router tables. 

I was reading about a guy who has had really good results with a Corian top. I was also reading about compact grade laminates in 1" thickness. That stuff looks great too but don't know where to find it locally.


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## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

OK ... you're going beyond the melamine/MDF open faced sandwich. I like the Corian idea, too. I went low budget 'cause I still had other purchases to consider. 

Looks like you've got the angle part down. 

Keep posting progress ... I'm curious to see how this works out for someone else.


_{Off Subject Alert:}_
BTW ... if you'll look under the main table in the back corners you'll see two pair of cylindrical hard points. The pair on the table extension side is adjacent to an access through the back of the plastic base. I checked and it looks like it would take a 1/4-20 tap or close. If so I'm thinking outfeed support. I've already got a cantilevered table design rumbling around my noggin. Take a look and see what you think.

GCG


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## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

You should be able to drill and tap either the Phenolic or the Corian. That would allow you to put the table levelers in the table as hex key grub screws accessible from the top which sounds like a cleaner solution than drilling and taping the longitudinal angles as I did.

GCG


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## pikespeakgtx (Jan 14, 2013)

GulfcoastGuy said:


> You should be able to drill and tap either the Phenolic or the Corian. That would allow you to put the table levelers in the table as hex key grub screws accessible from the top which sounds like a cleaner solution than drilling and taping the longitudinal angles as I did.
> 
> GCG


That's a great idea to use set screw levelers tapped into the plate instead of the longitudinal angles. Still going to drill/tap the longitudinal angles to accept a lock down screw. Use the same style of levelers the insert uses (attached photo), where you have a set screw leveler and a flat head lock down screw from the top of the plate, so you can be sure this setup stays put when you put the table up in the folded position. 

I too am space conscious. lately I've been doing table saw work in the kitchen hallway, with my wife's blessing:thank_you2:

I found some other post you made on Ask.com, I think, where a another guy asked if theres any router tables commercially available for the r4510.

Also wanted to mention I adjusted the sliding portion of the table to the same height as the stationary portion of the table by cracking loose the 10mm head screws in the picture and tapping until it's flush with a hammer handle and then snugging the 10's back down. There's 2 per side. It was off by about a 1/16 before. 

{Off Subject Alert:}

I see the points you mean. It looks to me like they are for a M6-1.0mm thread. So it should also accept 1/4-20.
Also there are also a great number of ejector pin locations used to remove the casting from the mold base during manufacturing that would serve as great places to drill/tap.
Install studs for so you could slip a cantilevered outfeed table to it. 

Trying to wrap my head around dealing with the cyl posts that are hidden under the plastic of the saw. probably work through the small slot to the left of the dust port slot with a custom offset aluminum bracket. a lightweight portable fold up out feed table would be really nice to have.


----------



## pikespeakgtx (Jan 14, 2013)

Okay... Received the Rockler Lift fx today and finished modeling the phenolic insert. 
The fancy rockler tables are 3/4" phenolic so 1" should be plenty. That's $40. I'm debating doing the machining myself or farming it out to a local CNC shop. 


The lift fx is narrower than the other static plates which allows a combo miter/t slot track on the table. Plus the opening is offset to one side allowing more usable space on the table. I haven't modeled the Bosch 1617 Router yet to see if everything is 100% happy and has its own place in live. Custom builds like this, there's always trade offs when things want to live inside one another. 


I ditched the Kreg levelers in favor of tapped holes with grub screws with flat head lock down screws.


That's about all for now just more pictures to look at.


----------



## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

I can confirm the points you correctly ID'd in post #76 - images 4 & 5 will tap to 1/4-20. I just finished two tonight and have a good 1/2" of 85% tread. My only fear is the hard points to the right are offset linearly from the access through the case. This could create a moment of inertia that could conceivably lead to failure of the hard point. I'm playing out solutions in my head (support outriggers tops on the list, so far).

Back on the router table insert. I noticed you're going for a miter/t-track combo. Then I checked the dims of Rockler Lift FX and noticed you get an extra 3/4" in width and 1/4" in length to work with. Nice, I'm still working out using the lone t-track in mine to make a usable coping sled.

Nice work so far. Keep the updates coming.

GCG


----------



## pikespeakgtx (Jan 14, 2013)

Anyone know if the kreg phenolic insert rings will fit these rockler plates? 

The injection molded ring that is supplied has only 3 screws on 120 degree pitch. The ring is warped and worthless. I can't believe it passed QC and got packaged for sale. The darn thing will just about jump off a flat table. 

The 3/8 aluminum plate is machined very well. The counter bore depth of the ring opening is .125 on the nose. 

I'm calling rockler tech support tommorow morning and will find a solution. The one in the pictures shows a 6 hole pattern on 60 degrees. The plate is tapped 6x. So if i have to run an injection molded part, it better have 6 holes in it.


----------



## pikespeakgtx (Jan 14, 2013)

I agree about the moment there. The outer post will have the highest tensile load and there will definately be torque happening there with that offset. Would be best to use a 4 legged table and use brackets off the hard posts to locate the outfeed table and secure it only...no load bearing. 

But my gut tells me you'd be alright with a two legged outfeed table if you bottom tap the holes and get the bolts in there deep... as close as comfortable to not break thru into the table top. But my mind doesnt want to find out.

You need a third pickup point... To resist the moment... I'd suggest usingt the existing mount that the table bolts to the plastic with by using a longer bolt and a spacer bushing.


----------



## pikespeakgtx (Jan 14, 2013)

Sorta disillusioned tonite. 

I'm debating sending the lift fx and bosch 1617 back in favor of a triton tra001 and a static bench dog plate. 

You need two wrenches on the bosch. Tritons got the auto spindle lock.

The triton is 1 hp more. Total investment is roughly the same. 

Was not feelin' Rocklers customer support love at all today. Would rather not give them my business. 

Want to do raised panels and worried the 1617 isnt up to the task.

Anybody got advice for the router rookie?


----------



## jw2170 (Jan 24, 2008)

pikespeakgtx said:


> Sorta disillusioned tonite.
> 
> I'm debating sending the lift fx and bosch 1617 back in favor of a triton tra001 and a static bench dog plate.
> 
> ...


Go with your gut and get the Triton. But I am biased.......


----------



## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

I'd say for all things other than weight and perhaps size - the Triton.

Bosch 1617 - 8.2 lb - 3.72 kg
Triton - 13.2 lb - 6 kg .... might not be an issue ... I honestly don't know.

Don't know the size of the Triton but I know the 1617 fits, handles and all, but it just barely blocks the storage location of the TS fence. If I stow it with the RT insert in I leave the fence on the table to hold the RT insert in place.

Anyone have a size comparison between the two?

GCG


----------



## pikespeakgtx (Jan 14, 2013)

jw2170 said:


> Go with your gut and get the Triton. But I am biased.......


Well yeah! Isn't the Triton from down under?


----------



## jw2170 (Jan 24, 2008)

*Triton fan ????*



pikespeakgtx said:


> Well yeah! Isn't the Triton from down under?



Not any longer. The Triton brand is owned by Powerbox AG (a swiss company) with HQ in England.

The routers were, I understand, designed in Australia but have alway been manufactured in Tiawan.

Also to GCG, IMHO weight is not an issue when set in a table, in fact it may help to make it more stable.

Don't get me wrong. I am not a fanatic that believes that the Triton is the one and only router. I just feel that it is one of the best for table mounting. No lift is required and the new models all have through the table height adjustment. Cutters can be changed from above the table.

And they come in 3 size ranges if you don't want a 3+HP machine.

It almost seems that it was designed with table mounting in mind, not as an after thought.

I also use Makita, Ryobi and Ozito routers for other tasks.


----------



## pikespeakgtx (Jan 14, 2013)

I'm going to give the triton a hard look tommorow at the local woodcraft store.
I also really like the freud 15amp and the big bosch plunge.

If I go that route I wont need any router insert plate. I'll make my own all inclusive, one piece phenolic table insert and mill a profile to utilize the incra magnalock insert rings with magnetic dress washers with viton or buna-n o-rings beneath like incra does. 

Such as these:
K&J Magnetics - Products




















INCRA Precision Fence :: Router System Accessories :: INCRA Solid Aluminum MagnaLOCK RT 

What good is a $180 router lift if it uses cheeze-ball warped insert rings Rockler? I'm supposed to make my bit height adjustments based off that? :sarcastic:

Might as well put that money towards a powerful router with the 'cruise control' electronic feedback.


----------



## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

Please be aware of size. You're moving into larger format routers and the R4510 has some other stuff under there a larger router may run into. I'm not saying they won't fit. I just know how close the 1617 is to some things under there and it'd be a PITA if you made a large $$ purchase and there was an interference issue. It was something of a concern for me but I already had the router so I was only out the cost of the insert parts if I ran into problems.

Personally I like the idea of the dedicated larger router with no plate. It'd make for a stronger insert and it opens the general design to a wider range of routers. Just be sure you can shoehorn the thing in there.

GCG


----------



## pikespeakgtx (Jan 14, 2013)

GulfcoastGuy said:


> Please be aware of size. You're moving into larger format routers and the R4510 has some other stuff under there a larger router may run into. I'm not saying they won't fit. I just know how close the 1617 is to some things under there and it'd be a PITA if you made a large $$ purchase and there was an interference issue. It was something of a concern for me but I already had the router so I was only out the cost of the insert parts if I ran into problems.
> 
> Personally I like the idea of the dedicated larger router with no plate. It'd make for a stronger insert and it opens the general design to a wider range of routers. Just be sure you can shoehorn the thing in there.
> 
> GCG


It fits! 

I bought a Triton 3.25 hp today from Woodcraft for $210 on sale. 

It does not interfere with the miter fence storage at all. TS fence is a different story but that doesn't matter because the router fence will be bolted to it 95% of the time.

Nobody in town had a Freud 3000 or a Bosch 1619 so I bought the Triton for about the same money as a bosch 1617 combo setup.

Plus the Triton is Orange! It color coordinates with the Ridgid saw.


----------



## Dmeadows (Jun 28, 2011)

pikespeakgtx said:


> It fits!
> 
> Plus the Triton is Orange! It color coordinates with the Ridgid saw.


My wife would buy one if it was blue!


----------



## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

pikespeakgtx said:


> It fits!
> 
> I bought a Triton 3.25 hp today from Woodcraft for $210 on sale.
> 
> It does not interfere with the miter fence storage at all.


Great to hear. That extra pony will come in handy on the raised panels, I'm sure.



pikespeakgtx said:


> TS fence is a different story but that doesn't matter because the router fence will be bolted to it 95% of the time.


Mine was on the TS fence till just recently. The table stores just fine with the extension out and the fence on the table. I only removed it because I needed to use a sliding tenoning jig on the TS fence.



pikespeakgtx said:


> Nobody in town had a Freud 3000 or a Bosch 1619 so I bought the Triton for about the same money as a bosch 1617 combo setup.
> 
> Plus the Triton is Orange! It color coordinates with the Ridgid saw.


Since I only see it briefly when I'm adjusting bit height the clash of Ridgid orange and Bosch blue doesn't bug me.

Congrats ... Now, back to fab ... and more pictures.

GCG


----------



## pikespeakgtx (Jan 14, 2013)

Little ditty about Triton's seemingly dubious reputation. Believe the hype. 

First one power switch didn't work. 
Second one, worm drive ratching height adjuster deal was chunky and rough. 
Third one checks out ok. 

Made in Tiawan. Probably in a sweatshop. Definately not iso9000 or any six sigma qc going on here. 

Bosch 1619 is manufactured to a much higher standard but was unavailable locally and is quite a bit more expensive and its blue.


----------



## pikespeakgtx (Jan 14, 2013)

2/9/13 UPDATE!

A 1" thick 12x24 Sheet of XX Grade Paper Phenolic sheet showed up Friday. It is very hard, very dense, heavy, very flat, slippery, and cuts OK on the R4510 with a Diablo thin kerf 80 tooth blade. Set me back $40. 

1st cut it down to size. ~10.25" x 22". 
Then notch each long side for clearance of the vertical edges of the aluminum angles.

It fits very snug.. I didn't remember to bring home my calipers so I made multiple passes on the table saw to sneak up on the dimension that gave me a very snug slip fit.

Couldn't resist making a little insert piece to fill the hole that's left in the wing of the saw. That was done with a chop saw and belt sander. The angles are 30 degree. I'm going to drill and tap it for 10-32, and drill clearance holes in the table saw wing and mount it with socket head cap screws. 

I mocked up the Triton TRA001 router, used the pink 360 degree protractor and found the best angle to mount it which is 23 degrees anti-clockwise from the horizontal centerline of the table saw. This way the router just misses the miter fence when it's stored. We're talking less than a 1/16 of clearance. You can see the dust collection port on the router in the picture. That's a slick feature that I haven't seen on a router until you hit the $800 price tag of the Festool. With double dust collection there and on the fence, you shouldn't see a speck dust. 

I'm going to cnc the flat head router mounting screw hole locations during the same setup as the pocket for the incra magna throat plate system so that the router ends up perfectly concentric about the opening of the throat plate. 

I'm still waiting for the incra magna rings and hardware kit to show up and I still need to mill a slot for the combo miter/t-track from Kreg.


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## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

Looking good. I DO like the phenolic and that Triton is a monster compared to the Bosch 1617 in mine.

GCG


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## gmercer_48083 (Jul 18, 2012)

This design is the best idea I've seen on this site in the last year! If there was an annual award for the best design you would win hands down! Awesome!


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## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

gmercer_48083 said:


> This design is the best idea I've seen on this site in the last year! If there was an annual award for the best design you would win hands down! Awesome!


Don't hold back ... tell me what you really think.

Really, thanks for the complement. Just trying to give back. There is still a good argument for a separate table, but when you're low on space ...


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## Njhw (May 13, 2013)

Gulfcoastguy thanks for this thread and all the info! I have a dedicated router table but this is a great option for me when I'm working on a job site I own the same TS and I have a few questions if you don't mind , how do you attach the fence to the TS fence ? and how's it working for you so far? anything that you would've done different? 
Thanks in advance.


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## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

Njhw said:


> Gulfcoastguy thanks for this thread and all the info!


You're welcome.



Njhw said:


> I have a dedicated router table but this is a great option for me when I'm working on a job site I own the same TS and I have a few questions if you don't mind


Sure.



Njhw said:


> , how do you attach the fence to the TS fence ?


The t-tracks in the TS fence. The ones on the top are pretty straight forward; two on the side the Router fence are on are under the adjustable fence sections and accessible with a Phillips screwdriver through the slots in the sliding sections when the sliding sections are fully retracted. The center attachment on the side is in the back of the router bit/dust extraction cavity. I originally used plain hex nuts in the slots but have since moved on to 80/20 style t-nuts. These are over sized for the TS slots but I worked them down to size on my bench sander. 



Njhw said:


> and how's it working for you so far? anything that you would've done different?
> Thanks in advance.


It's working well and I don't have any plans to add or change anything. It's become a real goto piece of equipment for me.


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## Tiberius13 (Aug 8, 2013)

jschaben said:


> :stop:It looked good to me until I got to this the first pic. The way you have it set up you will have to work over the long (left) end of the saw. You need to set it up so the fence is between the router position and the saw blade position so your routing work area is off the right end of the saw. Actually the fence itself is fine I just am hoping you are planning on mounting it on the other side of the saw fence than what you are showing


I'm just curious what the reasoning is for having the work area to the right of fence and saw blade? Being able to work from the same side of the table that you saw from would have advantages (if an outfeed table is in place on the other side, etc). 

I'm just curious the reasoning... is it just that it's a no-no to work over the save blade area of the table saw?


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## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

Tiberius13 said:


> I'm just curious what the reasoning is for having the work area to the right of fence and saw blade? Being able to work from the same side of the table that you saw from would have advantages (if an outfeed table is in place on the other side, etc).
> 
> I'm just curious the reasoning... is it just that it's a no-no to work over the save blade area of the table saw?


Other than being awkward and therefor potentially unsafe ... no. After using it for a while I was very glad that John gave me the heads up on that one. Also I've found that for most of what is done on the TS the RT fence can stay attached without interfering at all. I only needed to remove it when I needed to cut a groove on the edge of a piece or use the sliding tenoning jig I made. (nothing to see here, very simple).


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## jw2170 (Jan 24, 2008)

Welcome to the forum, Tiberius.


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## Tiberius13 (Aug 8, 2013)

Ok - so I'm making this insert and had a minor setback... I was trying to use some extra 5/8th melamine I had on hand, and I got it completely cut (absolutely perfect fit for the insert, just a smidge deep so the levelers could do their thing... and a perfect cut off the side for the T-Track....

.... and then I handling it a bit too roughly and.... *snap*... there really wasn't a lot holding it together with all that material removed... if I would have got it clamped and then screwed to the 1/2" MDF bottom piece I would have been set... *sigh*....

Going to start over... probably going to get the 3/4" Melamine just to have the extra thickness this time (although I think it would have been fine with the 5/8" if I had just been more careful with it before getting it re-inforced/attached to the MDF)

*ONE BIG QUESTION:*

I have 1/8th 3/4" aluminum angle for the bottom braces, and I sit the 1/16th 1/2 x 3/4 angle at the ends, and when I place the 1/2MDF in it, the side edge of the 3/4"angle is HIGHER than the MDF!?!? Based on the cut plan, the Melamine is wider than the MDF, thus I believe it is intended to sit over the entire MDF/Angle surface... but the angle is propping it up above the MDF currently.

Did I misunderstand something in the plan? (I guess I should have realized this would be the case based on math... 3/4" angle - 1/8th angle thickness - 1/16th angles thickness = 9/16th. 9/16th > 1/2... duh!

Did everyone else rip down the entire length of the 3/4" angle to reduct it's height (easy enough to do - but such a mess when cutting metal)

Thanks.


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## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

Whoa, Tib. No need to make a cut that long. The 1/2" side rides up the side of the MDF and the 3/4" side rests on the bottom.

The 5/8" melamine in addition to 3/4" MDF will probably be too thick and you'll never get the top even with the top of the table saw. It's a tighter tolerance than than it may appear. I'd keep with what you had for a total of 1-1/8" as opposed to 1-1/4". It should be fine. I wouldn't expect the loss of 1/8" to be a problem.

Addendum:

Attach the melamine to the MDF before the cutout. Cut the access at the same time you cut the recess for the top plate. It'll make things much easier.


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## Tiberius13 (Aug 8, 2013)

GulfcoastGuy said:


> Whoa, Tib. No need to make a cut that long. The 1/2" side rides up the side of the MDF and the 3/4" side rests on the bottom.
> 
> The 5/8" melamine in addition to 3/4" MDF will probably be too thick and you'll never get the top even with the top of the table saw. It's a tighter tolerance than than it may appear. I'd keep with what you had for a total of 1-1/8" as opposed to 1-1/4". It should be fine. I wouldn't expect the loss of 1/8" to be a problem.
> 
> ...


Thanks for the tips. 

To be clear - there is no half inch side on the 3/4x3/4 angle (these are the long pieces with the notches cut out at the ends to make it 1/2" where it slides into the groove). That is the angle that sits too high (higher than the 1/2" MDF that rests in it). I think once there are levelling screws in place it may be a moot point since the entire MDF/Melamine table will be raised above the 1' 10" side angle pieces anyway.

Also, the overall thickness I'm using is 1/8 thinner than your plans: 1/2 MDF and 5/8 Melamine (your plans called for 1/2 MDF and 3/4 Melamine). The overall thickness of 1 1/4" seems to work well (with levelling screws not having to raise the table much), but if the MDF/Melamine table actually rest on the edge of the 3/4x3/4 angle (the 1' 10" pieces)... I actually think it might be too high before you even bring levelling screwed into the picture. Thus, my concern/question about the overall design. My use of 1/2 MDF and 5/8 Melamine actually had me in ok shape even with the entire table resting on the 3/4x3/4 angle.

Based on your above comment I wonder if you switched from 3/4x3/4 angle? But, the whole process around cutting the notch in the end to 1/2" height so it will slip into the groove is because of the use of 3/4x3/4 angle?

I actually can push the angle as far to the sides as it goes and it sits outside the edge of the melamine allowing it to not "float" on the edge of the angle - but ultimately that results in a 1/8" gap at each side of the saw table... and makes the MDF piece look like it was seriously undercut in width 

Anyway... somehow it doesn't sound like you encountered/noticed this issue? When I look at the height of the Melamine surface when resting on the 3/4 angle (the 1" 10" pieces)... I think if it was 3/4" Melamine it would be pretty much flush with the saw surface... perhaps even too high... not much need for levelling screws. Thus, I assumed yours wasn't sitting on the 3/4x3/4 angle (meaning it would sit at least 1/16" lower) 

Maybe I need to take some pictures... :wacko:


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## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

Tiberius13 said:


> Thanks for the tips.
> 
> To be clear - there is no half inch side on the 3/4x3/4 angle (these are the long pieces with the notches cut out at the ends to make it 1/2" where it slides into the groove). That is the angle that sits too high (higher than the 1/2" MDF that rests in it). I think once there are levelling screws in place it may be a moot point since the entire MDF/Melamine table will be raised above the 1' 10" side angle pieces anyway.
> 
> ...


Sorry, I missed the post.

The leveling screws are the support points for the insert and in my installation they do raise the insert just enough to clear the 3/4 x 3/4 angle. Once clear there is just a little leveling to do, but just a little so YMMV. You should be in good shape as the 5/8 melamine is 1/8 thinner than my 3/4 (6/8). You may be right, perhaps some pic's may be the ticket. Just as a check verify that the MDF was cut 1/4" narrower (10" vs. 10-1/4": see post #9) than the Melamine to allow the vertical side of the angle a recess to fit into. If so you may have some dimensional differences in you saw table's assembly and may need to cut a rabbet in the Melamine to extend the recess to fit. If that is the case this would be a perfect time to fit a sacrificial fence to the TS fence for rabbet cutting if you haven't already. Much easier than trying to shave the top of the angle away.

I'll try to monitor the thread a little more closely till we get this resolved.


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## Tiberius13 (Aug 8, 2013)

In a nutshell, I think the melamine resting on the edge of the 3/4 angle is "expected" in your design (once the MDF is glued/screwed to the melamine the gap I'm observing between the MDF and melamine is a moot point - it becomes a gap under the MDF between the insert and the horizontal part of the 3/4 angle. It just seemed strange to have the MDF floating and not touching the bottom support of the 3/4" angle). However, even when resting on the top edge of the 3/4" angle, the entire insert still needs to be raised to be level with the table saw surface. In your case (using 3/4" melamine) you only needed to raise it a tiny amount with your levelling screws. I'm my case (using 5/8" melamine) I will need to raise it an extra 1/8" with my levelling screws compared to yours. Ultimately, the insert does not rest on the bottom lip (horizontal part) of the 3/4 angle... it rests on the levelling screws and the MDF floats above the 3/4 angle... 

My initial reaction was more based on the "assumption" that the insert should "rest" on the bottom of the 3/4" angle... but the need to raise it higher to level the insert really negates that assumption.

All is well in the world


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## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

Great!

Feel free to ask any other questions that may come up.


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## Tiberius13 (Aug 8, 2013)

GulfcoastGuy said:


> Bought a $2 poly binder from Office Depot and cut out some spacers for edge jointing.
> 
> They mic'd out at .018" just over 1/64th" each.
> 
> GCG


What exactly were these spacers used for? I didn't understand that first time through the thread - so now I'm going to ask


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## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

Sorry again for the delayed response. I was away for the holiday weekend with no access.

Check out Jointing With A Router on the NewWoodworker site. _Good site to explore BTW_

It'll explain it much better than I can. I use the spacers to set the offset of the outfeed fence section.


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## Tiberius13 (Aug 8, 2013)

Thanks for that link GCG! Great info!

I have the router table insert completed. A few notes from my experiences:

1) I thought I noticed a small amount of sag in the middle of the insert (Due to the weight of the router I figured), so I included additional levelling bolts in the middle of the 3/4 angle as support (I put a small piece of 3/4x1/2 angle on the edge where the bolt makes contact). *This may also be due to the table saw surface not being perfectly level - but it did seem to improve the alignment with the table saw surface in the middle of the router insert.

This slight sag may also be due to the 5/8" MDF vs 3/4" MDF - but could be a risk for any insert over time?

2) When using the router, I had 2 of the levelling screws fall out! The table was kinda clamped in the table saw opening so it didn't sink down while I was routing luckily. Basically, the bolts aren't "tight" in the threads I created. I think adding the middle support levelling bolts also took "stress" (weight of the router table) off of the corner bolts allowing them to vibrate loose, etc. I think masking taping the bolt threads might give them a snug fit - haven't tried it yet... 

3) An interesting observation... The T track on the top of the Ridgid fence is NOT the same width as the T track on the sides of the fence! The opening on the sides is NARROWER than the top (at least on my saw fence). The T bolts included with a Kreg Klamp block set I have will fit in the top T track, but not the side T tracks of the table saw fence... I thought this was strange...

I am at the stage where I need to finish assembling the fence now (all parts cut and ready to go). Need to shop for a bolt/nut combo to use to connect to the Ridgid fence. It looks like a 2 1/2" bolt with a nut that is 3/8" or 7/16" wide should work, and of course the top attachment looks like a 3/4" bolt with a 7/16" or 1/2" nut width would work. I was thinking I might just get T bolts and cut them to size, but now it appears standard T bolts won't fit into the side T track on the table saw fence... bummer...

Overall, I really like the design and functionality so far! Getting the router mounted at the correct angle to the insert plate is critical (to avoid obstacles below the table surface, ensure you can hook up your vacuum hose, etc.)


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## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

1) Not seeing sag here so far, but the extra screws can only help.

2) When I get that going on, some thin strips of paper held in the inside threads to tighten 'em up is my usual fix. Just hold long thin strips in place while you thread the screws in and snug 'em down. then just tear off the excess. 

3) Yup, ran into that, too. You'll also find the standard T-nuts (ground down to fit) have a tendency to bind in the track (steel on aluminum, should have expected it) making attachment and removal of the Router fence something of a pain. I'm going to try to make my own from some "UHMW like" cutting board material I have (the cheap white Mainstay brand boards from Wally World). You may want to try that up front.

I'm not currently doing dust collection below the table and it's a real cleanup chore. Bravo for getting the collection going from the get go.


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## DHH57 (Feb 16, 2014)

This has been an interesting thread. I used MDF to make a stand alone table and it has been too unstable with the changing humidity in the south. I am going to take a good look at my saw to see if this is feasable. plywood with laminate.


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## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

Don't discount the value of the aluminum angle. It IMO has played a big role.


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## plunger (Jun 21, 2013)

GulfcoastGuy said:


> I'm not currently doing dust collection below the table and it's a real cleanup chore. Bravo for getting the collection going from the get go.


Does anyone know if this R4510 router table insert solution will support an Incra CleanSweep system? Dust collection is definitely important for me.


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## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

I don't have the dims on this but it looks like it's probably too big for the available opening.










For something like this I'd have to recommend a dedicated table or an router extension on a more standard sized TS.


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## Rubberdowel (Feb 13, 2014)

Thanks to the OP for this thought provoking addition to the table saw. Here is my revision number... 2 I think :lol:! There are a couple of things though that I want to add and a little unsure of as I am just starting into this wood stuff... I want to use the existing fence that is on the table saw I think I maybe able to do that given the supplied tracks that run in and along the fence I was thinking I could either fabricate one from wood or HDPE or UHMW. Could this work any plans? The other thing I want to do is add a miter slot running down the outside to add the feather boards in there. Thanks for the help!


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## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

I did what you're talking about with my fence. MDF router fence attaches to the TS fence via the t-slots on the TS Fence.










If you look close you can see both ends of thr TS fence in there.


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## plunger (Jun 21, 2013)

I was thinking about building my router insert... potentially different design to speed up installing the insert.

Realized 1/8" material will easily fit underneath the stock table saw fence- up to about 3/8" deep.

I was thinking a piece of 1/8" steel stock could just lay on top of the extension rails, leaving 3/8" for an insert plate & RT top material. There's a max of about 1/2" height from the rails to the top of the table saw.

Any thoughts? A few of you have played with these designs.


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## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

At roughly 5.1 lb/ft², it would be a little heavy but manageable. It'd scratch up the rails. Beyond that, as long as it were rigid enough (should be), it might be a workable idea. You could direct connect the router base or even a small footprint lift. You'd have to attach the top with screws or perhaps contact cement.


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## bodavis (May 15, 2014)

hello...i have the same saw and looking to add a router top to mines....by chance do you have the plans and dimensions to share....


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## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

Everything is in this thread. Just start reading from the beginning. If you still have questions just reference the relevant post and feel free to ask.


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## wifes_handyman (Jan 8, 2014)

Great design! With the current design, could you offset one of the fences for use as a jointer?


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## mrmagloo (Jan 3, 2015)

Hi Patrick,

Thanks again for the great design. I just picked up the last R4510 and stumbled on your post on the Ridgid forum. I've read this whole thread a couple of times, and I'm missing a few bits of info I can't seem to figure out. (Sorry in advance but I've never owned a router, and I'm just a beginner, so some of these might really be dumb - I mean really, really dumb!):

1. On the fence components, do you have anything in schematic form that shows the dimensions of all of those pieces? I found the illustrations for the insert and rail components and dimensions, and I saw the image of the fence pieces, but I can't seem to find the dimensions for those or how those are all connected?

2. I see some reference to the oval track nuts, but I can't see where they all go, and how many I need? Or how many bolts and their dimensions to put the fence together? I'm totally lost on the fence and I'm just not able to figure this part out, even after reading this thread umpteen times?

3. I think I see that you used a INCRA TTRACKPLUS24 with the ruler for the fence face. However, I'm trying to figure out the correct PN#'s for the track used at the top of the fence and the one on the insert? Is that the Incra TTRACKREG? If so, I'm thinking I could just get a 48" length to save a little money and just cut it in half? 24" for the fence and roughly 21" for the insert?

4. It looks like you used pan head screws to mount the t-tracks. Don't the items you would mount to these need to slide in the track? Do the pan heads interfere? Should I think about using flat heads instead? I'm a little unclear there.

5. Regarding these tracks, what are they used for? I thought at first perhaps feather boards? I see Incra makes hold down clamps that fit these tracks, but no feather boards. Do you have links for what you use in those tracks? Just trying to understand how I would use those once I get this all put together and get my first router.

6. I'm thinking about getting the Ridgid R22002 2 HP Router - Gotta love that lifetime warranty, but do you think this will fit OK, and not be too heavy? Is there a different plate you would recommend for this, instead of the spec'd Grizzly you used? I too don't want to get crazy with the cost, but if there is a substantial benefit on going with something else, I'd really appreciate the heads up.

I've got most of the components in my shopping cart on Amazon, (dust port, oval nuts, t-tracks, etc) but wanted to double-check before checking out.

Lastly, I know others asked you this earlier on, but is there anything you would have done differently? I almost thought about buying 3/4" UHMW sheet for the top, but figured I'd go with the much cheaper melamine I got for $2.99 as I work through this, and I can always upgrade later. But it seems a lot of the Fence material is MDF I think, and I wonder about moisture affecting those pieces?

Sorry again for all the questions, no doubt some pretty dumb, but I appreciate your help!

Thank you sir!


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## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

mrmagloo said:


> Hi Patrick,
> 
> Thanks again for the great design. I just picked up the last R4510 and stumbled on your post on the Ridgid forum. I've read this whole thread a couple of times, and I'm missing a few bits of info I can't seem to figure out. (Sorry in advance but I've never owned a router, and I'm just a beginner, so some of these might really be dumb - I mean really, really dumb!):


Everyone was a beginner once.




mrmagloo said:


> 1. On the fence components, do you have anything in schematic form that shows the dimensions of all of those pieces? I found the illustrations for the insert and rail components and dimensions, and I saw the image of the fence pieces, but I can't seem to find the dimensions for those or how those are all connected?


You can get all dimensions from the Sketchup file in the zip attached to post #64. You'll need to download and learn Sketchup Make {free}



mrmagloo said:


> 2. I see some reference to the oval track nuts, but I can't see where they all go, and how many I need? Or how many bolts and their dimensions to put the fence together? I'm totally lost on the fence and I'm just not able to figure this part out, even after reading this thread umpteen times?


These are used where the RT fence attaches to the TS fence t-slots. They still bind pretty badly when the RT fence is attached and removed. I've been meaning to fashion some out of UHMW or similar but just haven't gotten around to it. I would strongly advise making the attempt.



mrmagloo said:


> 3. I think I see that you used a INCRA TTRACKPLUS24 with the ruler for the fence face. However, I'm trying to figure out the correct PN#'s for the track used at the top of the fence and the one on the insert? Is that the Incra TTRACKREG? If so, I'm thinking I could just get a 48" length to save a little money and just cut it in half? 24" for the fence and roughly 21" for the insert?


Yup, Incra TTRACKREG but using the INCRA TTRACKPLUS should work fine just adjust the dim's of the adjoining parts to accommodate.




mrmagloo said:


> 4. It looks like you used pan head screws to mount the t-tracks. Don't the items you would mount to these need to slide in the track? Do the pan heads interfere? Should I think about using flat heads instead? I'm a little unclear there.


No interference so far. I believe the screws came with the track IIRC.



mrmagloo said:


> 5. Regarding these tracks, what are they used for? I thought at first perhaps feather boards? I see Incra makes hold down clamps that fit these tracks, but no feather boards. Do you have links for what you use in those tracks? Just trying to understand how I would use those once I get this all put together and get my first router.


Third party feather boards, stops, and what-have-you add on's.



mrmagloo said:


> 6. I'm thinking about getting the Ridgid R22002 2 HP Router - Gotta love that lifetime warranty, but do you think this will fit OK, and not be too heavy? Is there a different plate you would recommend for this, instead of the spec'd Grizzly you used? I too don't want to get crazy with the cost, but if there is a substantial benefit on going with something else, I'd really appreciate the heads up.


I don't have any experience with that router so I can't advise. I would expect as long as it would pass through the cut out for the plate it should work fine. The Grizzly plate is a mainstay for many of the membership here. That's why I went with it. I've been very happy with it.




mrmagloo said:


> I've got most of the components in my shopping cart on Amazon, (dust port, oval nuts, t-tracks, etc) but wanted to double-check before checking out.
> 
> Lastly, I know others asked you this earlier on, but is there anything you would have done differently? I almost thought about buying 3/4" UHMW sheet for the top, but figured I'd go with the much cheaper melamine I got for $2.99 as I work through this, and I can always upgrade later. But it seems a lot of the Fence material is MDF I think, and I wonder about moisture affecting those pieces?
> 
> ...


Other than a fix for the binding track nuts I'm satisfied. As far as the UHMW I would be concerned with rigidity even with a backing piece. A thin UHMW veneer might be a worthwhile idea if MDF or similar were used instead of Melamine.


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## mrmagloo (Jan 3, 2015)

Thanks a lot for the fast reply Patrick! I'm not sure how to do the quotes to specific points like you did, but I'll just respond in the order originally presented.

I did download Sketch program and the file. I got it to open, and I can see the components, but don't see any dimensions? I can click on a single piece on the visible end, and use the tape measure tool to get the size, but any piece that is covered doesn't allow this? If I right click on a piece, there are a bunch of options, but none so far give me anything but the total area of the piece, but not the WxDxL or material? Seems there's a pretty big learning curve with this program? That's why I was hoping your had a sheet with the dimensions for all of the fence piece like you did for the rails and insert pieces? I will keep playing with this program and see if I can figure it out.

_"These are used where the RT fence attaches to the TS fence t-slots. They still bind pretty badly when the RT fence is attached and removed. I've been meaning to fashion some out of UHMW or similar but just haven't gotten around to it. I would strongly advise making the attempt."_

I got kind of lost here. I get that RT stands for router table and TS stands for table saw, but what is exactly binding and what is getting damaged? And, most importantly, what would piece would you make differently out of UHMW? The slotted RT fence face? Or the nuts? I would think UHMW nuts that would fit the slot would strip out pretty easily, if I'm reading this right? (which no doubt, I'm not).

Regarding the Incra track, I like the Plus piece with the ruler on the face, which I think will be helpful for quick eyeballing. However, I did call Incra and asked about what accessories like feather boards, etc, that they had to fit the t-track channel, and the engineer guy said those were only designed for their clamps. That all of their router tables use the larger miter channels which fit their featherboards, etc, made by Jessem. So that's what prompted that question. Seems I would be better off using the miter channels, unless there are other products I haven't stumbled on that will fit the T-Track. I'm just not seeing anything beyond clamps at the Incra website?

Thanks for the thoughts on the UHMW table top. I'm definitely going to have to try and seal the melamine and MDF as it get quite humid in my garage and I'd hate to see this insert get all warped.

Thanks again!


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## Paul Brierly (Feb 19, 2015)

Easy plans to follow many thanks as I am currently building a router table most helpfull


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## mrmagloo (Jan 3, 2015)

I'm slowly working through this. I have the insert done - found the recommended cheapo insert is warped, but I'm hoping it straightens out after a couple of days with the weight of the router. 

So, on to the fence. I still cannot figure out the Sketching program very well, but I was able to use the measure tool to get the dimensions of the pieces. I have noticed there are a few changes from the Sketch file to the final product, but I've calculated the dimension changes of the pieces. I cannot however figure out the locations of the slots or the mounting holes. Is there a trick to that? And, on the back of the tall 5-3/16" x 2' x 3/4" piece, are you using pronged Tee Nuts on the back for the 4 face bolts?

Lastly, has anyone been able to figure out what GCG was suggesting to avoid the binding? I still don't have any idea what he was recommending?

Thanks.


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## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

mrmagloo said:


> I'm slowly working through this. I have the insert done - found the recommended cheapo insert is warped, but I'm hoping it straightens out after a couple of days with the weight of the router.
> 
> So, on to the fence. I still cannot figure out the Sketching program very well, but I was able to use the measure tool to get the dimensions of the pieces. I have noticed there are a few changes from the Sketch file to the final product, but I've calculated the dimension changes of the pieces. I cannot however figure out the locations of the slots or the mounting holes. Is there a trick to that?


The slotted pieces need to slide far enough to gain access to the outer mounting screws otherwise those slotted pieces would need to be removed to mount the fence to the table saw fence. When fully open a Philips driver will fit through the end of the slot that just uncovers the screw head. I know there's a learning curve to Sketchup but it's very useful in cases like this and what I used to set the length of the slots. In Sketchup, I moved the slotted pieces to a point that formed an opening that would clear the largest panel bit I thought I'd use and found where the slot needed to be to use that position to access the mounting screws.



mrmagloo said:


> And, on the back of the tall 5-3/16" x 2' x 3/4" piece, are you using pronged Tee Nuts on the back for the 4 face bolts?


Close. Press fit FLUSH MOUNT threaded barrel inserts. McMaster-Carr or similar.



mrmagloo said:


> Lastly, has anyone been able to figure out what GCG was suggesting to avoid the binding? I still don't have any idea what he was recommending?


Just a piece of UHMW or similar threaded for 1/4-20 or whatever sized to fit the TS fence slots to replace the steel nuts that tend to bind to the aluminum extrusion of the TS fence. 



mrmagloo said:


> Thanks.


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## mrmagloo (Jan 3, 2015)

Thanks again GCG. I have everything cut out for the fence and ready to start assembly. The one thing I just noticed is my stock fence sits about 1/8" off the table. Do suggest still aligning against the bottom of the stock fence maintaining that gap, or should I sneak it down so sits closer to the table? I'm leaning towards the latter, but I wanted to see if that gap was needed? If so, what gap should I shoot for? Thanks!


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## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

You'll find that the router fence will shift up and down some. Mine will rub on the table top and cause some drag. I deal with it by placing some thin shims (nothing specific) under the router fence before I tighten it down and then it glides smoothly.


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## mrmagloo (Jan 3, 2015)

Thanks - I was guessing I could make a few small 1/16" shims to maintain a decent gap when adding the router fence. I'm off to see if I can find a countersunk screw slot router bit to do the faces. I hope I can find one locally.

Thanks again for all of the help. This is my first router related product - actually the insert hole was the first time I've ever touched a router, so it's all been a good learning experience. Thanks!


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## smfleis (Jul 8, 2015)

I was wondering if you had plans for the router insert I have the same saw and I'd like The way you have it set up you have a diagram for the aluminum frame you made of appreciate any help you could give me thank you Scott


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## GulfcoastGuy (Feb 27, 2012)

Check post #64. There's a Sketchup file in the downloadable zip attached.


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## smfleis (Jul 8, 2015)

for some reason I cant get sketchuup to open. do you have the plans any other way. thank you scott


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## mrmagloo (Jan 3, 2015)

Imho, you have to try and get the sketch up installed and working. I thought the program was a little complicated and tough to get the dimensions of each part at first, but eventually I got it. Definitely would be much easier to have a numbered part list with the dimensions of each piece but Sketch up does help to figure it out.


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