# Porter cable 7518 In a Table



## Chris Hachet (Dec 25, 2016)

I am assuming the Porter cable 7518 is still the gold standard for an under table mounted router on a lift?

Planning on adding this to my shop, but want to know if there is a better option. Mostly looking for speed control and power to run larger bits. 

Router lift IIRC is Incra, but think it has been a few years since I bought it.


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## RainMan 2.0 (May 6, 2014)

It is to me Chris , just be careful about Stick . He's pro Bosch and has many dislikes about the porter cable . Apparently they use ceramic bearings which burn out prematurely. They can be replaced with better ones though if one likes .
He also mentions distortion problems with the case , none of which I found on either of mine after checking with calipers

Update : Oops , my bad , apparently ceramic good


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

rainman 2.0 said:


> it is to me chris , just be careful about stick . He's pro bosch and has many dislikes about the porter cable . Apparently they use ceramic bearings which burn out prematurely. They can be replaced with better ones though if one likes .
> He also mentions distortion problems with the case , none of which i found on either of mine after checking with calipers


edit your information...


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

http://www.routerforums.com/tools-woodworking/98266-pc-7518-a.html
http://www.routerforums.com/woodworking-classifieds/19441-looking-buy-porter-cable-7518-router.html


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## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

Actually Rick, Stick suggests replacing the stock bearing with Ceramic. I had the bearings on a PC ROM and on a 1/4 sheet pad sander go at the same time and they are some of the cheapest bearings money can buy, If you buy one of them in bulk you get it for about $0.80 each. 

The 7518 at least was the gold standard but I'm sure if it still is. Any lift maker designed their #1 lift to hold that motor and then either made others of different sizes or offered shim rings for other model motors. I would see if you can find recent reviews on that motor and if you have a repair depot close that also handles other brands I would ask them how the 7518 compares.


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## Job and Knock (Dec 18, 2016)

Are P-C 7518s really that bad these days? And if they are, which Bosch model would be a suitable replacement? I'm even wondering if the deWalt DW625 (minus base and legs) could be engineered into a router table lift. It has 2000 watts of power and a high quality collet design (identical to some Festools)


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## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

Eric quite a few of the newer routers have built in lifts like Triton, Bosch, and the Hitachi M12V2 to name a few. You mount them on a plate and drill a hole to access the lift mechanism. On my M12V2 it's a 14 mm nut so I keep a speeder handle with socket on it for adjusting it. There's also the Router Raizer which attaches to plunge routers to lift them. I saw one member who used an automotive scissor jack under the router to lift it. But plunge router motors generally can't be fitted to a conventional lift because you can't separate motor from base, unlike fixed base routers.


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## Chris Hachet (Dec 25, 2016)

Cherryville Chuck said:


> Eric quite a few of the newer routers have built in lifts like Triton, Bosch, and the Hitachi M12V2 to name a few. You mount them on a plate and drill a hole to access the lift mechanism. On my M12V2 it's a 14 mm nut so I keep a speeder handle with socket on it for adjusting it. There's also the Router Raizer which attaches to plunge routers to lift them. I saw one member who used an automotive scissor jack under the router to lift it. But plunge router motors generally can't be fitted to a conventional lift because you can't separate motor from base, unlike fixed base routers.


This is really interesting to me as I knew nothing of this....the pain of being more of a hand tool guy...THANKS! :wink:


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## Chris Hachet (Dec 25, 2016)

Stick486 said:


> http://www.routerforums.com/tools-woodworking/98266-pc-7518-a.html
> http://www.routerforums.com/woodworking-classifieds/19441-looking-buy-porter-cable-7518-router.html


So is there an appropriate Bosch router for a router lift? I am primarily looking for speed control to run larger bits. mainly a hobbyist but my routers seem to see at least weekly use. 

Thanks!

Chris


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

how large of a bit???
1617 or 1619 will work well in a table.........


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

you mentioned FesTool...

.


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## Chris Hachet (Dec 25, 2016)

Stick486 said:


> how large of a bit???
> 1617 or 1619 will work well in a table.........


1 1/2 inch....methinks I might have found my next router in the 1617. And what you said elsewhere about bearings vs bushings with Festool makes perfect sense. 

Do Bosch routers have dust collection similar to Festool? That was the one other thong I liked about the FT routers.


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## RainMan 2.0 (May 6, 2014)

Chris Hachet said:


> 1 1/2 inch....methinks I might have found my next router in the 1617. And what you said elsewhere about bearings vs bushings with Festool makes perfect sense.
> 
> Do Bosch routers have dust collection similar to Festool? That was the one other thong I liked about the FT routers.


https://www.boschtools.com/us/en/boschtools-ocs/dust-extraction-attachments-tool-specific-23478-c/


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## Job and Knock (Dec 18, 2016)

Stick486 said:


> you mentioned FesTool...


Very droll. :wink: There's another thread running elsewhere on the forum where the issue of overstating the "truth" is being discussed. This guy admits to not being a woodworker, then goes on to show his utter ignorance of the subject by amongst other things comparing this saw to a framing saw, negatively. Maybe he's really a journalist?

The net is full of people slating expensive tools, cars, boats, cameras, etc. often out of some sort of perverse inverted snobbery. All I know is that when I got my first plunge/rail saw in the late 1990s I got that attitude a lot. By the time I bought my TS55 6 years ago still got me some (often from older guys who are so set in their way of thinking that they just can't handle stuff like laser levels, laser rangefinders, etc - they are fundamentally scared of technology), but these days I work in environments where about 1 in 6 or 8 carpenters has a rail/plunge saw, often a Festool. When I go to Germany, the Benelux or Francethat figure is nearer 1 in 3 or 4. They can't all be idiots with unreliable kit, can they?


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

all that money for bushings and plastic......
just saying...
there are ways to do the same a helluva lot cheaper...
and w/ good equipment that have bearings and less plastic in the....


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## Job and Knock (Dec 18, 2016)

Chris Hachet said:


> Do Bosch routers have dust collection similar to Festool? That was the one other thong I liked about the FT routers.


Not even close. One of the few routers with DX as good as the Festools is the deWalt DW621/DW622. For table use, though, it shouldn't make a difference because the table extraction system is what counts


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## Job and Knock (Dec 18, 2016)

Stick486 said:


> all that money for bushings and plastic......
> just saying...
> there are ways to do the same a helluva lot cheaper...
> and w/ good equipment that have bearings and less plastic in the....


There are ways - but they are slower, produce a poorer quality of cut, are less accurate, give you back strain because of the weights you lift all day, leave you breathing dust (but, hey, COPD is just another badge of being a woodworker, isn't it?) and leave you with a drty job site which takes longer to clean-up. But they do have better bearings - maybe - if those bearings aren't made in China and need replacing after 12 months. Like my last Milwaukee saw. Or my last Milwaukee recip saw. Or your P-C routers. Just saying......


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

Job and Knock said:


> Not even close. One of the few routers with DX as good as the Festools is the deWalt DW621/DW622. For table use, though, it shouldn't make a difference because the table extraction system is what counts


guess you have not used a Bosch w/ their dust hoods....
nor experienced DW CS...


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

Job and Knock said:


> There are ways - but they are slower, produce a poorer quality of cut, are less accurate, give you back strain because of the weights you lift all day, leave you breathing dust (but, hey, COPD is just another badge of being a woodworker, isn't it?) and leave you with a drty job site which takes longer to clean-up. But they do have better bearings - maybe - if those bearings aren't made in China and need replacing after 12 months. Like my last Milwaukee saw. Or my last Milwaukee recip saw. Or your P-C routers. Just saying......


A thousand dollar saw should do better than bushings...
harbor freight can give you a saw w/ bushings and plastic for 30 bucks....
you feel slighted now you will defend FT to the death...
and I still say they are WAY over priced... they least they can do is give you better for that much money.... 

https://www.boschtools.com/us/en/boschtools-ocs/dust-extraction-attachments-tool-specific-23478-c/



> and need replacing after 12 months. Like my last Milwaukee saw. Or my last Milwaukee recip saw.


not buying into this either...
been using Milwaukee for too many decades in commercial production... still using a second generation Milwaukee reciprocating saw and a 1st generation saw when they went w/ the red bodies...

then there's this PR statement of yours...


> There are ways - but they are slower, produce a poorer quality of cut, are less accurate, give you back strain because of the weights you lift all day, leave you breathing dust (but, hey, COPD is just another badge of being a woodworker, isn't it?) and leave you with a drty job site which takes longer to clean-up. But


..


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## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

Stay polite gentlemen.


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## Chris Hachet (Dec 25, 2016)

Job and Knock said:


> Very droll. :wink: There's another thread running elsewhere on the forum where the issue of overstating the "truth" is being discussed. This guy admits to not being a woodworker, then goes on to show his utter ignorance of the subject by amongst other things comparing this saw to a framing saw, negatively. Maybe he's really a journalist?
> 
> The net is full of people slating expensive tools, cars, boats, cameras, etc. often out of some sort of perverse inverted snobbery. All I know is that when I got my first plunge/rail saw in the late 1990s I got that attitude a lot. By the time I bought my TS55 6 years ago still got me some (often from older guys who are so set in their way of thinking that they just can't handle stuff like laser levels, laser rangefinders, etc - they are fundamentally scared of technology), but these days I work in environments where about 1 in 6 or 8 carpenters has a rail/plunge saw, often a Festool. When I go to Germany, the Benelux or Francethat figure is nearer 1 in 3 or 4. They can't all be idiots with unreliable kit, can they?


We have a lot of cabinet shops around here that run Festool stuff hard and it seldom breaks according to the guys I talk to. 

It could be made of smurf dust and moon rocks, but it does sure seem to perform.


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## Chris Hachet (Dec 25, 2016)

Job and Knock said:


> Not even close. One of the few routers with DX as good as the Festools is the deWalt DW621/DW622. For table use, though, it shouldn't make a difference because the table extraction system is what counts


I was more thinking about for edge routing, as I am going to dedicate my PC 690 twins to dovetailing and flush trimming. 

I am thinking this forum is dangerous, as I bought a 1617EVS on new years day, put it in the table and have been running ti every day since, very pleased. 

Thinking of re-arranging my shop and adding a PC 7815, as I am wanting to build a bunch of passage doors in my shop. 

It is a sad thing when routers become as addictive as hand planes...

Still thinking I would like the smaller of the Festool routers for mortises and edge work-

The FT router has outstanding dust collection, I love the plunge mechanism, and the balance in my hands is the best of any router that I have tested. 

So slowly over the next couple of years I want to add at least two more routers. the 1617 EVS came at the right time because it is $150 cheaper than the PC 7518 and I am needing to build a second work bench. 

As I said in the intro section, I share my shop with a friend of my son who builds guitars and we are frequently doing work at the same time, both using a lot of hand tools. The $150 I did not send to PC will be sent to lee valley for a twin screw 24 inch vise. :smile:


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## Chris Hachet (Dec 25, 2016)

Stick486 said:


> all that money for bushings and plastic......
> just saying...
> there are ways to do the same a helluva lot cheaper...
> and w/ good equipment that have bearings and less plastic in the....


The $150 I just saved will help my woodworking immeasurably this next year. My daughter is moving home after college to pay off some student loans, and wants some new furniture for the room she will be staying in. Every dime counts at this point...


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## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

Chris Hachet said:


> I was more thinking about for edge routing, as I am going to dedicate my PC 690 twins to dovetailing and flush trimming.
> 
> I am thinking this forum is dangerous, as I bought a 1617EVS on new years day, put it in the table and have been running ti every day since, very pleased.
> 
> ...


This forum is very dangerous when it comes to buying tools as we have a lot of members who will gleefully help you spend your tool budget and possibly even some of the money budgeted for other things that wasn't supposed to get spent on tools.

That LV vise is a little pricey but worth every penny. I've had one for maybe 20 years and to quote Charlton Heston, if you tried to take it from me you'd have to pry it out of my cold dead hands. When you add the moveable jaw to it make sure you drill some dog holes in it first.

Generally for edge work work you don't need a lot of power so something as small as a DeWalt 611 will usually be enough and it's nice not to manhandle a big plunge when you do that work. One thing that really helps when doing edge work is an offset base for added stability. When edge routing only maybe 40% of the base is on the board. Quillman makes some beauties that are pretty reasonable for the quality of what you are getting.


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## Chris Hachet (Dec 25, 2016)

Cherryville Chuck said:


> This forum is very dangerous when it comes to buying tools as we have a lot of members who will gleefully help you spend your tool budget and possibly even some of the money budgeted for other things that wasn't supposed to get spent on tools.
> 
> That LV vise is a little pricey but worth every penny. I've had one for maybe 20 years and to quote Charlton Heston, if you tried to take it from me you'd have to pry it out of my cold dead hands. When you add the moveable jaw to it make sure you drill some dog holes in it first.
> 
> Generally for edge work work you don't need a lot of power so something as small as a DeWalt 611 will usually be enough and it's nice not to manhandle a big plunge when you do that work. One thing that really helps when doing edge work is an offset base for added stability. When edge routing only maybe 40% of the base is on the board. Quillman makes some beauties that are pretty reasonable for the quality of what you are getting.


Probably building square dog holes into the bench, I want a more traditional look. Good to have a vote of confidence, it looks like the cats rear end (in a good sort of way) when it comes to actually clamping wood. 

Thinking very much a smaller router would be nice for edge work, even my PC 690 is a little awkward. I have thought about the Dewalt 611 but I am a little on the fence in regards to Dewalt tools. Love the Compound miter saw I have, hate, hate, hate Dewalt drills. 

But yes, in your hands that 611 is one sweet little beast....


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## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

The easiet way to make square holes is to laminate two grooved pieces together. If you make your own wooden dogs cut a 2* bevel on the face. That helps to keep things down instead of popping up as you tighten. Lots of members have the 611 and the reviews and experiences have been good so far. It comes with an offset base and built in work lights. I bought the PK version which is fixed and plunge bases and I like them both. I also have a much older 610 which is a bit bigger in fixed only and it has been a very good router. I have a 3/8 corded drill and several RO sanders, also all good. I've used the 12" SCMS and not a big fan of it. I prefer the Milwaukee I just bought. Bought my son a 14volt DeWalt drill years ago and I think he's still using it but there was a battery or charger recall and that has been an issue with them I think. An employer had the same 3/8 drill I have but with keyless chuck and the chuck is a piece of useless crap. Like most tools winners, losers, good points, and bad points.


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## Chris Hachet (Dec 25, 2016)

Cherryville Chuck said:


> The easiet way to make square holes is to laminate two grooved pieces together. If you make your own wooden dogs cut a 2* bevel on the face. That helps to keep things down instead of popping up as you tighten. Lots of members have the 611 and the reviews and experiences have been good so far. It comes with an offset base and built in work lights. I bought the PK version which is fixed and plunge bases and I like them both. I also have a much older 610 which is a bit bigger in fixed only and it has been a very good router. I have a 3/8 corded drill and several RO sanders, also all good. I've used the 12" SCMS and not a big fan of it. I prefer the Milwaukee I just bought. Bought my son a 14volt DeWalt drill years ago and I think he's still using it but there was a battery or charger recall and that has been an issue with them I think. An employer had the same 3/8 drill I have but with keyless chuck and the chuck is a piece of useless crap. Like most tools winners, losers, good points, and bad points.


Again, good info.....a 611 would save money for hand tools, as I am primarily a hand tool guy. 

Enjoying the Forum!:smile:


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