# Questions: Our Clueless First Experience w/Apollo 1050VR Sprayer



## riffin-rich (Feb 19, 2011)

Hello everyone! So, we broke-out the sprayer yesterday. 

The product: *Insl-X Urethane Acrylic Satin "CabinetCoat" Trim & Cabinet Enamel, White CC-4510*. Using the sprayer booklet: "Thinned latex paint/thick/high-viscosity industrial coatings... - Viscosity Zahn #2 (24-35 seconds) - 2.0mm tip/needle - Air Cap B" ... "That's us!" So, that's what we did. 

Mistake (?): It took 6 parts of water to 7 parts of paint to get the viscosity to 30 seconds until the first break in the stream. Viscosity was like skim milk. So, we gave it a whirl with the 2.0mm tip (as called for in the directions) and it was a drippy mess! Pinholes everywhere ... turned up the pressure and overspray everywhere! Turned the pressure down and opened the paint flow ... problems continued.

So, we put the books aside and re-mixed 5 parts of pure paint with 3 parts of the previous 6:7 mix and tried again with the #2 tip. It was much better given the ratio was _about_ 7 parts paint to _about_ 3 parts water, or 32% dilute). I managed to spray the whole thing with a first coat but the spray was coming out very blotchy with lots of large sputters mixed in with fine droplets and a whole range of sputters ... we had no consistency in the spray. Turning up the pressure resulted in a lot of overspray (very bad since I wasn't wearing a mask for 30 mins and it contained ethylene glycol). But the first coat was done and it looked pretty good.

Today, my buddy put the 1.3mm tip on and laid down a second coat with the same mix. He said it actually sprayed fantastic! He reported that overspray was minimal and he got atomization, even spray droplet sizes, etc.. Though, he did get overspray "blow-back" spraying into the cubby-holes since there's no place for the spray to exit.

So, I clearly I don't understand what's happening here. Why use the Zahn #2 cup to thin a thick latex down to skim-milk-like consistency and then spray with a 2.0 mm tip (following the directions)? It seems that the 2.0 tip is for spraying the heavy consistency paint (perhaps only thinned to 10% dilute). But why even mention the Zahn #2? Once it's thinned for the Zahn cup, it seems like it should spray with a 0.8 to 1.0 mm tip and just require many coats ... no? Also, what product do you use for a nice, painted-on finish? Thanks much! - Rich

Disclaimer: I didn't build this by myself ... my buddy and I did it together. :happy:


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## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

I am no expert with a spray gun but I usually follow the directions on the can which usually says 10-15% thinner. I had never heard of mixing close to 50-50%. Maybe try a test run on something small with the paint at full strength and the 2.0 tip. If it doesn't want to spray try mixing a little thinner in the cup and see what happens. My experience is to follow the directions and then trouble shoot what you see happening until you get it to work.


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## riffin-rich (Feb 19, 2011)

Fair enough Chuck, but again, why even provide a Zahn #2 viscosity cup and give instruction tables to thin the medium to pass through the cup in x to Y seconds? I just don't understand. Maybe, instructions like, "Throw away the Zahn #2 cup, thin by 10% and then use the following tip
- Thick oil-based paints: 2.5mm
- Thick latex paints: 2.0mm
- Polyurethanes: 1.5mm
- Enamels: 1.3mm
- Lacquers: 1.0
- Water: .8mm

I'm not being difficult ... I just don't understand why you use the viscosity cup to thin the material so thin that it's worthless ... ? Thanks, Rich


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi

On my cheap HF HVLP setup I don't every need to thin the paint down many of the paints I use state on the cans say Don't thin down.

$999.99 for this one ▼
April-Catalog2011Web.pdf
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## paduke (Mar 28, 2010)

I follow directions on the materials not the sparay gun. Viscosity varies from manufacturer to manufacturer At least with my minimum experience but the guy who taught me did it that way


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## riffin-rich (Feb 19, 2011)

Fair enough Bob--I think that's our lesson here.

I'm a little frustrated with Apollo right now ... I have a call in to them and they haven't returned my call yet ... today's the 2nd day so I called again ... still no response. What good is "tech support" if they don't answer the phone or call you back? Hmmmm.


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## jschaben (Jun 21, 2009)

Hi Rich - I usually start with little or no thinning then try it out and thin from there until I get the spray I'm looking for. 
I wonder about using the Zahn #2 cup. Seems #2 is usually used on thinner materials than latex paint.
Ask the Expert: Paint and Coating Viscosity Measurements Using a Zahn Cup


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## riffin-rich (Feb 19, 2011)

Thank you John. The link you provided made for an informative read. I've added the bookmark for future reference...

So, now I need to know more about the quality of the finish. I haven't seen it after Rob put the second coat on, but I'm wondering how this product compares (holds-up) to the more hazardous coatings I've read about such as acrylic modified lacquer (CAB-Acrylic) or Catalyzed lacquers. I don't know which is better, but I believe I recall reading that these are very hard and long-wearing finishes. It seems that this is where I'd want to be provided I can spray outdoors without making a terrible overspray mess of my neighbors' houses. ;-)


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