# O rings for routers



## S Bolton (Mar 5, 2007)

Where can someone buy o rings to but in the bottom of a router collet? What size for 1/2 in and 1/4 inch?

Many thanks

Steve Bolton


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## curiousgeorge (Nov 6, 2006)

Steve check out this link:
http://www.routerforums.com/table-mounted-routing/4385-setting-router-collet.html

I got this by doing a search on o-rings.


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## dadsalmon (Sep 26, 2004)

I guess I can't see the need. Bob says put the bit to the bottom and pull a sixteenth inch. Good enuf for me! Rich


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## challagan (Feb 7, 2006)

dadsalmon said:


> I guess I can't see the need. Bob says put the bit to the bottom and pull a sixteenth inch. Good enuf for me! Rich


Rich, I do the same thing but I have had them slip down to the bottom while tightening the collet nut when I didn't know it. Also with some matched sets of bits like tounge and groove, rail and stile etc. you retain the matched set characteristics when you bottom both out on the o-ring. No guess work. 

Corey


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## Mike (Nov 22, 2004)

The O-ring should fit snuggly into the shaft hole. The diameter of the ring material should be 3/16-1/8". The reason for this is proper spacing that is automatic. You insert the bit till it touches the O-ring and stops. The O-ring allows the collet to compress normally for a secure fit each and every time. By using the O-ring method you eliminate the possibility of the bit shifting too far into the shaft which causes a loose grip on the bit. It is also much easier to have the bit resting on the O-ring and tighten it in place, no guess work involved.


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## harrysin (Jan 15, 2007)

Steve, as you probably know, I've been using routers for a very long time and just cannot understand why anyone would want or need to poke foreign objects into the collet, some routers like the Triton take the cutter all the way in, the rest, fully insert then pull out slightly, the amount is not critical. Just in case you don't believe me, places that sell bearings normally sell "O" rings.


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## del schisler (Feb 2, 2006)

home depot has a selection of O rings in the plumbing isle Mite find what you need del


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi Harry

It took you a long time for you to get me to try the skis, right ...

I would like you to try something for me...

Put in a O-Ring in place now chuck up one part of the T & G bit, now make a pass , now take the bit out and switch the cutters out , then put the bit back in the router now make the next pass...but be sure the bit is in and on the O-ring... now take the board to the saw and rip it into two parts, then set in on the work bench,,,both parts of the T & G will line up right on the button will almost no sanding needed to finish the job...

Now put your R & S bit set out and do the same thing.. the set should be the pair type (matched set ) but it can be just the one bit type but the washers and shims must be but back in the same order..

The parts will line up right on the button, many router bits come in pairs or need to be taken down to use both cutters setup ...

And as you know.001 is a big deal when you want to line the two parts up for glueing and doing it by eye just can't be done over and over the same way.

Like you I have been using the router for a long time and I could not see why any one would put rods in the base of the router and hang sticks out for skis then some guy said try it, you will like it and I'm saying the same thing try it you will get it and like it ... 


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harrysin said:


> Steve, as you probably know, I've been using routers for a very long time and just cannot understand why anyone would want or need to poke foreign objects into the collet, some routers like the Triton take the cutter all the way in, the rest, fully insert then pull out slightly, the amount is not critical. Just in case you don't believe me, places that sell bearings normally sell "O" rings.


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## dadsalmon (Sep 26, 2004)

Harry that is also my feeling. This operation is only to reduce the amount of the heat transmitted from the motor to the bit. I tighten bits with the router on its side. after finger tightening the collet, just as you see Bob do on the RWS. As far as using the oring as a height positioner for interchanging bits to attain the same height as in cope and bead bits or T & G, maybe I'm missing something, but I have a plunge router. and what insures that it is set at the same height? Not having a digital height adjuster kinda precludes any implied accuracy. I feel test cuts are the best way to verify the settings. The stacked bit for cope and bead from OP requires height adjustment and testing.


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## Mike (Nov 22, 2004)

The facts are this has nothing to do with heat. This is a method which allows you to rapidly set the bit to the same height each and every time. This is the same as some models of routers which provide an insert stick for proper bit positioning when table mounted. The fixed base or plunge mechanism has nothing to do with the way the bit is set inside the shaft. The bit shank always goes into the shaft the same distance which is very useful when working with matched cutter sets. Of course you still verify by eye or with a test cut. This method is simply an improvement over setting by guesswork. Nobody should feel obligation to use this method. This is for people who are looking to reduce adjustments and speed bit changes.


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi dadsalmon

Just a note about the OP cope and bead bit,,, 

They no longer offer that one for sale,, and this could be why.

I love router bits and have MANY of them ,out of all the bits I have I dislike that one bit the most, it will make more firewood than any other bit I have ,,, 

It's a real pain to get the 2nd. cut setup and to come out right
or to say get the bit setup right for the bead pass...


The O-Rings/faucet washers are not use in the plunge router the norm because they don't come into play...only use in the router table setup ....but if they are in place the will not hinder the bits that are going to be used..

Hope this helps 
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dadsalmon said:


> Harry that is also my feeling. This operation is only to reduce the amount of the heat transmitted from the motor to the bit. I tighten bits with the router on its side. after finger tightening the collet, just as you see Bob do on the RWS. As far as using the oring as a height positioner for interchanging bits to attain the same height as in cope and bead bits or T & G, maybe I'm missing something, but I have a plunge router. and what insures that it is set at the same height? Not having a digital height adjuster kinda precludes any implied accuracy. I feel test cuts are the best way to verify the settings. The stacked bit for cope and bead from OP requires height adjustment and testing.


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## harrysin (Jan 15, 2007)

Bj., I can't do as you ask because I now have A Triton router permanently in the table and Triton say put the cutter ALL the way in. On the previous table mounted Makita, a plastic spacer was supplied on to which the cutter was dropped. When short cutters were used with the Makita, which required two spanners, and I only have two hands, I simply had an "O" ring on the shaft. I doubt that I would ever rely on a cutter ending up in an identical position whatever method is used, test cuts in my usual humble opinion are the way to go.


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi Harry

I looked in my router manuals and I can't find anything on insert two 3 ft. rods in the holes for the edge fence... ... 


The grommet/ faucet washer goes in the bottom of the collet nut NOT in the bottom of the arbor shaft...Triton router will work well for this type of setup.

The faucet washer works the best for this type of job because it will stay in place...it's only 1/8" thick...


Unlike the O-ring that will slip down or up when the bit is put in place...


You sound like me ,, Skis, I don;t need not stinkin skis and they can't work as well as the router table,, do you recall that ??? LOL LOL LOL


Get a faucet washer and press into to place and try it... 

Then tell me what you think 

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harrysin said:


> Bj., I can't do as you ask because I now have A Triton router permanently in the table and Triton say put the cutter ALL the way in. On the previous table mounted Makita, a plastic spacer was supplied on to which the cutter was dropped. When short cutters were used with the Makita, which required two spanners, and I only have two hands, I simply had an "O" ring on the shaft. I doubt that I would ever rely on a cutter ending up in an identical position whatever method is used, test cuts in my usual humble opinion are the way to go.


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## dadsalmon (Sep 26, 2004)

Ah, well, we have the no oringers and the oringers, to each his own, but mainly it's about having fun!


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi dadsalmon

Right on , have fun 


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dadsalmon said:


> Ah, well, we have the no oringers and the oringers, to each his own, but mainly it's about having fun!


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## dadsalmon (Sep 26, 2004)

06-10-2006, 12:14 PM #2 
Hamlin 
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Hello Artedna, one usually puts an "o" ring in the arbor to keep the bit from "bottoming out". This prevents heat build up on the bit itself. 
Some router collets are designed that way others could be an issue with the collet itself. Need a bit more info... router make, model??
__________________
Ken

This may be why I was misled about the heat factor. Rich


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## harrysin (Jan 15, 2007)

"The grommet/ faucet washer goes in the bottom of the collet nut NOT in the bottom of the arbor shaft."

How about a drawing Bj. once again I appear to be missing the point. But doesn't it make getting out of bed in the morning so much easier when there is the forum to peruse.


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi Harry

How about a snapshot ,see below

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http://www.routerforums.com/attachments/router-bits-types-usage/9363-bit-setup-rubber-washers.jpg
http://wealdentool.com/acatalog/tips_1.html

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harrysin said:


> "The grommet/ faucet washer goes in the bottom of the collet nut NOT in the bottom of the arbor shaft."
> 
> How about a drawing Bj. once again I appear to be missing the point. But doesn't it make getting out of bed in the morning so much easier when there is the forum to peruse.


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## Hamlin (Dec 25, 2005)

Hi Harry, on my two Makita 3612C's, I didn't receive any plastic insert. Nor do I have the two wrench system with either one.

With mine, you won't be putting in a "O-ring" simply due to the fact the arbor is hollowed much deeper than the shaft of the bits. The only "bottoming out" would be from the under side of the bit hitting the top side of the collet. Since I'm also using plunge routers, there is no need for such a setup.

Now, IMHO, the "O-ring", the following is taking directly from the RWS site...


> Never “bottom out” the router bit. When installing the bit pull it up slightly so that there is approximately 1/8” between the bottom of the bit and the router collet. This prevents heat transfer.





> Rich, I do the same thing but I have had them slip down to the bottom while tightening the collet nut when I didn't know it. Also with some matched sets of bits like tounge and groove, rail and stile etc. you retain the matched set characteristics when you bottom both out on the o-ring. No guess work.


Now, if you wish to believe that is has nothig to do with heat transfer, then there is a contradiction in terms between here (the forums), and the RWS site. http://www.routerworkshop.com/routerbits.html

With this being said, I'm done and I quit!


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## harrysin (Jan 15, 2007)

Hamlin said:


> Hi Harry, on my two Makita 3612C's, I didn't receive any plastic insert. Nor do I have the two wrench system with either one.
> 
> With mine, you won't be putting in a "O-ring" simply due to the fact the arbor is hollowed much deeper than the shaft of the bits. The only "bottoming out" would be from the under side of the bit hitting the top side of the collet. Since I'm also using plunge routers, there is no need for such a setup.
> 
> ...


I haven't ever used the 3612C in the table, prior to the Triton I used a Makita 3600BR which, unlike the 3612C uses two spanners. So far I haven't said a word about heat transfer, but as it has been brought up, consider, the surface area of the cutter end is a fraction of the total area in contact with the cutter, so I have difficulty in appreciating that it could make any appreciable difference to the temperature. As they say, that's just MY 2cents worth.


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## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi Guys

Heat transfer,,,no way to stop it in a wood working router,the bit can be all the way to the bottom or just off the bottom ,,,or sitting on a rubber washer/O-Ring the only way to stop heat transfer is to cool the bit down with some type of lub running on the bit or very cool air blast...  metal is metal and the heat will always transfer to the other parts.
Friction = heat,,, in all the ways you can think of...the absence of friction = Cold
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Friction

...
Lifting the bit off the bottom , this is to let the collet grab the bit and when you crank it down the bit will move down just a little bit, the collet needs the room ,the rubber O-Ring/washer works the same way, it lets the collet work like it should,it will compress just a little bit so the collet can hang on to the bit.

If you look at many of the collets you will see a small band of steel at the base of the collet this is put in place to keep the collet the right size ( ID ) some don't have this band they use the collet morse taper to keep the bit in shape or to say the right size.
If you over tighten this type you can damage the collet if the bit is not in place at that time..(crack the collet nut) 


Just my 2 cents 

====


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