# Need a router w/ accurate and easy height adjustment in table use.



## WoodTroll (Jun 5, 2008)

Hi, new to wood working and have been looking for a router. Primary use will be in a Wolfcraft 630 folding router table for blind-inside cuts requiring 3-5 passes w/ an increase in height of 1/8" per pass. Of secondary and third importance is the vacuum possibilities and noise level of the router. I have a shop vac and the 630 table has a dust port but can better vacuuming be achieved when attached at the sametime to both the router and the table? And a lower noise level would be nice.

So far I have considered the following routers:
Bosch 1619EVS - my table manual says it will accomdate routers w/ bases up to 7" and this behemoths base is at 7.5" otherwise I would already own it.
Bosch 1617EVSPK - higher expense initially, possibly the best performer out of the combos, wood grips are questionable.
Craftsman 17543 - low expense initially, accessory needs should be covered, only a 1 year warranty and then who fixes Craftsman routers??
Hitachi KM12VC - low expense initially, 5 year warranty, location of origin questionable.
Porter-Cable 694LRVK - higher expense initially, accessory needs are covered, least HP out of the combos.
With the exception of the 1619, the height adjustment is questionable on all of them since I've found at least 2 user reviews each across the net where the accuracy and/or ease of the height adjustment was the focus of a complaint.

While I have a specific use now, I'm assuming all of these routers can handle beginner through intermediate wood working projects with soft and hard wood. Currently I'm down to either the Craftsman or Hitachi and will probably go with the Hitachi because a Router Raizer is available for it should the height adjustment not work out.

Thanks!


----------



## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi WoodTroll

This just my 2 cents..

Knowing what I know now I would put my money into the Craftsman 17543 combo ,,you can get a 5 year tool top warr. that will cover the tool for a full 5 years...

Sears is all over the place ,so if you run into a error with the tool, it will be easy to have them take care of it...

If the bottom line is holding you back the 110.oo dollars for the Craftsman is the one to select..

It comes with all the items you want and have posted, plus lights on the base..if you play it right you can get it for about 95.oo dollars + the warr.charge...that should be around 25.oo dollars..

Good luck with yor quest..

===========


----------



## Hamlin (Dec 25, 2005)

Hi,

Too add to what Bj said, most craftsman routers also have an above table adjustment feature. This of course pending on what type of plate you have it mounted to for in-table use.


----------



## WoodTroll (Jun 5, 2008)

Hi bobj3, thanks for your response and your previous posts regarding the craftsman router on this site. Whats your experience with the height adjustment of the Hitachi and Craftsman?



bobj3 said:


> Knowing what I know now I would put my money into the Craftsman 17543 combo


 What do you know; something about Craftsman vs Hitachi?



bobj3 said:


> Sears is all over the place ,so if you run into a error with the tool, it will be easy to have them take care of it...


 For me, Sears and Hitachi are even on this point as I'm in LA and there's five Hitachi authorized service centers around I'd be willing to drive to.



bobj3 said:


> If the bottom line is holding you back the 110.oo dollars for the Craftsman is the one to select..


 The Hitachi is down to $129 delivered so the price gap is closer than it was last year when there was posts on the subject.



bobj3 said:


> the warr.charge...that should be around 25.oo dollars..


 I see the different levels of Sears protection plans at their site but no mention of price. Hard to believe the top of the line Master Protection plan would only be $25. I'll give them a call.

WoodTroll


----------



## WoodTroll (Jun 5, 2008)

Hamlin said:


> most craftsman routers also have an above table adjustment feature. This of course pending on what type of plate you have it mounted to for in-table use.


Hi Hamlin, thanks for bringing that up. According to my table manual there is a list of compatible router models and the hole pattern to use on the included adapter plate. The 17543 is not listed but the Porter-Cable 690 and 890 series are listed and I figure I could return it if it doesn't match up. The adapter plate that mounts to the router base plate has three molded tabs 120 degrees apart that slide into a quick lock system under the table. There's no holes in the table to directly attach the router so the routers weight is basically hanging by the three tabs of the adapter, wow that sucks. I may not even need a router w/ an accurate heigh adjustment if the plate flexes from the weight.


----------



## Hamlin (Dec 25, 2005)

WoodTroll said:


> Hi Hamlin, thanks for bringing that up. According to my table manual there is a list of compatible router models and the hole pattern to use on the included adapter plate. The 17543 is not listed but the Porter-Cable 690 and 890 series are listed and I figure I could return it if it doesn't match up. The adapter plate that mounts to the router base plate has three molded tabs 120 degrees apart that slide into a quick lock system under the table. There's no holes in the table to directly attach the router so the routers weight is basically hanging by the three tabs of the adapter, wow that sucks. I may not even need a router w/ an accurate heigh adjustment if the plate flexes from the weight.


Hi WoodTroll,

Again, this matters on what plate you're going to use. However, I should point out, you would already have a template for drilling a hole for that adjustment. Use the base plate on the router as your template. I do agree with Bj about the craftsman, I have this particular model as well. It's well worth it's price. 

I'm not familar with other plates nor routers, (I have 2 craftsman and 2 Makita routers), because, I use the OP table and plates. These plates are quite sturdy, no flex. I don't wish nor mean to 'saude you from your current table but, I'd recommend taking the time and build yourself a new table.

Just my $0.02 worth.


----------



## Mike (Nov 22, 2004)

Lets spend a minute to clarify a couple things so we are all on the same sheet of music. As BJ mentioned the Craftsman is an excellent value with many nice features. At the price it is a real value for your money. Sears has been building and selling inexpensive power tools for home owners for a long time and this new router is by far the best to date. The key phrase mentioned is home owners. There is a difference between home owners and commercial in the quality of the construction. The Hitachi is the value leader for commercial routers. Both of these are styled after the long lived Bosch 1617 combo kit. The Bosch is industrial quality and designed for heavy duty extended use. When you have these routers in your hands you will notice a difference in the feel of the controls. Most staff members own Bosch, and Bosch is consistently top rated in all magazine testing. There are two schools of thought, one is "Use it up and throw it away" and the other is "spend a bit more up front and have one that will last." Extended warranties are a way of increasing profits on a sale and seldom provide you with real value. By the time you add the cost of an extended warranty there is little difference in price between the Craftsman and the Bosch. Routers are the least expensive part of routing, your real expense will be in bits. My first router was a Craftsman. When I got serious about routing my choice was to go with the quality router since I use my router a great deal. Many members will not use their router as much and this is where the Craftsman becomes a real value. There is no "wrong way" in deciding on a router, they will all turn the bits. Decide which features and quality level is right for you. And by all means put your hands on the model before you spend any money on it.


----------



## jer760 (Nov 17, 2007)

Have you per chance had a look at Triton's routers? I have the Sears model discussed here for hand held ops and love it, for my table it's the Triton all the way. Customer service is second to none and the innovative features such as the above table bit change leave me as satisfied with a tool purchase as I can be. Cheers.


----------



## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi WoodTroll


I have the Triton 2 1/4HP ,Craftsman 2 1/4HP (2ea.) and the 3 1/4HP Hitachi and out of the 3, I like the Craftsman the best.. 

I have all 3 setup to be used in the router tables or as a hand plunge router.

" height adjustment" on the Craftsman is a easy one to use and setup,they don't say a word about in the manual but all that's needed is a SMALL hole for a tee handle Allen key to slip into router table base plate...
You can also make your own with some hex stock and bend it over into a L shape and then put a knob on it you want...but the Tee handle works well.

The Hitachi has a router razer on it and it works very well in the router table...

" Protection plan " is base on the price of the tool....and the time of the warr. I have one for my Sears CarveWright machine and it was right at 265.oo if I recall that right...( I paid 2500.oo for that one) 

" 
The Hitachi is down to $129 delivered" but what comes with it ?

================


WoodTroll said:


> Hi bobj3, thanks for your response and your previous posts regarding the craftsman router on this site. Whats your experience with the height adjustment of the Hitachi and Craftsman?
> 
> What do you know; something about Craftsman vs Hitachi?
> 
> ...


----------



## WoodTroll (Jun 5, 2008)

Hi Jer, I can see you're happy with it from old posts. What did you end up doing with the Hitachi from ebay and have you learned to use all four routers? The only Triton dealer within reasonable distance is the nearest Rockler and I've never seen a router on display to try there. And being a dealer doesn't mean they'll help with any warranty/repair issues. What is the base size of their two models; couldn't find the size at the Triton website or in the pdfs. Their manual is top notch, lots of features like the handle lock from Dewalt, and included accessories so everything I'm seeing is telling me "beware of sticker shock."


----------



## WoodTroll (Jun 5, 2008)

bobj3 said:


> " height adjustment" on the Craftsman is a easy one to use and setup,they don't say a word about in the manual but all that's needed is a SMALL hole for a tee handle Allen key to slip into router table base plate...
> You can also make your own with some hex stock and bend it over into a L shape and then put a knob on it you want...but the Tee handle works well.


 Yes that caught my attention from an old post and I even bookmarked the harbor freight link you provided for a tee handle set! But I think a user review or two at Sears mentioned something about motor slip. Sounds like no one here has that issue.



bobj3 said:


> The Hitachi has a router razer on it and it works very well in the router table...


 You installed the router raizer right? That item has perfect reviews so I figured it's worth the money, however, adding that to the Hitachi KM12VC and I'm up around the Bosch 1617EVSPK.



bobj3 said:


> The Hitachi is down to $129 delivered" but what comes with it ?


 A squirt more of HP, low speed down to 8,000 for larger bit and harder wood use, template guide adapter, centering gauge. Sears website is down at the moment but I think the 17543 lacks the template guide adapter and centering gauge but includes a straight edge guide.

So bobj3, how long do you think Sears will keep the 17543 before it's discontinued? Even if Sears is happy with the line, they're still at the mercy of who's making it for them. And I think Mike was talking about the Craftsman as use it up and throw it away which was one of my concerns sorta. I typically prefer having an item that I can order a part for and do the repair myself unless it's too difficult, too risky, requires special tools, etc..

Thanks!


----------



## RustyW (Dec 28, 2005)

WoodTroll said:


> So far I have considered the following routers:
> Bosch 1619EVS - my table manual says it will accomdate routers w/ bases up to 7" and this behemoths base is at 7.5" otherwise I would already own it.
> Bosch 1617EVSPK - higher expense initially, possibly the best performer out of the combos, wood grips are questionable.
> Craftsman 17543 - low expense initially, accessory needs should be covered, only a 1 year warranty and then who fixes Craftsman routers??
> ...


Hello WoodTroll,

The Bosch 1619 would be a great choice if you already had others and just wanted one to stick in the table. If your here very long you will end up building a few tables and buying several more routers(check the fine print its in the rules somewhere). I have a Hitachi M12v2 that I pulled the springs and stuck in a table before turning the power on. The 3+ hp plunge routers are great for tables because the lift is kind of built in.

Bosch 1617EVSPK, I have the Craftsman 26620, which is the Bosch made clone of the 1617. Sears discontinued it and was selling them out for about $100. Doubt they have any left, but its a great router. Not sure what issue you would have with the wood handles. Most of the time you will have that base in the table and use the plunge base for handheld. The fixed base does allow through table height adjustment with a supplied allen wrench.

Craftsman 17543, I don't own one, but my dad bought one for the table I gave him. I did play with it a bit and mounted it to the table plate for him. Seems to be a very good router and has a similar height adjustment to the Bosch. Bj has mentioned bending an allen wrench, but the new one came with a T-handle allen (might be something they added recently). For around $100 this would be hard to beat for a 1st,2nd,or 10th router.

Hitachi KM12VC, I had the SC (single speed version). Used it for quite awhile and was then given a Bosch 1613EVS, bought a Colt,and bought the 26620. The Hitachi was a very functional,reliable router, but it really paled in comparison to the Bosch models in the way things fit and adjusted. It did however fit the same holes as a PC690 so it should fit your table.

Porter Cable 694LRVK, Again I had the single speed version. These are great routers but you'll want more power in a table. Aside from the 1/2" collet, the Bosch Colt I have now will do everything it will do.

As far as accessories, other than maybe template guides, you'll find ways here to make just about anything else you need(I think Bj has made some guides). Such as,circle cutters,edge guides,skis,tables,sub bases,etc. Hope this helps.


----------



## RustyW (Dec 28, 2005)

I forgot to mention that height adjustment on the Hitachi KM12VC/SC is the same as a PC 690 series. In that the motor spins in the fixed base to adjust depth. So thru table adjustment is not possible without an after market lift.


----------



## WoodTroll (Jun 5, 2008)

Hi RustyW and thanks a bunch, your post really fired on all cylinders (was that baad?) I came across reviews saying the wood handles led to losing their grip but as you said I would use the plunge more for handheld use. I have a book partially on routers that stated concern about using a fixed base outside a table. You're right about the KM12VC fitting my table, it's listed as using the D hole pattern on the supplied adapter base plate. You sure the 1617 has an above table height adjustment using an allen wrench; I would have to purchase Bosch RA1165 Under-Table Router Base w/ Above Table Hex key? And do you think Bj would share his guides?


----------



## RustyW (Dec 28, 2005)

Went out and took a quick pic of the base that came with the Craftsman 26620(on kitchen table)with wrench that came with it. Other pic is one I found on the web of the Bosch 1165 base. I'm almost positive that this base comes with the new models and is available as an accessory to owners of older 1617 models.


----------



## bobj3 (Jan 17, 2006)

Hi WoodTroll

" And do you think Bj would share his guides? "

You bet ,, Free for ALL , just click on the Gallery item of the left side of any post I have made..

You will see " Attachments Posted by bobj3 " 3,850 of them not all jigs but many of them are..  or just a snapshot of them..it can take a bit of time to view them all but sometimes you can use the search tool to find items you want to check out..

Free for all.. 

==========


----------



## WoodTroll (Jun 5, 2008)

RustyW said:


> Went out and took a quick pic of the base that came with the Craftsman 26620(on kitchen table)with wrench that came with it. Other pic is one I found on the web of the Bosch 1165 base. I'm almost positive that this base comes with the new models and is available as an accessory to owners of older 1617 models.


Thanks RustyW! You're right, that under the table base is now included with the 2.25HP combo version. I like Bosch and own one of their hammer drills. Originally I had considered the price of that base on top of the combo but now I'll have to reconsider! What's the size of the base, no larger than 7" I hope? I've been on the phone with Wolfcraft (no wait to speak with their friendly customer service) and they will be sending me a blank adapter base plate free of charge.


----------



## WoodTroll (Jun 5, 2008)

Bobj3, already taking a gander, thanks!


----------



## Mike (Nov 22, 2004)

The Bosch 1617 is so easy to adjust under the table there is really no need for an above the table adjustment, but the new models have it anyways. The first thing to know is two screws and those wooden handles come off the fixed base for table mounting; this makes it even easier to pop the router in and out of the table. I have a pair of 1617's with one in my table full time and the other in the plunge base. I own other routers but these are my favorites. The 1617's 20 year old design has been copied by most brands but none have improved on it.


----------



## WoodTroll (Jun 5, 2008)

I'll have to take a look at the 1617EVSPK and 17543 up close as well as make sure the 1617 fits my table. And if I go with the 1617 I was considering a reconditioned one from cpotools.


----------



## Mike (Nov 22, 2004)

Bosch factory reconditioned tools are a good buy. I have spent time at the service center and have seen the process, they are very thorough. My second 1617 motor was one of these units. As far as fitting your table, the worst case is you will need to drill new mounting holes. This is simple using the sub base plate as a template for location.


----------



## WoodTroll (Jun 5, 2008)

Correction from a previous post. The 1617EVSPK comes with fixed base #RA1161 and not router table base #RA1165. Although both have an above table adjustment for bit height.


----------



## jer760 (Nov 17, 2007)

WoodTroll said:


> Hi Jer, I can see you're happy with it from old posts. What did you end up doing with the Hitachi from ebay and have you learned to use all four routers? The only Triton dealer within reasonable distance is the nearest Rockler and I've never seen a router on display to try there. And being a dealer doesn't mean they'll help with any warranty/repair issues. What is the base size of their two models; couldn't find the size at the Triton website or in the pdfs. Their manual is top notch, lots of features like the handle lock from Dewalt, and included accessories so everything I'm seeing is telling me "beware of sticker shock."


Geez, sorry I missed this post. If it's still pertinent info the base models are 2.25 hp and 3.5 hp. The dealer probably is not going help with the warranty/repair issues but Triton themselves will. Call their toll free number and chat with them. Btw, while speaking to them you could also inquire about their factory reconditioned models as well, my brother bought the same model as I did in this fashion and saved a bundle.
Still have the Hatachi and I'm planning a portable router table that I will mount it in. As for learning to use them, let's just say I'm much further ahead than I was a year ago. Cheers.


----------



## WoodTroll (Jun 5, 2008)

Visited Sears today. Not at all impressed with their floor people, but I expected that going in. Took a look at their line of routers up close. Like it's been posted before, the 17543 combos plunge base action is so smooth; I can't imagine anything smoother. And if there is smoother action I doubt I'd be able to feel the difference. Tried their other plunge routers, not smooth. Spoke with a department supervisor and the power tool floorman to get the warranty info nailed down. Only one year extension warranty(2 years total) is available for $16.50 and since the item is an inexpensive power tool, the warranty calls for immediate replacement instead of repairing. The bit height adjustment on the fixed base is easy to use, smooth, and should not slip once the base buckle(similar to a ski boot buckle) is closed. I had expected routers to be large bulky power tools but the entire Sears line was smaller and not unwielding. However, no power was going through the models. The rubber grips of the 17543 felt great and I like the rubber boot sealed power switch. Next stop will be lowes for a gander at the Bosch 1617EVSPK or Boschs closest model equivalent.


----------



## hd98sport (Mar 3, 2011)

RustyW said:


> Went out and took a quick pic of the base that came with the Craftsman 26620(on kitchen table)with wrench that came with it. Other pic is one I found on the web of the Bosch 1165 base. I'm almost positive that this base comes with the new models and is available as an accessory to owners of older 1617 models.


Thanks for the PICs! I have been online researching table top adjustable routers then came across this post. I went down and looked ay my Craftsman 17543 router base and low and behold, there is a hole in the base! Made a quick hole im my plate and tried it out. (Will get the 5mm T-wrench tomorrow.) I see I still have to reach under the table to loosen the clamp enough to get the router to move up or down but my design allowed for that.  I should post some pics of my table/cabinet setup. It's da-bomb for dust collection! By the way, the 17543 not a bad router set for under $100.00.


----------



## Gearhead1 (Aug 30, 2010)

Art,

Please do post some pictures. I ;ove dust collection! 

Thanx,

Bruce


----------



## KenBee (Jan 1, 2011)

I have a Milwaukee 5615-20 VS(10,000-24,000 RPM), 2 1/4 HP in my table and I can't help but think the settings from table top are just as precise, if not more so as any router on the market. In fact after using it for a couple of projects I wouldn't even consider wasting money on a riser. I use a height gauge to make my settings and once you dial it in and lock it down it does not move one iota.

The one disadvantage I found with it was changing bits while in the table, but I cured that by raising the router as far as possible and using a 1 1/8" offset wrench for the bottom nut and the supplied wrench to loosen the collet. No pain, no strain. By the way the offset wrench is actually a Porter Cable wrench, but as I said, it will work with the Milwaukee.

Just my humble opinion.


----------

