# Help with Incra Jig through Dovetails



## abbedo (Nov 28, 2008)

I need someone that has been successful in using the Incra jig to make through dovetails. If some one would describe step by step (and I mean at the Sesame street level) of how to go about this. I have made very good blind dovetails, so there is some hope, I hope. I made the initial mistake of making the stock 3/8", finding the right depth of cut for a good fit, which was less than the thickness of the stock and thought I was good to go, however rereading the instructions showed me the errors of my ways. Please help an old man of 70 to accomplish this.

Regards,
Don


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## old55 (Aug 11, 2013)

Hello Don, I can't help you with your inquiry but am sure someone with experience will be able to help.


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## jw2170 (Jan 24, 2008)

Hello Don, what model jig do you have?

Some jigs are only designed for half blind dovetails, I believe.


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## Gene Howe (Jul 10, 2007)

Sorry, Don. I'd love to help but, I'm 5 years beyond helping. And worse, I don't use an Incra dovetail machine.:no:

Actually, I've found that Incra will go out of their way to help any of their customers, regardless of age.
I had a bit of difficulty with their IBox (my own stupidity) and they resolved it quickly and efficiently with one phone call. Didn't laugh at me either.


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## timbertailor (Oct 4, 2009)

I will take a stab.

It sounds like you have the manual. (Page 8 in mine). Which template did you want to use with your 3/8" stock?

What exactly are you having problems with? Tight or loose fit?


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## Jerry Bowen (Jun 25, 2011)

Hi


Duncanrouter said:


> I need someone that has been successful in using the Incra jig to make through dovetails. If some one would describe step by step (and I mean at the Sesame street level) of how to go about this. I have made very good blind dovetails, so there is some hope, I hope. I made the initial mistake of making the stock 3/8", finding the right depth of cut for a good fit, which was less than the thickness of the stock and thought I was good to go, however rereading the instructions showed me the errors of my ways. Please help an old man of 70 to accomplish this.
> 
> Regards,
> Don


Hi Don,

Maybe this old man off 77 can be of help, I have had excellent results cutting throught dovetails with the Incra jig. I will try to help, but I first need to know what is not working for you, will be watching for your answer.

Jerry


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## suds (Aug 25, 2008)

I know there is a 3 part demo on doing dovetails on YouTube but I don't recall (I'm 71) if it gets into real detailed procedures.


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## abbedo (Nov 28, 2008)

Jerry Bowen said:


> Hi
> 
> Hi Don,
> 
> ...


Many thanks Jerry for responding and to others that have offered assistance. My main issue was that I was trying to use DOVH to make a through dovetail in 3/8" stock. I had made the depth of cut test and had my router bit height set to a little more that 1/4", which yielded a really good fit. At this point I had not realized that the depth of cut was dictating the stock thickness I was limited to. Once I had the cuts made and tried to join them I realized that the tails were not long enough to fit the 3/8" stock I was using. I kept thinking I was doing something wrong with the process of cutting these dovetails. After sitting and staring at this unwanted result I realized that to use 3/8" stock I was going to have to hunt for a template that allowed use of the stock I had. I had just finished making halfblind dovetails were the depth of cut was not as important as it was for the through dovetails. I was really making good half blind dovetails. Well now the problem is solved for making dovetails using 3/8" stock. Since I have your attention Jerry and others, I am having a bit of a problem with these through dovetails in that the fit I get leaves me having to coerce joining these pins and tails with help from a mallet. Because I get a fit that does not seem to be a push fit I wind up having some battered pins and tail. Jerry, did you experience in your early efforts this type of problem with fit and how did you solve it. It just seems that so many little things can go awry in using the Incra jig (Ultra). Any thoughts on the matter would be much appreciated.

Regards,
Don


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## Jerry Bowen (Jun 25, 2011)

Duncanrouter said:


> Many thanks Jerry for responding and to others that have offered assistance. My main issue was that I was trying to use DOVH to make a through dovetail in 3/8" stock. I had made the depth of cut test and had my router bit height set to a little more that 1/4", which yielded a really good fit. At this point I had not realized that the depth of cut was dictating the stock thickness I was limited to. Once I had the cuts made and tried to join them I realized that the tails were not long enough to fit the 3/8" stock I was using. I kept thinking I was doing something wrong with the process of cutting these dovetails. After sitting and staring at this unwanted result I realized that to use 3/8" stock I was going to have to hunt for a template that allowed use of the stock I had. I had just finished making halfblind dovetails were the depth of cut was not as important as it was for the through dovetails. I was really making good half blind dovetails. Well now the problem is solved for making dovetails using 3/8" stock. Since I have your attention Jerry and others, I am having a bit of a problem with these through dovetails in that the fit I get leaves me having to coerce joining these pins and tails with help from a mallet. Because I get a fit that does not seem to be a push fit I wind up having some battered pins and tail. Jerry, did you experience in your early efforts this type of problem with fit and how did you solve it. It just seems that so many little things can go awry in using the Incra jig (Ultra). Any thoughts on the matter would be much appreciated.
> 
> Regards,
> Don


O,K. Don,

From what you are saying now, you can, with a mallet, drive the pins and tails together. It that is your only problem for the moment, it is an easy fix. Let's fix that first and then if you still are still having problems we can address them later so here goes.

obviously the pins are to narrow or the tails are to wide. All that is needed is to widen the pins just a tad so that the tails can fit, right. 

Yes I had this problem when I started, so here is what I did to solve it. After making a cut through with the bit to cut out the pin for the tail to fit into, I kept the workpieces be cut clamped up tight just like they were during the cut, and then advanced fence by five clicks, .005", make another pass over the bit, then I moved fence rearward ten clicks, .010", and make a third pass over the bit, then forward five clicks back to where I had started. This widened the cut by .010", but kept the bit in it's starting position before advancing to the next cut. I went through this drill with each pin cut.

I talked to Mark Mueller, Incra's Tech Support Guy, about it and while he told me that he had done the same thing, he said that he only widened the cuts by .006" and it worked for him. 

The problem must be in the actual diameter of the but not quite matching the template for one reason or another.

Give this a try and get back as soon as you find out it works for you or not and we will go from there. I love the Incra jig. When you try to do corner posts joinery you will really have problems if you do not do what I have described. Before I did the drill described, I constantly broke the corner post trying to force them in place with my rubber mallet.

When you are happy with the fit you get there is one more issue that we need to talk about if the edges of the assembled four parts of a box are not perfectly flush with each other. But for now, first things first, O.K.

Jerry


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## abbedo (Nov 28, 2008)

Jerry Bowen said:


> O,K. Don,
> 
> From what you are saying now, you can, with a mallet, drive the pins and tails together. It that is your only problem for the moment, it is an easy fix. Let's fix that first and then if you still are still having problems we can address them later so here goes.
> 
> ...


Thanks Jerry for your response. If I understand your message, when making the vertical cuts for the pins you moved the fence over 0.005 and then back 0.010, finishing up by going back by 0.005. Having performed this step do you need to do the horizontal cuts on the pins? Will start working on this today and watch for your response.

Regards,
Don


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## Jerry Bowen (Jun 25, 2011)

Duncanrouter said:


> Thanks Jerry for your response. If I understand your message, when making the vertical cuts for the pins you moved the fence over 0.005 and then back 0.010, finishing up by going back by 0.005. Having performed this step do you need to do the horizontal cuts on the pins? Will start working on this today and watch for your response.
> 
> Regards,
> Don


I only did those widening extra cuts on the vertical cuts. Give it a try and get back to us on who it goes.

I'll give you a heads up on the other issue that I aluded to earlier. If, after you make all of the cuts on one end of the two work pieces and you flip them end of end and then make the cuts on the other ends. Look real close and see if the pins are exactly the same width on both sides of the workpieces. I they are not exactly the same width, the error is due to not having the workpieces perfectly centered. If you find that is error is present after making all of the cuts, let me know and wil will deal with it later, right now just do the cuts and widen them as I have suggested.

Jerry

Jerry


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## abbedo (Nov 28, 2008)

Hi Jerry,
I tried what you said but what I got was a bit if a sloppy fit. I used the jig again and this time carefully watched what the wood did on the vertical cuts. I was surprised to find that as the wood engages the bit that the wood is moving upward just a bit, which would account for some shallow depth of cut measurements that I had made when examining poorly fit joints. I went back at it again, however this time I affixed a sheet of sandpaper to the backing board. Watched again and saw no movement as before. This time after all of the cuts were made the boards slipped together effortlessly. I had to pinch myself. It was a near perfect dovetail. Thanks for sticking with me on this as I was about to give up.

Regards,
Don


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## Jerry Bowen (Jun 25, 2011)

Duncanrouter said:


> Hi Jerry,
> I tried what you said but what I got was a bit if a sloppy fit. I used the jig again and this time carefully watched what the wood did on the vertical cuts. I was surprised to find that as the wood engages the bit that the wood is moving upward just a bit, which would account for some shallow depth of cut measurements that I had made when examining poorly fit joints. I went back at it again, however this time I affixed a sheet of sandpaper to the backing board. Watched again and saw no movement as before. This time after all of the cuts were made the boards slipped together effortlessly. I had to pinch myself. It was a near perfect dovetail. Thanks for sticking with me on this as I was about to give up.
> 
> Regards,
> Don



Sure does feel good when things finally go right doesn't it. Good hear that things are working out for you.

Jerry


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## suds (Aug 25, 2008)

I sure wih someone would make a video of this. I am just starting out using my Incra setup for dovetails and don't seem to be able to visualize the problem/solution.


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## Jerry Bowen (Jun 25, 2011)

suds said:


> I sure wih someone would make a video of this. I am just starting out using my Incra setup for dovetails and don't seem to be able to visualize the problem/solution.


Bill, 
What part of this discussion is confusing you, I might be able to help.

Jerry


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## suds (Aug 25, 2008)

Thanks Jerry. I'm really a green pea to routing and unfortunately one of those who understands better when seeing a picture or video. I'm trying to envision moving the fence for each dovetail.


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## abbedo (Nov 28, 2008)

suds said:


> I sure wih someone would make a video of this. I am just starting out using my Incra setup for dovetails and don't seem to be able to visualize the problem/solution.


I don't have a video setup or I would try to capture something for you. Are you using the Incra Jig at all? The mail problem I was having was not selecting the right dovetail template for the thickness of stock I was using. Once I got by that problem I ran into the problem of some fine settings that played a bigger role than I anticipated. Using the Incra Ultra Jig one has to be very exact with the settings in order to get a good fit. Something that seems small at the outset of the process comes back to you in a poor fitting of the joint, especially when using through dovetails. If you have any questions please ask as I have been down every road possible in making mistakes and curing them.

Regards,
Don


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## Jerry Bowen (Jun 25, 2011)

suds said:


> I sure wih someone would make a video of this. I am just starting out using my Incra setup for dovetails and don't seem to be able to visualize the problem/solution.


Bill,
Did you not get the DVD that came with your system?

Jerry


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## suds (Aug 25, 2008)

No. I got mine from a local Craiglist woodworker. But I just ordered one! Thanks for the offer to help, I'm really going to need it.


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## Jerry Bowen (Jun 25, 2011)

suds said:


> No. I got mine from a local Craiglist woodworker. But I just ordered one! Thanks for the offer to help, I'm really going to need it.



Bill,
Once you get the "lay of land" so to speak with the Incra Jig you are going to love it. There is plenty of help for you on this forum. The jig is quite popular and that's because it is such a good tool. Will be watching for you progress onece you get started, don't be afraid to ask all the questions that you need to ask. We all started from the same point being ignorant of how things work.

Jerry


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## TwoSkies57 (Feb 23, 2009)

Mr. Bowen..

now who woulda thunk it


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## Jerry Bowen (Jun 25, 2011)

TwoSkies57 said:


> Mr. Bowen..
> 
> now who woulda thunk it


Thunk what?

Jerry


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## TwoSkies57 (Feb 23, 2009)

there was a time, not all that long ago, that you're responding to the question rather than posing the question was most unlikely....

and in case you are still confused,,,, it is ment in a most complementary way my friend.


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## suds (Aug 25, 2008)

I'm looking forward to being able to do dovetail joinery. I've always admired guys who had the ability to create beautiful projects. I was lucky to find a complete setup of Incra LS, mobile router table, PC 890 router and a box of new bits plus a bunch of other accessories on our local CL. So....no excuses now.


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## suds (Aug 25, 2008)

Haven't received my DVD on the LS yet but I did receive the large book of templates and instructions as well as a PDF from Perry McDaniel of Incra Projects & Techniques. One thing I noticed is it looks like the dovetails are in 7,9 & 14 degrees. My Leigh set of 16 bits are all in 8 degree. Does this matter in using the templates?


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## Jerry Bowen (Jun 25, 2011)

suds said:


> Haven't received my DVD on the LS yet but I did receive the large book of templates and instructions as well as a PDF from Perry McDaniel of Incra Projects & Techniques. One thing I noticed is it looks like the dovetails are in 7,9 & 14 degrees. My Leigh set of 16 bits are all in 8 degree. Does this matter in using the templates?


That's a good question, I would give them a try, they will work or they wond't. If they won't, then you can find out why they won't. If that should happen then there will be a "work around" so that you can use them or there won't be, and then it will be time to make a decision about acquiring a new bit or a set of new bits.

You are going to have to spend a little time just learning the basics first, and by the way the time doing so will in itself be fun. Don't get frustrated with the learning, it's just a natural part of getting acquainted with a new tool. My first attempt with the jigs was to cut some "box joints" and they turned out perfect except for not being properly centered. I have kept that first set of cut and have admired them from time to time. They consisted of two pieces of 3/4" pine about five inches in length, not sure what the width was but the fit was beautiful to me. Since than I have done many through nad half blind dovetails as well as the corner posts concepts. I have not net attempted the double through dovetail as it just has not appealed to me that much.

We will be waiting for your questions, if you would send me your mailing address I can send you the DVD to look at, just let me know if it would be of any value to you.

Jerry


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## suds (Aug 25, 2008)

Thanks Jerry. I do have the DVD on order and it should arrive by this weekend. I'm looking forward to using the system this weekend.


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## abbedo (Nov 28, 2008)

suds said:


> Thanks Jerry. I do have the DVD on order and it should arrive by this weekend. I'm looking forward to using the system this weekend.


Hi Suds, this is Don the guy that originally wanted help with the Incra jig. I know you ordered the DVD that comes with the jig, however while you wait I have found a tutorial on YouTube that helped me out inaddition to Jerry. You can search on "Through dovetails, Part 1 with the author being Fine Tools. He has about 9 videos out that helps one follow the directions given in the Incra instructions. The Incra instructions are well written but do leave out some little things where you can make a wrong turn. Wishing you good luck with your jig and will be waiting to hear how you are coming along.

Regards.
Don


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## suds (Aug 25, 2008)

Fantastic Don. I just got through watching the 9 videos and exactly what I'm looking for. Thank you. I figure if I watch it 10-12 times I'll get it!!! Can't wait to goet started.


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## abbedo (Nov 28, 2008)

I am glad you found it useful. It gets frustrating not being able to produce the type of joint you want. It is a very good jig but at times it can get to you. Good luck with your efforts.

Regards,
Don


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## suds (Aug 25, 2008)

I've watched the video a few times and the setup has me a bit confused but I think once I combine all that with the DVD and some practice I should be able to figure it out. It would be nice to be able to do it as fast as the 3 part promotional video. The guy with the beard is truly a pro at doing it and makes it look so easy.


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