# Flying wood



## Barry99 (Feb 10, 2009)

Just tried out my first router (Craftsman combo) on Craftsman router table. Used a 1x2 foot long piece of oak stock, 3/8 cove with bead bit. My first attempt I set the fence 3/8" from bit and wood cut a few inches then went flying. Read the instructions and then set fence to 1/8 from bit, speed from 6 to 2, wood cut 3 inches then went flying. Third attempt I set bit so top of bit just touched the wood. The wood cut about 5 inches then went flying. I also noticed (and posted in table fourm) the fence that adjusts for joining sticks out about 1/16". Any ideals what I am doing wrong?


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## Dan Mooney (Feb 2, 2009)

Just a question, are you feeding the wood from right to left or left to right? You should always feed the stock from the right side of the fence to the left side, Just a thought.

Dan


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## Barry99 (Feb 10, 2009)

Good question. I am feeding right to left. Should I hold the stock tighter? I am use to table saw, just push guide and push the wood. I think it would be dangerous to try to hold wood tight useing a router?


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## Dan Mooney (Feb 2, 2009)

You want to make sure you are holding it tight and secure against the table and fence, and if it is a piece you have a hard time getting a good grip on, always use a push block or some other device to keep your fingers FAR AWAY from the spinning bit. 

Dan


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## Birchwood (May 13, 2005)

Barry99 said:


> Just tried out my first router (Craftsman combo) on Craftsman router table. Used a 1x2 foot long piece of oak stock, 3/8 cove with bead bit. My first attempt I set the fence 3/8" from bit and wood cut a few inches then went flying. Read the instructions and then set fence to 1/8 from bit, speed from 6 to 2, wood cut 3 inches then went flying. Third attempt I set bit so top of bit just touched the wood. The wood cut about 5 inches then went flying. I also noticed (and posted in table fourm) the fence that adjusts for joining sticks out about 1/16". Any ideals what I am doing wrong?


Something sounds wacky here. Just for laughs check how you mounted the router in the table-check direction bit turning when router upside down. And as noted, you should keep the workpiece TIGHT to the fence. I'm not the expert here but man it sure sounds like routing the WRONG direction to me.


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## Woodnut65 (Oct 11, 2004)

Hi: If you are using a bit that puts a bead or round over on the edge of a board, the
fence should cover the bit, leaving only a portion of the cutting edges beyond the fence. if the bit has a bearing mounted on it the out side diameter of the bearing should be even with the fence. You can take a straight edge and hold it to the span the opening of the fence and it should just touch the bearing lightly. Then you use a push stick and push the material into the bit from right to left.
Hope this helps. I also sugghest that you invest in a book or two, which should help clearing it up. Woodnut65


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## Barry99 (Feb 10, 2009)

I don't think the direction of the bit can be changed by mounting in table, always counter clockwise no matter which way the router is faceing.


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## Barry99 (Feb 10, 2009)

Thanks for the suggestions. I am going to do some reading before I try it again.


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## Birchwood (May 13, 2005)

Okay Barry, you're right. For some reason I was thinking if you mounted the router a certain way in the table you would be feeding into it wrong. Your situation has really been bugging me and I just don't understand what is going on. If you have the bit the right distance from the fence, the workpiece tight to the fence and the feed direction right what the hell can it be? Before we get this figured out don't do much routing!!! I'd hate to see you grind off some finger tips.


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## Cassandra (Mar 15, 2006)

Hi Barry:

A picture's worth a thousand words.

How about posting a picture of your set-up?

Cassandra


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## AlanZ (Aug 21, 2008)

I still can't tell from your original post... is the wood between the bit and the fence, or is the bit mostly covered by the fence. Your wording can be read both ways, especially because you mention your table saw experience.

If it's the first case, and you're using the router as you would for ripping on a table saw (where the wood edge touching the fence is not cut) then the entire bit is exposed and you're cutting with the 'back' side of the blade, and the wood will go flying.

It should be the second case, where only half (or less) of the bit is protruding from a space in the fence, and the wood face touching the fence is cut from right to left.

So now we're all curious... a photo of the setup would help


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## Ghidrah (Oct 21, 2008)

One point to kind of clarify bit rotation, it's a matter of perspective. Like a man at bat looking out into the field. Or looking down on Earth from either of the N. pole. Left field is not from the fielders position but the batters, rotation is not from the S but N.
So I see the rotation from the (Batters box/N pole) through the motor making it clockwise.

To back up AlanZ
If the "MATERIAL" is between the bit and fence and push "Right to Left" the mat will likely get a flying lesson, (like a pitching machine).
If the "BIT" is between the mat and fence and you push "Left to Right" it may have enough flying time to go for it learners permit.


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## woodnthings (Jan 30, 2009)

*Eliminate everything else!*

Hi Barry, Maybe this will be of help: Like they say when you have a computer problem..unplug everything...Start from the beginning!  Look at your router make certain the bit is secure, and its rotating concentrically in the router when you turn it on . You will be able to tell. If it wobbles, fix it or pitch it. Next check across the fences with a straight edge. They should be parallel, straight, flat, with one another, or in the same plane. Lay the fence on the router table if it wobbles, fix it. Re-install evrything. Turn on the router. check for vibrations etc. Next locate the fence so that the bit is exposed by 1/2 of it's cutting surface, a "light" cut. The depth can be full depth. Next take a straight grained pine board or MDF, anything with no cross grain, place it against the right hand side of the fence, like you would to actually feed it into the cutter. If you have a finger board apply light pressure to the board against the fence. Use a push stick if the board is less than 24 " to start with. Turn on the router and feed the board from right to left. NOTHING BAD SHOULD HAPPEN! AS you transition from the infeed side to the out feed side keep firm pressure in toward the fence and downward toward the table. NBSH! If this doesn't work, I'd find a new Hobby!Bill


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## Gerard_sr (Dec 7, 2008)

*I lay awake in bed last night, this possibility came to me*

Barry,
This may *NOT* be the way you are doing things, but as I lay awake in bed last night, this possibility came to me so I'm mentioning it here.

With a table saw and a fence the wood is sometimes between the blade and the fence. If you were on the side of the saw and looking towards the fence, it would look like the workpiece goes from right to left, just like a router setup.

With a router it sort of looks like the same thing.
*ONLY*: at least half of the bit is hidden in/under the fence for *many* operations!
If one is attempting to put a cove on a workpiece, the edge that is to be coved or cut is directly against the fence! 
*NEVER *between the bit and the fence as on a table saw.










You must always apply inward pressure, with a feather board or a pushstick on a small piece as well as downward pressure as you are feeding the workpiece from right to left at a slow pace.

To my little knowledge, the only operations where some of the workpiece is between the router bit and the fence happens when one is cutting a grove in the workpiece and then, an amount of the workpiece is also on the side away from the fence.

Also to bring under consideration is the speed of the workpiece's movement or rate of feed. It is not a fast operation. You know that from a table saw, but it's most times much slower than that of a table saw.

You are probably not doing this, but I had to mention it because I thought there was a slim possibility that someone who had used a table saw might, just might, make this mistake.

Cordially,
Gerry


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## Mike (Nov 22, 2004)

Barry, you said you set the fence "3/8" away from the bit." Is this a plunge cutting bit? By your description it sounds like you are trying to push the wood between the fence and the bit. This would explain why the wood is flying. We never trap the wood between the cutter and fence. To cut the profile on the edge of a board the cutter must be recessed into the fence. Your wood must be held firmly to the table and against the fence. There are many types of push sticks designed to help you do this.
You need to watch some of the router videos before continuing.


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## Birchwood (May 13, 2005)

Barry, I believe these fellas have nailed the problem. It was the FIRST thing I thought of back when you presented your problem and it has stayed in my mind. These last few posts should be read carefully. I think you'll be fine but the guys do make a good suggestion when they reccomend a couple videos or even one of those old fashiond things.....a book!


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## woodnthings (Jan 30, 2009)

*Kickback!*

Gerry, there you go again with the most clear explanations on the post! Sorry fellows. Those diagrams say it all.  I never dreamed that our friend Barry had the wood between the bit and the fence! He's lucky NBH Nothing Bad Happened! WOW! This should be a post for all Newbies/Beginners. Talk about KICKBACK! Good thing it was only a Craftsman router not a Monster 3 1/2 HP Porter Cable....eh eh! Bill


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## Timonjkl (Jan 9, 2009)

How fast is it moving at launch? Table saw kickback is around 100mph? and its only rotating at a fraction of the speed of a router bit.


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## woodnthings (Jan 30, 2009)

*Launch Speed of Wood Rocket Propulsion Devices*



Timonjkl said:


> How fast is it moving at launch? Table saw kickback is around 100mph? and its only rotating at a fraction of the speed of a router bit.


I really don't know about the launch speed of either, but maybe we can calculate it:
A table saw blade at 4000 or so RPM with a 10" blade has a peripheral speed of 4000 x pi D or 125,600 in per min divided by 12 equals 10,466 ft per min. divided 5280 equalsmiles per min. times 60equals 118.93 MPH. 
A 1" router bit turning at 20,000 rpm has a peripheral speed of 20,000 x pi D or (1.57) correction should be 3.14" or...... 31,400 in per min divided by 12 equals 2676.66 ft per min, divided by 5280 equals .4955 miles per min. times 60 equals (29.73 MPH) times 2 equals 59,46MPH corrected, because I can't do math!....I think!
If this is far off, please forgive me. I studied Art in school, so I can't read, write, spell or do math! I stayed in college so long they gave me a job teaching there! Thankfully, I got a real job at a big 3 car co. and retired early.
Bill PS Good thing Howard Hughes is dead, he'd want to get a patent on Flying Wood!


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## Ghidrah (Oct 21, 2008)

1" Router bit @ 20000rpm = 59.46 MPH
10" blade @ 4000rpm = 118.93 MPH


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## woodnthings (Jan 30, 2009)

*Redos allowed here?*



Ghidrah said:


> 1" Router bit @ 20000rpm = 59.46 MPH
> 10" blade @ 4000rpm = 118.93 MPH


Thanks for the correction. See I told youi I counld'nt spel or du math! Bill
You know, I got so involved with these calculations... sort of a foreign language to me, I forgot why we wanted to know this....duhhh? Maybe the point was the tablesaw has twice the propulsion capability of the router? 
"Never stand directly behind a horse or tablesaw that's running!" Bill


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## Ghidrah (Oct 21, 2008)

If the router had a 10" dia. bit it would cover 594.696 MPH in rotation. Torque is the interesting thing and I don't have the math to calc it. What could either of those motors push and how fast could they go?


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## xplorx4 (Dec 1, 2008)

I don't know how fast the router or saw are spinning but my head is somewhere between the two by now!!


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## WIHaltom (Oct 24, 2008)

It sounds to me like you are feeding the workpiece in between the fence and the bit instead of having the fence cover part of the bit. If that's the case, then the workpiece could "go flying".


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## Rogue_Runner (Mar 29, 2007)

The above post, plus I suggest that you examine the bit and confirm that the cutting edges are intact.


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## Barry99 (Feb 10, 2009)

Birch said:


> Okay Barry, you're right. For some reason I was thinking if you mounted the router a certain way in the table you would be feeding into it wrong. Your situation has really been bugging me and I just don't understand what is going on. If you have the bit the right distance from the fence, the workpiece tight to the fence and the feed direction right what the hell can it be? Before we get this figured out don't do much routing!!! I'd hate to see you grind off some finger tips.


I did have it set up wrong, I was using bit,wood then fence and I believe the outfeed (see other posts) is not recessing flush so when the wood starts to pass the bit it gets push into the bit hence flying wood. If I had it set up right (wood,bit,fence) the wood would not fly.


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## harrysin (Jan 15, 2007)

One thing I have learned from this thread is that next time I have a maths problem, instead of sweating over it, I'll just post it, then sit back and wait for the answer!


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## woodnthings (Jan 30, 2009)

*Good Plan!*



harrysin said:


> One thing I have learned from this thread is that next time I have a maths problem, instead of sweating over it, I'll just post it, then sit back and wait for the answer!


Hey Harry, Good Plan! As you can see the Art student had the principles correct, but the math wrong, so you may get more than one answer, some correct and some incorrect! It seemed like a rather simple equation, basic physics, but right hand rules and electronics theory leaves me out..I'm sort of out there anyway!  signed: Art Student, Bill


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