# #6 Stanley Bailey Plane



## sreilly (May 22, 2018)

I thought I had posted this earlier but it's nowhere to be found. So I decided on hamburgers for dinner but soon found out we didn't have lettuce and tomato so off to the store. Next to the grocery store is a store called Rivertown, a second chance business and I just happen to have a bit of spare time so I drifted in and lo and behold there was this Stanley Bailey #6 plane that looked reasonably good.

The front counter had a sheet of 1/4" glass and the plane sat flat without any rocking so that seems to be a good sign. It listed at $50 so I figured it was a minor risk and took it home. Once home I took it into the shop but didn't expect to do manything with it today.

But that didn't exactly pan out....so I took it apart and did an initial cleanup getting the old sawdust and stuff out of it and checking the parts a bit better. I had no intention of doing much else but decided I needed to see how flat the blade was and started on the blade back on my extra coarse diamond stone. 30-40 minute later and a good sweat and the blade still wasn't flat. I was working the last inch or so and then I noticed that the blade wasn't square to the blade side either.

So now it looks like I'll need to setup my low speed grinder and the Veritas jig and square the blade of order a new blade from Hock or Veritas. The frog, lever cap, adjusting lever, sole, tote, knob, and chipbreaker all look good. 

We'll see how this all turns out.


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

Did you ever get to upgrade your hamburger to a cheeseburger???

lot's of promise in that plane...


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## sreilly (May 22, 2018)

Stick486 said:


> Did you ever get to upgrade your hamburger to a cheeseburger???
> 
> lot's of promise in that plane...


Seriously?.....Yeah, all the way to cheeseburger deluxe w/BBQ beans.

That plane has hope but the blade is questionable. I need to build the table mount for the grinder and jigs. I had been waiting till I had started using the lathe but it looks like having the Veritas jigs and the grinder will necessitate me getting off my duff and get it one.


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## PhilBa (Sep 25, 2014)

Yeah, some barbarian held it against his grinder and it eventually wound up in some thrift store donation box. The store owner probably found it there for like $2. Glad some one to give it TLC got it - even for $50, it's a good deal.


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

sreilly said:


> Seriously?.....Yeah, all the way to cheeseburger deluxe w/BBQ beans.
> 
> That plane has hope but the blade is questionable. I need to build the table mount for the grinder and jigs. I had been waiting till I had started using the lathe but it looks like having the Veritas jigs and the grinder will necessitate me getting off my duff and get it one.


deluxe... now we're talking...

how much grinding does the iron need???
grinding may not be the way to recovery...


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## Nickp (Dec 4, 2012)

Steve...your preference but from the last picture it doesn't look like it needs a grinder...I would just use your stones and jig to knock it down square and at the right angle at the same time.

Nice find...good luck with it...


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## sreilly (May 22, 2018)

It's hard to tell from the picture but I'd guess that the blade is out of square by 1/8". I realize I can adjust the angle with the adjusting lever but I thought, could be wrong, that it was best to start with the balde square. Too extreme and maybe not so critical? Bringing these back to shop status is new to me and I just want to at least start off doing it properly. Maybe not the word I'm looking for but close to what is considered as a newer state. And I do have the grinder with the Wood Turners Wonders CBN wheels, one is Mega Square + 4-in-1 Pair CBN Wheels and the other 180 MS+600 4-1. 

Then I was given the Wolverine sharpening jig for my lathe tools. I later bought the Veritas jigs for sharpening my chisels and plane blades including the grinder tool rest and grinding jig. That's what I thought would help square the blade as it has a slot for the grinding jig to rest in and alignment pins to set the blade squarely in the holder. Then I just need to adjust for how much to grind checking with the square from time to time. The CBN wheels reduce the heat and sparks a good deal I'm told. At least that's what this video references 




Am I being too critical on cleaning this up? Going too far? Like I said, I'm a bit new to this refurbishing part and just want to get it back to good working order and being rather new to hand planes I figure the closer to new like working state maybe the easier to use properly. But........


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

Steve...
use your MK-II and start out w/ coarse wet/dry...
you won't regret it...

often you read that members use a grinder to work on or sharpen their chisels and irons...
they often say that's to remove nicks/chip outs from the cutting edge...

ever wonder why those nicks got there to start w/???
the heat from grinding operation changed the temper of the iron or chisel...

_*BUT WAIT!!!!*_

to the last they all say that they never get the metal hot...
I beg to differ..
the cutting edge is extremely thin and it takes nothing to heat it up and change the temper...
it's that fine edge that does all of cutting/shaving, not the body of the iron or chisel..


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## roxanne562001 (Feb 5, 2012)

Nice find Steve


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## sreilly (May 22, 2018)

Hey Stick I wasn't going to sharpen the blade with the grinder but rather just square the blade. With the CBN wheels you hardly see any sparks and the metal is warm to the touch.

I had started just using the extra coarse DMT Diamond stone but after almost 45 minutes the back was still not flat in the corner. I then saw the blade wasn't square so then I thought I needed to square it to the side of the blade and then sharpen. I plan on using my various grit DMT plates for that. I have the extra coarse, coarse, fine, and extra fine. But again I thought it was necessary to square the blade....


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

it's necessary...
but leave the grinder out of the picture...

hardley any spaks and the metal getting warm is the cue..
the body of iron may only get warm but IWTB that the edge got hot..

w/ the corner not flattening, is it bent???


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## DesertRatTom (Jul 3, 2012)

I replaced a stock iron with a Hock and it was a big improvement. Stick's point about heat buggering up the temper is worth considering. If it's off square by 1/8th inch, it's probably been ground by someone who didn't know what they were doing and they may have overheated it long before you got it. I worked with a carpenter a few years ago who hadn't a clue about sharpening. 

That is a really nice plane and after cleanup, deserves a good iron. If you have an engineer's square, check to make sure the sides are 90 to the sole before you spend any money on a blade. BTW, you can email Hock to get their advice on your best choice for that particular plane. I thoroughly enjoy using any plane, and we forget that for most of history, planes did a LOT of the work.


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

I have Hock irons...
but I suggest you go to the head of the class w/ a PM-V11 ...
*Stanley/Record Bench Plane Blades made by Veritas*


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## sreilly (May 22, 2018)

So it seems I may have missed something else. I took Stick's worthy advice and used a coarse git sandpaper to get the iron with good scratch marks across the entire front end which is about 1.5-2" back. Way faster than the extra coarse diamond plate. I took a 60 grit belt sander belt, cut it, and clamped it to the workbench that does have a flat surface. 

I ran the iron with the entire iron on the paper lengthwise a few times and that's when I noticed the area back where the chip breaker screw goes didn't have a scratch on it. The iron is flat 2/3rds of the way and then bends slightly up at the top of the iron. I'm not sure if this is the result of the chipbreaker or if it's usable in this condition. I can see where tightening everything too tight and leaving that way may have some consequence but I haven't seen this before. That said maybe I have and didn't notice. 

So is this usable? Do I need to address the rear warpage? It will lay flat in the vise but springs back when not in the vise. The Lee Valley Veritas PM-V11 iron is out of stock till 2-28 according to the website not that it's critical to have at this point as I have more to do but the question remains do I try to do anything more with this iron? Inquiring minds.....you know...


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

get another iron...


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## RickKr (Dec 30, 2018)

Nice find. Sounds like you should be able to recover that blade. 

I scored a Stanley Bailey No. 3 at a bamboo fly rodmakers gathering last Oct., for $40. I didn't actually know what I had. I showed a photo to a friend who collects vintage hand tools, in particular chisels and hand planes. He got started with tools he got from his grandfather. 

He said this Bailey was probably made in the 1920s. I am impressed with what good shape it is in, if that is the case. He has one from sometime in the 1880s, I think he said, again, that was his grandfather's. 

While at that bamboo rodmakers gathering, one accomplished maker presented on sharpening hand plane blades. He only demonstrated with Veritas PMV11 blades as that is all he uses now. Said they sharpen really easily and hold an edge longer than Hock blades. I really want to get some, but for that kind of coin, they'll have to wait. 

I sharpen a lot of stuff, using a Tormek T8 system and jigs. I also recently added a Viel 1x42 belt sander and installed a variable speed DC motor on it. I modified that by adding a reversing switch. I can get the belt speed down to almost zero. I have very little trouble heating blades on it, and despite the slow speeds, it cuts fairly quickly. Running the water bathed Tormek grindstones never heats up anything. 

Rick


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

sreilly said:


> 1... So it seems I may have missed something else. I took Stick's worthy advice and used a coarse git sandpaper to get the iron with good scratch marks across the entire front end which is about 1.5-2" back. Way faster than the extra coarse diamond plate. I took a 60 grit belt sander belt, cut it, and clamped it to the workbench that does have a flat surface.
> 
> 2... The iron is flat 2/3rds of the way and then bends slightly up at the top of the iron. I'm not sure if this is the result of the chip breaker or if it's usable in this condition.
> 
> ...


1.... OOOOPS!!!!
the rough paper was to bring the iron's bevel into square very rapidly...
it will take a bit of work to get those gouges polished out...

2,3... it's usable w/ some improvement...

4... that's not warpage...
it's mechanically bent...

5... so straighten it..
place the iron parallel to and at the edge of your work table/bench, w/ the apex up, support both ends equal distance from the apex of the bend...
using a quick clamp, type F, or C clamp***** press down on the apex some... (truly try not to over do it)...
press some, check for flatness; repeat as often as necessary to take you to your happiness...

**** NOTES:*

the foot print of whatever you press w/ needs to be narrow to the length of the iron and all the way across the width...
a large diameter bolt laid across the width will work fine for this...
you could use your vise to ''get er'' done...


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## TwoSkies57 (Feb 23, 2009)

Keep moving forward with this iron Steve. Do everything you can do to make it at least appear to be usable. Being aware that in the end, it may very well not have been worth the effort. However, what you learn along the way can and will be applied to every sharpening task you face in the future. Time, effort, technique, tempering etc. all can be gained from this one project. You'll be much better equipped to access the worthiness of the next iron you look at. You will most likely end up acquiring an aftermarket iron, which is just fine. Hock's are great, I have several. The Lee Valley PM-V11 by all accounts are well worth the investment if you plan on using your plane quite a bit. The ease of sharpening and long wearing edge make em hard to pass on. I don't have any.....yet *S*

The plane itself looks to be well worth the time and effort required just so long as you get the sole FLAT toe to heel. Small isolated pits and dings will not adversely impact the planes designed purpose. Larger low spots on the sole may affect how the sole rides over the high spots on a board. Depending on their orientation. Left to right low spots may cause the plane to "dip" as it rides over a ridge. Where as front to back low spots may just ride over the ridges. 

Don't worry to much about the 90 degress sole to sides stuff. Close will be good enough for this one. Unless you plan on using this plane as a "Shooter" (shooting board) or plan on doing alot of rabbet work with it. Both of which appear unlikely at this stage of your plane use development. 

Closely inspect the knob and tote for cracking. They appear to be in nice shape! Clean em up and refinish. Just a good cleaning is all you need for the rest of it to have a really nice looking user for your shop. 

Often, knowing what not to do or not worth doing is as valuable as knowing what to do.....

just my 2cents worth...


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## sreilly (May 22, 2018)

Stick486 said:


> 1.... OOOOPS!!!!
> the rough paper was to bring the iron's bevel into square very rapidly...
> it will take a bit of work to get those gouges polished out...
> 
> ...


I should have taken notes....there's too much time between hearing and doing sometimes and the ole memory isn't what it use to be.....not that is was ever great.

I have to get on the elliptical or it won't get done and I'm trying hard to maintain that 4 mile daily routine. Sometimes it gets truncated to 3 but not often. Depends on how those knees feel.

When that's done I'll get back on the iron as it seems I've created some additional work on getting the back cleaned up and shiny again. 

Then I'll tackle the squaring with several long strokes on the sandpaper Once there I'll get into my "normal" sharpening routine with the DMT Diamond stones. I have the Duos, I think they call them, with Coarse on one side and Fine on the other with another that has Very Fine and Coarse. I also have the Very Coarse as a separate plate. 

That along with the Veritas MKII or the Woodpecker's sharpening system I should be able to get a good cutting edge. What are the chance, and I haven't looked yet, that the lever lock will straighten the iron? After all as long as the iron is flat from the frog down isn't that the most important?

I'll look and see what effect it has if any. I know it was extremely tight when I took it apart.

I'll post any results, good, bad, or ugly as they develop. Now for some sweat..............


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

sreilly said:


> What are the chance, and I haven't looked yet, that the lever lock will straighten the iron? After all as long as the iron is flat from the frog down isn't that the most important?..............


Trying to break something are we????


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## sreilly (May 22, 2018)

Newest update is the new iron should be here tomorrow. I ordered the VM-11 and it was said to be out of stock until the end of February but shipped two days ago. Meanwhile I decided to use the EvapoRust and clean up the parts on the plane. I only had 2 quarts so I did all the part except the sole so far. A gallon is due today as well.

I started to use a small aluminum disposable pan (Reynolds) but later realized that I was better off making a container that would fit the sole as well. I made it long enough that should I finally find my #7 (22") it would fit as well (23") and soaked the parts for 17 hours. What I did was take a piece of 4" PVC conduit and glue a cap to one end. The 2nd cap simply fits on when the tube is being used and is secured in an upright position. Takes less solution than trying to use a tray 22" long.

When the gallon of EvapoRust gets here today I'll add enough to cover the sole and let set overnight as well. For the short few hours I had the sole sitting in the pan w/solution it was already doing some good work. Overnight should be wonderful.


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## sreilly (May 22, 2018)

Almost forgot the handles. Certainly not Rosewood and I think they were painted which is likely how they will be again. I sanded them down to get rid of dirt and marring but didn't want to sand so much it physically changed the shape. I started with 100 grit, went to 150, 220, and then 400. They are extremely smooth but not entirely down to bare wood.


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## 1fizgig (Feb 11, 2018)

Steve, looking good. After that cleaning don't forget to give them a light oiling to prevent the rust from coming back to haunt you.
Do you need to paint the handle/knob? Is that an aesthetic thing for you? I'd be inclined to leave them and maybe clear poly to protect them, but that's just me.
Getting to know planes is interesting. I'm on that journey myself. I have 2 x #4 Stanley's, one old one modern. The older one was seriously used and abused by my brother in law, so have recently re-acquired and cleaned it up. I had to clean the sole up a bit, and spend time sharpening, but it's been putting out some nice shavings since that love and care. Seems to do a better job than the modern one.


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## sreilly (May 22, 2018)

I bought some Jojoba Oil just for that purpose. Handle isn't important to me other than it's solid and protected. Once I get out and get my needed maple I'll build that wall hung tool cabinet for the planes, chisels, and such.


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## Nickp (Dec 4, 2012)

Nice work, Steve...but I wouldn't paint the wood...oil leaves such a beautiful natural look...just a thought...

Nice thining to use a PVC tube for the de-rusting...have you considered capping a long enough piece of PVC and then cutting it in half...? Then lay the sole in it...? "Canoe for the shoe"...LOL...


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## sreilly (May 22, 2018)

Nickp said:


> Nice work, Steve...but I wouldn't paint the wood...oil leaves such a beautiful natural look...just a thought...
> 
> Nice thining to use a PVC tube for the de-rusting...have you considered capping a long enough piece of PVC and then cutting it in half...? Then lay the sole in it...? "Canoe for the shoe"...LOL...


I'll likely use some stain sealer. Might need to get down to some barer wood though if I do it right. 

Cutting the tube length wise makes it far more unstable and for this profile the 4" is just about right so even laying it on the side wouldn't gain much. For the 18" sole it takes just over a gallon of EvapoRust to cover the entire sole standing up. Now if it had a flat side you might.......maybe cap a bit of gutter pipe. Sorry, got lost there for a moment.


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

kodos...


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## sreilly (May 22, 2018)

So the new Veritas VM-11 iron arrived a short while ago. The accompanying sheet that came with it says the iron is ready for honing. Isn't that another word for sharpening? The sheet says the blade is harp and ready for final honing. Unless the balde face has been scratched only the bevel will need to be resharpened.

The blade bevel has been ground to an average roughness of 16 microinches (0.000016")or better. The face has been machined lapped to an average roughness of 5 microinches (0.00005") or better over the working surface. And goes on a bit more. 

To prevent any damage to a new iron my best guess is that I need to check the flatness of the iron back by working the 1st 1-2" on the coarse diamond plate, change over to the fine, and then very fine as usually with each step making new scratches over the previous. 

Then because I have them I would mount the iron properly for the desired bevel angle in the Veritas MK-II jig or the Woodpeckers jig. I've seen both 25 and 30 degree bevels being suggested but I have not looked at the bevel that Veritas shipped the blade with. Hold on.......OK back, and the angle is.....30 degrees just like the label says.

So I'll set it as needed and go through the diamond plates as I did for the back. When that's done I can set a secondary bevel with another 2 degrees, again going through the diamond plates. This should leave a burr on the opposite side (back) that needs to be eliminated by doing a single stroke on the very fine diamond or strapped on the leather and compound.

Sound about right?


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## 1fizgig (Feb 11, 2018)

Sounds about right Steve. Yes, "ready for honing" kinda means ready for sharpening, but it's finer than that. You'll find it's already "sharp", but honing will just create a finer edge that makes the difference.
Gee, I have been learning my craft! Been looking into this a lot lately, so been great to see your project and each step you've taken, thanks for sharing.


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## RickKr (Dec 30, 2018)

I hope this doesn't spawn a "spirited discussion" that turns into an argument, especially about love/hate for Tormek type wet grinding systems. And I hope this doesn't hijack this thread, but...

Sharpening is essentially at least two staged: establishing bevels using some form of grinding/sanding, etc. and honing, which is burr removal. Edges can be single sided (chisels/plane blades, Japanese knives, etc.) or two sided (typical knife edges). The degree of effective burr removal determines the ultimate true sharpness of an apex. That sharpness is a reflection of the width of the apex, assuming the burr has been removed. A knife sharpener in Australia has done quite a bit of work researching knife sharpness in relation to burr removal and has published a short book on deburring. I'm sure there are other books on this subject; this is one that I've found particularly enlightening and practical. This guys works extensively on Tormek grinding systems, but his work on deburring is based heavily on paper and felt wheels using various grits of diamond paste. I believe the deburring principles and processes discussed apply to deburring for any type of bevel formation methods (grinding/sanding, etc.) and is by no means limited to wet grinding systems like the Tormek. 

Knife Grinders book on deburring. PDF through Amazon.
Knife Deburring: Science behind the lasting razor edge

A sharpness chart showing apex width and sharpness scores of a -standardized method for measuring edge sharpness. 
(downloads a PDF)

Knife Grinders home page
Knife Grinders

Rick


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## sreilly (May 22, 2018)

Closer to the finish line. Honing the iron this afternoon and just took the sole out of the EvapoRust after 22 hours. Looks goo and clean. Now I need to check the sole for flatness and have done so on smaller planes but this beast is 18" and my diamond plates are only 8".

My best guess is to lightly clamp the sole in the vise and take the diamond plates to run the length of the sole, inverted as you would a smaller plane. I would of course mark the sole with a magic marker making lines across the sole to see where the sole is flat paying special attention to the toe where the iron opening is and the perimeter of the entire body as well as the heel.

Is this correct or do I need to do something else?


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## sreilly (May 22, 2018)

So after further review I think I'll need to pickup a few belt sander belts and use them on my table saw table. I'll put down some heavy plastic to protect the table and then run the sole over the sand paper after marking the bottom. 

I was thinking the granite slab I have would be useful but it's only 18" x 12", too short for this use. Not crazy about using the table saw table but at least I don't need the sand paper wet. The great news is there is no rocking of the sole when sitting on the granite slab. At least I know all 4 corners are flat and even.


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

go to a granite counter maker and raid their scrap pile...


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