# Table and fence position



## ranman (Oct 27, 2017)

I don't see this configuration used anywhere. Why not?


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## mimac (Dec 13, 2009)

Not only that I don't see anything:grin:


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## ranman (Oct 27, 2017)

That's why I asked.


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

ranman said:


> I don't see this configuration used anywhere. Why not?


think it through and you'll come to the correct conclusion...


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## CharlesWebster (Nov 24, 2015)

Because that would be cutting with the back side of the cutter. The cutter turns clockwise, you should be feeding the material across the right side of the cutter not the left.


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## ranman (Oct 27, 2017)

The router is in a table. Unless I have a Chinese router this ought to be running the correct direction....into the work piece.


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## ranman (Oct 27, 2017)

I'm truing up a section of some old Wilsonart flooring so I can inset some repair pieces using lap joints in the floor and repair piece. I need flawlessly parallel pieces. I did a test repair and this setup works like a dream.
Hardest part will be making the cutout in the floor perfectly square. 
I glued a teplate to the floor using hot glue. Then I used a 1/4" bit the full depth og the material to make the first cut, then changed my bit to 3/4" to make the lap joint. The repair's corners will be rounded in the floor of course, but I found that with some sandpaper on a block of wood, hand shaping the corners in the repair piece isn't all that hard to do. An $800 repair will save the homeowner from replacing a $9000+ floor.


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## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

I thought you wern't supposed to trap a work-piece between the fence and the bit?


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## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

OK...here's the relevant info!
Yup; don't trap your work-piece!
http://go.rockler.com/tech/47905-ProFence-Inst.pdf


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

DaninVan said:


> I thought you wern't supposed to trap a work-piece between the fence and the bit?


you are not...


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## ranman (Oct 27, 2017)

If it makes any difference, the material I am using has a paper like consistency like Masonite. I's less than 3/8" thick. I cut the section to about 1/16" oversize, then use the fence to creep up on the width by 64th's or less. Just sayin', that I'm not hogging off 1/4 inch per pass with 3/4 inch thick maple.

I don't see my configuration in that link. I see one that's _*just the opposite *_and it says avoid climb cut. (image 2) Mine isn't a climb cut if I'm feeding _*into *_the bit instead of with it's rotation. 

That said, I appreciate the input greatly. I'm here to learn.
I suppose a feather board pushing against my work piece. One hold down or featherbboard on top of it might make it safer. That would keep it from raising up I suppose. It's not gonna happen in the repair that I'm going to do. I'm just shaving off a little dust, one pass at a time, 'till the repair section drops in..


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

DaninVan said:


> OK...here's the relevant info!
> Yup; don't trap your work-piece!
> http://go.rockler.com/tech/47905-ProFence-Inst.pdf


your diagram shows a climb cut...


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## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

ranman said:


> The router is in a table. Unless I have a Chinese router this ought to be running the correct direction....into the work piece.


You have the rotation going backwards. Start spinning your finger around in the correct direction if you had it handheld (clockwise) and then while still spinning your finger turn your finger facing up. What was clockwise facing down is now counterclockwise when facing up.

In that orientation the cutter is moving the same direction as you are feeding so the bit wants to self feed without any help from you. The cutter can't cut the material off as fast as the bit tries to self feed so very bad things can happen like shooting the workpiece across the room at barely sub sonic speeds and /or bending the armature. Years ago someone mentioned embedding their workpiece in the far wall in their shop.

Take the Wilsonart and put it up against a straight edge. Put a piece of panel board on it that has been ripped to the correct width. Clamp together and trim with a flush trim bit.


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## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

My diagram???
Did you mean my link to the Rockler diagram?
The text is the explanation for the diagram...which does say "AVOID"

The text is reprinted below:


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## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

I've seen what Randy's doing but done in a custom jig that controls the workpiece _from both edges_. Ie it can't go anywhere and as Randy said only a paper thin piece of materiel was being removed.
What my guy was doing was lightly machining planking for a strip built kayak. It was already ripped to width but I can't rember why he was doing a pass through the router jig(?) a slight bevel maybe???


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## ranman (Oct 27, 2017)

I'm totally confused. The diagram shows feeding the board into the tool same direction the bit is rotating. That would obviously grab the board and launch the work piece out of the table. I'm feeding the _opposite _ direction ...into or against the tool, not with it.

I guess I'd just like to know what could happen. The diagram shows something that, well, looks obvious. ..scary just thinking about it.


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## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

ranman said:


> I'm totally confused. The diagram shows feeding the board into the tool same direction the bit is rotating. That would obviously grab the board and launch the work piece out of the table. I'm feeding the _opposite _ direction ...into or against the tool, not with it.
> 
> I guess I'd just like to know what could happen. The diagram shows something that, well, looks obvious. ..scary just thinking about it.


Randy; where the confusion is coming from is because you're* running the material trapped between the fence and the bit*, as the text in my link discusses; feeding from a different direction isn't the issue, it's still dangerous! The bit should be tucked into the fence where it belongs, and the work-piece outbound from the fence.
I know this isn't what you want to do and I completely understand your perspective, but for the reasons given in the text I posted, it's still hazardous.


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## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

"I guess I'd just like to know what could happen. "
-Randy

*shock!*


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## ranman (Oct 27, 2017)

Cherryville Chuck said:


> You have the rotation going backwards. Start spinning your finger around in the correct direction if you had it handheld (clockwise) and then while still spinning your finger turn your finger facing up. What was clockwise facing down is now counterclockwise when facing up.
> 
> In that orientation the cutter is moving the same direction as you are feeding so the bit wants to self feed without any help from you. The cutter can't cut the material off as fast as the bit tries to self feed so very bad things can happen like shooting the workpiece across the room at barely sub sonic speeds and /or bending the armature. Years ago someone mentioned embedding their workpiece in the far wall in their shop.
> 
> Take the Wilsonart and put it up against a straight edge. Put a piece of panel board on it that has been ripped to the correct width. Clamp together and trim with a flush trim bit.


 Here's what I think you are saying.
Obviously in the first image, the work piece is trapped by the fence and it's gonna launch forwards into the wall.
In the second image, you're saying it can grab the piece and pull it away from the fence and throw it back towards you.

Like Danivan said, a simple fence or feather board ought to do what's needed to keep control.


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## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

A safer technique would be to use your router table as a jointer...









And yes, I realize that doesn't address the issue of parallelism, but he does have a suggestion for that in the second link.


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## ranman (Oct 27, 2017)

DaninVan said:


> Randy; where the confusion is coming from is because you're* running the material trapped between the fence and the bit*, as the text in my link discusses; feeding from a different direction isn't the issue, it's still dangerous! The bit should be tucked into the fence where it belongs, and the work-piece outbound from the fence.
> I know this isn't what you want to do and I completely understand your perspective, but for the reasons given in the text I posted, it's still hazardous.


 Our fathers told us not to do things too. I have hair on my knuckles. :wink:
Before doing my test repair I was concerned about the material pulling sideways, but since I was trimming off such a minuscule amount I wasn't concerned. 
The reason I asked is because I want to know. The feedback I'm getting is great.
I'm still thinking a feather board or fence on the opposite side would work fine.
I can see if you are holding the board loosely and not paying attention that things would go south really fast. I would hope nobody works that way.
On a table saw, you are supposed to use that center piece with the anti-kickback pawls and plastic cover .......... How many people do that?
I've installed flooring for almost 45 years and worked with all kinds of power tools. The router, not so much. I hand feed 8 foot sheets of 1/4 inch plywood into my portable table saw when cutting underlayment. 20X faster than using a circular saw. It's not recommended I'm sure. I wouldn't do that with 3/4" plywood. (too heavy) :grin:


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## ranman (Oct 27, 2017)

Danivan, thanks for the links. I'll watch them later. I can't do video on my connection. 
Parallelism is 99.9% of what's important on this job and it's going to take a number if passes to creep up on an exact fit. When I get close during my practice repair, I used a strip of masking tape on the fence to shave off another .004" without moving the fence. What _I _am gonna be doing in my opinion isn't unsafe, but everyone's concerns here make me rethink doing this with other materials and different thicknesses. Initially I thought it would be great for use as a jointer. ........rethinkin that.


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## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

"...Our fathers told us not to do things too. I have hair on my knuckles. "
Randy
I thought it was the palms that were at risk?! 'Randy'...how appropriate is _that_?  Lol!
(And I'm sure it was our Moms. )


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## ranman (Oct 27, 2017)

DaninVan said:


> "...Our fathers told us not to do things too. I have hair on my knuckles. "
> Randy
> I thought it was the palms that were at risk?! 'Randy'...how appropriate is _that_?  Lol!
> (And I'm sure it was our Moms. )


It was palms............ memory fading fast at age 60.960526315789
...not that I'm counting. :wink:
Worked on a temporary router base for my lift to fit into this afternoon. It's just a partial sheet of 3/4 plywood with a routed inset for the lift plate to drop into. It's gonna get clamped or screwed down onto my portable table-saw table for this job. It's starting on Monday and I'm probably gonna have 4 days on it.
I promise I'll be careful. :grin:


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## JFPNCM (Dec 13, 2009)

Looks like a great opportunity to either eat a piece of work or launch it through a wall.


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## CharlesWebster (Nov 24, 2015)

ranman said:


> The router is in a table. Unless I have a Chinese router this ought to be running the correct direction....into the work piece.


I dunno about your router but mine turns clockwise. You are showing yours turning counter-clockwise and creating a climb cut.


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## ranman (Oct 27, 2017)

CharlesWebster said:


> I dunno about your router but mine turns clockwise. You are showing yours turning counter-clockwise and creating a climb cut.


When turned upside down as when in table, the bit turns counterclockwise. Hold a bit with the shaft pointing down. It's obvious which way it has to turn. Also consider what I am cutting. Imagine cutting a 64th of an inch off of a 3/8" thick Graham Cracker using a fence like I'm going to. Now imagine cutting 1/4 inch of material off a 1/2" thick piece of Hickory. You're going to get two totally different behaviors.


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## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

Silly question but why not just use a plane? Is the material too hard?


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

DaninVan said:


> Silly question but why not just use a plane? Is the material too hard?


why not use the KISS/MISS method w/ a heavy dose of safety...
make the two edges parallel and as far apart as needed.... well at least parallel that wood will allow... 
now cut the edge profiles needed in the time proven method...

*STEP 1...*
make one edge straight... (see the PDF)
*STEP 2...*
make the 2nd edge parallel to the 1st using the TS...
*STEP 3...*
cut the profile(s) on the normally set up RT...


.


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## ranman (Oct 27, 2017)

The product is a "floating" laminate floor...... One of those click together laminate floor that look like wood. In this case, like bamboo. The surface hardness is like Formica on steroids. The center of the material is a composite wood product sorta like Masonite.
My project is about the same as cutting a hole in a Formica counter top, then cutting, shaping and inserting a repair piece that's invisible and as durable as the original. It's gonna be an interesting week.
The repair areas are 5" by 7" and a larger one, 10" by 26".


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

ranman said:


> The product is a "floating" laminate floor...... One of those click together laminate floor that look like wood. In this case, like bamboo. The surface hardness is like Formica on steroids. The center of the material is a composite wood product sorta like Masonite.
> My project is about the same as cutting a hole in a Formica counter top, then cutting, shaping and inserting a repair piece that's invisible and as durable as the original. It's gonna be an interesting week.
> The repair areas are 5" by 7" and a larger one, 10" by 26".


make your life easier... 
use negative rake rated for the material tooling...


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## ranman (Oct 27, 2017)

I looked over the PDF and that's way more than KISS. I can square up two edges in my table saw and fine tine the squareness with the hand held router One that's done, I can use the saw once more to cut the length and width about 1/16" larger than I need. From there, the fence setup I'm using will, one pass at a time, shaving off a few thousandths each pass, make for a custom fit. I can shave off the thickness of a piece of paper if I so choose. The rectangular holes that I route into the floor will of course have rounded corners. I'll hand file the fill/repair piece to match those rounded corners in the floor.


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## ranman (Oct 27, 2017)

Stick486 said:


> make your life easier...
> use negative rake rated for the material tooling...


O lordy.............. you're talkin' an $85 bit aren't ya?


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

ranman said:


> O lordy.............. you're talkin' an $85 bit aren't ya?


you watch how fast you kill non rated tooling ...
several times over...
then get back to us on the total cost..

you've never done this before.. have you???


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## ranman (Oct 27, 2017)

No one else has either. 
I bought 2 new Amana bits for the cuts on the showing, or surface edges. A 3/4 bit for the floor cut and a 1/2" for use in the table mount. They need to survive for 80 inches.
I've done this before with the old Pergo laminate. Like this job, hardy any left over material, so I had to make up pieces from leftover cuts. I had to T&G them so they would mate into the rest of the floor.


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## ranman (Oct 27, 2017)

Stick, I did my test pieces with "Exchange-A-Blade" brand 3/4 inch and 1/4" router bits. These weren't new bits. They looked fine when I got done using them and the cuts were good. The Amana bits look to be considerably better made. They'll survive this job. If this was a common repair I'd go for the gusto. 
This is a thrice in 45 year type of repair. I shouldn't say 45 years because laminate floors like this haven't been around nearly that long. Maybe 28 years.......... you get the picture.


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

ranman said:


> .......... you get the picture.....


yup..
I got the picture...


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## roxanne562001 (Feb 5, 2012)

What they said. Don't trap your work!!


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## MEBCWD (Jan 14, 2012)

@ranman You are correct that you are feeding the material into the bit correctly BUT you are still traping the material between the bit and fence. 

With this set up, one small lapse in control of the material makes the part vulnerable to the cutter's tendance to grab the part and throw it back at you. If the material is not traped then it will usually just be pushed away from the bit, when trapped between the bit and fence it cannot fall away from the cutter safely and becomes a projectile that will be thrown toward you. 

Don't fall prey to the "it won't happen to me" because that's why it's called an accident and you will be saying " I knew better but did it anyway, so I'll have to get use to seeing out of the one eye I have left".


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## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

No leftover material from the original installation? I thought there was a technique for removing click~lock boards in the middle of a floor?...
I hope this is for yourself! If it's going to take a week it'd be cheaper to just replace the floor...


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

double post


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

DaninVan said:


> it'd be cheaper to just replace the floor...


throw a nice area rug over it..


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## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

Or a bear skin...


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

DaninVan said:


> Or a bear skin...


bug condo...


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## ranman (Oct 27, 2017)

Danivan, to replace this floor and matching stairway might cost well over $8,000. It looks like brand new even tho it's over 10 years old. It might even go under the kitchen cabinets and the island. 
There is also a 3 1/2 foot wide stairway leading up to this large upstairs living area. Id guess maybe 25' by 40'?
Wilsonart brand laminate floors were the high end of this type of product. The planks in this floor are of the locking type. Stair treads were something quite special that Wilsonart manufactured. Most laminate installations on stairs required the planks to make up the stair, then gluing on a special stair nose piece. Wilsonart actually made one piece stair treads that matched the floor exactly.
I will have two leftover stair treads to use for the repairs. They are about 12 inches by 48 inches. If I get lucky, I can remove one plank from a small pantry closet for the large repair, and replace that pantry plank with a piece of the stair tread material....... I'll of course have to machine the edges and spline them together. That was standard repair procedure for the older glued together planks. I have two Wilsonart wing bits made for doing that T&G procedure.


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## ranman (Oct 27, 2017)

Stick486 said:


> bug condo...


When the homeowner asked me to do this repair a year ago, I suggested a planter box. :grin:
They have two homes and I wasn't prepared to do this repair. Since then, I bought two routers and constructed a lift so I actually have a chance to be successful doing this repair. It's not going to be invisible close up, but hopefully from a standing position only the home owners and me will know it's there. The large repair will be 26 inches of cross grain cuts. That's what's going to make the repair difficult to make invisible. The customer knows that, but anything is better than a large hole in the floor.


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## Herb Stoops (Aug 28, 2012)

MEBCWD said:


> @ranman You are correct that you are feeding the material into the bit correctly BUT you are still traping the material between the bit and fence.
> 
> With this set up, one small lapse in control of the material makes the part vulnerable to the cutter's tendance to grab the part and throw it back at you. If the material is not traped then it will usually just be pushed away from the bit, when trapped between the bit and fence it cannot fall away from the cutter safely and becomes a projectile that will be thrown toward you.
> 
> Don't fall prey to the "it won't happen to me" because that's why it's called an accident and you will be saying " I knew better but did it anyway, so I'll have to get use to seeing out of the one eye I have left".


I like Mike's explanation the best. On a table saw the cutting edge of the blade is spinning down towards the table and kickbacks are caused by the back of the blade catching the material and throwing it back at the operator. In this case the cutting edge of the router bit is catching the material and will send it back towards the operator. The safest way like mentioned above would be to set up like a jointing operation with the cutter just barely exposed beyond the fence and run the material as many times as it takes to creep up on the exact width. If the material is ripped on the TS to parallel before you start to joint that shouldn't be an issue.

Herb


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## CharlesWebster (Nov 24, 2015)

ranman said:


> When turned upside down as when in table, the bit turns counterclockwise. Hold a bit with the shaft pointing down. It's obvious which way it has to turn. <snip>


Yeah, got it. I was holding the router right side up. Sorry :frown:


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## ranman (Oct 27, 2017)

Herb Stoops said:


> I like Mike's explanation the best. On a table saw the cutting edge of the blade is spinning down towards the table and kickbacks are caused by the back of the blade catching the material and throwing it back at the operator. In this case the cutting edge of the router bit is catching the material and will send it back towards the operator. The safest way like mentioned above would be to set up like a jointing operation with the cutter just barely exposed beyond the fence and run the material as many times as it takes to creep up on the exact width. If the material is ripped on the TS to parallel before you start to joint that shouldn't be an issue.
> 
> Herb


Appreciate the explanation, Herb. I still plan to do this the way I did my test repair. Because of the comments and information everyone here have brought up, I've made modifications to my methods, to router lift and fence to keep the material from lifting. Since I am taking off such a minuscule amount of material, moving slow and steady will make this work out fine. The fence and router plate will be lubed so the material passes easily.
What everyone has been saying makes complete sense, so in the future, when working with _ real wood_ I'll definitely change my methods.
I have 10 working fingers and thumbs now. Maybe I'll show em still intact once the repair is completed. :grin:


CharlesWebster said:


> Yeah, got it. I was holding the router right side up. Sorry :frown:


I work upside down and sideways on a regular basis as you can tell from following my topic.


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## Hypnotoad (Apr 17, 2018)

ranman said:


> I don't see this configuration used anywhere. Why not?


You do all the time in a thicknesser, this is exactly how a thicknesser works, with the router bit being the blades of the thicknesser and the cutting edge cutting into the workpiece, not dragging it along. In a thicknesser you have rollers that pull the work piece along and push it down against the table. Some on this thread think you are climb cutting where you are not. 










The danger of doing this on a router table is that the bit is exposed and you have no rollers pushing the piece against the fence. So there is really nothing to stop it from grabbing the work piece and becoming a rocket launcher.


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## ranman (Oct 27, 2017)

Hypnotoad said:


> You do all the time in a thicknesser, this is exactly how a thicknesser works, with the router bit being the blades of the thicknesser and the cutting edge cutting into the workpiece, not dragging it along. In a thicknesser you have rollers that pull the work piece along and push it down against the table. Some on this thread think you are climb cutting where you are not.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


That makes sense to ma Hypnotoad. I don't like the description of a climb cut meaning no matter what you do it's a climb cut.
What you are showing there (image 2) looks scary and dangerous. I'm not feeding a skinny 3/4 inch thick piece of _grainy_ hardwood through my setup. 
I'm feeding a 3/8" thick piece of hard board type material that lays flat on my table. The pieces were 5 to 10 inches wide. Now if one _*daintily*_ holds the material and _*recklessly *_slides the material past the bit, well that would be dangerous with any saw or router setup. If you move _*slowly*_ and move the material with a controlled firm grip........... that's a recipe for success. 
Once more my material is what made this procedure safe as any other sawing or milling operation. Never felt safer in my life.
*I'll post images of my setup. later so you can see.*
Here's the before and after.
The "after" still has my clamps glued to the floor to keel the surfaces even.
I wish I has images that would do these repairs justice. They turned out _*sweet.*_
Customer and her friend kept referring to me as an artist........... $100 tip on an $800 job was nice too. Lost my ass time wise. but I discovered this repair was actually possible. My brain hurts from the thinking process of performing the multiple operations.


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## ranman (Oct 27, 2017)

Hypnotoad said:


> You do all the time in a thicknesser, this is exactly how a thicknesser works, with the router bit being the blades of the thicknesser and the cutting edge cutting into the workpiece, not dragging it along. In a thicknesser you have rollers that pull the work piece along and push it down against the table. Some on this thread think you are climb cutting where you are not.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


That thicknesser is used to plane the width of 4, 6, 10, 12, and larger width wood boards. Wood boards have alternating grain. I'm removing 1/16 or less from the edge of a 3/8" thick piece of hardboard material. Not even comparable.
I'll get some images of my setup so it makes better sense.


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## ranman (Oct 27, 2017)

OK, here's the setup. Good enough to get my job done.
First image is the plywood table top.
Second is the fence setup being just some angle aluminum.
The way the back of the fence is secured is just by using some furniture screw inserts embedded in the plywood. I could adjust the width for the cuts I needed.
The front side of the fence was secured with a c clamp.
Third image shows why the piece cannot move sideways or up. The 1 1/2" stick on the right is bolted to the router lift and a cam action allows quick movements to keep it _almost_ in contact with the work piece. The nylon screw is also adjusted to near contact with the work piece.
It can't go up and it can't go sideways... and it can't go backwards unless I let go of it.
The top and methods were for getting this job completed. I'll design a real top later. This was safer than drinking a glass of water.
This might not be safe with smaller stock or real wood............ Yes,a bit of common sense is required to operate this one.


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## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

*I'm lovin' that stop/ featherboard, Randy!* That setup is infinitely safer than what you originally proposed.
You'd have to be drunk and multitasking to have that go wild on you.
You've got too many years on the job to make the newbie mistake of wearing gloves...


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## ranman (Oct 27, 2017)

DaninVan said:


> *I'm lovin' that stop/ featherboard, Randy!* That setup is infinitely safer than what you originally proposed.
> You'd have to be drunk and multitasking to have that go wild on you.
> You've got too many years on the job to make the newbie mistake of wearing gloves...


That "featherboard" worked out sweet with the cam action. You could easily creep up or adjust it after each pass. ....and I made many dozens of em a few thousandths at a time.
I suppose I could have made the point of contact closer to the bit................ but I had me some work to get done. $$$ :grin:

"That setup is infinitely safer than what you originally proposed"
Thanks to poking and prodding by everyone here.......... Thanks a bunch guys and gals!


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## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

Oh! And great job on the photo shoot!!!


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## ranman (Oct 27, 2017)

Thanks DaninVan. Wish I had a real camera so the images would be better. If the customer sends some photos of the floor repair, I'll post em.


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## ranman (Oct 27, 2017)

ranman said:


> "That setup is infinitely safer than what you originally proposed"
> Thanks to poking and prodding by everyone here.......... Thanks a bunch guys and gals!


I had a 6 foot section of 3 1/2" hickory T&G flooring laying around. It was a finger jointed piece. Ran that board through my setup a dozen times and even set my dial indicator against the fence so I could measure what I removed. Same with a fir 1X4. This setup felt as safe as anything could be.
I'm thinking now that terrible things might happen should I let go of the piece half way through the cut and go fetch a cup of coffee..........
A thicker cam action "featherboard" might be a good idea and so might a second _real_ featherboard on the outlet side.
This setup wouldn't be for ordinary router use, but I needed it for my project and it performed flawlessly. I could make adjustments to the laminate at about about .002" per pass. I could also correct out of square by that amount.


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## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

Great outcome, Randy! The only other safety measures that you could add would be a guard over top of the bit, sort of along the lines of the guard on a jointer? and maybe something like anti-kickback pawls, to prevent the workpiece from coming back at you?
What's the chance you'll ever need this setup again; is this a regular application? Maybe you could patent it... 
Nice job on the jig.


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