# Advice needed for beginner please!



## kjackson82 (Mar 25, 2013)

I have been doing small jobs with wood and have started to acquire some tools and a lot of interest in doing more wood working. I now have a porter cable circular saw, bosch 4100 table saw, bosch jig saw and bosch palm sander. We recently bought a house with a 12 x 14 shop so space is kind of limited as to having a cabinet style table saw and dedicated space for different pieces of equipment. Where should I go from here? Router? Miter saw?

I think router would be my guess, seeing as i have made it this far with out a miter saw (i've been using my speed square clamped as a guide for circular saw on long boards and table saw for smaller stuff). I would like to make a sled for my table saw along with some jigs to start doing different joints and get away from the torx deck screws for holding things together! I would also like to make a base for my table saw and get away from the rolling fold up that it sits on now. I would then like to make an outfeed table and my own router table with all being the same height to give me multiple uses from each. 

So, which do you recommend, router or miter saw? or is there some stuff I need to do before getting any? 

Also, I would like to get my table saw set up a little better such as a sled for such a small table, increasing the accuracy of the pusher thing with the degrees on it (what is that thing called again?)

Thanks in advance!


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## jw2170 (Jan 24, 2008)

Welcome to the forum.

Predictably, I will recommend a router.

And, yes IMO, a small sled is better than a miter gauge.... (unless you bite the bullet on a really good miter gauge - does your table saw have a proper 3/4" slot?)


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## Mike (Nov 22, 2004)

Start by reading the sticky threads at the top of each section of the forums. They are loaded with good information which will help you make your decision.


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## kjackson82 (Mar 25, 2013)

jw2170 said:


> Welcome to the forum.
> 
> Predictably, I will recommend a router.
> 
> And, yes IMO, a small sled is better than a miter gauge.... (unless you bite the bullet on a really good miter gauge - does your table saw have a proper 3/4" slot?)


Thanks

Yes, it has 3/4" slots.


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## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

Welcome to the forum KJ. I wouldn't do without my crosscut sled. I like the out feed table on my table saw too but I have the room for it. You could get by with out feed rollers which can be folded up and stowed out of the way when you don't need them. You could also use a router table for an out feed table too. You could then use the fence on the router table as an extension fence with your TS fence. You would just have to set your TS fence and then use a long straight edge to run your router fence up to it.

Since you have been doing okay without the miter saw, I would say router would be next. With a few edge profiling bits you can really dress your projects up. As you say, the TS can make good cuts with the right jigs and the speed square is good for the long stuff but if you don't have a fine tooth blade for the circular saw I would get one.


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## carlp. (Nov 3, 2012)

*Welcome to the forum*

welcome K J this forum is a good place to get the advice you require.regards carl


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## mgmine (Jan 16, 2012)

I would say the miter saw and and a 12" one if you can afford it. You will find that the first tool you go to will be the table saw the second tool I go to is the miter saw. A router is a great tool but the wood needs to be cut to size before you take it to the router. Plus there will be far more things that need to be cut accurately to size then will need to be routed in any way shape or form. Days, weeks or months may go by without you ever turning the router on.


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## kjackson82 (Mar 25, 2013)

Mike said:


> Start by reading the sticky threads at the top of each section of the forums. They are loaded with good information which will help you make your decision.



Thanks Mike, I have read all of the stickies (noticing you wrote most of them:agree but still wanted to make sure I am going in the right direction. 

So i am looking at the Bosch 1617evspk. I have had good luck with Bosch products so I will stick with em.

I spent 8 years as a machinist running vertical and horizontal mills, lathes, precision grinders and some CNC equipment and while doing so, put myself through school getting an industrial electricity associates degree and have been a mechanical/electrical technician for Mars food for the last 4 years. I have a pretty technical background and good grounds for building/machining. So now on to building a zero clearance insert and a sled for my table saw. *Would the sled plans for these cabinet saws also work for my smaller portable bosch? And out of all the different plans is there one that just stands above all others for you? I know it has 3/4" slots. And also, a good table saw and circular saw blade that Lowes carries?*


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## kjackson82 (Mar 25, 2013)

mgmine said:


> I would say the miter saw and and a 12" one if you can afford it. You will find that the first tool you go to will be the table saw the second tool I go to is the miter saw. A router is a great tool but the wood needs to be cut to size before you take it to the router. Plus there will be far more things that need to be cut accurately to size then will need to be routed in any way shape or form. Days, weeks or months may go by without you ever turning the router on.


But couldn't I clean up my circular saw cuts, create joints, and trim angles to correct degrees with the router? Please explain your reasoning a little more. I need a really good reason not to spend 200 on a router vs the 400 to 800 for a 12" dual bevel, sliding miter saw!


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## Mike (Nov 22, 2004)

KJ, if all you are planning on doing is installing trim then a miter saw is your priority. If you want to do woodworking a router is the way to go and the 1617EVSPK is a great place to start. Woodsmith just emailed out a very nice plan for building a table saw sled and it should be available for download on their site.

You do not need a sled for a router table, it is easy enough to guide off your fence.


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## MEBCWD (Jan 14, 2012)

Hi Keith,

Just my opinion but you have 2 saws now and can use them for 80 to 90 percent of your needed cuts without adding any thing to them. I would go for the router so you will have more capabilities. I think your choice of routers is also a good choice.

As far as replacing your "pusher thing with the degrees on it" Look around and you will find plans and ideas for vary simple cheaply build sleds and also expensive to build sleds with all the bells and whistles. It will be your decision what kind you chose to build, maybe more than just 1, maybe several with specific uses and one that is adjustable.

What ever you go with let us see your projects, finished or in progress.

Work safe, Have fun, Cut some wood,


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## kjackson82 (Mar 25, 2013)

So i won't need to scale these table saw sled plans (any plans, not just the onw mike mentioned from woodsmith) down any for my portable saw? They should all fit nicely on the saw without any issues?


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## Semipro (Mar 22, 2013)

Kieth
Every shop need a good table saw,now if you are going to build large construction type jobs buy the miter saw, but if you plan on cabinets and furniture and crafts you will need a good router maybe more then one (one table and hand held) usually I find a project to build and to learn another technique on woodworking then buy the tools I need to build it.
If it was me I buy the router first but I am down the road you will want the miter saw 
John. PS down the way you will own a lot of tools


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## MEBCWD (Jan 14, 2012)

kjackson82 said:


> So i won't need to scale these table saw sled plans (any plans, not just the onw mike mentioned from woodsmith) down any for my portable saw? They should all fit nicely on the saw without any issues?


Keith,

You might have to adjust some of the dimensions for the sled plan you choose to fit your saw but it shouldn't be a problem once you get the plan and look at what the plan calls for. Most of the plans will let you know when a particular dimension is dependent on your particular saw's specs.


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## kjackson82 (Mar 25, 2013)

Ok, router it is. I have been getting along ok with my larger construction type building with the two saws i have. I have lots of scrap pine and red oak to start fooling with too. Next question, most of these sleds i see built are being built with router tables and i see router tables being built with a router table too. *So should i start by building a sled for the table saw or building a router table? And is it possible to do without the use of a existing router table? Also, any recommendations on good saw blades from lowes that i can fit my table saw and circular saw with?*


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## MEBCWD (Jan 14, 2012)

kjackson82 said:


> Ok, router it is. I have been getting along ok with my larger construction type building with the two saws i have. I have lots of scrap pine and red oak to start fooling with too. Next question, most of these sleds i see built are being built with router tables and i see router tables being built with a router table too. *So should i start by building a sled for the table saw or building a router table? And is it possible to do without the use of a existing router table? Also, any recommendations on good saw blades from lowes that i can fit my table saw and circular saw with?*


If you build a sled first you can use it to help build a router table. If you build a router table first you can use it to help build a sled.:haha:

The sled will be a smaller project so I would probably build the sled first while you think about what kind of router table you would like to build.

As far as saw blades go you need to look for a good rip blade, a good cross cut blade and a good combination blade. If you can only afford one blade right now get the combination blade. For the next blade you need to consider what you do the most of rip or crosscut. If you buy cheap blades they will dull quicker. Some of the cheap blades can't be resharpened where as a quality blade can be resharpened several times and often save you money in the long run.


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## Mike (Nov 22, 2004)

Keith, most of the time I leave a Freud Diablo red combination blade on my table saw. This is a 10" blade with 50 teeth and it has a 1/8" kerf. Priced around $40 this blade has cut many types of wood, plywood, high density particle board, 1/4" plastic and Formica cleanly. (Actually I use Freud's Diablo blades on all my saws)

The weather is starting to break here and I am going to try a new saw blade with similar specs: This one is from Guhdo-Gmaxx and it features a black proprietary coating. Guhdo-Gmaxx also produces a limited selection of router bits with this coating.


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## kjackson82 (Mar 25, 2013)

Well i was hoping to pick one up at Lowe's after work. They carry CMT blades with an orange coating? Any input on them or any others that Lowe's carries? Wife and I just had a baby two weeks ago and if i have a saw blade shipped then she knows, if i pick it up at lowe's it goes straight in the shop!


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## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

CMT makes very good cutting tools, as does Freud and Amana. Most say that Forrester make the best saw blades.
I didn't use a router to make my sled. I just cut a piece of hardwood 3/8 x 3/4 hardwood and screwed it to the bottom of a piece of ply. I did need the TS and the router to make the router table.


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## jw2170 (Jan 24, 2008)

RE:


> Would the sled plans for these cabinet saws also work for my smaller portable bosch


? 

Keith, I was able to construct a table saw for my GMC benchtop table saw, so I see no reason that you could not make one for the Bosch saw.

http://www.routerforums.com/jigs-fixtures/17843-my-new-sled.html


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## Mike (Nov 22, 2004)

HD carries the red Freud blades.


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## kjackson82 (Mar 25, 2013)

Ok, so now Bosch router, CMT blade and table saw sled we go!


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## kjackson82 (Mar 25, 2013)

Mike said:


> HD carries the red Freud blades.



No HD around me. Lucky to have the Lowes! I am dead center middle of no where. 2.5 hours to Jackson, MS... 2.5 hours to Memphis, TN and 2.5 hours to Little Rock, AR!


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## kjackson82 (Mar 25, 2013)

Well i went by lowe's on my way home and what do you know, no Bosch router in stock and no CMT blades carried in store. I did do some looking around and checked their selection of router bits. They carry Skil and Bosch bits. How do the Bosch bits rank?


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## Mike (Nov 22, 2004)

Keith, you are way better off ordering bits from MLCS.com with free shipping. Router bits is one thing Bosch does not do well; this is why they bought Freud bits and blades.


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## Phil P (Jul 25, 2010)

mgmine said:


> I would say the miter saw and and a 12" one if you can afford it.


Well I'd agree with the choice of tool - a crosscut is much more useful than a sled on a table saw IMHO - which really isn't going to be much use should the OP ever need to crosscut anything of any length (such as a full-size door stile or a flooring joist), but why do you say that a 12in saw is best, Art? Size isn't everything! In my own line (carpenter/joiner) I find that my 8-1/2in SCMS can do 80% of the cuts I need whilst my 10in SCMS will do almost 100% of the cuts I need. I've only needed a 12in saw twice in the last 10 years - and that was for massive bespoke cornice (crown) mouldings - a real one-off job. 12 in saws also have a tendency to flex a bit more than the smaller ones on bevel cuts (not just my experience, but that of every professional woodworker I've ever talked to on this subject) as well as the blades costing a lot more. These days I tend to use the 8-1/2in saw as my "go to" - smaller, lighter and will handle many trim jobs alons. The 10in saw mainly comes out for kitchen jobs where ther are large cornice (crown) mouldings to handle

Regards

Phil


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## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

Mike said:


> Keith, you are way better off ordering bits from MLCS.com with free shipping. Router bits is one thing Bosch does not do well; this is why they bought Freud bits and blades.


Skil and Bosch are made in the same factory. I don't know how the 2 compare, maybe the Skil is a slightly lower quality than the Bosch. Milwaukee is made by Freud so that's what you are actually buying. That's why some Milwaukee bits have the quad-cut technology. 

What is the downfall on the Bosch bits Mike? I've bought a few over the winter off ebay and haven't had a chance to use any of them yet. They look good enough,; decently thick carbide, sharpened well, etc.


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## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

Phil P said:


> ... why do you say that a 12in saw is best, Art? Size isn't everything! In my own line (carpenter/joiner) I find that my 8-1/2in SCMS can do 80% of the cuts I need whilst my 10in SCMS will do almost 100% of the cuts I need. I've only needed a 12in saw twice in the last 10 years - and that was for massive bespoke cornice (crown) mouldings - a real one-off job. 12 in saws also have a tendency to flex a bit more than the smaller ones on bevel cuts (not just my experience, but that of every professional woodworker I've ever talked to on this subject) as well as the blades costing a lot more. These days I tend to use the 8-1/2in saw as my "go to" - smaller, lighter and will handle many trim jobs alons. The 10in saw mainly comes out for kitchen jobs where ther are large cornice (crown) mouldings to handle
> 
> Regards
> 
> Phil


Phil, do you find the 8 1/2" to more accurate than the 10"? I've heard this from people who have used both. I personally find a standard chop saw to be more accurate than sliders. Have you had any experience with the new extended reach saw that hinges instead of sliding?


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## Phil P (Jul 25, 2010)

Cherryville Chuck said:


> do you find the 8 1/2" to more accurate than the 10"? I've heard this from people who have used both. I personally find a standard chop saw to be more accurate than sliders. Have you had any experience with the new extended reach saw that hinges instead of sliding?


Hi Charles

I don't think there is much in it between the 8-1/2in and the 10in SCMSs I have (deWalt and Makita respectively) - the main reason for having the 8-1/2in for trim work is that it is considerably smaller and lighter, a big issue when you carry the tool back and forth to the van twice a day for weeks on some jobs. I've had the opportunity in the past to compare the Makita 12in SCMS against both a DW618 and the 10in Makita side-by-side. I found the Makita 12in saw was more rigid than the DW 12in model and that the 10in saw was better than either with only a small amount of cut capacity loss - to the point at which for the odd cut where it isn't big enough I'll get the saw to do 90% of the cut and finish with a hand saw and block plane - but I must emphasise that it's a very rare occurrence. Before anyone starst on that their 12in doesn't flex I should point out that what I am referring to in particular is bevel cuts (to full width) NOT mitre cuts and that those cuts tax most saws. I agree with you that a non-slider, being more rigid than a slider will be more accurate still, but they don't have the crosscut capacity I need for stuff like shelves, floorboards, flooring joists, etc. Even the little DW can tackle most of that sort of stuff I come across

By the _"extended reach saw that hinges instead of sliding"_ I presume that you mean the Bosch GCM12GDL?








I've not had the chance to try one, although I know someone who bought one, so I've had a little play with his. A couple of impressions; it's a phyiscally large saw, and heavy, especially when mounted on that Gravity-Rise base (we call those the GTA2500W here, catchy!) and you do need it on one of those mobile bases to move it around without doing yourself a mischief. Because they are so big I came to the conclusion that I'd need to go 1 size up in van to carry one with a consequent increase in insurance, road tax, fuel and other running costs, etc. Needless to say that has put me right off the idea. The pair of folding arms at right angles should hopefully reduce the tendency to flex when making bevel cuts, but he's not done enough work yet to be able to confirm or deny this. One thing he did comment on, though, is the extra cost of buying 12in blades over 10in ones - perhaps not an issue for a home shop, but each of my saws has 4 or 5 blades with it so it is an issue for me and other tradesmen. Were I doing a lot of roof framing or structural woodworking it might be worth a punt, but as it stands I for one am not interested at present

Regards

Phil


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## Mike (Nov 22, 2004)

Many router bits are made in the same factory but each brand has it's own specifications for quality. Different grinds on the carbide too. The only bit with a bad report so far in the router bit testing was a Bosch that had a burr on it. In most cases MLCS bits are less expensive than Bosch bits and similar quality. Which would you choose?


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## kjackson82 (Mar 25, 2013)

Mike said:


> Many router bits are made in the same factory but each brand has it's own specifications for quality. Different grinds on the carbide too. The only bit with a bad report so far in the router bit testing was a Bosch that had a burr on it. In most cases MLCS bits are less expensive than Bosch bits and similar quality. Which would you choose?


After some anonymous input, I think I will try some Whiteside bits. The source seems to be well informed in the router bit world.

Edit: Scratch that, I need to do some more research as to needing the bushings and other accessories. Don't think I will be able to tie that much money up in bits right off the bat. Is there a good quality bit between the MLCS and Whiteside or should I start with MLCS bits?


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## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

Hi, Keith; why a 12" SCMS? I've got a couple of 10" mitre saws and can't really say that's ever caused me any inconvenience. They're sure easier to pack around!
The mitre saw will allow you to very efficiently and accurately chop material to length, repeat cuts precisely, cut deep material, easily cut material to 12" wide. With the right blade, designed expressly for mitre saws, your cuts will be glass smooth. It's my first choice when I'm crosscutting; 2nd choice is my TS, LAST choice would be my router. 
The router can do a lot of things, just not always as efficiently as other tool choices.


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## kjackson82 (Mar 25, 2013)

DaninVan said:


> Hi, Keith; why a 12" SCMS? I've got a couple of 10" mitre saws and can't really say that's ever caused me any inconvenience. They're sure easier to pack around!
> The mitre saw will allow you to very efficiently and accurately chop material to length, repeat cuts precisely, cut deep material, easily cut material to 12" wide. With the right blade, designed expressly for mitre saws, your cuts will be glass smooth. It's my first choice when I'm crosscutting; 2nd choice is my TS, LAST choice would be my router.
> The router can do a lot of things, just not always as efficiently as other tool choices.



I won't be packing it around any so the mobility factor won't play into my decision. That being said, I am not set on a 12" though it was recommended earlier in this thread. For now, I see myself getting more use out of the router as I don't have many construction type projects come up. My current project is a Keezer (google "Keezer 5ive" for real similar project) for my homebrew, which other than my work bench has been my largest project. I see myself working on a lot of smaller projects such as small boxes, a decent tool storage unit along with just stuff to keep me busy in the shop. Plus, it won't be too long before my wife starts talking about a swing set for our daughter and sounds like a really good time to slide in a nice 12" table saw, if i don't end up with one before then!


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## Mike (Nov 22, 2004)

The MLCS 15 piece bit set is a good way to start. As these bits wear out you can replace them with Whiteside. Woodcraft offers a different Whiteside bit each month for 25% off.


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## kjackson82 (Mar 25, 2013)

Mike said:


> The MLCS 15 piece bit set is a good way to start. As these bits wear out you can replace them with Whiteside. Woodcraft offers a different Whiteside bit each month for 25% off.


MLCS 15 piece for $47 or the WoodRiver 10 piece for $87? Which would you suggest?


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## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

"...slide in a nice 12" table saw"
Keith; you can probably count on two hands, the members here who have 12" saws.
Not that they don't want one...we'd all like a Rolls as well...it's just that they're commercial quality machines, heavy, expensive, and require a lot of HP to run them. Just the physics of applying a lot of friction 12" out from the arbor eats up the HP.
Did I mention that the blades are expensive?
In my 4+ decades of construction and woodworking I've never had a 12" saw of any type, and never missed not having one 
(doesn't mean that I wouldn't buy one if I won Lotto 6/49... but then I'd also be building a 30' shop with all the bells and whistles!).


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## kjackson82 (Mar 25, 2013)

DaninVan said:


> "...slide in a nice 12" table saw"
> Keith; you can probably count on two hands, the members here who have 12" saws.
> Not that they don't want one...we'd all like a Rolls as well...it's just that they're commercial quality machines, heavy, expensive, and require a lot of HP to run them. Just the physics of applying a lot of friction 12" out from the arbor eats up the HP.
> Did I mention that the blades are expensive?
> ...



Yeah i haven't done a whole lot of homework table saws yet. Once i get to feeling like it is a "must have" item then i will start researching. For now, i think the router will get a heck of a lot more use than a third saw for my ideas. Like i said before, I've become pretty good at using my circular saw and table saw for all my projects but after all the comments and some thinking on the matter, I believe a 10" is what i will be researching!


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## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

Keith, I have a 10" Unisaw with 52" cut and I love it but I have a big shop and the Unisaw requires a hefty portion of it. A good contractors saw will do pretty much all the same things, maybe just a little slower, and takes up a lot less room and is much easier on the pocketbook at about 1/2 the price or less. And if you need to move a contractors saw you can, a cabinet saw isn't that easy. As far as routers go, get a good quality one and either get a combo set or buy a plunge. A plunge will do anything a fixed base will but it doesn't work the other way.


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## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

Thanks for the reply Phil. I had used a Dewalt 12" at a fireplace mantel shop I worked at for a little while. I wasn't particularly impressed with it. Like you say, it seems like overkill and it felt like it would flex a bit. We didn't use it to cut most of our moldings with. The average crown moldings (and trim moldings) were cut on standard chop saws by aligning one flat to the table and the other flat to the fence so that only a vertical 45 degree chop was necessary. Once in a while I saw someone use the Dewalt to cut very wide crown that couldn't be cut any other way. The other thing I found about the Dewalt is that I always needed to check the bevel before I used it in vertical position. The scale was impossible to read unless you were tall like myself (6' 2"/188cm). It was rarely reset to 90 degrees.

I haven't used an 8 1/2" but I have a 10" slider and it will do a decent job of cutting miters but not as good as my old Makita 10" chopsaw. For moldings the chopsaw will cut 99% of all that I ever need to do but the slider is handy for shelving and wide lumber. I haven't even had a chance to put my hands on the Bosch hinge job yet where I live, but from an engineering standpoint, a knuckle joint should be more stable than a pair of spring steel rods. I would like to have the best of both, long reach and deadly accurate but I think and will give the Bosch some more time to prove itself and give me some more time to think about size and weight as well. Thanks again for your comments.


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## mgmine (Jan 16, 2012)

kjackson82 said:


> But couldn't I clean up my circular saw cuts, create joints, and trim angles to correct degrees with the router? Please explain your reasoning a little more. I need a really good reason not to spend 200 on a router vs the 400 to 800 for a 12" dual bevel, sliding miter saw!


From my experience you will never use a router to clean up circular saw cuts or make joints or trim angles. To do any of these would require setting up the router with a special bit and then adjusting it then testing the cut and possibly adjusting it more and so on. Do this a few times and you will be sick of the time it takes to get one board made let alone a whole project. What you will do with your router most of the time will be to make a fancy edge on a board. You will find that you will seldom make a mortise or cut a circle but you will always find that you need to cut a board to length, square an end up or cut a miter. You can do this on a table saw but the miter saw is so much easier. You don't have to spend $400 to $800 and you don't need a sliding miter saw. A router is a specialty tool and what it does it does well. A jointer is a specialty tool and it does its job well. I have both and can't tell you when was that I used ether of them but I can tell you that I used my miter saw twice last week and my table saw about six times. By all means get a router if not your work will never get to the next level but don't expect to use it that often. Just MHO.


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## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

"...haven't even had a chance to put my hands on the Bosch hinge job yet "
My local lumberyard threatened to call Security if i didn't stop drooling on theirs.


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## kjackson82 (Mar 25, 2013)

Well I have been pretty busy the last few months with the new baby and all. I have made some significant progress though as I have acquired a Dewalt DWS780 with the DWX723 heavy duty stand (Amazon for $427), Bosch 1617 evspk (Amazon $189), Bosch adapters for PC bushings, Bosch 3pc dust collection kit, Bosch edge guide, MLCS 15 Bit Set, Woodcraft Brass Bushings.

Now, I have been working on getting my 12x14 shop in order by taking the 1/2 OSB and 1/2 Peg board down and insulating and sheetrocking the whole shop. The existing shop had some old cabinets that had pretty much been destroyed by someone using the wrong wood screws with out drilling pilot holes so the face frame had been cracked and split in a few places. I disassembled them and sanded, which now leads me to my second point/question, and created a mess along with noticing my lungs weren't working as they should for the next few days. So now i am working on a dust collection system. 

I have been reading several forums and articles and have pretty much come to the conclusion that I will just collect the larger chips and exhaust the fine dust to the outside of the shop as the cheaper dust collectors such as HF, Grizzly, etc.. tend to come with 30 micron bags and going down to a 1 micron would strain the motor. I have a squirrel cage fan out of a commercial unit that runs on 220v that I am going to use to remove the dust/fine particles and exhaust outside. Once i have adequate dust collection I will begin building all the rolling cabinets for the table saw, miter saw, router table, and two tables that will be used as infeed/outfeed and miter saw wings. 

Any input on any of my plans would be appreciated, just wanted to let everyone know that i haven't gone AWAL! Just been extremely busy as a first time dad and trying like hell to get the shop ready to use, I can't wait to get to the point were i can walk in and everything be in its place and ready to sling some chips!


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## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

"...I can't wait to get to the point were i can walk in and everything be in its place and ready to sling some chips!"

Heh...we can all dream!


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