# Trouble With Stuck Bit (sort of)



## AirWeaver (Dec 3, 2019)

First post here, and it’s a challenge for the collective wisdom and experience of you fine folks!

I have a Dewalt 625 in a table. I added the Xtreme Xtension by Router Technologies. (Router Raizer still in the box waiting for me to tackle that installation.)

I used it a few times, then my shop time went to zero for nearly a year. Now I can’t get the xtension out of the router. This wouldn’t bother me too much as I intend to keep it in there permanently. This is a dedicated table router, especially once I install the raizer,

But the 1/2 to 1/4 collet reducer is also stuck. I wouldn’t have noticed until I realized that putting a bit in it did not result in any kind of tightening. So it won’t hold a bit, but it won’t come out either. The set screw is out, so that being tight is not the problem.

I have sprayed it with Freeze-off by CRC. I cannot get it to move. (Freeze off is more of a lubricant than actual freezing agent, though it does have a small freezing effect at the outset. It is mostly for cutting through rust. It is what I had on hand. 

I am at a loss here. I’m not very mechanically inclined, so I don’t have much experience in getting stuck metals apart without destroying them. I have ordered a replacement collet reducer, they are cheap enough, but I need to get this one out without destroying the xtension. I bought mine in rockler over a year ago for about 75, they are now over 90.

I am thinking of putting the whole thing in the freezer for an hour then trying to remove it. But I wanted to check in with others before I do something like that. 

Any advice?


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

welcome N/A...

for the Xtension; I believe the wedge is jammed into the reducer...









The wedge and bolt work together to secure retain the cutter in the extension.
screw the set screw into the wedge a tad and lightly hit the head of the screw to knock the wedge loose... 

as for the router see the PDF....

after you get everything apart clean everything better than really well..
see the maint PDF...

.


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## AirWeaver (Dec 3, 2019)

Stick486 said:


> welcome N/A...
> 
> for the Xtension;* mechanically spread it open ever so gently..*
> as for the router see the PDF....
> ...


Thank you for the fast reply.... I confess my ignorance, I have no idea how to go about the bolded part. I don’t even know what tool I should be looking for. I have been trying to hook it from underneath via the recommended paperclip method (From the manualj, and that didn’t budge, so I found something like a dental pick with a handle, and still nothing.


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

AirWeaver said:


> Thank you for the fast reply.... I confess my ignorance, I have no idea how to go about the bolded part. I don’t even know what tool I should be looking for. I have been trying to hook it from underneath via the recommended paperclip method (From the manualj, and that didn’t budge, so I found something like a dental pick with a handle, and still nothing.


see the edited post...


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

AirWeaver said:


> Thank you for the fast reply.... I confess my ignorance, I have no idea how to go about the bolded part. I don’t even know what tool I should be looking for. I have been trying to hook it from underneath via the recommended paperclip method (From the manualj, and that didn’t budge, so I found something like a dental pick with a handle, and still nothing.


you do stand a chance of damaging something w/ that dental pick...


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## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

Hi Air Weaver and welcome. Regarding using the extension all the time: imagine that the armature/router extension in your router is a lever. The bottom bearing would be the fulcrum. The longer the distance from the bottom bearing to the force being applied by the router bit the more force being applied to the bottom bearing and also the top bearing. Moral to the story: if you don't really need the extra length then I would recommend not using it. Also members have stated that it vibrated badly when using larger diameter bits.


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## AirWeaver (Dec 3, 2019)

Stick486 said:


> see the edited post...


Ah, ok, I re-read it now. Unfortunately the wedge is already out. I removed the screw and wedge easily. But this collet reducer is stuck like Fleck’s tongue on a flagpole in A Christmas Story.


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## AirWeaver (Dec 3, 2019)

Cherryville Chuck said:


> Hi Air Weaver and welcome. Regarding using the extension all the time: imagine that the armature/router extension in your router is a lever. The bottom bearing would be the fulcrum. The longer the distance from the bottom bearing to the force being applied by the router bit the more force being applied to the bottom bearing and also the top bearing. Moral to the story: if you don't really need the extra length then I would recommend not using it. Also members have stated that it vibrated badly when using larger diameter bits.


I installed it so that I could change bits over the top of the table instead of under, and I am starting to see why that “feature” is not a good idea. 

I am ready to abandon the whole idea of the extension based on this feedback. But as it is still stuck in my router I am still in a quandary as to how to get it out without damaging the router.


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

AirWeaver said:


> Ah, ok, I re-read it now. Unfortunately the wedge is already out. I removed the screw and wedge easily. But this collet reducer is stuck like Fleck’s tongue on a flagpole in A Christmas Story.


use heat from a hair dryer...


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## AirWeaver (Dec 3, 2019)

Stick486 said:


> use heat from a hair dryer...


I have a heat gun, so even better!

I was under the impression that heat expands metal though, so I assume this is to apply to the extender, not the collet reducer stuck in the middle?


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

AirWeaver said:


> I have a heat gun, so even better!
> 
> I was under the impression that heat expands metal though, so I assume this is to apply to the extender, not the collet reducer stuck in the middle?


soldering iron works well too...
more concentrated heat...


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

@AirWeaver ...
aka N/A...
would you fill out you basic profile...


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## JFPNCM (Dec 13, 2009)

Is it possible that the router collet is one which still holds the bit tight even though the nut appears to be “loose”. My Dewalt works that way. I loosen the nut initially with a wrench, turn it a few times and it seems to tighten again and the bit can not be removed. A second short turn with the wrench pops it loose and the bit can easily be removed. 

The above is my version of the instructions in Stick’s pdf on how a collect works.

Note this applies only to removing the extension from the router not the reducer from the extension.


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## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

Heat will often break the bond that is holding them. Penetrating fluid may help too. It's probably a tiny bit of corrosion that holding them together.


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## AirWeaver (Dec 3, 2019)

Stick486 said:


> @AirWeaver ...
> aka N/A...
> would you fill out you basic profile...


I added my name, everything else was entered last night but some fields didn’t populate with a brand new account.


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## AirWeaver (Dec 3, 2019)

JFPNCM said:


> Is it possible that the router collet is one which still holds the bit tight even though the nut appears to be “loose”. My Dewalt works that way. I loosen the nut initially with a wrench, turn it a few times and it seems to tighten again and the bit can not be removed. A second short turn with the wrench pops it loose and the bit can easily be removed.
> 
> The above is my version of the instructions in Stick’s pdf on how a collect works.
> 
> Note this applies only to removing the extension from the router not the reducer from the extension.


I did indeed turn further and it loosened, sort of.... now the collet cover (nut?] is sitting as far uo as I think it can go, most threads on the router are now visible. But the extender and nut still will not budge. I keep turning, and it doesn’t seem to go up at all, i can turn it freely with my fingers fir kess than a rotation, then it feels like it engages the threads again, then spins off. So i am rather confident I have it screwed off all the way, still stuck.

I would post pictures but I haven’t gotten to 10 posts yet, so my account is prevented from doing so.


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## JFPNCM (Dec 13, 2009)

I would follow The advice from Stick and Chuck to proceed then.


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## gmercer_48083 (Jul 18, 2012)

Andy, If the photo is on your computer, you can upload it (no waiting). You must have 10 posts before you can post a link (url) from the internet.


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## AirWeaver (Dec 3, 2019)

gmercer_48083 said:


> Andy, If the photo is on your computer, you can upload it (no waiting). You must have 10 posts before you can post a link (url) from the internet.





gmercer_48083 said:


> Andy, If the photo is on your computer, you can upload it (no waiting). You must have 10 posts before you can post a link (url) from the internet.



Ah, ok, trying it now----- current state of affairs. Heat gun caused damage to the plate from the table. Still no movement of either piece, but I am now mostly just focused on getting the whole extender out. I can deal with the collet sizer on its own after that. 

Am I going to have to disassemble the whole router? I am getting the feeling that is the only direction to go. Getting a grip on the extender to pull with any strength is a challenge with the taper. I have a set of pin pullers, but none fit under it really.


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## AirWeaver (Dec 3, 2019)

JFPNCM said:


> I would follow The advice from Stick and Chuck to proceed then.


I got a lot of damage to the table insert material with the heat gun so i paused that method. I can unscrew that easily and retry heat, but before I do that I want to figure out how I will even get a hold of the extender to pull it out. I'm really at a loss.


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## Nickp (Dec 4, 2012)

You could try putting a length of 1/2" rod to act like a bit to create a handle. You could also try jiggling it with the 1/2" stock in place and see if it loosens...


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## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

Try tapping sideways on the extender and rotate as you do. It may take a while. As in up to 10 minutes. Use something about the size of a 3/4" wrench.


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## Nickp (Dec 4, 2012)

Cherryville Chuck said:


> Try tapping sideways on the extender and rotate as you do. It may take a while. As in up to 10 minutes. Use something about the size of a 3/4" wrench.



I had a feeling we were getting close to discussing hammers...:grin:


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## AirWeaver (Dec 3, 2019)

Cherryville Chuck said:


> Try tapping sideways on the extender and rotate as you do. It may take a while. As in up to 10 minutes. Use something about the size of a 3/4" wrench.



Removing the set screw and wedge, there is a hole through the extender. I'll put the strongest thin rod through that I can and bang on that for a while


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

AirWeaver said:


> I did indeed turn further and it loosened, sort of.... now the collet cover (nut?] is sitting as far up as I think it can go, most threads on the router are now visible. But the extender and nut still will not budge. I keep turning, and it doesn’t seem to go up at all, i can turn it freely with my fingers fir kess than a rotation, then it feels like it engages the threads again, then spins off. So i am rather confident I have it screwed off all the way, still stuck.
> 
> *I would post pictures but I haven’t gotten to 10 posts yet, so my account is prevented from doing so.*


post pictures from the device yur posting from anytime...
don't need 10 posts...


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

AirWeaver said:


> I got a lot of damage to the table insert material with the heat gun so i paused that method. I can unscrew that easily and retry heat, but before I do that I want to figure out how I will even get a hold of the extender to pull it out. I'm really at a loss.


install a beat up large body ¼'' router bit in the extender...
use that to ''grab'' a hold of and put the extender under a bit of tension using a bearing puller or the ilk... 
*easy on the force...* it won't take much...
heat the router's collet w/ a soldering iron.. (remove all meltables 1st)...
hold the router shaft w/ the wrench...
now turn/spin the extender....
as the extender draws out keep loosening the collet nut...
when you see the collet... use a drift punch and tap on the collet shoulder forcing it up and out...

reasons why yur stuck...

over tightening...
shank bottomed out...
corrosion....
collet broken...


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## AirWeaver (Dec 3, 2019)

Stick486 said:


> i*nstall a beat up large body ¼'' router bit in the extender*...
> use that to ''grab'' a hold of and put the extender under a bit of tension using a bearing puller or the ilk...
> 
> reasons why yur stuck...
> ...


I can’t currently install a 1/4 inch bit in the extender. Nothing gets tight, ironically. That was how I discovered these issues. I tried to get the collet reducer out to reset it, then I realized how both elements were stuck. (Reducer, and extender)


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## DesertRatTom (Jul 3, 2012)

Looks to me that you might have bottomed the extension out in the motor shaft, not the collet. I don't have this router, but that's a lot of exposed thread and the collet is riding up that angle of the extension. I think you will have to lock the shaft, and then keep taking the entire collet off the shaft. The extension should go with it, if not, at least you will know the extension is stuck in the motor shaft, not the collet. Then you can look at heat, but don't overdo it. Collets work because they can close up a couple of thousandths, so the specs are very tight. At this point if you're not really a tech kind of guy, you might take it to a DeWalt service shop and have them try it. 

If you get it out, I'd replace the collet entirely. This one has been compromised. In future, remember you don't want to insert a bit or the extension all the way down to bottom in the collet. I put a half inch grommet (not O ring) so you never bottom out.

I do think your collet is toast, and I'd certainly NEVER use it again.


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

AirWeaver said:


> I can’t currently install a 1/4 inch bit in the extender. Nothing gets tight, ironically. That was how I discovered these issues. I tried to get the collet reducer out to reset it, then I realized how both elements were stuck. (Reducer, and extender)


ouch!!!
a Bearing Puller Jaw Wheel under the extenders shoulder...

.


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## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

I feel your pain, Andy. 
You've got the best minds you can rent workin' on it!


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## AirWeaver (Dec 3, 2019)

Stick486 said:


> ouch!!!
> a Bearing Puller Jaw Wheel under the extenders shoulder...
> 
> .


Thank you so much! This is what I envisioned in my head, not knowing what it was called. I will try to locate one of these while out and about today,


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## AirWeaver (Dec 3, 2019)

DesertRatTom said:


> Looks to me that you might have bottomed the extension out in the motor shaft, not the collet. I don't have this router, but that's a lot of exposed thread and the collet is riding up that angle of the extension. I think you will have to lock the shaft, and then keep taking the entire collet off the shaft. The extension should go with it, if not, at least you will know the extension is stuck in the motor shaft, not the collet. Then you can look at heat, but don't overdo it. Collets work because they can close up a couple of thousandths, so the specs are very tight. At this point if you're not really a tech kind of guy, you might take it to a DeWalt service shop and have them try it.
> 
> If you get it out, I'd replace the collet entirely. This one has been compromised. In future, remember you don't want to insert a bit or the extension all the way down to bottom in the collet. I put a half inch grommet (not O ring) so you never bottom out.
> 
> I do think your collet is toast, and I'd certainly NEVER use it again.


I will definitely get a new collet, that’s for sure. I put this all together before I really understood the complexities of routers. It does seem amazing to me that something so high powered with dangerous sharp things flying around so fast would not have a locking system more involved than basically squeezing a smooth round bit shaft and holding it tight. That’s how my layman mind thinks of it. 

If I don’t succeed with a bearing puller like Stick mentioned, I will try to locate a dewalt service shop. I didn’t even think such places existed. I know where to take my car, my lawn mower, my computer, but I assumed there really isn’t a similar place for power tools. But I live in Central PA where every other business is some kind of mechanical service, so this shouldn’t be too hard. I scored this router at an auction for under $100 but it’s a $300 replacement so I am not giving up on this.


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

AirWeaver said:


> I scored this router at an auction for under $100 but it’s a $300 replacement so I am not giving up on this.


you could up grade to a bosch...


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## AirWeaver (Dec 3, 2019)

I haven't had the chance to work on this for a day or so, but I had a random dangerous thought.....

How stupid would this be? - Since I'm trying to loosen the piece, not likely using it again, and the collet is assumed to be a lost cause.... would there be any benefit in turning on the router to spin it and see if it loosens at all? I'd point it toward a safe catch area or some kind of booth, in case it actually worked. 

Does even entertaining that thought indicate I might not want to spend much more time around power tools? >


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## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

I wouldn't risk it. Remember that it's spinning at 20,000 plus rpm just before it launches. And there is no way of knowing where it will be pointed if it lets go. It's not going straight out. It will be at some angle. Try the tapping on it trick I suggested first.


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

AirWeaver said:


> I haven't had the chance to work on this for a day or so,_ but I had a random dangerous thought....._
> 
> *How stupid would this be?* - Since I'm trying to loosen the piece, not likely using it again, and the collet is assumed to be a lost cause.... would there be any benefit in turning on the router to spin it and see if it loosens at all? I'd point it toward a safe catch area or some kind of booth, in case it actually worked.
> 
> *Does even entertaining that thought indicate I might not want to spend much more time around power tools?* >


I guess so...
MUCH!!!! as in YIKES!!!...
yup....


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

Cherryville Chuck said:


> I wouldn't risk it. Remember that it's spinning at 20,000 plus rpm just before it launches. And there is no way of knowing where it will be pointed if it lets go. It's not going straight out. It will be at some angle. Try the tapping on it trick I suggested first.


add a fuzz of tension w/ the puller to the tapping trick...


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## AirWeaver (Dec 3, 2019)

OK, I wasn't really going to try to spin it out via the motor......

I found a local guy who works on power tools as a side hobby. It's in his hands. He's likely to charge me less to get this taken care of than I would spend on the tools I'd need to do it. I'll hopefully hear back with a day or two.


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## LeftFinger (Mar 21, 2019)

I've had that happen . I loosen the collet and tap the router with bit on a piece of hardwood (as drive the bit in a little) works every time for me.


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## AirWeaver (Dec 3, 2019)

LeftFinger said:


> I've had that happen . I loosen the collet and tap the router with bit on a piece of hardwood (as drive the bit in a little) works every time for me.



Turns out that was all it took. I was afraid to "tap" because my history with tapping things usually ends up with broken tools. A friend of a friend took it to his shop and got everything apart in no time. I'm rocking and rolling (and routing) again!


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## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

I've had a couple of times when whacking the bit with some hardwood didn't work and I had to go to the tapping method. If you were worried about breaking something then your version of tapping is my version of giving it forceful whacks.


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

or pounding the snot out of it...


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## DesertRatTom (Jul 3, 2012)

Snot my idea of a good thing to do to unstick stuff.


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## pal (Feb 13, 2008)

That sounds very much like me Stick lol


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## JFPNCM (Dec 13, 2009)

Don’t use force just get a bigger hammer.


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

JFPNCM said:


> Don’t use force just get a bigger hammer.


.


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## JFPNCM (Dec 13, 2009)

That works.


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## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

Stick486 said:


> .


Something will come loose, guaranteed.


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## dbur (Apr 10, 2010)

To unstick an object in a collet I always ovoid tightening them fully inserted to the bottom of the hole. Then if it sticks you can easily crack it loose with a tap from a block of wood.


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