# Fence squareness



## scribble79 (May 10, 2014)

I was working on my router table last evening preparing to route for my miter slot and t track and noted the fence wasn't nice and square. I measured this Morning and it is approximately .027 out at the top. The fence is 4" tall to give an idea of how much out of square over how much run. I'm sure this is probably not the end of thr world just looking for thoughts. Pic attached










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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

is table square to the bit...
verify this 1st...


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## scribble79 (May 10, 2014)

I believe I understand your question but am trying to visualize the process of that. 


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

I went back and edited...

put a verified straight ½'' drill bit in the router and check the table for squareness to the bit...... 
drill rod is better than a bit and you can check for run out while yur in there...
also, it won't hurt to check the table for flatness...

see if you have sawdust built up behind the sacrificial face on your fence..
another thing.. is your square square...
those styles/types of square are known to be out of square.. brand new...
I like verified USA made Swanson speed square...

*please do not turn the router on or work on any of this with it plugged in...*


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## scribble79 (May 10, 2014)

OK I understand about the bit vs table 90 deg squareness. I thought you were saying make sure the bit and fence were both vertical which i couldn't get my head wrapped around. I did remove the sacrificial and verified the sacrificial are flat and square even double checked the t slot I cut. The fence without sacrificial is the same amount out from the table. I verified the table was flat. I will check the bit to table 90 and the run out of the router when I get home. I am unfortunately stuck at work till 2 and then most likely won't get back in the shop till around 8 pm and then of course I will probably get paged out for something and never make it back into the shop for the night.


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## Quillman (Aug 16, 2010)

Fence should be as straight and square as possible/practical.
Imagine if your material prep is <desirable.
Then the squareness of your work and the fence being < or > 90° will compound the error in the y-axis. So you might want a slot down the work, & it will vary from work-piece to work-piece depending on how the misshapen stock is presented to the cutter.
= Undesirable.


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

and then you use a known square square for all of this...
stop at an art store and pick up 90/45 and 30/60 drafting triangles..
good for tool/blade set ups too...
bigger is better and quality matters...

Alvin makes good ones...


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## scribble79 (May 10, 2014)

Quillman said:


> Fence should be as straight and square as possible/practical.
> Imagine if your material prep is <desirable.
> Then the squareness of your work and the fence being < or > 90° will compound the error in the y-axis. So you might want a slot down the work, & it will vary from work-piece to work-piece depending on how the misshapen stock is presented to the cutter.
> = Undesirable.


Can you expound on what you posted. I think I am missing something in your message.


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## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

I think Pat was referring to when you cut the parts out to make the fence. One option if everything proves that the fence is out of square is to shim it back to straight by adding strip(s) of veneer to the back edge. By the way, can you post a pic of the entire fence assembly just to make sure our suggestions will work Chris?
Also, one way to verify if your square is square is to put it on a straight edge piece of ply or mdf and scribe a line with a knife blade. Then flip the square over and see if you can scribe another line that exactly matches the first.


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## scribble79 (May 10, 2014)

So I used a drafting triangle with a sold steel rod as I didn't have a 1/2" drill bit with full 1/2" shank and no 1/2" bolts long enough. The router shaft is indeed tipped back a slight amount. I have attached pictures of my fence setup as well. 


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## scribble79 (May 10, 2014)

I did try using a 1/2" drill but and got the same results 


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## tomp913 (Mar 7, 2014)

- Rotate the shaft/rod 180° and see if there is any difference

- rotate the router motor 180° and see if there is any difference.

- Check that the mounting plate is flush with the top back and front as this could give the effect of the router not being perpendicular to the top.


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## scribble79 (May 10, 2014)

Ok so I've rotated my 1/2" rib and the gap didn't change. I removed the router from the table and am just trying to square router to plate. Appears to be .022 out at the 9" height mark. I did rotate the router base in the plate and double checked there were no barbs from the mounting holes and still nothing changed. I figured since the gap was .022 I would try shining the router base to the router plate in the direction I wanted it to move and noting changed. I am very baffled. Remove the router plate insert and checked vertical with only router base and its right on. Suspect plate but it doesn't make sense since rotating plate didn't change. Checked the plate for flatness and don't see any light shining through. 
Router run out is .005


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## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

I would that those are 2 separate and probably unrelated problems but both are a concern. Put an accurate square of the inside of the fence assembly and see if it is off square that way too. If it is then the gussets weren't 90* when you assembled the fence. As I said earlier you might be able to true it to very, very close if you add a strip of veneer at the back edge on the bottom of the fence and tip it forward.

Try turning the router shaft 1/2 turn and see if the problem remains the same or reverses where the square makes contact at the top and not the bottom. Whether it does that or not indicates 2 totally different problems.


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## scribble79 (May 10, 2014)

I did try the shaft at each 90 deg point till I reached 360 I just reinstalled the base to the plate and got .010 variance at 9" vertical on the shaft. I am thinking for wood working this is most likely acceptable. I had to remove the handles on the base for it to fit this way. 


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## scribble79 (May 10, 2014)

I placed a piece of laminate under the rear of my fence and checked square and the fence is square to table now. Just need to adhere it to fence for permanent usage.










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## paduke (Mar 28, 2010)

I am not trying to be snobbish but I never trust a tri square for square when doing set up I get confused but if I followed thread both the fence and router bit are out of square. Do you think your square might be the issue?
BTW nice looking table


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## scribble79 (May 10, 2014)

Tried 3 different "squares" even drafting triangles and all read the same


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

move the position of the fence several places w/ the laminate in place and validate squareness...


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## scribble79 (May 10, 2014)

Verified that the fence is square to the table in 7 separate locations from front to back of the table. Now the only issue is I'm getting a new router plate as I can't stand having to unscrew the reducer rings to change out and also makes it a pain to change bits above table


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## Bushwhacker (Jun 16, 2009)

Stick486 said:


> I went back and edited...
> 
> put a verified straight ½'' drill bit in the router and check the table for squareness to the bit......
> drill rod is better than a bit and you can check for run out while yur in there...
> ...


My thought exactly. Those type of squares have a slight bit of play to them, and with it run out to the maximum length it could have enough play to make that amount of off set. try to check the square of the table against the guide with a framing square or a speed square. Might save you a lot of fiddling with the guide adjustments.
Back when I was a Paramedic Instructor. I would tell my students, when looking at some ones EKG strip, to look for ponies, not unicorns.


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## mgmine (Jan 16, 2012)

Unless you are routing something tall like a raised panel it doesn't matter one bit if the fence is square. It also doesn't matter if the fence is parallel to the table. It also doesn't matter what direction the fence is placed on the table. The fence really doesn't have to be anything more than a 2x4 piece of wood clamped to the table with a notch cut out for the bit to pass through. What I like about a taller fence is exactly what you have done which is to hold a dust port.


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## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

Another bit for which squareness would be critical would be a 45 lock mitre. I'll also confess to having used a 2 by for a fence.


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

something came to mind...

is the plate flush to the table???
how about the insert being flush to everything...

what did you do to mount the router to the plate???
is the motor square to the base....


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## scribble79 (May 10, 2014)

Plate is flush to table checked with straight edge as light/feeler gauges. 
Flush to everything ????
Fixed router base is screwed to router plate without the plastic router face. Secured router face to plate with double sided tape and marked and drilled srews with countersinks. 
Can't answer last one either


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## TenGees (Sep 12, 2012)

I'm scared to check mine now, Chris. I might need one of those adjustable squares, recently mentioned on the forums. I've always 'assumed' my bits would be square to the plate.

I was thinking along the same lines as Chuck... shim the fence. I recently 'over-shimmed' my fence to see if I can put a slight bevel around the edges of a drawer face.

Good luck with this problem, I'll be watching this thread for updates.


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