# Half Fence For Table Saw Ripping



## JIMMIEM (Apr 4, 2010)

I just came across a table saw technique that I was unaware of.......use of a Half Fence. An article I saw said that Half Fences are a common feature on European table saws. To simulate the Half Fence on a Full Fence table saw a flat board is clamped to the rip fence...the board extends from the front end of the rip fence to the midpoint of the saw blade. Anybody tried it?


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## woodknots (Mar 7, 2012)

I think a half fence for cross cuts is a good idea (think Delta's UniFence that has the ability to slide backwards), but a half fence for ripping? What happens when your wood gets past the half way point and suddenly dives to the right because there's nothing to support it? There's a possibility that your piece would then ride up on the blade. You want a solid fence to support your piece all the way through a rip cut.
That's my opinion only - others may chime in and tell me I'm all washed up.


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## DesertRatTom (Jul 3, 2012)

For ripping? Sounds like a bad idea to me. Certainly for cross cuts where you don't want a small cutoff piece trapped against the fence. But you only need a piece for what is really serving as a stop block. Rockler sells a nifty little clamp to hold the block against the fence.


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## SteveMI (May 29, 2011)

All of of the European Table Saws that I have seen in Germany were sliding to meet some requirement. They had a Festool sliding table saw. 12 years since I have been there.
Steve.


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## tooler2 (Aug 11, 2012)

vchiarelli said:


> I think a half fence for cross cuts is a good idea (think Delta's UniFence that has the ability to slide backwards), but a half fence for ripping? What happens when your wood gets past the half way point and suddenly dives to the right because there's nothing to support it? There's a possibility that your piece would then ride up on the blade. You want a solid fence to support your piece all the way through a rip cut.
> That's my opinion only - others may chime in and tell me I'm all washed up.



Yes you are washed up! By the time the wood meets the blade the fence has done it's job. Past the midpoint of the blade it only serves to create a trap to push reaction wood against the back of the blade so that it may be shot back toward the operator.
Rob


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## Stevekane (Jul 16, 2017)

Hi, Im in the uk and anything but expert, but I cannot say Ive ever seen the type of fence you describe, lots of the small "contractor" saws seem to have quite a short fence but I think they still extend well beyond the blade, and Ive tended to think that this was to create a simple fence that was just clamped at one end, and which Ive heard people complaining about as being a bit too flexible.
Ive been thinking about fences lately because I have an extreamly basic home made sawbench, the fence being just a piece of very shallow steel channel, its 2" wide x perhaps 3/8" high, now there have been times when I would have liked a bit more height but more often than not I actually 
like being able to guide the wood along the fence and whilst I have to be very carefull, its been enough to stop me making anything taller, I suppose its what you get used to.
Btw my fence is "loose" at both ends, a clamp at one end and a wing nut at the other, and I sight it useing lines scribed into the MDF top,,but I have to say I would not attempt the sort of projects you chaps take on.
Steve.


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## tomp913 (Mar 7, 2014)

https://www.popularwoodworking.com/woodworking-blogs/table-saw-safety-why-the-british-think-were-crazy


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## Terry Q (Mar 2, 2017)

Not sure a half fence would work well with grr-rippers


In woodworking there is always more then one way to accomplish something.


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## MEBCWD (Jan 14, 2012)

Really hard to cut dados or any cut that does not go all the way through the board.


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## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

Jim; I'm on your team! In spite of what Rob says, If I'm running a large panel through the saw I want it supported ALL THE WAY THROUGH ITS LENGTH!
To say that a 4x8 sheet won't move left to right, just because a 10" section is interacting with the blade is a fantasy.


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## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

I think the difference may be that when using the short fence a splitter behind the saw takes over and guides the board the rest of the way through. This would keep a curved board from getting bound between the saw and the fence. Without that properly fitted and lined up splitter I wouldn't attempt it. In fact, I drilled my Unifence so that I could add a straight edge to extend it for some cuts.


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## tooler2 (Aug 11, 2012)

Cherryville Chuck said:


> I think the difference may be that when using the short fence a splitter behind the saw takes over and guides the board the rest of the way through. This would keep a curved board from getting bound between the saw and the fence. Without that properly fitted and lined up splitter I wouldn't attempt it. In fact, I drilled my Unifence so that I could add a straight edge to extend it for some cuts.


The riving knife or splitter both protect the back of the blade from being touched but that is nothing to do with the short fence. The wood should never touch them unless it is reaction wood. Does your Uni fence not have enough length to guide to the back of the table if desired?
As for cutting sheet goods, the last section of a full length fence is only guiding the wood IF the wood is not being held firmly against the first section. Small table saws are not a great way to reduce full size sheet goods, they are why we have track saws, sliders and vertical panel saws. If you must use an ordinary table saw you can build it into bigger island like hardware stores did up till the eighties.
Rob


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## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

Rob; or just use a normal fence. 
I understand your argument, and I'm not saying that it doesn't have any merit. I AM saying that I'm very happy with my long fence (kicked a few thou out from the blade at the back) and i'm not planning on changing any time soon. I have neither the space nor the spare cash to plow into a $5K TS.


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## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

tooler2 said:


> The riving knife or splitter both protect the back of the blade from being touched but that is nothing to do with the short fence. The wood should never touch them unless it is reaction wood. Does your Uni fence not have enough length to guide to the back of the table if desired?
> As for cutting sheet goods, the last section of a full length fence is only guiding the wood IF the wood is not being held firmly against the first section. Small table saws are not a great way to reduce full size sheet goods, they are why we have track saws, sliders and vertical panel saws. If you must use an ordinary table saw you can build it into bigger island like hardware stores did up till the eighties.
> Rob


The Unifence is about 36" long I'd say without going to measure it. I can cut a full sheet of panel with it pretty accurately (it took a few tries to master the technique) but sometimes I need one a little longer. Trying to straighten out a warped board for example.


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## woodknots (Mar 7, 2012)

DaninVan said:


> Jim; I'm on your team! In spite of what Rob says, If I'm running a large panel through the saw I want it supported ALL THE WAY THROUGH ITS LENGTH!
> To say that a 4x8 sheet won't move left to right, just because a 10" section is interacting with the blade is a fantasy.


Dan: You said you are on "Jim's" team and want a large panel supported all the way through, but Jim, the OP was wondering about using a short fence. I responded by saying I want the wood supported all the way through as well. I'm hoping you got the name's mixed up.

Rob: I don't argue with your opinion, so telling me that I'm "washed up" is a little over the top. MY OPINION, is that I wouldn't rip with a short fence. I referred to Delta's UniFence. In their instructions, all reference to ripping operations show the fence in it's normal position, front to back. In their reference to crosscutting, or in their words "USING THE FENCE AS A CUT-OFF GAUGE", they warn that the "rear end of the fence be positioned in front of the blade".

In my opinion, having no fence to support the work piece past the blade COULD create a pivot point as you push the work piece. What would prevent the would from pivoting into the blade? Why don't you just rip without a fence, maybe hurt yourself, launch a lawsuit and a new line of, say SawStops???

The link to the article tells us that the British think we (North Americans) are crazy. Yet these are the same folks that don't create saws with arbors that are long enough to support dado blades.

I'll keep using my fence in it's full position to rip boards and my miter gauge or panel sled to cosscut, thanks. Yup, I've still got all my fingers and plan to keep it that way.


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## tooler2 (Aug 11, 2012)

Some of my saws have full length fences but they usually have a false fence bolted to them allowing the blade to cut into them for some cuts,. It is dead simple to clamp a board to the first half of the fence giving you a short fence for free! Give it a try and you will prove my point. *If you are relying on the fence past the blade to guide the wood*, you have a serious technique problem! The old Jet-Lock style fence relied on the back rail to lock the fence in position. With modern T-Square designs the rear rail is no longer required. There is something to be said for not providing room for a heavy unbalanced object to be mounted on a saw arbour.
Rob


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## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

Vince; oops! My apologies, Vince, " I'm hoping you got the name's mixed up." I meant you.


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## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

tooler2 said:


> Some of my saws have full length fences but they usually have a false fence bolted to them allowing the blade to cut into them for some cuts,. It is dead simple to clamp a board to the first half of the fence giving you a short fence for free! Give it a try and you will prove my point. *If you are relying on the fence past the blade to guide the wood*, you have a serious technique problem! The old Jet-Lock style fence relied on the back rail to lock the fence in position. With modern T-Square designs the rear rail is no longer required. There is something to be said for not providing room for a heavy unbalanced object to be mounted on a saw arbour.
> Rob


Been doing it the old way for a couple of decades + without issues Rob. I'm pretty sure my technique is working. There may be other ways but there is nothing wrong with mine. And my dado doesn't vibrate. If yours does get a better one. I have an unused CMT I can ship you for less than retail. I got a good deal on it.


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## tooler2 (Aug 11, 2012)

Cherryville Chuck said:


> Been doing it the old way for a couple of decades + without issues Rob. I'm pretty sure my technique is working. There may be other ways but there is nothing wrong with mine. And my dado doesn't vibrate. If yours does get a better one. I have an unused CMT I can ship you for less than retail. I got a good deal on it.


By definition your technique is wrong because you are not holding the wood tight against the first part of the fence therefore you do not have proper control of the work piece. It may well bite you one day. Try adding a quarter inch shim on the front half of the fence and practice a bit using scrap stock or styrofoam, you will be impressed. Realise that you should never put a non-straight edged piece of wood along a fence, tack it to a straight board instead.
I rarely use a dadoe but I do own a few mostly for use on a radial arm saw. They mostly use 2 tip cutters that can never be balanced but they do not vibrate. I prefer 1'' and 1.25'' shaft radial arm saws, my biggest dadoe is 12'' to use on the 18'' saws.
Rob


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## Alan D (Nov 12, 2017)

Just looked this up and here in the UK the official safety advice published by the Health and Safety Executive says that the fence should extend no further than the front edge of the blade, and a riving knife should be fitted. I assume from this that the short fence and riving knife have to be used together, not either/or, otherwise it could be even more dangerous, not safer!

I suspect this advice is based on workshop accident statistics, and aims to protect the least experienced operators using a badly set-up machine.

My saw was made for the UK market and has a full length fence (with rear clamping bar) and an a bolt-on short fence. I have to agree that there's nothing except the riving knife to control the workpiece once the back end reaches the blade and I usually get blade marks on the last couple of inches of it as you can't stop it pivoting slightly, especially when using a push-stick.


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## Nickp (Dec 4, 2012)

Jim...here's a short video discussing the benefits of a "short fence" attached to the existing fence...picture's worth a thousand words...






Couple of important points...
1. Once the piece has past the cutting point, the job of the blade is done...
2. The short fence should not go past the point where the highest part of the piece is cut...
3. Cut a sawdust relief at the bottom of the short fence to eliminate buildup...

This is just another technique that some will feel comfortable with and others will not. It feels a bit odd at first but after a couple of cuts it becomes more natural...it's not for everyone so you will need to choose for yourself.


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## tooler2 (Aug 11, 2012)

While we are at it, lets discuss how high the blade should be raised to make a cut!
Rob


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## JIMMIEM (Apr 4, 2010)

Nickp said:


> Jim...here's a short video discussing the benefits of a "short fence" attached to the existing fence...picture's worth a thousand words...
> 
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d7QXIN2X8-w&t=10s
> 
> ...


Thank You for posting the video.


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## Nickp (Dec 4, 2012)

JIMMIEM said:


> Thank You for posting the video.


You're welcome...


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## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

tooler2 said:


> By definition your technique is wrong because you are not holding the wood tight against the first part of the fence therefore you do not have proper control of the work piece. It may well bite you one day. Try adding a quarter inch shim on the front half of the fence and practice a bit using scrap stock or styrofoam, you will be impressed. Realise that you should never put a non-straight edged piece of wood along a fence, tack it to a straight board instead.
> I rarely use a dadoe but I do own a few mostly for use on a radial arm saw. They mostly use 2 tip cutters that can never be balanced but they do not vibrate. I prefer 1'' and 1.25'' shaft radial arm saws, my biggest dadoe is 12'' to use on the 18'' saws.
> Rob


Not wrong, different. And I do have control of the piece before it touches the saw. That was part of learning the correct technique to use. Like I said Rob, I've been doing this for well over 2 decades just the same and I couldn't tell you how many times with no issues. And without being in my shop and watching me do it you really have no idea whether I'm doing it well or badly, safely or unsafe.

As far as straightening a curved board with a long fence there is no issue with doing that way as long as the first cut is with the "horns" against the fence and the fence is long enough to have those points against it the entire time the saw is in the cut. It's no different than using the long straightening jig you mentioned which I have also used. If you are here long enough you'll find out that there is usually a number of satisfactory ways to do something.


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## tooler2 (Aug 11, 2012)

Actually Charles I can tell you are not using proper (safe ) technique by your admission that you are using the fence past the cut to guide your wood, that is what prompted me to reply to this thread. That you further confess to ripping a board with the horns against the fence proves it. You would be banned from using a saw in a professional shop.
Rob


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## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

I'm sensing a pending 'locking of a thread'...


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## tooler2 (Aug 11, 2012)

DaninVan said:


> I'm sensing a pending 'locking of a thread'...


Really? Are safety discussions not encouraged here? I am shocked that there are people who do not understand what a short fence does for you, even if the don't use one. I myself don't use one on my small saws all the time but I know better than to use the back end as a guide. It is a matter of principal.
Rob


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## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

*In This Corner...*

...weighing, ummm, a bit; The Moderator! 



tooler2 said:


> Really? Are safety discussions not encouraged here? I am shocked that there are people who do not understand what a short fence does for you, even if the don't use one. I myself don't use one on my small saws all the time but I know better than to use the back end as a guide. It is a matter of principal.
> Rob


Discussion is great, Rob, but this is getting dangerously close to "I'm right. End of discussion". Just saying...


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## tooler2 (Aug 11, 2012)

I thought of it as a civil discussion thus far. Being unaware of danger does not make it safe. 
Rob


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## woodknots (Mar 7, 2012)

A civil discussion involves two, or more people expressing their opinions, while listening to others, to further that discussion, and does not entail a "I'm right, you're wrong" attitude. Some of us have been working with wood and power tools for a long time and have used techniques that we are comfortable with, with great success.

I answered the original poster by saying that I would never rip with a short fence. That was my opinion and will always be. I'm not a professional, nor have I ever worked in a production shop, but I have been ripping, as a hobbiest, with a long fence, for 40 years. I don't plan to change my technique, regardless of how many times someone tells me it's wrong.

As regards to your last statement; "being unaware of danger does not make it safe", please explain how using a long fence (that is properly set up) make the activity dangerous?


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## DaninVan (Jan 1, 2012)

*Liability?*



tooler2 said:


> I thought of it as a civil discussion thus far. Being unaware of danger does not make it safe.
> Rob


'PhilP', out of the UK, banged that drum a couple of years back. So, no, we're not "unaware of(the) danger", and if the lack of incidents reported by the members is any indication, most woodworkers here _are_ operating their TS safely.
There are a few potential situations that we try and make new woodworkers aware of, for example not using the rip fence in conjunction with the miter gauge. Now there's a serious and very real hazard that we all take seriously!
Personally I'd like to see a lot more members using their blade guard~anti-kickback pawl protection, but again, a lot of members have been using their TS's without the guards for years if not decades; they have routines that keep them safe (we hope?).


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## tooler2 (Aug 11, 2012)

vchiarelli said:


> As regards to your last statement; "being unaware of danger does not make it safe", please explain how using a long fence (that is properly set up) make the activity dangerous?


It is not the long fence that is the problem it is the technique that *relies* upon the last half of the fence being there that is dangerous. The blade teeth cut slightly wider than the thickness of the plate of the blade. Anything that may cause contact with the plate is an accident waiting to happen. The only way to assure that the wood does not contact the plate is to feed it straight into the *front* of the blade. That is the purpose of the rip fence. By the time the wood has reached the front of the blade the fence has done it's job. If you were to cut off the fence right there it would not change anything but if there is reaction wood going past the front of the blade, the rest of the fence *could* cause the wood to contact the plate and rear teeth, causing jamming, burning and tooth marks.Some reaction wood may indeed cause the wood to close in on the plate, but in that case having the back of the fence in place is not going to solve anything. Free hand cutting on a tablesaw is not safe practice but if you do it make sure the fence is completely out of the way and concentrate on letting the teeth cut their path while guiding the wood so as to avoid touching the side of the blade. Remember the teeth coming up the back of the blade are not sharpened on their ''backside'', so pushing wood against them will burn quickly.

An interesting discussion on the Canadian Woodworking Forum lately has it that a bandsaw blade that has been used even once for curved work will never again be suitable for re-sawing. Obviously a tablesaw blade is less sensitive to the effect but food for thought never the less.
Saw Stop's advertising suggest a staggering number of table saw accidents every year, so clearly there is room for increased safety awareness
Rob


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## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

tooler2 said:


> Actually Charles I can tell you are not using proper (safe ) technique by your admission that you are using the fence past the cut to guide your wood, that is what prompted me to reply to this thread. That you further confess to ripping a board with the horns against the fence proves it. You would be banned from using a saw in a professional shop.
> Rob


I have worked professionally, once in a mantle shop and again in a cabinet shop with no issues in either one about the techniques I used. In fact management admired my techniques. I also worked for the BC Forest Service for 7 years as a contract/safety coordinator. I regularly dealt with the WCB, now Worksafe BC, and as such I needed to have a good working knowledge of the WCB Act. I never came across anything about using short fences, or dado heads or moulding heads either. Daninvan is a former contractor here in BC and I'm willing to bet his stories are similar to mine. Stick is also a former contractor as are other members and I'll bet their stories are also similar. Collectively all of us old guys have many hundreds of years of experience so when we say we can do something and do it well and safely you can bet on it that we know what we are talking about. That doesn't mean that a better way or better technology can't eventually replace it but our way works. This forum wouldn't be here if that wasn't true because people who don't know how to come here to find out how. That's what keeps this forum going.

So for you to insinuate that I and others here don't know what we are talking about is rude and fails the member respect policies we have so weigh any future comments you have carefully before making them. Remember that are usually multiple ways of doing any job and there is not necessarily one best way. Often just different ways.


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## tooler2 (Aug 11, 2012)

It was not my intention to be rude so I am sorry if I came across that way. Please realise that many people reading this forum are not experienced and I feel a duty to warn of unsafe practice so they do not get hurt. A table saw is not a machine to use to make a straight edge, it requires a straight edge to use against the fence. If you do not have a jointer it is so easy to simply tack the non straight board onto a straight one and run it through the saw that way. I have considerable experience myself. I own a 1930s GreenLee 493, two Wadkin PKs one from the forties the other from the fifties, and an Oliver 260d from the sixties. *All* of them came from the factory with short fences so this is not a new nor a UK thing. All of them run 18'' blades at 3600 rpm so the surface speed of the teeth is nearly 17000 ft/min compared to about 10500 ft/min for a typical 10'' saw so it would not take long to burn a blade that is worth many hundreds of dollars. These bigger saws do not slow down when pinched. I also own a Diehle straight line rip saw that *is* designed to put a straight edge on a rough board. It has a fence less than one foot long that stops 18'' before the blade so that it cannot interfere with the power feed chains that carry the wood through the 15hp direct drive blade. This saw is set up as a glue line rip saw, it is set to produce boards that are hollow by about .005'' over 6' long to give an improved glue joint when clamped. To tune machines like this requires a good grasp of the physics involved in milling lumber. Wood is a dynamic material.
Rob


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## Cherryville Chuck (Sep 28, 2010)

Nice old machines Rob and I love old cast iron. What you describe is similar to the feed in a gang saw or edger. Once you line it up the feed rollers take over. The short fence is just to help you get it lined up on an edger. Feeding by hand is a little different. I've fed numerous boards with a curve through saws and as I said, as long as the points stay in contact with the fence all the way through the cut. The board stays stable as long as that's the case. There is nothing dangerous about that. Trying to cut the convex side first is asking for trouble. 

You mentioned reaction wood as being an issue with using a long fence. I bought a bunch of #3 red oak years ago and it has been the worst wood I've used as far as having tension and compression fiber in it, possibly because of the knots. The wood that wanted to spread as it cut was never a serious problem. The one side stayed fairly tight against the fence and the other side opened up. The problem wood was the ones that wanted to close as they were cut. I had one do that recently and it almost stalled my Unisaw before I could hit the kill button with my knee. One member a couple of years ago said he was ripping on his saw with a Grrripper when it flipped upside down and he lost fingers as a result. He said it happened so fast he didn't know what caused it but I suspect it was the cut closing up without him being aware of it. 

The worst case I ever saw of that was when I was helping a cousin on his small sawmill. The mill had a 52" head saw and a 50s D8 Caterpillar motor driving it so lots of torque. He started into a green hemlock log about 18-20" in diameter and 8' long that I don't think the two of us could lift and about 1/3 the way through I heard the motor start to stall and I turned to look at the saw and witnessed that hemlock log getting ripped out from under the dogs on the carriage and tossed 10-12' through the air back onto the infeed deck. In cases like that the short fence on a TS makes no difference. What might is a properly fitted splitter like the Microjig. The stock splitter/anti-kickback probably wouldn't have helped much though.

As for physics, if you want to start a private dialogue I'll be happy to accommodate you. I was a physics major for a couple of years at the University of Alabama and I'm a retired power engineer so I think I have a pretty good handle on the physics involved with saw and wood dynamics.


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## JIMMIEM (Apr 4, 2010)

Stick,
Here it is


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

JIMMIEM said:


> I just came across a table saw technique that I was unaware of.......use of a Half Fence. An article I saw said that Half Fences are a common feature on European table saws. To simulate the Half Fence on a Full Fence table saw a flat board is clamped to the rip fence...the board extends from the front end of the rip fence to the midpoint of the saw blade. *Anybody tried it?*


yes... but not into more than ¼ of the blade for general use... overall ¼ of the way seemed to work a lot better than half way 
I prefer 8/4 or better for that ''board''... whole numbers for the math is a plus...
it's about the best set up you can do for wild grain ripping or wood under compression... it gives the erratic piece some place to go w/o the usual bind you get w/ a full length fence...
good to better than great for small piece cutting and for making thin strip...
for thin strips and small piece cuts the end of the add on needs to be just short/shy of the lead edge of the blade so that the strips/pieces freely fall away from the blade and are not in any way touching the end of the add on at the same time...

for the short/shorter strip/piece cuts... 
set the fence...
employ your miter gauge...
set the material to be cut to the fence and push through w/ the miter gauge..
for long/longest strip/piece cuts use your push stick or Gripper to completion...
for cuts w/o the miter gauge set the add on to the ¼ position...

*NOTES...*
the add on needs to be a lot thicker than the cut off... and I mean a lot... as in way lot...
for really small pieces rig your shop vac to collect the drops...
for really thin strips... rig a wedge attached to the drop side your spliter/riving knife... 
the lead edge of the wedge needs to be at zero or near zero thickness...
the teeth on the blade are wider then the blade body is thick... capitalize on this...
the wedge forces the strip to peel away from the blade and not to be ''grabbed by the back side teeth which then will throw throw the piece back at you... kick back.. what a miserable incident...
if the wedge deal isn't to your liking ... adjust the lead edge of your spliter/riving knife flush to the drop side of the blade and kant the trailing edge of your spliter/riving knife maybe a couple of degrees into the cut...
this works for long thins... the wedge on short thins...
to get a kant, all it takes is a thin washer under your spliter/riving knife and held in place w/ it's mounting screw...
hyper thins that are subject to the air flow/currents generated by the blade need to be caught by the shop vac...
I don't suggest nor recommend using compressed air to move the cuts away from the blade because you will have very little control on which way they will move...
sometimes they'll move away from the blade...
sometimes they'll flip back into the blade resulting in kick back......
need we mention a zero clearance inserts for these operations...


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

Terry Q said:


> Not sure a half fence would work well with grr-rippers
> 
> In woodworking there is always more then one way to accomplish something.


it does... just don't follow through...


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

MEBCWD said:


> Really hard to cut dados or any cut that does not go all the way through the board.


huh???


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

DaninVan said:


> Jim; I'm on your team! In spite of what Rob says, If I'm running a large panel through the saw I want it supported ALL THE WAY THROUGH ITS LENGTH!
> To say that a 4x8 sheet won't move left to right, just because a 10" section is interacting with the blade is a fantasy.


we both know that both fences have their place...
and why would you want to run a large panel anyways...
you 20 years old again???
there are so many ways to break down panels w/o a TS...


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

DaninVan said:


> Rob; or just use a normal fence.
> I understand your argument, and I'm not saying that it doesn't have any merit. I AM saying that I'm very happy with my long fence (kicked a few thou out from the blade at the back) and i'm not planning on changing any time soon. I have neither the space nor the spare cash to plow into a $5K TS.


but you do have the ability to modify what you have....


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

Cherryville Chuck said:


> The Unifence is about 36" long I'd say without going to measure it. I can cut a full sheet of panel with it pretty accurately (it took a few tries to master the technique) but sometimes I need one a little longer. Trying to straighten out a warped board for example.


why risk binding and kick back...
time for a sled, carrier, joiner, joiner substitute or a smoother/joiner plane.......
let's be safe out there...

.


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## Stick486 (Jan 4, 2013)

tooler2 said:


> While we are at it, lets discuss how high the blade should be raised to make a cut!
> Rob


at least 75% of the gullet showing at blade TDC to max of 95% of gullet......


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## hawkeye10 (Jul 28, 2015)

tooler2 said:


> It was not my intention to be rude so I am sorry if I came across that way. Please realise that many people reading this forum are not experienced and I feel a duty to warn of unsafe practice so they do not get hurt. A table saw is not a machine to use to make a straight edge, it requires a straight edge to use against the fence. If you do not have a jointer it is so easy to simply tack the non straight board onto a straight one and run it through the saw that way. I have considerable experience myself. I own a 1930s GreenLee 493, two Wadkin PKs one from the forties the other from the fifties, and an Oliver 260d from the sixties. *All* of them came from the factory with short fences so this is not a new nor a UK thing. All of them run 18'' blades at 3600 rpm so the surface speed of the teeth is nearly 17000 ft/min compared to about 10500 ft/min for a typical 10'' saw so it would not take long to burn a blade that is worth many hundreds of dollars. These bigger saws do not slow down when pinched. I also own a Diehle straight line rip saw that *is* designed to put a straight edge on a rough board. It has a fence less than one foot long that stops 18'' before the blade so that it cannot interfere with the power feed chains that carry the wood through the 15hp direct drive blade. This saw is set up as a glue line rip saw, it is set to produce boards that are hollow by about .005'' over 6' long to give an improved glue joint when clamped. To tune machines like this requires a good grasp of the physics involved in milling lumber. Wood is a dynamic material.
> Rob



Rob you must have a really nice shop to hold all those old machines. I would appreciate it if you could post some pictures of those old machines. I love seeing them.


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## JIMMIEM (Apr 4, 2010)

Stick486 said:


> yes... but not into more than ¼ of the blade for general use... overall ¼ of the way seemed to work a lot better than half way
> I prefer 8/4 or better for that ''board''... whole numbers for the math is a plus...
> it's about the best set up you can do for wild grain ripping or wood under compression... it gives the erratic piece some place to go w/o the usual bind you get w/ a full length fence...
> good to better than great for small piece cutting and for making thin strip...
> ...


Thank You.


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